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 Etrian Odyssey Untold out in Europe on May 2nd! Buy it now, gogogo! If you already have one of the games, and are looking for advice on getting started, skip down to the second post.  nce upon a time there was a company named Sir-tech. In 1981, they released the first-person RPG Wizardry: Proving Grounds of the Mad Overlord. It was the the beginning of a beautiful franchise. Between the Wizardry series and titles like Jagged Alliance, Sir-tech remained a fixture of the PC gaming scene for many, many years. Alas, the free market turned against them and the company's last subsidiary filed for bankruptcy in 2003, after the release of Wizardry 8. With the passing of the years, they became naught but memory; then myth; and then they were forgotten. But not by everyone. Japan remembered. The original game had a huge impact on the country's then-nascent video game culture, inspiring people such as Dragon Quest creator Yuji Horii. A small but dedicated fanbase kept the flame alive for the game's blend of first-person exploration, and unforgiving difficulty. Even the rights to the Wizardry name now belong to a Japanese company called IPM, Inc. Which brings us to 2007, and the release of 世界樹の迷宮 (Sekaiju no Meikyū, literally "Labyrinth of Yggdrasill") by Atlus. Having released the unrelated title Yggdra Union earlier in the year, they renamed it Etrian Odyssey for US/European release to avoid confusion. The rest is history. About the Games: At heart, the EO series is a love letter to the early days of RPGs. Design your party from the ground up, with an absolute minimum amount of hand-holding, and go nuts. Each game features 25+ floors of 3D labyrinth to explore, loot for treasure, and, of course get horribly murdered in. All exploration takes place in first person, with the player expected to draw their own map on the DS' bottom screen. Enemy and character sprites are simple 2D images with minimal-to-nonexistent animation. Series mainstay Yuzo Koshiro even composes all the music with chiptunes. That's not to say the storage space of a contemporary medium goes to waste: these are BIG games. The first title ran smack-dab into the memory limitations of a DS cart, and all entries since then have continued the trend. These are very deliberately 'old-school' games, but they were made by people who understand modern game design, best exemplified byOH poo poo GOON was ambushed by Japanese fan video that shows up in every EO thread! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dB_PVPyn6n8 FOE stands for 'Field On Enemy' in Japan, but Atlus USA chose to localize it as a truly sublime bit of Latin: Formido Oppugnatura Exsequens (very roughly, "ancient and terrible force of nature"). Whereas the rest of the game's enemies appear only in random battles, the F.O.E is a pseudo-Roguelike element that stays visible on both the map and gameplay screens. They move in tandem with every step you take, and with each turn in battle (which they can freely join). Some just mind their own business. Others will hound your every step. A few even lie hidden in wait until you're involved in a random encounter, so keep one eye on the map screen! You do not want to get caught by one of these guys when you're unprepared. See, a typical F.O.E is far stronger then anything else on the floor. Fighting them is never mandatory, but get caught unawares or hit a dead end and Bambi's mum will stomp all over your poo poo. In contrast with the static challenge of mazes and dead ends, trap doors and damage floors, the F.O.E is a dynamic obstacle for the player to overcome. It's not all bad though! A slain F.O.E rewards you with rare drops, and more importantly, STAYS dead for an in-game week or two. Clear all of them out of an area and you can hunt for resources to sell, quest in relative peace, and get killed by a run-of-the-mill random encounter instead. Would you enjoy the series? Well... Neither the DS nor 3DS games are graphics trendsetters, and they're tough games with bare-bone stories. However, while the series is challenging, it's not so much sadistic as unforgiving. Beating an EO game requires a combination of Dark Souls-style pattern recognition, and the long-term risk management/survival strategy of a good Roguelike. You learn how to play by dying a lot. It's a niche product, but the design is very tight. If you miss RPG battles with actual tension and tactical choices to make, then the EO series is a fine choice. Which One Should I Play First? If you have a 3DS, Etrian Odyssey IV or EO: Untold. They're roughly equal in quality. If a DS is your only option play EOIII. Enjoy yourself? Then you can take a crack at the others, but the further back you go, the fewer conveniences you'll find. Core gameplay doesn't vary a lot between games, but it gets progressively more polished. With each, the designers tinker with the math, refine the skill trees, and rebalance the classes. Some people favor the particular balance one game struck over the others, but none of them are broken. EOI-III also make incremental graphic improvements. EOIV and EOU on the 3DS are exponentially better, with actual enemy models to represent F.O.Es instead of color-coded fuzzballs. MUSIC ARGUMENTS OKAY NOW I GUESS  The Labyrinth swallowed all... Innocents were stranded; sinners drowned in the depths; the damned vanished there. The great power was lost to Man, and Mother Earth turned her back to the new world. Only the cursed king on his throne in the abyss remembers that golden age.
Official Atlus page for Etrian Odyssey LP by 100percentjesusfree in progress; currently on B18F.  When civilization sunk beneath the seven seas, deep forests spread across the five remaining islands. Only the chosen ones escaped the waters in their castle stronghold. Eventually the waves overtook even the last five islands... And the castle was all that remained. After the passing of ages, the people of the floating castle chose to descend upon their mother soil. These are the chronicles of the land of High Lagaard.
