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FishBulb
Mar 29, 2003

Marge, I'd like to be alone with the sandwich for a moment.

Are you going to eat it?

...yes...


I make my bread in a loaf pan that I put inside my Dutch oven with a couple ice cubes for steam and oven spring. It's pretty good but the Dutch oven isn't really that tall and sometimes when I have an especially puffy loaf the top of the loaf hits the bottom of the Dutch oven lid. Is there like a long, tall, heavy oval cooking unit anyone knows about? I've seen oval Dutch ovens but I don think they are any taller...

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mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Ricola-kun, tell me
about pizza cones!


FishBulb posted:

I make my bread in a loaf pan that I put inside my Dutch oven with a couple ice cubes for steam and oven spring. It's pretty good but the Dutch oven isn't really that tall and sometimes when I have an especially puffy loaf the top of the loaf hits the bottom of the Dutch oven lid. Is there like a long, tall, heavy oval cooking unit anyone knows about? I've seen oval Dutch ovens but I don think they are any taller...

You could get one of those enameled roasters. They're quite large.

Alternatively, I take an old jelly roll pan that I don't care about (e.g. warping) and let it preheat in the oven. Then I toss some ice cubes or some sprays of water onto it when I put the bread in. Works pretty well, though I only bother when I really am going all out for "artisan" bread. Just the small oven itself and the offgassing of water vapor from the dough is generally sufficient.

therattle
Jul 24, 2007

I'm a family man - I run a family business. This is my son and my partner, H.W.


Soiled Meat

FishBulb posted:

I make my bread in a loaf pan that I put inside my Dutch oven with a couple ice cubes for steam and oven spring. It's pretty good but the Dutch oven isn't really that tall and sometimes when I have an especially puffy loaf the top of the loaf hits the bottom of the Dutch oven lid. Is there like a long, tall, heavy oval cooking unit anyone knows about? I've seen oval Dutch ovens but I don think they are any taller...
Yes! I have the round dome version of this and it's brilliant: oven spring, and overall loaf quality, have markedly improved:
http://bakerybits.co.uk/Oblong-Cove...r-P2271932.aspx

I took an old silicone baking sheet which I cut to size. I sprinkle it lightly with flour before putting my shaped dough onto the baking sheet, which in turn is on a medium board. The dome heats in the oven. Prior to baking I remove from oven and just slide the dough and the sheet into the base of the dome. You don't need ice as it traps the escaping steam.

FishBulb
Mar 29, 2003

Marge, I'd like to be alone with the sandwich for a moment.

Are you going to eat it?

...yes...


Yeah. That seems about right. Too bad it's in moon dollars from crumpet land. I'll see if I can find something like that in the real world.

Thumposaurus
Jul 24, 2007



NosmoKing posted:

I've been baking no-knead bread all the time recently. I've been using the artisan bread in 5 min a day recipes and techniques. Basically a 50% ish hydration dough that you keep in the refrigerator and hack a hunk off of when it's time to bake. Let it bench proof for a bit, slash, put in 450 degree oven. Makes decent bread and it's so much faster than the more complicated methods.

I asked this in the last bread thread and got no response, so I'm going to try again. Anyone have a good lavash recipe and or tips on making it??

Lavash

1 tsp yeast
1 c whole milk
1/2 c rye flour
3 1/2 c all purpose flour
1/4 tsp salt
1/4 tsp sugar
1 Tbs olive oil
1 c cold water

Mix the dry ingredients together in a bowl
Add the milk and mix just till incorporated
Add the salt adjust the dough with water until it is not too dry
Mix by machine for 6-7 minuted or knead by hand until a smooth dough is formed
proof for 30 mins

Roll it thinly, brush with olive oil sprinkle with salt and parmesan cheese dock surface well with a fork.
Bake at about 350 until golden brown and crisp
You can either cut it before baking or break it into pieces after baking.

Liquid Communism
Mar 9, 2004


At least we didn't cook the dog.



