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Can Of Worms posted:Stop being such a dick, Vyce. Still, the added conversations are a nice touch. Sure, the battlefield may not be the best place to have such banter, but it gives some more characterization to the members of the group... even if it is just childish feuding.
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Sep 13, 2012 01:38
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Can we class change him into a priest? Or whatever class is the most embarrassing for him?
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| # ? Apr 26, 2024 08:06 |
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quote:People having success with Rune Knights quote:Stats quote:Vyce
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Sep 13, 2012 01:38
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 You can't change a guest character's class. Don't worry, if this play through goes anything like every other play through I’ve done of this game, Vyce won’t be making it to the end of many battles. But that's mainly do to the fact that the guest AI is really dumb and suicidal.
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Sep 13, 2012 01:55
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So, do we have any input on Denam's class? Personally, I've always enjoyed making him a Rune Fencer for the early chapters. They're not very good in the early game since they're mediocre at melee and magic, but he should have the stats to be good at it. Generics just... don't. Warehouse will probably do class overviews himself, but I can give a quick rundown of what we got at the moment if it isn't a bother.
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Sep 13, 2012 02:15
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I cannot believe how absolutely lovely Vyce is in this version haha. He was always a prick, but god drat, this is insane. Also, calling dibs if we get duders named after Goons.
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Sep 13, 2012 02:24
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And since this game lets you field so many characters and keep so many in reserve, an all goon platoon could include most if not all of the posters in this thread. I'm game for that.
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Sep 13, 2012 02:32
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One nifty thing about the guests is that they all have unique lines if you try to change their class, as well as if you try to remove them from battle! Discovering those was pretty cool.
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Sep 13, 2012 03:14
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Are there any stat thresholds to change classes (like the previous TO games), or can anyone immediately jump to any class you have the mark for?
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Sep 13, 2012 03:14
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PFlats posted:Are there any stat thresholds to change classes (like the previous TO games), or can anyone immediately jump to any class? All you need is a class mark! Getting them, however...
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Sep 13, 2012 03:15
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PFlats posted:Are there any stat thresholds to change classes (like the previous TO games), or can anyone immediately jump to any class you have the mark for? Have fun grinding!
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Sep 13, 2012 03:19
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theshim posted:when you get your first classmark for a later class and change it, you now have a level 1 character all over again.
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Sep 13, 2012 03:50
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PFlats posted:I did realize that, but I cannot comprehend the logic here. Is the only difference between characters their skills (besides Denam/Catiua's unique necklaces)? I can't remember entirely, but most non-generics have different speeds. Although some plot characters are faster than others, I think they're all faster then generic characters. Plot characters also tend to have higher overall stats, and at least somewhat predetermined stat spreads (or so I think.)
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Sep 13, 2012 03:53
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Cake Attack posted:I can't remember entirely, but most non-generics have different speeds. Although some plot characters are faster than others, I think they're all faster then generic characters. Plot characters also tend to have higher overall stats, and at least somewhat predetermined stat spreads (or so I think.)
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Sep 13, 2012 06:55
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Kobold posted:All I can remember from the original TO was that the plot characters are just straight-up better than any normal grunt you could hire. Didn't keep me from dumping the soldiers I got at the start in the remake and naming them all things like Subtract and Divide so that my Holy Order of Operations would be properly staffed. This is the best. You are the best.
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Sep 13, 2012 06:59
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Lotish posted:This is the best. You are the best. Is it too late to change our name here? Because I wish I'd thought of that.
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Sep 13, 2012 07:02
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drat, I'm too late. He should have been Denamza.
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Sep 13, 2012 07:02
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OK, I think it's time for an "I'm fresh off the SNES/PSX version, why the gently caress do we have classes from the start?" update. It seems a lot has changed. Also, have the classes themselves changed? I don't remember the Rune Knight and the "Valkyrie's male equivalent" comments made me pause since the old LUCT had the classes pretty asymmetric gender-wise.
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Sep 13, 2012 13:07
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Gosh, Vyce wasn't *this* awful in the original, was he? I mean, good god.