Official Atlus page for 'Heroes of Lagaard'  Hie thee to the ocean city... To the Yggdrasil Labyrinth. A journey to the blue depths... To conquer the shadows of night. Though you know not what this means, you go towards Armoroad. What awaits is time's end; death's demise. A tempestuous dream... To push away the unfathomable dark and bring light to Armoroad. A stormy adventure begins...
Official Atlus page for 'The Drowned City' EO3 Skill Simulator (super helpful for planning builds, and if you want to know the exact percentages behind the math)  As divine verdure fertilizes; The malign verdure corrupts. What is left is a holy husk. Hollow ones cling to faith; Fanged ones honor power; Foolish sages protect a lie. But the Medium's song remains, guiding you to Yggdrasil. You hold the wings to soar in this tempestuous saga. Winds of beginning, blow now...
Official Atlus page for 'Legends of the Titan' Japanese gameplay trailer (Now available in English!) EOIV Skill simulator; names may change for US release (Still very much a work in progress but handy as a preview. Also spoilers for the unlockable classes, I guess? It never bothered me, but YMMV)  "We've received a quest from a town called Etria. It seems they need a Highlander's aid. This will be a dangerous mission but I have faith you can do it. You are bound to the far East. Show them a Highlander's justice."
Official Atlus page for 'Etrian Odyssey Untold: The Increasingly Cumbersome Subtitle' Rangpur fucked around with this message at 20:00 on May 2, 2014 |
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Nov 9, 2012 02:16
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(Hilariously, this means Japan is getting an album of chiptune arrangements for the game's music instead of the usual orchestral remix.)
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Lots of people play the EO series. A far smaller number continue to play after hitting one of the game's many infamous walls, let alone finish the game and remain fans afterwards. I will be using this post to explain general strategy for the games, which you all are welcome to critique if you think I'm full of poo poo. So, without further ado... HOW TO LABYRINTH General Advice: The first thing you need to know is that there IS a 'right' way to play Etrian Odyssey games, but it's not a reference to specific skills, so much as understanding the way skills work. Long term, you'll also want to learn the most efficient ways to grind XP or money--and you WILL need to do this at some point. Which brings us to
The games are not balanced for a single party to overcome all obstacles, beat all the monsters, and loot all the resources. If you try to build a party that can do ALL of that you will find them falling short in all three. Early on you want a party skilled in handling enemy mobs, and one geared towards gathering resources. Name the latter Farmbot1, 2, and 3 if you want, but you need them because gathering resources requires gathering skills, and the opportunity cost for a starting party will be a major detriment. Later on, when your options for leveling and money-making have expanded consider building up a third party: one designed to hunt and kill FOEs and bosses. We will discuss these further down. But it has to be said that no matter you do you will run into
All of this so far applies across the entire series, NOW comes the game-specific advice. I'll attempt to keep plot points out of this, but it's not possible to discuss them in depth and remain totally spoiler-free so consider yourself warned.  Etrian Odyssey: "Never underestimate the labyrinth." Class and Party Builds: The first game in the series also has the most straightforward class selection to start with, so an 'orthodox' RPG party will serve you well. Protector and Landsknecht up front, Medic-Alchemist-Survivalist in the back. Dark Hunters can also serve well in the front line if you want an additional melee character but the class doesn't truly come into its own until EOII. You will want a Troubadour... eventually. Their Relaxation song provides passive TP recovery to the entire party, which is a Godsend on long expeditions. However, just unlocking it takes 12 skill points, and maxing it will take another 10, so it won't do you much good early on. Skill effectiveness can scale very oddly at times, but the rule of thumb is to assign each 1, 5, or 10 points--those are almost always the levels with the best gain for the investment. Protectors and Medics will want to start building towards Defender and Immunize right away, but this won't handicap starting parties. The skills required are ones you'd want to invest in anyway. Protectors should drop at least a point into Provoke even though it doesn't contribute to learning Defender; all that tankiness won't do much good if the enemies aren't targeting you. An Alchemist's ultimate goal is too max one of the second tier, single target elemental spells. Pound for pound, these are some of the best damage dealers in the game (the target-all elemental spells by contrast are not very good for the cost). But the skill to max FIRST is Poison. Poison is a very dangerous status ailment, but unlike most RPGs this applies equally to the enemy. Poison damage also ignore defense. The downside? Well, it might not loving work and then you've wasted the TP, and your Alchemist's turn. It's a high risk/high reward strategy: Poison is the quickest way to killing FOEs you would not otherwise be able to handle, and make no mistake if you can kill that giant mantis the first time you fight it the XP gains are nuts. For Landsknechts, the golden skill is AllSlash while Survivalists will want Multihit, and later Apollon. They otherwise have less pressure on their early skill points than many other classes. Anything that increases a Landsknecht's damage dealing capabilities is worth considering. The Chase <element> skill that complements your Alchemist is one possibility... but do note you won't have access to any of the skills I mentioned if you specialize in axes. So don't do that. For Survivalists, I recommend investing in Ambush/Aware, a pair of passives that together cut way down on occurrences of 'party was ambushed!; monster used <total bullshit>!; party is dead!' But gently caress that old and busted stuff, let's talk the new hotness. Ronin do more damage than a Landsknecht of similar level, and move faster. So what's the problem? They've got crap for defense, and their equipment doesn't do much to improve it. You'll want to dump your skill points in one of the three Ronin stances--Overhead, Seigan, or Iai--which they need to activate before using attack skills. Each offers powerful attack