Fun Shoe

mediaphage posted:

You could get one of those enameled roasters. They're quite large.

Alternatively, I take an old jelly roll pan that I don't care about (e.g. warping) and let it preheat in the oven. Then I toss some ice cubes or some sprays of water onto it when I put the bread in. Works pretty well, though I only bother when I really am going all out for "artisan" bread. Just the small oven itself and the offgassing of water vapor from the dough is generally sufficient.

Yeah, I get perfectly fine results out of a smallish oven, a thick pizza stone, and a little old cast-iron spoon rest I can toss some water in.

Gormless Gormster
Jul 28, 2012

AVE IMPERATOR!

Or something

There is a very nice French bakery a short drive away from where I live. I believe that God's personal baker works there. The baguettes there are several dozen rungs above the best of the other breads in the city. They sit on a lofty perch and gaze down at the competition with condescending amusement.

To put this in context, I'm usually too lazy to walk 2 minutes to the supermarket downstairs to get the ingredients for a proper meal. But the moment I run out of baguettes, I will literally run to the car and narrowly avoid crashing through the bakery's front window (probably because I wouldn't want to hamper baguette production.)

This bakery is the reason that I never bake my own bread and probably never will, until the dark day when it closes and I'll be left alone and baguette-less. (And if it closes, it'll be because everyone in this city is a godless philistine.)

taco show
Oct 6, 2011

motherforker


Grimey Drawer

Big Bad Voodoo Lou posted:

Does anyone have a foolproof brioche recipe? The only bread I make from scratch is a slightly sweet (due to honey) challah that everyone loves, but I never bother to braid it.

Anyway, all the best higher-end burger joints in town serve their burgers on incredible brioche buns from one local artisan bakery that doesn't sell directly to the public, and they are AWESOME. I'd love to make brioche buns or rolls or something like that for Thanksgiving dinner this year.
I really like Jacques Pepin's brioche
http://blogs.kqed.org/essentialpepi.../09/18/brioche/

But Dorie Greenspan's recipe has milk and less butter, which might hold up a bit better with a burger
http://www.bonappetit.com/recipes/2...le_top_brioches

The Doctor
Jul 8, 2007

The angels have my snatch

Fallen Rib

I'm excited for this thread. I tried to bake bread for for years and could never create anything that wasn't garbage, then I tried again a couple months ago and somehow I can now magically make excellent bread.

So I make a couple loaves every week and don't experiment much, it's breakfast toast, for lunches, etc. I use a pretty standard challah recipe:

4 eggs
2 1/2 cups warm water
4 tbsp oil
1 tbsp instant yeast
2 tbsp sugar (I halved the original amount, works fine)
a little salt
8 cups whole wheat flour

I mess around with it sometimes, this week I switched to 7 cups w.w flour and 1 cup of soy flour to increase the protein content. It was successful but created a slightly more dense loaf, as expected. Sometimes I will add extra gluten, ground flax, whatever interesting might be lying around.

Any ideas on how to keep the protein content of bread high without making it too dense? I think I am doing well as it is but I always like to add more protein.

I like the idea of making flavoured breads as well, I set aside some of my dough this week and added four crushed garlic cloves and about a tablespoon of rosemary, was delicious and the boyfriend ate basically all of it.

I also really need to make a brioche in the near future, I keep meaning to because it sounds so awesome.

therattle
Jul 24, 2007

I'm a family man - I run a family business. This is my son and my partner, H.W.


Soiled Meat

The Doctor posted:

I'm excited for this thread. I tried to bake bread for for years and could never create anything that wasn't garbage, then I tried again a couple months ago and somehow I can now magically make excellent bread.

