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bolind
Jun 19, 2005



Pillbug

Forgot to mention, I bake on a slab of 30mm marble that's been pretty well heated.

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bolind
Jun 19, 2005



Pillbug

This thread needs a shot of yeast up its rear end. Rise! RIIIIIIIIISE!!!

Just got some sourdough from some friends. Their obsessions with cooking never stops to amaze me. "Would you like rye or wheat sourdough"? Then they showed off their flour grinder.

What's the recommended procedure for a sourdough virgin? Sourdough + yeast? It's for a wheat bread.

Cymbal Monkey
Apr 16, 2009

Lift Your Little Paws Like Antennas to Heaven!


bolind posted:

This thread needs a shot of yeast up its rear end. Rise! RIIIIIIIIISE!!!

Just got some sourdough from some friends. Their obsessions with cooking never stops to amaze me. "Would you like rye or wheat sourdough"? Then they showed off their flour grinder.

What's the recommended procedure for a sourdough virgin? Sourdough + yeast? It's for a wheat bread.

I have moral obligations to sourdough+yeast as a procedure. At that point all you're doing is adding acidified dough to a normally risen bread because baker's yeast will quickly decimate a sourdough culture. The procedure I always like is a longish preferment (couple days in the fridge), then build a dough on that, ferment it over night and then bake the next day. That'll ensure you have a ton of microbial action in there before it's time to bake.

bolind
Jun 19, 2005



Pillbug

What's the ratio of preferment to dough?

Cymbal Monkey
Apr 16, 2009

Lift Your Little Paws Like Antennas to Heaven!


bolind posted:

What's the ratio of preferment to dough?

I like to go about 45% preferment to dough. That's a fairly high percentage but if you keep a large pool of preferment it means you can knock out a loaf in 24 hours.

DornerHorse
May 21, 2014

Chewie, we're Prohm

Anyone at high altitude (I'm in Denver) have a good recipe already adjusted for altitude? Can't find one at all.

shabbat goy
Oct 4, 2008





I make pizza dough a lot, but I've noticed a weird phenomenon that's probably because I'm doing something stupid and I'm hoping a bread nerd can explain it to me.

Here's my basic recipe:

~3c all purpose flour
1/2 tsp sugar
1 tsp salt
2 tsp active dry yeast
+
1.5c warm water
1 tbsp olive oil

I add wet to dry, knead it until it's a good dough, and then let it rise for 1 to 2 hours, form it into the proper shape by tossing/rolling it, and topping+baking it @ 350*F for ~18 minutes. It's pretty springy and makes a nice thick crust, but it never gets very crispy like I would hope pizza dough does and it tastes pretty much like white bread.

EXCEPT I usually make a double batch and freeze half of it for later in the week. The dough that I freeze, I thaw the day of and do the exact same thing and it turns out exactly how I want it (still a thick crust, but golden brown + crispy on the outside and with a nice slightly-sourdough-ish flavor.)

I know that some of that is likely a result of letting the risen dough sit around for longer albeit in the freezer, but I'm not sure why the dough is so much better after a freeze/thaw cycle. The obvious solution is to just do this everytime, but I'm guessing there's some cool bread trick I'm not aware of that can save me the trouble/time of freezing and thawing dough everytime I want to make a pizza. In addition, if any goons have a nice thick pizza dough recipe, I'm all ears

dedian
Sep 2, 2011


Let it ferment for about an hour (doubled-ish) but instead of using the dough straight away, throw it in the fridge overnight. An hour or so before you're going to make pizzas the next day, take it out of the fridge so it can warm back up to room temp. This is essentially the same thing that the dough you threw in the freezer is doing - longer ferments and proofs at lower temperatures produces more flavor (I don't know the science part of that though).

Nicol Bolas
Feb 13, 2009


Xposted from the general questions thread:

So enriched breads. I have vegans coming for Thanksgiving and want to make some sweet potato knots vegan-style. (Specifically this recipe which worked great as written last year.) Obviously the milk converts simply to whatever nut milk, but the egg yolks give me pause. How can I replace them?