skills, and a STR based elemental attack. The Iai skills have better speed modifiers, while Overhead skills are slower and stronger but you can't go wrong choosing so long as you stick primarily to one of them. Meanwhile Hexers have the vital-in-an-Atlus-game debuffs, multi-target binds, and every status ailment, save poison. Not as broken as they are in the second game, but still exceptionally useful. It's hard to screw either of the two unlockable classes up too badly. Making Money: This is a snapshot of the exit on B1F:  The sparkly bit right next to the exit is a resource node. Five 1st level survivalists with all their points in the Chop skill can use it 15 times/day. The Inn charges 16en a night. I trust no further explanation is needed? Here's a little more anyway: even if you don't want to maintain a bunch of farmbots, I suggest going through this at least a few times so you can get your starting team fully kitted out. FWIW, you find your first 'Take' node on B3F, and the first 'Mine' nodes on B4F. EOII has an even more efficient way of harvesting money based on collecting the conditional drops of Stratum bosses. But most of the bosses in the first game don't have those. Their rare drops are just... rare. Too bad! There is one notable exception to this: the boss of the third stratum has a conditional drop you earn by killing it with its head bound. Fortunately grinding bosses--they respawn every 14 days--isn't that hard. Power scales in such a way that if you spend those 14 days exploring the new stratum you just unlocked the previous boss will be a joke by the time he pops up to fight again. Staying Alive: Mostly covered under party builds, but here are a few other bits of useful for planning how to keep your drat fool selves in one piece.
EOII - Heroes of Lagaard: "But our guild could never even get close to the floating castle..." Class and Party Builds: Everything old is new again! Sort of. Compared to the first game, a lot of skills got more expensive with costs that ramp up faster as well. Medics and Protectors both lost a useful ability (Immunize and Defender, respectively), but its Alchemists and Survivalists that got screwed the worst. The steeper TP curve and additional options for Elemental damage makes the class more trouble than it's worth. Survivalists retain their valuable exploration skills, but their damage output has dropped precipitously. There's still a use for them, but not in your main combat party. The Dark Hunter skill Climax now works at >55% health when maxed, and both sword and whip specialists can use the exceptionally useful Bait/Magibait counter skills. If you drop skill points into both sword and whip master, anyway. Hexers get access to poison, half the reason Alchemists are redundant. Ronin lose the stat-buffing effect of their stances but no longer need to spend a turn activating a stance before using the skills. The skills themselves remain largely the same. Gunners are the other half of the reason Alchemists were made redundant, since their elemental shots do the same thing, and their basic attack doesn't suck. It can also be used from the back row. AND they have attacks with binding riders. I recommend specializing in one of them, and one element. Later on you can respec them to get Multishot. The War Magus is a 'jack-of-all-trades' class but more useful than that makes them sound. They're invaluable in the first stratum for HP Regen, a minor but free, passive full-party heal that triggers every turn. Their War Edge skill tree gives them sword attacks with additional effects if the enemy is afflicted by certain ailments, while War Lore is partial Medic healer skill tree--it lacks Resurrection and Full Cures but it will do the job, and it's nice having a healer who can still do things when everyone is topped up. Also note: their War Edge skills are considered magic attacks for purposes of enemy's with physical immunity.  Beasts--accessible after completing the 1st Stratum--are statted to serve a role similar to Protectors e.g., High HP and VIT. Unlike Protectors their Loyalty skill is a passive. At max ranks it's a 75% chance the Beast will take an attack in place of another party member. Automatically. Forever. Of course you can't turn it off so keeping them alive will be tricky. Beast exclusive armor is powerful but enough to make up for missing the rest. Fill the leftover slots with accessories as needed. Devour is probably their most damaging single-target attack skill and it heals based on the damage you do. Bodyslam is a solid choice as well. Of course if you REALLY want resource gathering capability on your main party, their Fetch skill can be used at any item point. None of the points you sink into the LUC and TEC prequisites will do you much good otherwise though. One final note: each class has an exclusive Force technique. Force techniques are 'super moves' usable only when the character's Force meter is full. This fills slowly as you battle in the Labyrinth. Taking/receiving damage or actions add Force points; more of each gets you more. Fleeing from battle lowers it. Dying resets it, as does returning to town. This mechanic existed in the first game as well, but activating 'Boost,' as they called it, merely turbocharged whatever skill you used in conjunction. 'Force Skills' stand entirely apart. Nor or all of them straight damage-dealers. The Medic and Beast Force Skills heal, revive the dead, and cure status ailments. A War Magus will heal your party, but cannot resurrect dead members--instead they apply a massive defense buff. Troubadours enhance ATK, DEF, and max HP. Perhaps most importantly, the Protector's Force Skill negates ALL damage for the entire party that turn. Dark Hunters' Domination applies all 3 binds to one enemy with a 100% success rate. Beating the final, ultimate boss usually requires extensive abuse of both. Overall, EOII rewards more aggressive party builds. Beasts over Protectors, Gunners over Alchemists, Dark Hunters and Ronin over Landsknechts, War Magi over Medics. Do note however, a Protector and a Hexer are both necessary for the post game. Making Money: Sending your farmbots out to gather still works, but it is super-tedious. Also every time you gather there's a chance your party will be ambushed by a monster from several floors up. There is no way to prevent this. I believe the odds are LUC-based? ESC-up is a handy investment for anyone you want to farm with. But the real money is Stratum Boss conditional drops. How MUCH money? The normal drop of the 1st Stratum Boss is worth 776en. The conditional? 30,000en. Just one of them should solve your money problems until the postgame. Here's how to get 'em!