So I make a couple loaves every week and don't experiment much, it's breakfast toast, for lunches, etc. I use a pretty standard challah recipe:

4 eggs
2 1/2 cups warm water
4 tbsp oil
1 tbsp instant yeast
2 tbsp sugar (I halved the original amount, works fine)
a little salt
8 cups whole wheat flour

I mess around with it sometimes, this week I switched to 7 cups w.w flour and 1 cup of soy flour to increase the protein content. It was successful but created a slightly more dense loaf, as expected. Sometimes I will add extra gluten, ground flax, whatever interesting might be lying around.

Any ideas on how to keep the protein content of bread high without making it too dense? I think I am doing well as it is but I always like to add more protein.

I like the idea of making flavoured breads as well, I set aside some of my dough this week and added four crushed garlic cloves and about a tablespoon of rosemary, was delicious and the boyfriend ate basically all of it.

I also really need to make a brioche in the near future, I keep meaning to because it sounds so awesome.
I was staying with some friends in the country recently and wanted to make bread. I had neither the time nor any sourdough to get a decent flavour so I added some grated cheese and chopped fresh herbs from their garden, and it was really good. I don't do flavoured bread very often but it is pretty drat tasty every now and again.

scuz
Aug 29, 2003

You can't be angry ALL the time!


I love you, Bread Thread

Any dynamite hamburger bun recipes? If I'm not using the King Arthur recipe, I usually just add 2T of fat (usually shortening), and 1T of sugar to my normal 5:3 loaf recipe, give 'em an egg wash and away we go. They're a little denser than I'd like, but whenever I get a really wet dough going, I get paranoid that there isn't enough gluten development to facilitate a decent rise

Charmmi
Dec 8, 2008

:trophystare:


A chance to show off my rainbow sesame sprinkle hamburger buns!



I like this straightfoward and highly yeasted 40 minute hamburger bun recipe. It holds up well to toasting and heavy patties.

Happy Hat
Aug 11, 2008

He just wants someone to shake his corks, is that too much to ask??


An open letter to mindphlux! (because the cheap bastard doesn't have PM's)

Everything I know about bread!

The order of the ingredients doesn't really matter, if only you remember this...
You're working with two different elements - your yeast and your gluten - both of which are important for the formation of a proper loaf, bun, whatever...

Yeast is alive, and needs to be active.. If you're using dry yeast, then activate it - add a splash of lukewarm water to the yeast, and then add a tablespoon of sugar - mix it, and look at it untill it starts bubbling happily away (unless you can't be bothered to wait that long - which is about 10 minutes!!!) then just mix it thoroughly and let it liquify.

If you're working with active yeast, then drop a block of yeast into the standmixer and add a tablespoon of sugar to it, and turn the standmixer on, and then go away for a while - when you return the yeast will have liquified, and that means that it is active like hell..

Drop your flour on top of that... Different flours have different gluten contents, the less gluten there is in a flour, the longer you have to knead.

I usually use 60-100% durum (which shouldn't be possible according to some).

Add your water, and add about a little handfull of salt (don't be stingy with the salt).

There you have your basic bread - this recipe is about :

50g of active yeast or 1 package of dry yeast
30g sugar
1kg flour
30g salt

Hydrate as you wish..

But what about the gluten formation?

Well - here is the deal with the gluten formation...

Do not add your coarser material to the bread from the start - whole grains, nuts, raisins or whatever, actually get in the way of the formation of gluten - meaning that they act as some sort of inhibitor..

The way that you do it is by first kneading the hell out of the dough (with your standmixer) until it gets a shiny surface - this means that not only has everything been hydrated, but by now it has actually developed the gluten, it will take about 5 minutes on low on your standmixer. The window-paning thing has always confused me, because I think window-paning happens earlier than optimal gluten formation, and misleads a lot of people into thinking that they're done before they actually are....

Then you can add your bran of choice to the bread, and let it knead in for a couple of minutes, or until it has spread evenly through the bread.

Also - Salt - salt makes a difference to not only the taste, but also the texture of the dough - I think it helps in the formation of gluten, but dough with salt is much more pliable and springs easier back when pressed than dough without salt..

