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Mellow Seas posted:Old posts but oh well A good point, in the absence of social safety nets, people were more dependent on their family, church, and/or spouse for survival. Many proponents of the traditional nuclear family have openly lamented the role that welfare programs had played in rising divorce rates and the "dissolution of black households" (nevermind that no-cause divorce was legalized).
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Jan 30, 2023 19:47
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Panfilo posted:This is a similar sentiment I see with some drug addicts. They think they are incurable, destined to continually alienate and disappoint everybody around them and resigned to just dying a gently caress up. But it's kind of a self fulfilling prophecy when you embrace that fate so hard you don't do anything about it. I'll say as someone with depression that really, really had to work on it with a therapist, there's an addictive quality to it. It's like a scratchy, uncomfortable blanket. Uglycat posted:Notre Dame doesn't exist apparently The only school they list in Massachusetts is UMass Amherst. Good thing there aren't a ton of well known schools in this state.
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Jan 31, 2023 00:16
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Neito posted:I'll say as someone with depression that really, really had to work on it with a therapist, there's an addictive quality to it. It's like a scratchy, uncomfortable blanket. It's absolutely an addiction, in a very real sense. The behaviour leads to chemical rewards for your brain, you learn to seek them out by continuing the behaviour. That it's stuff being produced by your own brain in a reaction to stimuli rather than external drugs doesn't change the addictive quality. And really, isn't "scratchy, uncomfortable blanket" an apt metaphor for all addictions? They're all ultimately stupid and destructive, but our brain likes to be tickled by a certain mix of chemicals and we teach ourselves how to accomplish that task by one means or another.
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Jan 31, 2023 00:38
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Neito posted:The only school they list in Massachusetts is UMass Amherst. Good thing there aren't a ton of well known schools in this state. There are only like four or five private universities on the list. It's weird there are so few given how much woke professors stuff is about the $60k tuition private schools all the op-ed writers attended. James Garfield fucked around with this message at 01:26 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 01:23
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https://twitter.com/VICENews/status/1619732392687636481 https://www.clevelandjewishnews.com...af331b9097.html "These are the more than 2,500 members of the “Dissident Homeschool Network,” a channel on the social network messaging app Telegram. The “dissidents” are a group of Nazi parents who share homeschooling lesson plans extolling the virtues of Hitler and white nationalism — while relying on a popular social media account run by a Jewish woman to provide ammunition for their hatred. The founders of the group were recently unmasked by a hate group monitor as a couple in rural Upper Sandusky, Ohio" "Launched in fall 2021, the Lawrences’ homeschooling project is explicitly labeled as a means for neo-Nazi parents to indoctrinate their kids by keeping them away from public school. Lesson plans include teaching cursive by having students write out famous quotes from Hitler and American neo-Nazi George Lincoln Rockwell; building “math” classes around racist manipulations of urban crime statistics; and praising Confederate general Robert E. Lee as “a grand role model for young, white men.” In idle chats, members of the group disparaged the Indiana Jones movies as “Jewish revenge porn.”"
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Jan 31, 2023 01:40
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OgNar posted:https://twitter.com/VICENews/status/1619732392687636481 "while relying on a popular social media account run by a Jewish woman," is doing a lot of heavy lifting here when they could have just said outright that Chaya Raichik is fueling literal nazis via LibsofTikTok. It's actually a lot more gross to just refer to her as, "a Jewish woman." One of these descriptions is who she is (her name) and the other calls attention to her race/religion for no reason. I bet some fuckstain editor at Vice said you had to file the serial numbers off of saying critical statements about her directly. It's so funny. These idiots wrap themselves in free speech and anarchist trappings while also, at the same time, not wanting to offend the chuds and neo-nazis that drive engagement to their content. Other RWM outlets get to be free and post whatever they want. Other left wing outlets do too. Vice, the most cucked editorial position. ErIog fucked around with this message at 04:33 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 04:30
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Neito posted:The only school they list in Massachusetts is UMass Amherst. Good thing there aren't a ton of well known schools in this state.
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Jan 31, 2023 06:36
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ErIog posted:"while relying on a popular social media account run by a Jewish woman," is doing a lot of heavy lifting here when they could have just said outright that Chaya Raichik is fueling literal nazis via LibsofTikTok. It's actually a lot more gross to just refer to her as, "a Jewish woman." One of these descriptions is who she is (her name) and the other calls attention to her race/religion for no reason. It really is annoying that outlets and right-wingers alike focus on her being Jewish as if her pro-Nazi poo poo isn't a more important element of her lovely character.