Staying Alive: Here are the unlock requirements for the common healing items. Note that you may find these, or even their more powerful variants in chests before you can buy them in the shop. These merely mark the point where you can maintain a steady supply.
And finally, there are two notable non-storyline walls which the game isn't very helpful in overcoming. The Tree Key is required to unlock the sealed doors you keep stumbling across. It can be purchased from an NPC on 17F for 10,000en. If you wish to fully explore the 6th Stratum complete the following quest chain: 'Rendering Assistance' --> 'The Second Grail' --> 'Blood for the Grail.'  EOIII - The Drowned City: "End this madness." Class and Party Builds: Hoooo, boy... Almost every class in the game is different or radically modified from what came before, so I'm just going to do this first part in list format. The classes behind <spoiler> tags are unlocked after finishing the third stratum.
Got all that down? Too bad! Now we talk sub-classing. Available after you complete the 2nd Stratum, sub-classing grants you a one time bonus of 5 skill points, and access to another class' skill list, minus their exclusive. It is this feature that lets you customize your EOIII party like no other. Remember though: it will not change your stats, and it will not change the armor you equip. A Zodiac who sub-classes into Gladiator will still be too squishy for the frontline, and their low STR makes learning the weapon skills pointless. Teach them Charge, on the other hand, and the damage from Meteor goes from high to 'ludicrous.' The number of possible combinations are too numerous to go into, but here are a few of the most popular to get you thinking (the class listed first is always considered the PRIMARY class; switching the primary and secondary classes does not guarantee the same results since many of these builds depend on a class' exclusive skills or equipment lists).
Making Money: (AKA, 'Pasaran grinding') Bosses in EOIII still have conditional drops, but the requirements for getting them have tightened considerably--you will not be able to beat Narmer on BF4 with a solo party member the first time you fight him. Alas most of them are now worth a mere 10,000en instead of the previous game's 30K. However, there is yet another new method of making money fast, though you will have to wait until you reach the 5th Stratum. On your journey downwards, you will occasionally see a gold-colored FOE icon spawn on your map. Chasing them down is tricky, as they can pass through walls and will actively avoid you. Touch them, and you will enter battle with a Pasaran. There are four varieties, one for each of the first four strata (they're all named 'Pasaran' but each has its own bestiary entry). All have very high defense/evasion, and typically flee or self-destruct within the first couple turns. Should you manage to slay one, they are worth thousands of XP each. Very handy for level building! However, the type you encounter in the 5th Stratum onwards are called 'Blue Pasaran,' and their XP is piddly. Yet they have a secret: strike them with a Volt attack and they will produce a Yellow Pasaran, ala Gremlins. Fire attacks result in a Red Pasaran. The former drop Happiness Fluff, which sells for 50,000en a pop. The latter are worth buckets of XP. The best part? You can keep splitting off new Pasaran for as long as they hold out. It's tricky--all of them are prone to running or exploding but you can earn up to 999,999 XP in one fight. And just for the sake of completeness, here's the conditional drops for the storyline bosses:
Staying Alive: Core gameplay hasn't changed a ton, despite the new classes, so I'll be focusing on the new system mechanics EOIII introduced plus the other strategies for rapid XP grinding.  Step one: if you run into one of these during your first trip to the Labyrinth, run. FORGING WEAPONS Certain weapons (and armor, though you can't modify the latter) have little symbols as part of their statblock. They have the effects listed below (all are cumulative). If a stat/element is marked with an (*) that means you can add forges of that aspect to any weapon with an empty slot, if you find the appropriate Hammer. Most are found in the labyrinth, but some you get as a reward for quest completion. Most weapons have 1-3 empty slots, a handful have 4 and there's a single post-game sword and katana with 8 empty slots to customize. STR/VIT/TEC/AGI/LUC(*): +1 for that stat HP/TP: +5% ATK:(*)increases physical damage by 3% HIT:(*)increases accuracy rate by 3% CRI:(*)increases critical rate by 3% SPD: increases action speed. 1 SPD is worth about 2 AGI (see below) LIM: increases the Limit gain for a given action by 0.5 Element: Fire (*) , Ice (*), Volt (*), Slash, Pierce, Blunt Weapon - inflict +10% of base damage as element Armor - resist +10%. 