Anyways - you're looking for gluten!

Shiny surface = gluten!

Also - the dough will collect on the hook more at the end of kneading, so just because it looks like it is a sloppy mess at the beginning, doesn't mean that it will end out like that!

Hydration
All the water that you add to your bread should be lukewarm (37*c up to 42*c, but just hold your hand under, and if it doesn't scald you, and doesn't make you freeze your fingers, it is about right - if it only is 25*c it doesn't really make any difference, because it will still do what it has to do, only slower)...

So how do you know how hydrated your dough is??

You look into the bowl!

If, after 2 or 3 minutes, the dough is collecting on the hook, but is still sticking to a larger area of the bottom, but not the sides of the bowl - you're at 80%, which is about as hydrated as you want it to be.

If it lets go of the bottom of the bowl when you lift the hook out, then you're around 50%, which can be ok, if your dough has a lot of butter in it..

Smaller sticking to the bottom of the bowl is around 65-70%.

(And you can also hear it... but that is a different story, and not scientific in any way)

Taste
Now.. we're talking pure bread! Not with additives, which can be fun, good and general win the heart and minds of lesser persons.

But for pure bread!

Yeast is farting a lot of good stuff out into your dough, the gas for the rise, but also estere - which is a good thing about yeast...

Estere can taste of anything from rotten animal flesh to bananas - in general the estere of tame yeast tastes like.. bread!

So the more bready a flavor you want - the worse conditions you give your yeast!

This means - cut back on the yeast - and then let it rise slowly under harsh conditions... Shout at it in German while you're at it, to make it feel mistreated, because that will cause the yeast to piss itself, and that is what you want!

What I am saying is...

Use 1/50th of the yeast in the recipe above, use cold water and use time... Then the yeast will develop a more bready flavour..

You can do the first rise, and then knock it back and put it in the fridge - I've done that as an experiment, and the bready flavour improves until day 5, then it starts deteriorating, and at day 8 it is nigh unedible..

(I did this by creating the same dough - exact measures, same batch of flour, same batch of yeast (had bought a kilo of active yeast in one package), every day for 8 days, let them rise at the same temperature (in the oven at 40*) for the first rise, for the same time, and then I put them in my fridge to store.

I took them out at the same day, with 25 minute intervals, and let them reactivate on the kitchen counter in the same way (couldn't do the exact same placement)

Baked them in the same oven at the same temperature for 20 minutes (then 5 minutes for the oven to get completely temperature stable again), and sat them on the counter till they were all room temperature (here - I am assuming that resting time doesn't impact too much)..

Day 5 is best!)

Moistness
Moistness is not the same as hydration - the moistness (and how long the bread will keep) can come from a lot of stuff...

Carrots are good for keeping the bread moist for longer periods of time (just add a couple of hundred grams of grated carrot to the dough before kneading)

Oatmeal is good for the same (make a couple of bowls worth of oatmeal, and replace flour with it)

Grated squash is good for keeping moist

and...

Fats (oils, margerine, whatever).

So how about shaping?
Stretch and fold, because all of your strands of gluten are bunched up after using a machine... not really an issue, but some people like the look of something that has been stretched and folded a few times..

Use baskets for rising (if you want) or let them rise under a wet side cloth. Alternatively you can brush them with milk constantly, but if you've done everything else right they will get a somewhat mutated surface look during the rise.

Finally... bake them - use a stone if you swing that way (but do it at high heat then) or use a plate if that is your preference... I ususally swing back and forth, and use a stone, with bursts of steam in the oven (I just pour in about half a cup of boiling hot water, not that loving ice-cube thing, because I want a lot of steam, and I want it now - not waiting around foppishly while drinking tea and looking at melting ice)..

Steam right at the beginning and again at 3-5 minutes in..

The taste of your steam doesn't matter - I have tried some pretty hefty stuff, and it really doesn't make a difference, unless you go to extremes (how the gently caress do I get this fucker to taste of anything that I steam with??? Let's try a teaspoon of ammonia).. Not recommendable, but your oven gets really clean, and so does your sinuses.