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Sep 13, 2012 14:36
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Pierzak posted:OK, I think it's time for an "I'm fresh off the SNES/PSX version, why the gently caress do we have classes from the start?" update. It seems a lot has changed. Also, have the classes themselves changed? I don't remember the Rune Knight and the "Valkyrie's male equivalent" comments made me pause since the old LUCT had the classes pretty asymmetric gender-wise.
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Sep 13, 2012 15:00
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Helmet 10 Warehouse posted:
I'm assuming Warriors don't have great stats, since they seem to be a basic class -- does Vyce eventually change automatically for story-related reasons? That's how some characters with unchangeable classes worked in OB64. Speaking of me not knowing whether Warriors are a basic class, is there any chance we could see class rundowns like in the FFT/FFTA LPs? Just, like, a summary of each class's abilities, advantages/disadvantages, stat gains, etc.
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Sep 13, 2012 15:14
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The classes aren't scaled based on availability, really. Warrior and Archer are two of your first choices and Archer especially is crazy good, as we mentioned earlier. Each class does have a kind of specialty, and then they're balanced around that-- such as balance exists in this game. For example, Warrior covers the "general melee" schtick while something like the Terror Knight is no longer outright better at thumping people, instead filling a "Black Magic Knight" role.
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Sep 13, 2012 15:22
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So can you change Canopus's class, or is he locked to bein' a birdguy?
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Sep 13, 2012 18:02
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You can change his class, but his "Soldier" class is replaced with his "Birdman" class instead, if I remember correctly. EDIT: vvvvv Ah, right right. I had a niggling feeling that he also had a smaller class selection list, but couldn't remember exactly. Kobold fucked around with this message at 18:16 on Sep 13, 2012 |
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Sep 13, 2012 18:13
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Kobold posted:You can change his class, but his "Soldier" class is replaced with his "Birdman" class instead, if I remember correctly.
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Sep 13, 2012 18:14
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Glazius posted:So can you change Canopus's class, or is he locked to bein' a birdguy? As soon as a character joins for real (as opposed to hanging around as a guest, which Vyce and Catiua currently are) you're free to change their class around. Characters with unique classes usually have a way to finagle classmarks (that only they can use) from somewhere or other so you can switch them back and forth if you want. Canopus starts out in the birdman-only Vartan class, which isn't technically unique since you can recruit generic birdmen who have access to it too; there are several other non-human races that have their own mix of human and special racial classes (P.S. please recruit and use all of them for the LP, thanks.)
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Sep 13, 2012 18:19
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Just to clear up any confusion. Right now Canopus can change into any of the classes we currently have available except for Knight and Berserker. Also it is only guest party members that are lock into their class, so changing Denam’s class is fair game and open to suggestions at any time. By popular request. Class: Warrior  A mainstay attacker adept with a wide variety of weapons. Jack-of-all-trades, master of none. RT*: 32 Movement: 4 Agile Jump: 2 Up, 3 Down Equip**: Fist, Dagger, Sword (1H), Sword (2H), Axe, Hammer, Cudgel, Whip, Heavy Armor Spells: None Skills: Mighty Impact (3***), Vigorous Attack (15), Double Impact (25) There is not much you can say about Warriors. They’re designed to walk around and hit things and that's about it. Their skills Mighty Impact (one attack with 100% hit and critical) and Double Impact (attack twice) make sure they at least do the hitting part well, but with a slightly higher than average RT they are not going to win any battles on speed alone. * A unit's final RT = Class RT + Race RT + Equipment RT + Character mod (this is usually a negative number for unique characters) ** Sometimes certain weapons will be unequippable by a class just because this game is screwy. *** This is the minimum level required to be able to learn the skill.