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Jan 31, 2023 11:22
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This Elizabeth Warren quote was reported on talk radio as "Warren crushing/slammong Kamala Harris"quote:Underlining the concerns, Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.), speaking on Boston radio station WGBH on Friday, shied away from a full endorsement of Harris as Biden’s 2024 running mate. Asked if the president should seek reelection, Warren responded quickly, “Yes, he should run again.” But asked if Harris should be his running mate, she said, “I really want to defer to what makes Biden comfortable on his team.” Seems pretty tame to me and comes off as Warren maybe not being super into Kamala but it's hardly some vicious takedown or anything.
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Jan 31, 2023 12:49
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Tesseraction posted:It really is annoying that outlets and right-wingers alike focus on her being Jewish as if her pro-Nazi poo poo isn't a more important element of her lovely character. The thing I find really annoying as a Jewish person is how the conversation gets flattened as if being Jewish is some kind of inoculation against being a nazi. It's 2023. Zionists in Israel voice direct support for literal nazis in Europe on the regular. Her being Jewish and a nazi is not a contradiction. That's just kind of how really devoted Zionists are. It's not an accident. They like it. It's not ironic, it's exactly as expected. They like fascist ethnostates. It's kind of their whole thing. It's really disgusting to me that they frame it that way because a lot of Jewish people, a lot of soft zionists even, disagree with her and everything she stands for. Her Judaism is neither here nor there. She's a fascist first. The fact that she found a way to be fascist and Jewish isn't material.
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Jan 31, 2023 13:22
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ErIog posted:The thing I find really annoying as a Jewish person is how the conversation gets flattened as if being Jewish is some kind of inoculation against being a nazi. It's 2023. Zionists in Israel voice direct support for literal nazis in Europe on the regular. Her being Jewish and a nazi is not a contradiction. That's just kind of how really devoted Zionists are. It's not an accident. They like it. It's not ironic, it's exactly as expected. They like fascist ethnostates. It's kind of their whole thing.
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Jan 31, 2023 13:50
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ErIog posted:The thing I find really annoying as a Jewish person is how the conversation gets flattened as if being Jewish is some kind of inoculation against being a nazi. No, that's what you're doing, flattening them into Nazis.
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Jan 31, 2023 14:01
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FlamingLiberal posted:I mean also look at Stephen Miller Or not, can I not? It's uncomfortable gazing upon eldritch snake beasts that have less mortal years on their form than I do while having such an uncanny visage.
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Jan 31, 2023 14:02
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bird food bathtub posted:Or not, can I not? It's uncomfortable gazing upon eldritch snake beasts that have less mortal years on their form than I do while having such an uncanny visage.
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Jan 31, 2023 14:39
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ErIog posted:"while relying on a popular social media account run by a Jewish woman," is doing a lot of heavy lifting here when they could have just said outright that Chaya Raichik is fueling literal nazis via LibsofTikTok. It's actually a lot more gross to just refer to her as, "a Jewish woman." One of these descriptions is who she is (her name) and the other calls attention to her race/religion for no reason. The quote is from Cleveland Jewish News, not Vice. The URL makes that pretty clear even if you don't follow the link. I suspect they refer to Raichik as a Jewish woman because they are Jewish News.
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Jan 31, 2023 15:11
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I mean, I see that rhetoric get thrown around a lot in conservative media. Right now chuds are focusing really hard on the fact that the cops that killed Tyre Nichols were black. How can black people be racist? How can it be white supremacy when it was just black on black violence? It also serves to shift the burden of what makes the person a bigot. How can Chaya Raichik be chummy with Nazis, she's Jewish! Obviously the people that hate her are the real Nazis. How can Proud Boys be racist when their leader is Afro Cuban? They pulled this again recently with a street fight that took place in (LA I think? Not sure the exact context of the clip). Proud Boys and Antifa were fighting, and the Proud Boys in the video were Latino and Asian, which served the narrative that antifa must have been the "real racists".
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Jan 31, 2023 15:40
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Panfilo posted:How can black people be racist? How can it be white supremacy when it was just black on black violence? There was a tweet linked around from a black commentator re: the Nichols murder, and he said his version of The Talk involved understanding that the race of a cop is "cop", even if their skin is black. It's worth generalizing: the race of a fascist is fascist, and the religion of a fascist is fascism. Everything else is an intentional distraction.