All of the above is true for whichever kind of bread that you want to bake - the rest is just in the shaping and the namecalling of them, and sourdough is really only about getting othere estere, and some sourness into the bread too..

Edit: for content - this just came out of the oven

Happy Hat fucked around with this message at Oct 19, 2012 around 13:27

therattle
Jul 24, 2007

I'm a family man - I run a family business. This is my son and my partner, H.W.


Soiled Meat

Yet another awesome HH post. Thanks man! Very useful. Slightly different approach to me but same general principles!

mindphlux
Jan 8, 2004





Happy Hat posted:

An open letter to mindphlux! (because the cheap bastard doesn't have PM's)

I have bought plat like 6 times now I've given up because you just lose it every time you get banned. I think bartolimu was supposed to restore mine after that battle beet throwdown, but I guess it looks like I still don't have it.

anyways, loving awesome post. I'm going to print it out and read it every time I take a dump for the next two months. maybe also put it under my pillow at night. after which I'll be a master of bread.

will post my first attempt here - I haven't tried to make bread in a year or so.

ChetReckless
Sep 16, 2009

That is precisely the thing to do, Avatar.


I would really love for someone who is educated on the subject of starters to post something about them. I tried making one a few years ago with no real results. Is it a worthwhile pursuit for someone who bakes bread occasionally (i.e. a few times a month)? Is there a fool proof method?

Devoyniche
Dec 21, 2008


There are a few cool sites about breadmaking, I don't know if they have been brought up but between thefreshloaf.com and wildyeastblog.com (and its Yeastspotting category) you have a large index of recipes and discussions.
That said, I would also be interested in someone who has made something like a sourdough starter to share, I want to try making one but am concerned about things like waste: is this recipe better than this other one, how much do I really need to feed it, how much is too much/will I really use this much, and then storing it.

TychoCelchuuu
Jan 2, 2012

This space for Rent.

I don't know if I was blessed by sourdough gods or whatever but my starter was basically:

1.5 cups white flour
1.5 cups water
1/8 tsp yeast (optional: I think if you don't use and yeast you might want to use some whole wheat flour since that has more organisms in it)

And I let it sit out for a while. From that point on I would feed it the night before making bread, otherwise I'd let it chill in the fridge. When I feed it I give it approximately 1 part whole wheat flour, 1 part white flour, 2 parts water, or something. I just eyeball it. I aim for a consistency of about pancake batter. Sometimes I feed it, let it bubble up, then feed it again when it has stopped bubbling up. Otherwise I just feed it, grab half for my bread, and stick the other half back in the fridge.

But of course YMMV. Everything I read online was like "you need to feed it this specific blend of flours and this amount of water measured carefully by weight and also feed it a potato and here is the feeding schedule you have to do it twice per day every day and you have to discard half the starter each time and if you don't do all of these you will be making illegal hooch and the FBI will shoot you."

Probably the easiest route is to ask all of your friends if they have any starter. That's easy mode because you can then just grab a cup of theirs and feed it to get a feel for how it works, and if you kill it, who cares? You can just get more from your friend.

Ideally someone who knows WTF they are doing, but who isn't as touchy as all those websites, can just post in here and replace my ignorance with knowledge.

TychoCelchuuu fucked around with this message at Oct 20, 2012 around 20:19

dad.
Apr 25, 2010


ChetReckless posted:

I would really love for someone who is educated on the subject of starters to post something about them. I tried making one a few years ago with no real results. Is it a worthwhile pursuit for someone who bakes bread occasionally (i.e. a few times a month)? Is there a fool proof method?