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Sep 13, 2012 23:20
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Soldiers are pretty solid all around. Their greatest strength is their versatility. They can use shields if you want them to be tankier, they can use two-handed weapons for more power, and they can equip one-handed ranged weapons for more tactical options. They can use just about every melee weapon so you can experiment easily (most other classes are very limited in their weapon selection). As for skills, Mighty Impact is awesome. The guaranteed critical is good for ensuring knockback which has all sorts of tactical applications (the extra damage is nice, too). The other two come too late to be of any use since the player will have changed them into a more specialized class by that time. As far as I know, none of these skills can be put on other classes, so you can only make use of them as a Soldier. My opinion is that the Soldier is the best early game attacker available. The Berserker, while stronger, is bad on defense and easily overwhelmed (Mighty Impact is better than anything they can do anyway). The Knight is really slow with mediocre attack and much better suited for defense. The Rune Fencer is mediocre on offense and defense; although they can use magic they can't do much with the magic selection available in the early game. The Soldier is competent but unexciting, as befits a 'jack of all trades' type that it is. Use 'em for now and switch to something else as more options open up in the future. Those're my two cents, anyway.
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Sep 14, 2012 00:00
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Canopus is flying death. Most mission objectives can be solved by applying Canopus directly to the target. Vartan is a phenominal class at these levels, only losing out in output to the dedicated specialists later, much like Rune Knight. Their mobility offsets much of it in my book.
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Sep 14, 2012 00:06
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The sad part about the mighty skills is how fast they fall off. You stop using them around the time you get your weapon skills up to around rank 2-4. Then archers don't need to use might shot after they getdouble shot!, that skill is stupid. Will Canopus stay as a vartan, or move on to an archer? Because I think the vartans lacking a certain weapon type is rather lame. Also, can Denam be a berserker? Just cause running at things with axes is awesome... AWESOME.
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Sep 14, 2012 02:29
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Eddalius posted:Will Canopus stay as a vartan, or move on to an archer? Because I think the vartans lacking a certain weapon type is rather lame. I hope he stays at least long enough to get the Vartan's recruitment skill.
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Sep 14, 2012 04:58
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Eddalius posted:The sad part about the mighty skills is how fast they fall off. You stop using them around the time you get your weapon skills up to around rank 2-4. Then archers don't need to use might shot after they getdouble shot!, that skill is stupid. The mighty skills are your primary damage boost for most of the game. The double skills don't show up until the mid-20's which you won't hit until the penultimate dungeon at the very earliest and finishing blows are incredibly TP intensive (requires 100+ TP and uses all of it versus 40 TP for Mighty Blow). Plus with archers, Tremendous Shot has the added utility of being usable outside of your displayed range while finishing blows and Double Shot can't. Vartan is really the best class for Canopus since 2-handed bows aren't really worth giving up his amazing mobility for when 2-handed crossbows get the job done fine and have better finishing blows. Plus anyone can be a great Archer, but a highly mobile ranged attacker that hits like a goddamn train is pretty much unique to Canopus.
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Sep 14, 2012 07:13
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Kobold posted:All I can remember from the original TO was that the plot characters are just straight-up better than any normal grunt you could hire. Didn't keep me from dumping the soldiers I got at the start in the remake and naming them all things like Subtract and Divide so that my Holy Order of Operations would be properly staffed. Speaking as a math teacher, I hope your ninja/swordmaster was Parentheses. edit: are classes a spoiler? I don't even know.
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Sep 14, 2012 11:40
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I don't count class names as a spoiler but please refrain from talking about any class we have yet to see in detail. There will be time for that later. Also, Canopus is going to stay Vartan for a long time in this LP. The extra movement is too nice to pass up. Class: Archer  A mainstay ranged attacker adept with a bow and crossbow, though their accuracy drops sharply in bad weather. RT: 26 Movement: 3 Agile Jump: 2 Up, 3 Down Equip: Dagger, Bow, Crossbow, Thrown, Medium Armor Spells: None Skills: Tremendous Shot (3), Eagle Eye (15), Double Shot (25) At first glance Archers look like Warriors but with worse defense, less class RT, and ranged weapons. What makes Archers so effective is their range. They can hit targets sooner and with their low RT the can hit them more often. Their defense is low so if left alone an Archer can easily be overwhelmed in a hurry, but this is true for any class. To prevent this you need to have a strong frontline, which you should have anyway. With a well balanced team Archers are going to be softening up the enemy (if not just outright killing them) so when the frontline gets to them they can be easily dispatched. While at the same time the frontline will keep the enemy away from your more vulnerable characters. Their skills Tremendous Shot and Double Shot are ranged versions of a Warrior’s Mighty Impact and Double Impact. Tremendous Shot also has the added benefit of allowing Archers to be able to attack outside of their normal range with consistent accuracy. With more opportunities to attack an Archer will build TP very quickly so they can use their skills early and often in a fight.