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Jan 31, 2023 16:29
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PeterWeller posted:The quote is from Cleveland Jewish News, not Vice. The URL makes that pretty clear even if you don't follow the link. I suspect they refer to Raichik as a Jewish woman because they are Jewish News. Sorry I didn't check hard enough before slandering the fine people at.. checks notes.. Vice News. Ignore the second paragraph of my post then. My point still stands. It's a weird way to mention but not mention Chaya Raichik. It's not acceptable from Vice or any other publication. I take even more offense that a Jewish-run outlet would do this. She shouldn't be treated with kid gloves because she's Jewish. HootTheOwl posted:No, that's what you're doing, flattening them into Nazis. gently caress off. These people ARE Nazis. It's not like a thing I'm doing where I twist their words or make comparisons. Literal Nazis are giving thumbs up to her because she engages in eliminationist rhetoric about people she and they don't like. I'm comfortable calling a lot of even more tangentially-related people Nazis, even, but this is a case where it's like, "drat, were IBM really Nazis for building the counting machines that helped the holocaust? This is so hard.." Yes, you get to call the people that help Nazis and that Nazis like Nazis. You just do. FlamingLiberal posted:I mean also look at Stephen Miller Miller, Kuschner, etc. It's literally out in the open. These people are fascists, and the only purpose invoking their religion serves is to run cover for the gentiles who are also Nazis. I'm not gonna police who is and isn't Jewish, but the opinion that you gotta be somehow extra careful in calling out fascist behavior in people who happen to be Jewish has allowed this poo poo to get oxygen for decades. It's bad. If you're a fascist you should get called the gently caress out and shamed. shoeberto posted:There was a tweet linked around from a black commentator re: the Nichols murder, and he said his version of The Talk involved understanding that the race of a cop is "cop", even if their skin is black. Yes, and also the Panfilo post regarding racial clouding by Nazis is really on point. Modern Nazis have a very good understanding of modern racial norms and they know that by appearing to do something that seems contradictory they can complicate the discussion. This is why you take it back to fundamentals. People engaging in fascism are fascists. People espousing fascist ideas are fascists. People whose job it is to do fascism are fascists. Doesn't matter who they are. ErIog fucked around with this message at 16:41 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 16:29
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The article is even specifically talking about open neo-Nazis who teach their kids cursive by writing quotes of Hitler. This isn't one of those "calling every conservative you don't like a Nazi" situations.
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Jan 31, 2023 16:36
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Tesseraction posted:The article is even specifically talking about open neo-Nazis who teach their kids cursive by writing quotes of Hitler. This isn't one of those "calling every conservative you don't like a Nazi" situations. Everyone is a nazi except actual nazis, who are fine.
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Jan 31, 2023 16:41
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ErIog posted:gently caress off. These people ARE Nazis. It's not like a thing I'm doing where I twist their words or make comparisons. Literal Nazis are giving thumbs up to her because she engages in eliminationist rhetoric about people she and they don't like. I'm comfortable calling a lot of even more tangentially-related people Nazis, even, but this is a case where it's like, "drat, were IBM really Nazis for building the counting machines that helped the holocaust? This is so hard.." quote:Yes, you get to call the people that help Nazis and that Nazis like Nazis. You just do. Or you can keep doing the exact thing you're mad others are doing, and flatten all your enemies into one easy to label group because so you don't have to make the effort to actually figure out who's what.
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Jan 31, 2023 16:43
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HootTheOwl posted:No you shut the gently caress up here. I shouldn't have to explain to you how deeply hosed up it is to call people missing half their family tree Nazis because they're fascists. If you want to call them fascists do so. If you want to call them genocidal maniacs do so. They're Nazis. A word for "Jewish person working to pick targets for Nazis" is Nazi Piell fucked around with this message at 16:47 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 16:44
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ErIog posted:"while relying on a popular social media account run by a Jewish woman," is doing a lot of heavy lifting here when they could have just said outright that Chaya Raichik is fueling literal nazis via LibsofTikTok. It's actually a lot more gross to just refer to her as, "a Jewish woman." One of these descriptions is who she is (her name) and the other calls attention to her race/religion for no reason. In any story involving Nazis, whether someone involved is Jewish or not is relevant, because a key part of Nazi ideology is venomous hatred of Jews. Here we can see these particular Nazis, who say they do not like Jews and don't want to engage with media made by Jews, still do it as much as anyone else when the content of the media is to their satisfaction. It's interesting and even a little amusing. Civilized Fishbot fucked around with this message at 16:49 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 16:45
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Piell posted:They're Nazis. A word for "Jewish person working to pick targets for Nazis" is Nazi It's not, and it's completely and utterly moronic to say so.