Cymbal Monkey
Apr 16, 2009

Lift Your Little Paws Like Antennas to Heaven!


Nicol Bolas posted:

Xposted from the general questions thread:

So enriched breads. I have vegans coming for Thanksgiving and want to make some sweet potato knots vegan-style. (Specifically this recipe which worked great as written last year.) Obviously the milk converts simply to whatever nut milk, but the egg yolks give me pause. How can I replace them?

I've not tried this with breads, but in cakes I've had success using 3tbs of the liquid you get out of a can of chickpeas as a replacement for each egg. It serves the same binding function as an egg, you can even make meringues with it.

The Midniter
Jul 9, 2001



Cymbal Monkey posted:

I've not tried this with breads, but in cakes I've had success using 3tbs of the liquid you get out of a can of chickpeas as a replacement for each egg. It serves the same binding function as an egg, you can even make meringues with it.

I thought about suggesting the same, but isn't that liquid more of a substitute for egg whites, since you can make a meringue out of it? Nicol Bolas's original recipe includes only the egg yolks, which in a bread I would think would be there more for richness and flavor rather than for any binding action. I'd suggest using some other vegan fat source, and maybe upping the flour a little to make up for the lack of thickness of the egg yolks, or skipping that ingredient completely and seeing how they turn out. Maybe just add some more butter vegan fat source?

poverty goat
Feb 15, 2004



i baked my first bread ever tonight. it's ciabatta and i rigged up a ghetto brick oven with quarry tiles and it came out perfect

lookit this bread



good times

what bread should i bread next time?

SymmetryrtemmyS
Jul 13, 2013

I got super tired of seeing your avatar throwing those fuckin' glasses around in the astrology thread so I fixed it to a .jpg

The Goatfather posted:

i baked my first bread ever tonight. it's ciabatta and i rigged up a ghetto brick oven with quarry tiles and it came out perfect

lookit this bread



good times

what bread should i bread next time?

Very pretty. Next time, if you want to avoid the uneven air pocket distribution, flip the loaf upside down right before inserting it into the oven. The final proofing can tend to make the bubbles all rise to the top.

Next up, make a fluffy breakfast bread! http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/32...bread-tangzhong

Casu Marzu
Oct 20, 2008

I'm rude now.


Sup bread nerds

Sandwich loaf



Kouign Amann



therattle
Jul 24, 2007

I'm a family man - I run a family business. This is my son and my partner, H.W.


Soiled Meat

Casu Marzu posted:

Sup bread nerds

Sandwich loaf



Kouign Amann





Mmm, those look amazing.

Mikey Purp
Sep 30, 2008

I realized it's gotten out of control. I realize I'm out of control.

DornerHorse posted:

Anyone at high altitude (I'm in Denver) have a good recipe already adjusted for altitude? Can't find one at all.

Not a recipe per se, but I just moved to Denver and have also been getting into baking a bit. The general rules are:

1. It's a lot drier here, so you may need a higher hydration than a recipe states. Adjusting by 2-3% has worked pretty well for me. You also need to be a bit more careful during fermenting and proofing so that your dough doesn't develop a dry "skin." I spray mine with olive oil before both of these steps to combat that.

2. Because of the lower air pressure, your dough will rise faster, both during the proofing and, more importantly, during the bake. You want to bake at a higher temperature to make sure that your bread cooks faster to counteract the accelerated leavening. I've found that 25* more than the recipe calls for works out pretty well.

So in summary, more water, bake hotter. This page also has useful details: http://www.kingarthurflour.com/lear...ude-baking.html

Moey
Oct 22, 2010

I LIKE TO MOVE IT


DornerHorse posted:

Anyone at high altitude (I'm in Denver) have a good recipe already adjusted for altitude? Can't find one at all.

Seconding this, except for I am up the hill from him at like 9700'

Shnooks
Mar 24, 2007

I'M BEING BORN D:


I just got a cast iron dutch oven. Can I use any old bread recipe and just bake it in the dutch oven or are there special dutch oven bread recipes?

poverty goat
Feb 15, 2004



SymmetryrtemmyS posted:

Very pretty. Next time, if you want to avoid the uneven air pocket distribution, flip the loaf upside down right before inserting it into the oven. The final proofing can tend to make the bubbles all rise to the top.