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Sep 14, 2012 21:44
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I'm sitting in the low 20s and Canopus has stayed Vartan all game. A 2-handed crossbow and he wrecks everything everywhere all the time. 
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Sep 14, 2012 21:47
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Like everyone has been saying in the thread, Archers are crazy good... at single target damage. They're one the best single-target physical attackers available period. Their main weakness is their low move (at three, like mage classes) and mediocre defenses. Greatbows also have a big shadow range (generally three plus), so if someone gets inside it the archer actually can't move far enough to target them, so be wary of mobile enemies. For weapons, there's really no reason to make the archer use anything other than a bow. Bows can arc over friendlies and can shoot outside their targeted range, essentially giving them an extra square or two even on flat terrain. Crossbows, while better in uphill battles, just aren't as good due to needing a clear shot which doesn't mesh well with their low move. Bow finishing moves also have a certain property that the crossbow ones don't which is handy for archers, but I won't go into details at the moment. The archer's skills mimic the soldiers, only for ranged instead of melee. Tremendous Shot is much better than Double Shot because it can be used outside the bow's natural range (and if the first hit of Double Shot knocks the enemy back the second shot will miss). Eagle Eye is useless unless you have a lot of ranged attackers in your squad, but even then accuracy usually isn't an issue. With their great damage output and superior range, Archers are good throughout the game. They start off a little mediocre since the starting bow is terrible, but once greatbows show up they get better and better. By endgame they'll be taking out mages and their ilk in one hit and seriously injure defensively weak units.
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Sep 14, 2012 22:23
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Helmet 10 Warehouse posted:With more opportunities to attack an Archer will build TP very quickly so they can use their skills early and often in a fight. More importantly, remember that weapon skills rank up at a flat rate depending on how many times they're used. While your frontliners spend 5 turns in a row trying to chase down a couple fleeing enemies to end the fight, your archers are racking up hits and leveling up their skills, which eventually gives them a huge edge over slower melee characters.
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Sep 14, 2012 22:33
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Update 5: Dead On Time We start this update with a trip to the local shop.  It’s time to recruit some new goons, hired goons.   Gender and alignment were chosen at random. I even used a low-tech random number generator.  Of course I’m going to rename her.   Since Leal was the one who came up with the idea of name people after goons, are first recruit will be named Leal.  And Staticpulse will be the second.  They better I don’t want to update my ignore list.   Before we leave I buy some equipment and an offense, dark elemental spell.  Also someone in the thread wanted a Berserker Denam. So for this update Denam going to run around like an axe wielding maniac.  Hey look it’s time for a random battle, and it is like random battles in any rpg there’s some enemies, you kill them and you win.  Holy crap! They have lizard men and me without my recruitment skills.  Ah, what a nice day for a battle. This is the menu you see if you press start during battle. There is a bunch of options here but you’ll never use most of them. The only ones to note are the top on that lets you retreat for random battles and the bottom one that lets you save and return to the main menu.  Once again Canopus does the thing that he always does and after that nothing of note happens so let’s skip this. Canopus, The Wind Caller Is Faster Than You Count: 3 Yes, I’m counting random battles.     Before we move on I make a quick stop to buy some books on exorcism that just happen to be written in French.  Krysaro: Before the time of Dorgalua, this town in the Almorica marches was the center of cult worshipping the Sea God Vasque.    Sleep, souls. Embrace the waiting ever-world!    Impossible! My exorcism has failed!? Perhaps the corpses must be stilled before the soul can be put to rest.... I've forgotten much in the fifteen years since I last faced the undead. Ah, but listen to me, making excuses. Patience, Leonar. We need only wait for reinforcements.  Did someone say reinforcements? There, our liberators! Great Father smile upon us this day.  That is one oddly colored lady.  And no common sleep; they descend the sepulchral stairs toward death. When they wake, it will be as unliving horrors! She’s not kidding; all the undead units here are Walisters. We only need hold until Master Nybeth's return. Give them not an inch, and show them no quarter!   