10 => single digit damage Binds (*), blind (*), sleep (*), poison(*), paralysis(*), plague (*), confusion(*), stun (*): Weapon - inflict @ 6% for 1, 3% each for more. 8 => 27% Armor - resist @ 10% each. 10 => immune Death (*), Petrification (*): Weapon - inflict @ 4% for 1, 2% each for more. 8 => 18% Armor - resist @ 10% each. 10 => immune There are two limits on this. First, the cost of forging a weapon is a 1/4 the purchase price + it uses up the same ingredients from your stock you needed to unlock the weapon. Thus, turning your dagger into a lean, mean poisoning machine may render you unable to buy additional, base versions of that particular knife. Second, only empty slots may be customized. If a weapon has forges pre-equipped they cannot be modified. Most of this is straightforward, but there is one important point of note: elemental forges only proc off normal attacks. If fighting an enemy immune to Volt damage with a Volt-forged weapon, using a weapon skill like a Buccaneer's Hanging will still do base damage. The chance for a staus forge to proc is cumulative with the percentage from class skills, but since this only effects normal attacks, it's only relevant with a Gladiator's Stun Attack, or a Ninja's instant-death Kubikiri (and the Death forging hammer is on B25F, so not super-relevant for 99% of the game). THE NEED FOR SPEED In EO games, turn order for you and the enemy is determined by the AGI stat x the speed modifier (100% for normal attacks, with most active skills modifying that up or down) I & II had a unique speed modifier for every single active skill, that rose or fell depending how many points you put into it. If you want complete listings of that noise, try GameFAQS. EOIII simplifies this: the speed modifier is now additive rather than multiplicative, and determined by equipment rather than individual skills. Thus: Dagger: +3 Rapier: +2 Katana: +1 Sword : +0 Fist : +0 Gun : -1 Book : -1 Crossbow: -2 Spear : -3 Hammer: -4 Shoes: +4 Clothes: +2 Gloves: +1 Helmets: +0 Accessories: +0 Light armor: -1 Shields: -1 Heavy armor: -2 The Farmer-only weapons are an exception: they all have a +0 modifier, regardless of type. In addition, the Bikini Armor--available via the Deep Prelate's rare drop on B14F--has a whopping +10 speed modifier. (And despite the name, both genders can equip it. Progress!) Perhaps you've also noticed boots offer lousy defense compared to everything else, and wondered why anyone would bother? Well, now you know! Especially useful for Wildlings, who shine brightest when they can prevent the enemy from acting altogether, but possess a lackluster AGI stat. But even fast-acting characters can use equipment to gain an edge over equally fast enemies. THE SCYLLA EXPLOIT If grinding needs doing, best it were done quickly. Until your party is tough enough to treat post-game bosses like Dragon, Drake, and Wyrm as grist for leveling newbie guild members, the Pasaran trick (covered above under 'Making Money') is going to be your primary means of grinding out levels in a hurry. This is not terribly reliable however, and requires a specific skillset. However, if you've been making progress exploring the ocean there is another way... The 2nd-or-3rd to last destination in sailing mode is 'Trade City Aeaea' which grants access to the sea quest "For a Mutated Girl..." where you can fight Scylla. Your NPC companion for the fight is a Tiger summoning Wildling. A Tiger's first action when summoned is to use the Death Gaze ability, which has a 30% of insta-killing enemies at max skill ranks. I believe the 'Wild Mastery' skill (which you have to max anyway to get 'Call Tiger') adds another 15% or so. Most bosses in the game are resistant to instant death--full immunity is rare, but their resistance is so high the odds of triggering it are fantastically unlikely. However... someone found a way to make it go off on Scylla every time. Since summoning his Tiger is the NPC's first action every fight, and Scylla's first action is always a physical attack with pathetic accuracy, well, you get the idea. It works as follows:
Onward to adventure, mf'ers!  Art insert for EOIV bonus booklet by Alexandra 'Lexxy' Douglass (click to view her tumblr) Rangpur fucked around with this message at 20:25 on Mar 12, 2013 |
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Nov 9, 2012 02:17
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Rangpur posted:[*]OMG actual music instead of chiptunes worst sequel ever! Actually they got PC-88 chiptune remixes for all of the previous games too. I actually like some of them better than the originals. And yeah, the new music is goddamn amazing. Hope the rest of the game is just as good.
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Nov 9, 2012 02:26
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I am seriously considering LPing EO3. Talk me out of this, goons.
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Nov 9, 2012 02:48
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Well this is good timing. Should I feel bad about the whole Defender/Immunize thing in EO1? I just got to 3F and the game keeps trying to push my poo poo in at every opportunity 
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Nov 9, 2012 02:56
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Bellmaker posted:Well this is good timing. Nah, EO1 is a pretty tedious and badly balanced game so you shouldn't feel bad about taking every edge you can get in it.
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Nov 9, 2012 02:57
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Any word on pre-order items? The artbook you got for 3 is one of the nicest ones I ever got that wasn't a retail product. I'm super excited for this. I need something to play before we get SMT 4.
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Nov 9, 2012 03:00
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theshim posted:I am seriously considering LPing EO3. No. Do it. 