Next up, make a fluffy breakfast bread! http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/32...bread-tangzhong



theres nothing quite like spending 25 minutes beating the poo poo out of some dough

SymmetryrtemmyS
Jul 13, 2013

I got super tired of seeing your avatar throwing those fuckin' glasses around in the astrology thread so I fixed it to a .jpg

The Goatfather posted:



theres nothing quite like spending 25 minutes beating the poo poo out of some dough

Strange texture, huh? Fluffy, like cotton. Delicious, though - I love using the tangzhong technique.

Cymbal Monkey
Apr 16, 2009

Lift Your Little Paws Like Antennas to Heaven!


Shnooks posted:

I just got a cast iron dutch oven. Can I use any old bread recipe and just bake it in the dutch oven or are there special dutch oven bread recipes?

Any recipe will work, the real advantages become apparent with wetter doughs though.

Shnooks
Mar 24, 2007

I'M BEING BORN D:


Cymbal Monkey posted:

Any recipe will work, the real advantages become apparent with wetter doughs though.

I found a recipe that specifically calls for using a dutch oven and yes, the dough was incredibly wet, but I think I have an idea of how to use the dutch oven now.

The taste of the bread itself was meh but the crumb and texture was absolutely perfect. I barely did any work and I made perfect bread.

Mikey Purp
Sep 30, 2008

I realized it's gotten out of control. I realize I'm out of control.

I made Pain de Campagne from BBA today so that I could learn how to make fancy shapes!

Clockwise from front: fougasse, trese, and an epi wreath.









Crumb (I think the odd bubble on the right is a result of the braid being a bit lopsided and pulling this side of the loaf's surface):



I used to do no-knead a bunch, but this is only my second loaf of "regular" bread (the first is the Pullman loaf peeking from the back in the first pic). I'm in the process of learning how to cook and bake at altitude too, so I'm very pumped by these results. The flavor and texture are spot on, and I got a very crispy, crackly crust. I think that I went a little overboard with the flour dusting, but that's easily adjusted next time!

Mikey Purp fucked around with this message at Nov 11, 2015 around 01:52

poverty goat
Feb 15, 2004



SymmetryrtemmyS posted:

Strange texture, huh? Fluffy, like cotton. Delicious, though - I love using the tangzhong technique.

Yeah, it's really good. Great staying power over a few days too, the crust is still crusty and it's still soft and moist on the inside

It did burn just a little on the bottom a few mins before it should have been done per the recipe. Any tips/tricks to prevent this from happening before I smell burning?

poverty goat fucked around with this message at Nov 12, 2015 around 18:37

SymmetryrtemmyS
Jul 13, 2013

I got super tired of seeing your avatar throwing those fuckin' glasses around in the astrology thread so I fixed it to a .jpg

The Goatfather posted:

Yeah, it's really good. Great staying power over a few days too, the crust is still crusty and it's still soft and moist on the inside

It did burn just a little on the bottom a few mins before it should have been done per the recipe. Any tips/tricks to prevent this from happening before I smell burning?

Hmm, I've never had any burning problems. Maybe turn down the heat a couple degrees?

e: try bread pudding made of this stuff sometime. It's amazing.

therattle
Jul 24, 2007

I'm a family man - I run a family business. This is my son and my partner, H.W.


Soiled Meat

SymmetryrtemmyS posted:

Hmm, I've never had any burning problems. Maybe turn down the heat a couple degrees?

e: try bread pudding made of this stuff sometime. It's amazing.

I once made brioche just to make a bread and butter pudding. Amazing.

bolind
Jun 19, 2005



Pillbug

Just got myself a rising basket, and tried it last night. Tip #1: dust the everliving crap out of it or your dough will stick.

It made a very nice pattern on the bread, but didn't really achieve much in my life-long quest to get very hydrated doughs to not turn into very flat breads. Tips?