Since Donnalto is a unique character, a cleric, and is right next to the enemy, that means he is able to get an attack in before Canopus.   If you are unlucky with this skeleton’s first attack this fight can end in an instant. Unless you don’t care about recruiting Donnalto, then you can just let him die.  You can use items to give your units a quick boost of MP at the beginning of a fight. It such a neat trick that even the enemies will use it.  Before the battle I taught the Wizard lightning magic because dark magic isn’t going to anything to a bunch of undead skeletons.   Lightning magic on the other hand is going to tear them up.    The ghosts are undead mages.  I haven’t mentioned it yet but I hate this battle.  The thunderstorm going on decreases our Archer’s accuracy.  And our melee units don’t do much better.   Also if you don’t get lucky in the first turn keeping Donnalto alive takes a bit of effort, but it is do able.  The final annoyance of this battle, are these undead units.   When they ‘die’ they don’t really die. Three turn after their HP hits zero they will revive with full HP.  There are some tricks to dealing with them.  Like any other game undead enemies take damage for healing spells.  And remember those spells I bought, they can be used by anyone as items during a fight.  Using an acane as an item will cast its spell.   By using this method anyone can perform an exorcism and return the undead back to their true form, loot.  Also using the arcane will teach the user the spell, even if they can’t use it.   Vyce, the jerk, continues to be despicable by punches this poor woman from behind.  While Canopus, the awesome, boldly defeats her with an axe.   And then he finds some hemp.  Now about that two-handed sword I bought, guess who got it.  That’s right. Mister “I’m named after a person that can provide a more in-depth analysis on the game’s classes then the person who is playing the game for us,” that’s who. By the way thanks Staticpulse keep up the good work.  The battle drags long enough for the thunderstorm to blow over.  At some point one of the fallen enemies dropped a tarot card.  Picking up the card gives you the card as an item and…  A small but permanent stat boost.   Moldova attacks with her unholy dark magic that can be purchased at any store.  On the next turn she has a difficult choice. Who will she attack? On one side she has Leal who is currently Dark Attuned and has less HP. On the other there’s Vyce.  She made the right chice.  But in the end it will not help her.  Like every boss this early in the game she was destined to die by one of Canopus’s finishing blows.  Like so.   Moldova, may you be treated better in death than how you treated the dead. Congratulations        And my apologies to you, Abuna. Such is our reward for striking blind. Already I have lost too many of the duke's men. I know not how I shall face him. Probably with your tail between your legs. I am thankful that you, at least, still live. The Great Father favors us. As he is surely displeased by the trespasses of this Nybeth: A sorcerer of the foulest sort. Yes, Nybeth! He lies hidden in a rotting fastness beyond the town. Odd, with his men left at Almorica, I'd have thought him bound for Coritanae. What could he be scheming? I want his head, whatever it may be plotting. I will not return to the duke empty-handed. You mean to take the fastness with these numbers? Should we not withdraw and regroup? Were it only myself and the remnants of my men, I would find retreat more palatable. But do not forget our new allies. I have not. Yet be mindful of the Galgastani threat. Why, they might attack Almorica at any moment.  Yes, yes, of course. Advance or retreat, the decision is rightfully Denam's. Voltare, Sara. I know you'll not object. Of course they don’t object that would require them to talk. Then it's settled. We are yours to command.    It is worth noting that while Voltare and Sara do not have unique portraits they do have entries in the Warren Report and higher base stats than regular units.  Okay, here’s the situation. There’s a necromancer on the loose, and we can either fight him or go back to the castle and get new orders. So, you can either vote to fight the necromancer or return to the castle.
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Sep 17, 2012 01:41
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Fight the Necromancer because hahahahahahahaha
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Sep 17, 2012 02:01
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Be a man! Fight the Necromancer
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Sep 17, 2012 02:22
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| # ? Apr 26, 2024 08:06 |
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I never fought the Necromancer straight away, which means that if falls on you to do so. Fight the Necromancer. Although if you end up stalling feel free to go back and do it later.
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Sep 17, 2012 02:24
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