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Nov 9, 2012 03:01
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theshim posted:I am seriously considering LPing EO3. Do it so more people will buy it and get horribly murdered by a butterfly.
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Nov 9, 2012 03:12
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I'm really looking forward to EO4, I loved EO1 and 3 (despite never completing them). Also, if you REALLY can't wait for EO4 and love Wizardry-type games, go pick up The Dark Spire for the DS if you haven't already. It's different in many ways but really scratches that dungeon-crawling itch (it's also far less anime). theshim posted:I am seriously considering LPing EO3. Do it, so I can see the ending. I got really discouraged when it turned out I hosed up getting the True Ending path.
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Nov 9, 2012 03:13
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The tricky part to EOIII's true ending is that the flag for it is triggered (or not) many, many hours before the storyline actually branches off. If you've forgotten which choices you made, it can be a really unpleasant surprise when you get to the end. I think this is part of the reason the game's power curve scales the way it does. If you've played either of the routes to completion, any member of your endgame party can probably solo the entirety of the first two strata, FOEs and bosses included. It's much easier to keep track when the gap between event flag and storyline split is an hour or two. Also, considering the best armor for Yggdroids can only be unlocked via a drop from a boss on the opposite path, I think the game pretty clearly wants you to play through it at least twice. That was... maybe not the best design choice for such a grind-heavy title. Tomorrow I'll stick a guide to making it go as quickly as possible in the second post.
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Nov 9, 2012 03:39
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You should add "Character designs with creepy pedo vibes" to the bullet list for 4  Love the series but buying a 3DS for just Etrian Odyssey and MH4 seems ridiculous.
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Nov 9, 2012 03:53
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Count Uvula posted:You should add "Character designs with creepy pedo vibes" to the bullet list for 4 You could also buy it for Soul Hackers, SMT4, Layton, and a handful of good downloadable titles. I agree about the character designs though, they really took a huge step back from 3 overall.
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Nov 9, 2012 03:56
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Count Uvula posted:You should add "Character designs with creepy pedo vibes" to the bullet list for 4  Oh wait. You're not wrong, exactly. People have complained about it from the very first entry in the series, and Glorious Nippon surely does love to highlight the Junior Adventurers Brigade in official art. But the games have always provided at least one portrait per class that won't get you laughed out your D&D circle, and just skimming the Japanese EOIV website, I'd say that's still the case. Perhaps we can all agree to let it drop until they reveal the downloadable spanking minigame? Thread's not gonna last long if we have the 'bomb Japan again' derail every page, man.
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Nov 9, 2012 04:36
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Gyre posted:Also, if you REALLY can't wait for EO4 and love Wizardry-type games, go pick up The Dark Spire for the DS if you haven't already. It's different in many ways but really scratches that dungeon-crawling itch (it's also far less anime). Nooooo don't do this it's an incredibly bad game  I mean I love EO and SMT but Dark Spire is something else. It's flat-out unfun.
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Nov 9, 2012 04:36
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Yeah, EO is great and I love that poo poo, but The Dark Spire is pretty, uh... I don't even think "brutal" is the right word. It keeps track of your map progress, but neither your position on it nor your bearing (though you can find your bearing by burning a one-time-use Compass). Enemies will Sleep and Coup de Grace you starting from the first floor, and you can't even savescum your HP like you could in the actual Wizardry games because TDS's formula is based on an optimum HP per level, so even if you savescum max HP in the beginning of the game, you'll get 1HP per level every time for a long while after that. It's an exercise in frustration, and it doesn't even have a charming soundtrack. But at least you don't have to Retire characters to raise your level cap, haha.
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Nov 9, 2012 04:45
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Count Uvula posted:You should add "Character designs with creepy pedo vibes" to the bullet list for 4 Oh come on, Himukai Yuuji is a great artist and does really cool monster and character design (it really shines in Etrian Odyssey).  He's also a big Monty Python fan according to his blog, so imagining that kind of scenario (he quotes Life of Brian on there) with King Arthur and his group of merry men in the labyrinth is pretty funny.
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Nov 9, 2012 04:48
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Count Uvula posted:You should add "Character designs with creepy pedo vibes" to the bullet list for 4 It's not ridiculous, I'm buying a 3DS just for Etrian Odyssey and Fire Emblem. This game can't come out soon enough and the fact I have to wait until spring 2013 for it is killing me.
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Nov 9, 2012 04:56
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sandpiper posted:Oh come on, Himukai Yuuji is a great artist and does really cool monster and character design (it really shines in Etrian Odyssey). He's also a big Monty Python fan according to his blog, so imagining that kind of scenario (he quotes Life of Brian on there) with King Arthur and his group of merry men in the labyrinth is pretty funny.  I thought guy who translated his comics was just making poo poo up.   I guess this also explains why one of sailing destinations in EOIII is 'the Lost City of Aaaaeaa.'
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Nov 9, 2012 05:08
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RoboCicero posted:It's not ridiculous, I'm buying a 3DS just for Etrian Odyssey and Fire Emblem. This game can't come out soon enough and the fact I have to wait until spring 2013 for it is killing me. These plus paper Mario and SMT 4 completely justified me getting a 3DS last year.
