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Hard Clumping
Mar 19, 2008

Y'ALL BREADY
FOR THIS


grilldos posted:

The only thing he could have meant was a literal trial, because Walter's entire Season 5 arch was an metaphorical trial. It was about a man finally coming to terms with what he had wrought in a very real sense, and sacrificing himself in order to redeem.

This, but I'd extend that to say the entire show (but less so before season 5). Getting to understand this man and the skeletons in his closet, how he reacts to his actions having been so far removed from them for so long, and what he does to set things right. Fringe at its core is the trial/redemption of Walter Bishop. It is the single most important thematic element of the show. So either V-Men was referring to a literal trial, or he somehow watched the whole thing without seeing what was shoved in his face for 5 seasons

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...of SCIENCE!
Apr 26, 2008
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!


V-Men posted:

One of the things I disliked about the end was that it took away the concept of the trial of Walter Bishop for his crimes against the two universes.

Because season 3 of Battlestar Galactica was so great.

I AM GRANDO
Aug 20, 2006



...of SCIENCE! posted:

Because season 3 of Battlestar Galactica was so great.

But that lawyer guy was the best part. I loved it later when he hallucinated his dead wife's cat.

Humbug Scoolbus
Apr 25, 2008

The scarlet letter was her passport into regions where other women dared not tread. Shame, Despair, Solitude! These had been her teachers, stern and wild ones, and they had made her strong, but taught her much amiss.


Clapping Larry

Mark Shepherd can make anything good...see SOF Inc.

V-Men
Aug 15, 2001

Don't it make your dick bust concrete to be in the same room with two noble, selfless public servants.

grilldos posted:

The only thing he could have meant was a literal trial, because Walter's entire Season 5 arch was an metaphorical trial. It was about a man finally coming to terms with what he had wrought in a very real sense, and sacrificing himself in order to redeem.

How is the Observer invasion a consequence of his tearing a hole between universes? Also, does he really sacrifice himself when he takes the child into the past (or our future) to prevent the Observers from being born? In that case, he's going to live somewhere, albeit cut off from his family, but also in a place where no one probably knows who he is. Or if anything, he's a footnote in science journals. He'll likely be free to live and engage in science and contribute to ensure the Observers as he knows them never come to pass.

I suppose, in his taking the Observer child to the past, severing himself from his family is his self-imposed punishment, but -- this is what I like about the notion of Walter's trial (not literally on-screen) -- is that society recognizes his acts, kidnapping Peter, tearing a gap between universes, and the resulting damage Over There and the lives it takes, is criminal and punishes him for it.

Mostly, this interview stuck with me.

quote:

HitFix: But should viewers get invested in what happened in Detroit? Should viewers be invested in what happened with Broyles' eye? Should they be invested in how Walter's trial went down?

JHW[J.H. Wyman]: Yeah. Those are interesting. A lot of things are going to have degrees of importance. I think The Trial of Walter Bishop is very, very important and I know Jeff [Pinkner] agrees. That's a very big time in Walter's life and people who love Walter will love to see that.

Best if it happens off-screen or between seasons, but I loved the notion that Fringe's work goes public and that society becomes aware of what Walter did and how it affected an entire universe. And how Walter comes back from that.

I AM GRANDO
Aug 20, 2006



V-Men posted:

How is the Observer invasion a consequence of his tearing a hole between universes? Also, does he really sacrifice himself when he takes the child into the past (or our future) to prevent the Observers from being born? In that case, he's going to live somewhere, albeit cut off from his family, but also in a place where no one probably knows who he is. Or if anything, he's a footnote in science journals. He'll likely be free to live and engage in science and contribute to ensure the Observers as he knows them never come to pass.

I suppose, in his taking the Observer child to the past, severing himself from his family is his self-imposed punishment, but -- this is what I like about the notion of Walter's trial (not literally on-screen) -- is that society recognizes his acts, kidnapping Peter, tearing a gap between universes, and the resulting damage Over There and the lives it takes, is criminal and punishes him for it.

Mostly, this interview stuck with me.


Best if it happens off-screen or between seasons, but I loved the notion that Fringe's work goes public and that society becomes aware of what Walter did and how it affected an entire universe. And how Walter comes back from that.

Losing Peter was the one thing Walter feared. He had been tested many, many times and always held close to him no matter what the consequences were. Walter suffers in the last episode in the sense that he's forever separate from Peter. Look at how the scene of his departure with the observer child mirrors his return to his side with Peter in the second season.

bog savant
Mar 15, 2008

unending immaturity


Rewatching this now, Season 5 is still dumb. A huge missed opportunity...I hate the dumbass Observer invasion. I always thought a cool ending for Fringe woulda been like, a dozen Olivias and Walters working across dimensions to save all of reality or something. Evil Observers are cool for an episode but a whole season? Also I remember when watching season 4 the first time how sure I was the Sam Weiss would turn out to be the villain...nope its Bell for some reason.