One of the cooler, easier, methods of producing a starter is by making some prison hooch. You'll need a handful of raisins that aren't any real specific kind, as long as they aren't the bleached golden variety. Organic isn't really vital. Add this handful of raisins to a pint of water and let them soak for several days in a consistently not cold place. Initially the raisins will be resting on the bottom of the container, but eventually the yeasts that were on the skins of the grapes activate and start to ferment the sugary raisin water. You'll know it's fermenting when the raisins float to the top from the trapped gasses, and the liquid smells like juicy juice. Strain this water off and mix it with an equal weight flour, whatever type you want. Let this ferment for about 24 hours and be sure to stir occasionally to feed air to the yeasts. This is a good starting point for feeding a culture. Feeding this with a different weight of flour in relation to starter quantity and feeding schedule will give you different results that, if you allow it to reach maturity (for a liquid starter: it has soapy bubbles; for a stiffer starter: it is JUST beginning to collapse) give you a perfectly valid, usable preferment.

As for storing a starter, a stiffer starter refrigerated 3 hours after it's last feed can be stored for two weeks healthily without a re-feed. Liquid starters can be put away immediately after being given a feed of equal flour to starter weight and can last about two weeks as well without a refeed.

The raisin water method can also be used as a preferment in lighter, more subtle breads to impart the fruit's characteristics. The raisin method can be applied to other dried fruits as well, with my preference being apricots. You can add fresh fruits or vegetables to a raisin water to modify the flavors you want to get, just give it a few additional days to ferment with the new addition. Strawberries are great. Perhaps squash?

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Ricola-kun, tell me
about pizza cones!


TychoCelchuuu posted:

you might want to use some whole wheat flour since that has more organisms in it

Uh.

dad.
Apr 25, 2010


The real benefit of using a higher extraction (more of the wheat berry being used) flour or any integral flour is the additional nutrients and enzymes present to promote sourdough fermentation. It is true there is more stuff riding in the flour, but something-something motion of the ocean.

TychoCelchuuu
Jan 2, 2012

This space for Rent.

Sorry, I guess enzymes aren't technically organisms. They're... whatever enzymes are. I'm an American who only ever made it past high school biology, it's a miracle I even learned about evolution.

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Ricola-kun, tell me
about pizza cones!


TychoCelchuuu posted:

Sorry, I guess enzymes aren't technically organisms. They're... whatever enzymes are. I'm an American who only ever made it past high school biology, it's a miracle I even learned about evolution.

Organisms are living things. Enzymes are molecules that speed up a chemical reaction. That's what an enzyme is.

And I don't think you're going to find more "enzymes" in whole wheat flour over white. The flour is definitely compositionally different - it has the wheat's germ and and bran, in addition to the wheat's endosperm. That means it likely has more fat and fiber, and potentially more protein, though that's not always the case.

When I do use whole wheat flours, I tend to add extra gluten, especially if I'm using it to make rolls or sandwich breads.

dad.
Apr 25, 2010


"enzymes" comprises more than just alpha and beta amylase. There certainly is more protein in anything milled whole, it's just not structurally beneficial, like how rye has approximately 14% protein but you're not getting brioche-like volume in loaf made of it; also again, enzymes and pentosans etc.

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Ricola-kun, tell me
about pizza cones!


dad. posted:

"enzymes" comprises more than just alpha and beta amylase. There certainly is more protein in anything milled whole, it's just not structurally beneficial, like how rye has approximately 14% protein but you're not getting brioche-like volume in loaf made of it; also again, enzymes and pentosans etc.

Right.

therattle
Jul 24, 2007

I'm a family man - I run a family business. This is my son and my partner, H.W.


Soiled Meat

I think you mean "I stand corrected"!

Regarding starters, I keep mine in the fridge and feed it every week or so when I bake. I've left it for a couple of months without feeding and it revived. They're more robust than you think. The longer you go without feeding, as a general rule, the more sour. I am imprecise about my measurements and keep it pretty loose and batter-like. I tried the countertop every day feed method, but couldn't take the the hassle and the waste. I know is cheating but I supplement the starter when baking with a bit of yeast for sourdough flavour and guaranteed rise. I am more concerned with a consistent good outcome than the purity of the process. Others are free to differ.