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Nov 9, 2012 05:11
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I remember when I play EO1 and I wonder why the game was so hard. But it made me realized that the only rpgs I play was Mario or Pokemon at that time. This was also the first time where i had to know the game before play it or else it just kicked your rear end for it. But that is why I like it.
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Nov 9, 2012 05:28
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Yeah, EO4 and OH GOD A NEW FIRE EMBLEM mean I'm going to trade in my battered DS Lite pretty soon. It has served me well! Over four and a half years now!
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Nov 9, 2012 05:29
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The White Dragon posted:Yeah, EO is great and I love that poo poo, but The Dark Spire is pretty, uh... I don't even think "brutal" is the right word. It keeps track of your map progress, but neither your position on it nor your bearing (though you can find your bearing by burning a one-time-use Compass). Enemies will Sleep and Coup de Grace you starting from the first floor, and you can't even savescum your HP like you could in the actual Wizardry games because TDS's formula is based on an optimum HP per level, so even if you savescum max HP in the beginning of the game, you'll get 1HP per level every time for a long while after that. Dark Spire is pretty much like the old-school Wizardry games... it is a good enough play if you can tolerate (or enjoy) that special kind of bullshit. Also, I kinda liked the music The HP thing, however, is a bit weirder than that. It actually re-rolls all your hit dice every time you level up, taking the new total if higher. If it is the same/lower, you just get 1 HP. So... yeah, good luck savescumming HP after the first couple levels. Overall, the map/navigating isn't that bad. But, holy poo poo, some areas have that special kind of bullshit (looking at you spinners and the maze on the 4th(?) floor). Aside from the compass, there is a 1st level Arcane spell that shows you your position/facing on the map. You pretty much want every character to cast Arcane spells to some degree for that reason. Given the way XP/leveling works in the game, that's pretty easy too. But enough about that game. Is EO4 getting rid of the class/subclass system? If so, that sucks... was the best part of EO3's character system. Still excited for the game either way, though. ZarquonHigardi fucked around with this message at 05:36 on Nov 9, 2012 |
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Nov 9, 2012 05:30
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theshim posted:Yeah, EO4 and OH GOD A NEW FIRE EMBLEM mean I'm going to trade in my battered DS Lite pretty soon. It has served me well! Over four and a half years now! I still have my launch fat DS. I've been using it since release for all my games, the hinge between the two screens has shattered in half. Or at least, it did half a year ago. I still haven't replaced it with anything. Maybe I should just finally loving replace it with a 3DS XL so I can keep playing 3 and get 4.
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Nov 9, 2012 05:36
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Subclassing is returning, or so I have heard. Don't know if there are any changes to it.
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Nov 9, 2012 05:36
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Been playing through 3 for the first time, and now it looks like I'll be getting a 3DS after all, this series is seriously one of the greatest rpg series in the last decade. Even if I do get my rear end kicked a lot.
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Nov 9, 2012 05:53
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I'm working purely off hearsay at this point, but supposedly your subclass skills top out at 5 ranks instead of 10 (or half the main class maximum, I guess). Kind of a weird tweak, if it's true, but I could see the justification for it... Maining Zodiac, Ninja, Arbalist, Shogun, or Hoplite in EOIII gave you the most powerful class-exclusive skills by far. Trickster and Earth's Bounty are handy, but they fall way short by comparison. On the other hand, if you were forever blocked from maxing Swashbuckling without Buccaneer as your main class, it would be a weightier choice.
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Nov 9, 2012 06:00
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The White Dragon posted:Yeah, EO is great and I love that poo poo, but The Dark Spire is pretty, uh... I don't even think "brutal" is the right word. It keeps track of your map progress, but neither your position on it nor your bearing (though you can find your bearing by burning a one-time-use Compass). Enemies will Sleep and Coup de Grace you starting from the first floor, and you can't even savescum your HP like you could in the actual Wizardry games because TDS's formula is based on an optimum HP per level, so even if you savescum max HP in the beginning of the game, you'll get 1HP per level every time for a long while after that. That's crazy talk, EO is infinitely more tedious and hateful than The Dark Spire. Granted, TDS starts off a lot more difficult and has some archaic poo poo like not telling you specifically the stats on your items. But it doesn't require anywhere near the same amount of grinding, there are no stupid, unfun, bullshit brick wall fights every other floor, and you can actually finish the game without looking up the perfect party setup first. Once past the second floor it's actually not very difficult at all.
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Nov 9, 2012 06:02
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So out of the few hundred RPGs that I have, I've never really delved into this series mostly because of the outragious asking prices on the second market. On average what would be decent price for 2 and/or 3 with the slipcovers and cases? Because forget buying DS games without cases.