FlamingLiberal
Jan 18, 2009

Would you like to play a game?





swamp teen 1990 posted:

Rewatching this now, Season 5 is still dumb. A huge missed opportunity...I hate the dumbass Observer invasion. I always thought a cool ending for Fringe woulda been like, a dozen Olivias and Walters working across dimensions to save all of reality or something. Evil Observers are cool for an episode but a whole season? Also I remember when watching season 4 the first time how sure I was the Sam Weiss would turn out to be the villain...nope its Bell for some reason.
Yeah I'm with you, turning the Observers into mustache twirling villains undid a lot of the cool stuff they had set up with them over the previous years.

Swiller of Beer
Jan 2, 2003
Cold Hearted S.O.B.

Soiled Meat

They could have had any stupid thing be the villains and as long as there was Walter Bishop I still would've watched it.

Hard Clumping
Mar 19, 2008

Y'ALL BREADY
FOR THIS


FlamingLiberal posted:

turning the Observers into mustache twirling villains

They didn't, though. The original science team with which we're most acquainted were different people who didn't show up during the invasion to change the world to suit them, but to observe and report. Since they viewed humanity as it existed rather than something to be enslaved, nearly all the Observers who had lines pre-Letters of Transit end up having a change of heart about the human race and are punished by the higher-ups (even December in season 5 is killed and set up to look like a suicide when he tries to help September/Donald). None of the Observers who came back in the big invasion never got the chance to see humanity for what it truly was, and there's no evidence that other Observers wouldn't have felt empathy for humans if given the chance.

It's heavily implied that Windmark, his boss, and his underlings were part of a military/ruling caste.

FlamingLiberal
Jan 18, 2009

Would you like to play a game?





I think that's debatable...yes, we only saw some Observers previously, but there were no real hints to the whole 'go back into our past to mine it for resources' or 'we're basically Future Fascists' things.

Ugly In The Morning
Jul 1, 2010
Actually a pretty cool IK, even if he is MOBY (allegedly)


Pillbug

I just rewatched the entire series on Netflix and I'm glad I did. S4 is a lot better the second time through when you know what it's building up to with the bridge scene.

Season 1 is still weak in comparison to the rest of the series, but once the parallel universe is in play, drat, I forgot how good this show can be.

Wheat Loaf
Feb 13, 2012

by FactsAreUseless


I actually just finished Alias this evening. I wonder if I would have felt any differently about Fringe if I'd seen Alias first.

Queer Salutations
Aug 19, 2009

kind of a shitty wizard...



Guys Fringe is the best show but for what I hope are obvious reasons we really need to close this thread and create a new one to talk about it.

I AM GRANDO
Aug 20, 2006



Well, dealing with the consequences of harm visited upon children is a serious theme of the show.

Ugly In The Morning
Jul 1, 2010
Actually a pretty cool IK, even if he is MOBY (allegedly)


Pillbug

Ursus Veritas posted:

Guys Fringe is the best show but for what I hope are obvious reasons we really need to close this thread and create a new one to talk about it.

Most definitely. If there's interest in a retrospective/spoiler thread I can make an OP for it over the next couple days.


Jack Gladney posted:

Well, dealing with the consequences of harm visited upon children is a serious theme of the show.

:rimshot:

PriorMarcus
Oct 16, 2008

ASK ME ABOUT BEING ALLERGIC TO POSITIVITY


If you make that thread the title should be 'Fringe Retrospective - As suspectedů It's airtight' in reference to the scene in Parks and Rec when they give the show a shout out.

Hard Clumping
Mar 19, 2008

Y'ALL BREADY
FOR THIS


PriorMarcus posted:

If you make that thread the title should be 'Fringe Retrospective - As suspectedů It's airtight' in reference to the scene in Parks and Rec when they give the show a shout out.

Got a video link?

Regy Rusty
Apr 26, 2010



Hard Clumping posted:

Got a video link?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-YyEcIJzpI

Aexo
May 16, 2007
Don't ask, I don't know how to pronounce my name either.

Since I didn't see another thread yet, I'll chime in and say I've been on a Fringe binge... Just finished Season 3, which I believe to be the best season. I still have so many feels for Walter. I wish there were more extras on the Blu-rays.

Jose
Jul 24, 2007





This thread needs remaking

Hard Clumping
Mar 19, 2008

Y'ALL BREADY
FOR THIS


I think I'm gonna take a crack at a new thread after work, if no one is already on it. Got some ideas for an OP.

Rocksicles
Oct 19, 2012

by Nyc_Tattoo


If there isn't a recipe for strawberry milkshake, ima beat yo'rear end.

HUGE SPACEKABLOOIE
Mar 31, 2010




And one for LSD too

Rocksicles
Oct 19, 2012

by Nyc_Tattoo


https://www.facebook.com/WalterBishopsCookbook

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Hard Clumping
Mar 19, 2008

Y'ALL BREADY
FOR THIS


http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3682168

New thread is up, thanks for all your suggestions. I think they all went in.

Assuming everybody is cool with my new thread, can we get this one closed?

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