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Jan 31, 2023 16:48
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Jewish collaborators were called kapos, although as a gentile I'd tend to avoid using the term myself. Hence why in Raichik's case I call her "pro-Nazi" as opposed to kapo or Nazi directly.
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Jan 31, 2023 16:52
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I don't understand why some members of a group getting murdered by Nazis prevents some other people in that group from being Nazis themselves anyway. Like intellectually you'd hope they wouldn't (and you'd also hope on general humanity that no one would ever become a Nazi), but realistically sometimes they do. Can Poles become Nazis? Can homosexuals become Nazis? Can handicapped people become Nazis?
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Jan 31, 2023 16:55
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Tesseraction posted:Jewish collaborators were called kapos, although as a gentile I'd tend to avoid using the term myself. Hence why in Raichik's case I call her "pro-Nazi" as opposed to kapo or Nazi directly. I'm Jewish and also similarly missing parts of my family tree. Chaya Raichik is a Nazi. VitalSigns posted:I don't understand why some members of a group getting murdered by Nazis prevents some other people in that group from being Nazis themselves anyway. Like intellectually you'd hope they wouldn't (and you'd also hope on general humanity that no one would ever become a Nazi), but realistically sometimes they do. This! This is the thing. Nazis killed a lot of Jewish people. They also killed nearly as many disabled people, leftists, homosexuals, transgender people, anarchists, and any general shitkicker they didn't like. People have this fantasy that Nazis picked their prey carefully. They didn't. They set the ideal, and then they sought to eliminate EVERYONE outside of it. They chose Jews as a cover for the rest of it because anti-semitism was so prevalent. ErIog fucked around with this message at 16:59 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 16:56
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ErIog posted:I'm Jewish and also similarly missing parts of my family tree. Chaya Raichik is a Nazi. In her case I tend to agree so it was little funny watching her pikachu face when Kanye started spewing his poo poo and all the people she followed were nodding in agreement and calling it based.
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Jan 31, 2023 16:59
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Tesseraction posted:In her case I tend to agree so it was little funny watching her pikachu face when Kanye started spewing his poo poo and all the people she followed were nodding in agreement and calling it based. To take it back to Right Wing Media here after this derail, the thing about people like Chaya Raichik is that they don't actually flinch when they hear people like Kanye. People who have a kind of a zealotry in their Zionism literally hate most Jewish people that currently exist on Earth for not supporting the Zionist movement. Eli Valley depicts this and discusses this a lot. Out of one side of their mouth they will say they value the diaspora and the range of Jewish experience in the world, and then out of the other side they will condemn them as fake Jews. Mark Levin does this constantly. They agree with it. They're basically Nazi pickme's.
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Jan 31, 2023 17:03
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I'm Jewish and happy to call Raichik and Kushner Nazis. The word for someone who willingly works with or for Nazis is Nazi. Kapos were prisoners, at least, and so their issue is complex, and even then I'm pretty drat comfortable condemning them. But point is, there is an element of coercion present with the kapos that is not present with Raichik or Kushner or other Jews who help modern day fascists. They are not being forced to choose to be the oppressor rather than the oppressed when forced into a monstrous situation. Raichik is not a prisoner in a death camp choosing to throw transpeople under the bus to try and save herself. She is doing it because she is a fascist and she hates transpeople and she greatly desires their deaths.
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Jan 31, 2023 17:08
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ErIog posted:To take it back to Right Wing Media here after this derail, the thing about people like Chaya Raichik is that they don't actually flinch when they hear people like Kanye. People who have a kind of a zealotry in their Zionism literally hate most Jewish people that currently exist on Earth for not supporting the Zionist movement. Eli Valley depicts this and discusses this a lot. Likewise Sam Seder pointed out that for Ben Shapiro's criticisms of Stephen Crowder talking about "secular people with Jewish surnames" Shapiro himself had tweeted the exact same thing years prior, to say nothing of him calling any Jewish person who voted for Obama a kapo.