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Nov 9, 2012 06:03
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theshim posted:I am seriously considering LPing EO3. EO3 is one of my favorite games so uh DO IT DO IT I am glad you made this thread. EO is one of my favorite DS/game series and I'm excited to get more EO action. Adam Bowen posted:But it doesn't require anywhere near the same amount of grinding, there are no stupid, unfun, bullshit brick wall fights every other floor, and you can actually finish the game without looking up the perfect party setup first. To be fair super hard bosses are kinda the reason I like the game. Also IIRC the original was more punishing in terms of requiring optimal party setups. 2 and 3 I know I wasn't running anything super optimal but I still got my way through it. It's definitely a series that gets better with each game, so I'm very pumped for 4. Also EO3 has one of my favorite boss musics ever in a video game (Hoist the Sword with Pride)! Dragongem fucked around with this message at 06:16 on Nov 9, 2012 |
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Nov 9, 2012 06:10
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While I have never finished an EO title, I have spent way too much time playing these games. I just bought a 3DS so this will be a nice rage inducing addition!
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Nov 9, 2012 06:14
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Rangpur posted:You're not wrong, exactly. People have complained about it from the very first entry in the series, and Glorious Nippon surely does love to highlight the Junior Adventurers Brigade in official art. But the games have always provided at least one portrait per class that won't get you laughed out your D&D circle, and just skimming the Japanese EOIV website, I'd say that's still the case. Perhaps we can all agree to let it drop until they reveal the downloadable spanking minigame? You're right about it mostly just being the advertising; the japanese site has all the character portraits on it. Though I'm pretty sure it's the first game in the series where every default class has a prepubescent girl as an option instead of just having Yuuji's trademark 'cute warrior people' style. If you click the link up there, keep in mind the dark blue ones are unlockable classes and the first 2 are probably vague spoilers akin to the Yggdroid in E3. Vaerai Archon posted:So out of the few hundred RPGs that I have, I've never really delved into this series mostly because of the outragious asking prices on the second market. On average what would be decent price for 2 and/or 3 with the slipcovers and cases? I'd sell you EO3 for 25 shipped, but I'd need a couple days to retrieve it from my partner's cold, clammy hands. (Case itself should not be cold or clammy) e: VVVVVVV Aw man, they removed the common skills!
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Nov 9, 2012 06:14
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Rangpur posted:I'm working purely off hearsay at this point, but supposedly your subclass skills top out at 5 ranks instead of 10 (or half the main class maximum, I guess). Kind of a weird tweak, if it's true, but I could see the justification for it... Yeah, someone already made an EO4 skill simulator, and it looks like you can now only raise skills from your subclass up to half their normal maximum value. They'll still be useful for passive bonuses and support but your primary attacking skills will pretty much have to come from your main class, probably. Thuryl fucked around with this message at 06:17 on Nov 9, 2012 |
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Nov 9, 2012 06:14
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I really liked EO3, but the glacial pacing got to me and I burned out. The music was great though!
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Nov 9, 2012 06:21
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I just hope there's more than one save slot this time around so I can do gimmick runs without loving over my main save. I had an idea of doing an all monk run for the hell of it and the satisfaction of punching things in the face
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Nov 9, 2012 06:24
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Thuryl posted:Yeah, someone already made an EO4 skill simulator, and it looks like you can now only raise skills from your subclass up to half their normal maximum value. They'll still be useful for passive bonuses and support but your primary attacking skills will pretty much have to come from your main class, probably. Wow, this is my first look at the classes and skills for EO4 and there's some great stuff in there. Imperials in particular look super fun to work with. Marogareh posted:I just hope there's more than one save slot this time around so I can do gimmick runs without loving over my main save. I had an idea of doing an all monk run for the hell of it and the satisfaction of punching things in the face This is basically the only thing keeping me from replaying EO3 now, as my save file has a 100% completed run that took something like 90 hours or some ridiculous number and I just can't bring myself to delete it.
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Nov 9, 2012 06:32
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Yeah, from what I gleaned from poring over internet posts during periods of downtime at work, EO4 subclassing grants you the ability to use skills in that class at up to half the max level (meaning skills with only one point available as a class are unavailable to subclasses) and aside from a few interesting build options, subclassing seems useful mainly for the passive stat boost skills. Also, each "stratum" is apparently much smaller now, but the areas are divided among a main dungeon and one or two smaller sub-dungeons all accessed via airship. The EO4 wait has been making me consider trying a clean all-Farmer or 4-Farmer 1-Royalty gimmick run, but the combination of not wanting to wipe my progress in the sixth stratum (which I'll probably never finish, admittedly), my backlog of other games, and the general masochism of taking the challenge on are currently doing a good job of deterring me.
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Nov 9, 2012 06:42
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I'm just really disappointed in how boring the EOIV classes look, especially coming from EO3, which has plenty of interesting stuff going on. Except for that crazed little Defender-lookin' dude. Shine on, you murderous little diamond. Also, the lack of adult-looking women that aren't wearing little more than lingerie (outside of the animal people) bothers me.
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Nov 9, 2012 06:59
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Thuryl posted:Yeah, someone already made an EO4 skill simulator, and it looks like you can now only raise skills from your subclass up to half their normal maximum value. They'll still be useful for passive bonuses and support but your primary attacking skills will pretty much have to come from your main class, probably.
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Nov 9, 2012 06:59
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Heavy neutrino posted:I really liked EO3, but the glacial pacing got to me and I burned out. The music was great though! Isn't it all by that bad motherfucker who did Actraiser? Or was it the Secret of Mana guy?
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Nov 9, 2012 10:04
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