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Ricola-kun, tell me
about pizza cones!


therattle posted:

I think you mean "I stand corrected"!

Regarding starters, I keep mine in the fridge and feed it every week or so when I bake. I've left it for a couple of months without feeding and it revived. They're more robust than you think. The longer you go without feeding, as a general rule, the more sour. I am imprecise about my measurements and keep it pretty loose and batter-like. I tried the countertop every day feed method, but couldn't take the the hassle and the waste. I know is cheating but I supplement the starter when baking with a bit of yeast for sourdough flavour and guaranteed rise. I am more concerned with a consistent good outcome than the purity of the process. Others are free to differ.

No, I don't. Because I'm not incorrect. I just don't feel like continuing a discussion in a thread where people are using whole wheat flour for all the magical enzymes.

Happy Hat
Aug 11, 2008

He just wants someone to shake his corks, is that too much to ask??


I sometimes use whole wheat for the more rustic taste of it, the coarseness is a good match for the coarser pates and rillettes I think.

I also use the coarser flours for starters, not sure why, outside of that is how my dad does it, and that's how he was taught during his apprenticeship in the 50's, but that is primarily rye..

Finally I use it to smuggle a bit of fiber into the kids diet (well, I basically only use the coarser flours there).

I would assume that the enzymes, or whatever, doesn't make a difference when you're using a process that only takes a couple of hours?

aldantefax
Oct 10, 2007

ALWAYS BE MECHFISHIN'

Some people treat sourdough starter like a pet and care for it pretty much constantly, whereas other people tend to treat it more like a hardy plant. From what I've seen and tasted both are fine! In the San Francisco bay area, which I hear is a place that makes ok sourdough, you have a lot of different places to go to grab wild yeast or premade starter. For those less fortunate, you can even get sourdough starter for free via the post! Carl Griffith's Sourdough Starter is still around, I believe, and you can't really go bust with a starter that draws its roots from the tail end of the Industrial Revolution.

colonp
Apr 21, 2007
Hi!

...

colonp fucked around with this message at Mar 8, 2014 around 17:07

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Ricola-kun, tell me
about pizza cones!


colonp posted:

How do you guys soften up grains/seeds? I've been boiling them, then letting the resulting porridge cool off, then putting in the wet yeast etc. but the smell of the porridge have been dominating my bread. Maybe just leave 'em in a bowl of water over night? Or am I just overcooking?

I don't use them in breads really, but you could just leave them in a bowl of water in the fridge for a day, and avoid the cooking issue entirely.

colonp
Apr 21, 2007
Hi!

...

colonp fucked around with this message at Mar 8, 2014 around 17:07

therattle
Jul 24, 2007

I'm a family man - I run a family business. This is my son and my partner, H.W.


Soiled Meat

colonp posted:

What's the effect of over-proofing?
Very basically, your bread won't have as much rise or oven spring as it should as the yeasts have peaked.

Otm Shank
Mar 5, 2005
Mir raucht den Kopf!!!

So I really want to bake this bread:

Chocolate Orange Bread
http://smittenkitchen.com/blog/2006...side-of-atkins/

1/2 cup warm water, about 110 degrees
2 1/2 teaspoons (1 envelope) active dry yeast
2 3/4 cups unbleached all-purpose flour (remember to reserve some, adding it only if you need)
1/4 cup unsweetened cocoa, about 1 ounce
3 tablespoons sugar
1 teaspoon salt
1 teaspoon finely grated orange zest
1/2 teaspoon ground cinnamon
2 tablespoons unsalted butter
1/4 cup milk
1 egg

but a lot of the comments on the recipe complain about a weird acidic taste. Do you think bumping the sugar up to 1/2 a cup would fix this without messing up the loaf? Or have a better recipe?

mich
Feb 28, 2003



Plenty of breads don't contain sugar at all and don't taste acidic. I suspect the people who found an acidic taste used natural unsweetened cocoa, which is acidic. If you try that recipe be sure to use Dutch process cocoa. This is just my intuition though, so I don't know for sure. Increasing sugar wouldn't hurt if you are going for a sweeter loaf but it will rise very fast and you probably can decrease the yeast.