E: I also have a dough rising which contains no water - just the ~850g of slightly expired low fat yoghurt I had sitting around. I have no idea if it's going to be a disaster or not. Will report back.

bolind fucked around with this message at Nov 13, 2015 around 12:25

NightConqueror
Oct 5, 2006
im in ur base killin ur mans

bolind posted:

Just got myself a rising basket, and tried it last night. Tip #1: dust the everliving crap out of it or your dough will stick.

It made a very nice pattern on the bread, but didn't really achieve much in my life-long quest to get very hydrated doughs to not turn into very flat breads. Tips?

E: I also have a dough rising which contains no water - just the ~850g of slightly expired low fat yoghurt I had sitting around. I have no idea if it's going to be a disaster or not. Will report back.

A 50/50 mix of white flour and rice flour is really good at making things not stick.

poverty goat
Feb 15, 2004



SymmetryrtemmyS posted:

Hmm, I've never had any burning problems. Maybe turn down the heat a couple degrees?

e: try bread pudding made of this stuff sometime. It's amazing.

i made the last of it into french toast this morning and holy poo poo

SymmetryrtemmyS
Jul 13, 2013

I got super tired of seeing your avatar throwing those fuckin' glasses around in the astrology thread so I fixed it to a .jpg

The Goatfather posted:

i made the last of it into french toast this morning and holy poo poo

Cotton bread is

I like it with marmalade on top, or as french toast, bread pudding, whatever. It's the perfect breakfast bread - and it doesn't go stale too quickly, either. I don't know why you can't buy it on the shelf.

whoredog
Apr 10, 2002



I made a Rainbow Brioche once. It was almost perfect.



The lesson I learned was to roll the colored balls into logs in plastic wrap, instead of dusted with flour. The light dusting of flour made them not 'merge' perfectly.

Brioche makes the BEST grilled cheese.

whoredog fucked around with this message at Nov 16, 2015 around 16:47

Mikey Purp
Sep 30, 2008

I realized it's gotten out of control. I realize I'm out of control.

I made bagels yesterday. Pretty happy with the results, although they came out a bit flatter than I would have liked. I'm thinking that they may have been over-proofed, but do you guys have any other reasons for this? The recipe was the one from BBA, which is written up here.

Also, how do professional bagel shops get their toppings to stick? Egg wash? I've never noticed the shine from a wash, but my toppings fall right off when just applied to the wet bagel, so it makes me wonder.

Here are some pics:

Post retardation. The cinnamon raisin were adjusted with flour to make a stiffer dough than the white because I was a bit worried that the white were too tacky. They did not rise as much, but also came out fuller than the whites after boiling and baking so I dunno.


Done. You can see how they deflated quite a bit, while the cinnamon raisin in the back look a little more full:


Crumb:

Mikey Purp fucked around with this message at Nov 16, 2015 around 17:30

Chelb
Oct 24, 2010

I'm gonna show SA-kun my shitposting!


So I'm a scrub who's been kneading dough with a bread machine my dad originally had lying around gathering dust in his pantry. I then shape it and bake it in the oven. I've been enjoying it a lot so far, even to the point of getting into pre-ferments and the occasional, unsatisfactory attempt at sourdough.

Here are some pics.

50% Rye bread, with caraway seeds and orange zest:



A very tasty sort of dinner bread, flavored with goat's milk:



The same idea as above, but miniaturized:

Chelb fucked around with this message at Nov 16, 2015 around 19:11

Happy Hat
Aug 11, 2008

He just wants someone to shake his corks, is that too much to ask??


I'm loving around a lot with sourdough - takes a lot of experimentation to get somewhere that I want it to be, annoyed like gently caress with the effects of the acidity on the crust right now, trying to adjust that - I want a more basic crust.. also I need higher humidity while proofing than what I have presently, and am thinking of building a proofing cabinet of some sort..

Happy Hat
Aug 11, 2008

He just wants someone to shake his corks, is that too much to ask??


sourdough is annoying is what i am saying

bolind
Jun 19, 2005



Pillbug

Interesting. So, pure sourdough, no yeast? Care to post your most successful recipe?

Happy Hat
Aug 11, 2008

He just wants someone to shake his corks, is that too much to ask??