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Jan 31, 2023 17:14
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I didn't get the impression that the Cleveland Jewish News was trying to downplay her actions, if that was their goal they wouldn't have outed and named her as the organizer of a an explicitly neo-Nazi organization. The line mentioning she is jewish seemed more like a point of irony, and I'm pretty sure the editors of that paper are well aware of the number of historical jewish-fascist collaborators But yes it's generally bad to use identity as the sole means to signal or discern motive
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Jan 31, 2023 17:27
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ErIog posted:To take it back to Right Wing Media here after this derail, the thing about people like Chaya Raichik is that they don't actually flinch when they hear people like Kanye. People who have a kind of a zealotry in their Zionism literally hate most Jewish people that currently exist on Earth for not supporting the Zionist movement. I think it's very weird to start insisting that this right-wing Chabadnik actually hates Jews just because she hates trans people. She's just got ordinary right-wing Chabadnik politics, which are philosemitic and transphobic. I'm Jewish - more importantly I'm pedantic - and I wouldn't call someone a Nazi if they don't hate Jewish people because that's a pretty core element of Nazism. I also wouldn't call Nathan Bedford Forrest or Benito Mussolini Nazis, or call HItler a Klansman. For me it's enough to say someone's a reactionary contributing to violence, that's actually bad whether you do it German-style or White American-style or Chabad-style. Civilized Fishbot fucked around with this message at 17:55 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 17:48
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Civilized Fishbot posted:just because she hates trans people And gay people, and black people, and queer people, etc. she's got a very short list of people she doesn't hate.
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Jan 31, 2023 17:52
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ErIog posted:Sorry I didn't check hard enough before slandering the fine people at.. checks notes.. Vice News. Ignore the second paragraph of my post then. My point still stands. It's a weird way to mention but not mention Chaya Raichik. It's not acceptable from Vice or any other publication. I take even more offense that a Jewish-run outlet would do this. She shouldn't be treated with kid gloves because she's Jewish. Nobody's sticking up for Vice. There are numerous reasons, some already mentioned, why a Jewish news organization might want to point out that Nazis are relying on a Jewish woman's social media. They may not want to mention her name because she is a piece of poo poo and they don't want to drive any traffic her way.
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Jan 31, 2023 17:52
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Civilized Fishbot posted:Most Jews are Zionists. Virtually all the Jews who live in Israel, which is about half, are Zionists, and then most of us here in the US, which is near-about the other half, are Zionists. And then the diaspora outside the US are generally more supportive of Zionism than the diaspora in the US. Nah, a lot of those Zionists in Israel hate the diaspora Jews and see them as not being supportive enough of the Zionist project even if they say they nominally agree with it. You see it every time anyone Jewish says that maybe Israel should try to lay off murdering children in the West Bank. I will also reiterate that the thing that marked Nazism was not the targeting of any specific group. The criteria was not being "Aryan," and not being of use to the Nazi state. The Nazis exterminated 10-12 million people: Jews, Slavs, Roma, disabled people, leftists, gay people, trans people, socialists, and others. It's offensive for you to say it only becomes Nazism when it's about elimination of Jews and not when it's the elimination of all the other people Nazis exterminated. It's pretty much exactly the thing the First They Came For.. poem was decrying. So Raichik wants to eliminate trans people and most likely also Palestinians. She can work backward through my list and not be a Nazi until she hits Jews? Sounds dumb. ErIog fucked around with this message at 22:31 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 22:23
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ErIog posted:Nah, a lot of those Zionists in Israel hate the diaspora Jews and see them as not being supportive enough of the Zionist project even if they say they nominally agree with it. You see it every time anyone Jewish says that maybe Israel should try to lay off murdering children in the West Bank. Raichik isn't an Israeli Zionist, she's an American Chabadnik. quote:I will also reiterate that the thing that marked Nazism was not the targeting of any specific group. The criteria was not being "Aryan," and not being of use to the Nazi state. The Nazis exterminated 10-12 million people: Jews, Slavs, Roma, disabled people, leftists, gay people, trans people, socialists, and others. It's offensive for you to say it only becomes Nazism when it's about elimination of Jews and not when it's the elimination of all the other people Nazis exterminated. It's pretty much exactly the thing the First They Came For.. poem was decrying. There's plenty of awful ideology and violence in this world that isn't Nazism. If you don't hate Jews and love Hitler, you're not a Nazi, you're some other kind of fascist sicko. "Nazi/not Nazi" has no moral weight to it when we're already dealing with fascist sickos
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Jan 31, 2023 22:29
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Civilized Fishbot posted:Raichik isn't an Israeli Zionist, she's an American Chabadnik. I'm not saying she is. I'm saying that her words and her appearances in media that push anti-diaspora Israeli Zionist talking points lead me to believe she agrees with them and those points. Considering she's a Chabad Republican, I don't think that's a huge leap. It's rare for Jewish people, but there's still many of them. Some of them worked directly in the Trump administration. ErIog fucked around with this message at 22:38 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 22:33
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I don't have much interest in the slapfight, but the last few pages have brought to mind that I don't think I've read a single article on Chaya Raichik that didn't mention her religion.
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Feb 1, 2023 02:52
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shoeberto posted:
Yup
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