Aaronicon
Oct 2, 2010

by primus


I've only just recently switched from pre-mixed bread flours to a bag of just straight high-protein (12.5% or so) flour from Costco, and man I'm having issues. The first dough felt fine but after baking tasted bland as hell. It was a cold ferment dough but using the premix stuff I was able to go straight from that first two-hour rise to the oven and they've tasted fine before.

I made another batch yesterday, seemed to rise fine, and put that in the fridge overnight (a longer ferment process should develop more flavour) - and when I took the plastic wrap off this morning, I was almost floored by the alcohol vapours that came out. Like, almost gag-worthy rush of fruity spice. What the hell caused that? I've never had problems with my yeast before. Was my wrap too tight and didn't let it escape properly? Will that alter the dough? There's no pooling liquid and the smell of ferment is still stronger than normal, and apart from a dried-out top, the dough still seems nice enough.

I guess I'll find out.

Angstronaut
Apr 26, 2005

is there no shame?


Thanks for the informative post, Happy Hat! I just got a KitchenAid mixer for my birthday. I'm over the moon with it and I can't wait to make hella breads.

The Doctor
Jul 8, 2007

The angels have my snatch

Fallen Rib

My weekly challah exploded!



If you're wondering why that bread looks ripped in half...it's ripped in half. It likes to do that coming out of the pan sometimes. Just when you think you've used too much oil...

Any way I added extra salt and this is easily the best bread I've ever made. It's light and airy yet moist. It also has a stretched, stranded quality that probably has some fancy name in the baking world. Basically this is the kind of food that makes people obese.

Dreadwroth
Dec 12, 2009



Awesome new bread thread! I've been nerding out over handmade bread as I have no fancy machines being one of the poors. So far, my favorite bread has been a wheat graham bread with honey, brown sugar, barley and cinnamon up in there. Unfortunately it didn't rise much due to my murdering too much of the yeast, poor little guys. I have been just adding the yeast to the flour and then putting the sugar water mix on top and going from there. It seems to work okay, but it could use improvement. I think I need to loaf it up when I get off work. I think I'd like to try Happy Hat's recipe out, it looks really good.

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The Doctor
Jul 8, 2007

The angels have my snatch

Fallen Rib

Dreadwroth posted:

Awesome new bread thread! I've been nerding out over handmade bread as I have no fancy machines being one of the poors. So far, my favorite bread has been a wheat graham bread with honey, brown sugar, barley and cinnamon up in there. Unfortunately it didn't rise much due to my murdering too much of the yeast, poor little guys. I have been just adding the yeast to the flour and then putting the sugar water mix on top and going from there. It seems to work okay, but it could use improvement. I think I need to loaf it up when I get off work. I think I'd like to try Happy Hat's recipe out, it looks really good.

Can there be a rule or something where we stop apologetically calling ourselves poor? I don't know man, it's ok to not have money, and you can even be proud that you do everything by hand. I certainly do not use a mixer.

As for not killing yeast, the yeast I use is "dry active" and supposedly doesn't need to be proofed, but I will ignore that from now on because I had a significantly better rise when I activated it first in sugar water yesterday, and it definitely bubbled up and ate the sugar, so it's not doing nothing before the flour is added.

I think in a lot of ways, once your yeast has dined on glorious sugar, the order of ingredients doesn't particularly matter for a basic loaf, but since using this recipe I combine all of my liquid ingredients first and then add half my flour, mix into a batter, let it hang out on the counter for a while and then add the last of my flour, tip out onto a surface and knead. I've had pretty much complete success thus far.

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