I wouldn't call my attempts successful yet - I would call them failures that I will stuff in your face with force... (they taste fine, just not... well... perfect).

But getting a sourdough started is easy take 1/1/2 Coarse rye/whole grain wheat/water - and put in a jar, leave on the counter uncovered overnight.

Day 1: take 1/1/2 coarse rye/wholegrain wheat/water and mix - put in good sized jar (using mason jar myself)
Day 2: Feed it with 1/1/2 stir - leave on counter (covered with wrap)
Day 3: Should start to foam (in the winter this may come later than day 3), pour out 90% of it, and feed with 1/1/2, leave on counter
Day 4: Repeat day 3
Day 5: Use 90% of the sourdough for baking, feed with 1/1/2
Day 6: Store in fridge (note: storing in fridge will make the sourdough more sour, but you will have to feed less)
Day 11: Pour out 90% and feed - leave in fridge (or use the 90% for baking)

When baking:
Take sourdough out of fridge over night - let it get nice and warm and cozy
Use it as a replacement for yeast - just do your bread as you otherwise would
Refeed and put in fridge until the next time - stir it once a week, feeding it.
Your sourdough raise will be a lot slower than it will for yeast dough - this means that I usually bake by making the dough in the morning, and then pushing it down in the afternoon - shaping the breads, leaving them for the second raise overnight and then baking in the morning the next day - there's added advantages (taste) of this, but also issues (drying out of crust) - which is mainly what I am boxing with right now..

The sourdough makes the dough more sour (acidic) and that have some implications for the crust that sucks to figure out right now (sour maillard processes are a bitch compared to basic maillard processes).

If you cannot get the good natural sourdough going (becoming foamy and bubbly), then you can cheat a bit..

Add some yoghurt - just a tablespoon to get some cultures in there
Add some raisins - 5-10 should be enough - they have loads of natural yeast on the skin
Add some hand crafted beer - just a bit - after shaking it - there's still free floating yeast in there - look for bottles with sediment in them
Add some honey - just a bit - again yeast

The cheats are all under the assumption that you're using unprocessed, germ-filled food, rather than the other kind, which basically doesn't do anything for you - don't use filtered beer or other stuff.

And if you kill your sourdough (by forgetting to hold something back, or adding salt etc.) you can be smart, and instead of pouring 90% out when feeding, pour it on a sheet of parchment, and leave it to dry out completely - this can be stored in air tight containers (if really dry) or in the freezer and be an excellent base for the next sourdough - just rehydrate and feed.

Tastewise I think sourdough is the most fitting for coarser bread types, where the light fluffy breads don't benefit much from the sour taste.

Happy Hat
Aug 11, 2008

He just wants someone to shake his corks, is that too much to ask??


Rollofthedice posted:

So I'm a scrub who's been kneading dough with a bread machine my dad originally had lying around gathering dust in his pantry. I then shape it and bake it in the oven. I've been enjoying it a lot so far, even to the point of getting into pre-ferments and the occasional, unsatisfactory attempt at sourdough.

Here are some pics.

50% Rye bread, with caraway seeds and orange zest:



A very tasty sort of dinner bread, flavored with goat's milk:



The same idea as above, but miniaturized:


Also - this looks awesome!

Happy Hat
Aug 11, 2008

He just wants someone to shake his corks, is that too much to ask??


Also... this is one of my most recent fuckups.

70% hydration, 40/40/20 rye/stone ground whole white wheat/whole grain durum, first rise 6h, second 16h, raised in couche, baked at 280*c on a stone for 15 minutes. (steamed at 0m and at 2m).

Good crumb, not happy with crust..

Excellent taste

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exquisite tea
Apr 21, 2007

Carly shook her glass, willing the ice to melt. "You still haven't told me what the mission is."

She leaned forward. "We are going to assassinate the bad men of Hollywood."



Have any of y'all tried the America's Test Kitchen recipe for no-knead brioche, the one where you use melted butter and let the dough sit for 24 hours? I'm somewhat skeptical myself but I don't have the time or equipment to make real brioche, so I want to believe.

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