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Yeah, EO is great and I love that poo poo, but The Dark Spire is pretty, uh... I don't even think "brutal" is the right word. It keeps track of your map progress, but neither your position on it nor your bearing (though you can find your bearing by burning a one-time-use Compass). Enemies will Sleep and Coup de Grace you starting from the first floor, and you can't even savescum your HP like you could in the actual Wizardry games because TDS's formula is based on an optimum HP per level, so even if you savescum max HP in the beginning of the game, you'll get 1HP per level every time for a long while after that. It's an exercise in frustration, and it doesn't even have a charming soundtrack. But at least you don't have to Retire characters to raise your level cap, haha.
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Nov 9, 2012 04:45
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Heavy neutrino posted:I really liked EO3, but the glacial pacing got to me and I burned out. The music was great though! Isn't it all by that bad motherfucker who did Actraiser? Or was it the Secret of Mana guy?
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Nov 9, 2012 10:04
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Dinky Duck Race posted:You forgot to mention that 4 has a brand new casual mode for idiot children and Grade-A pointdexters that gives you infinite warp wires and sends you back to town when you die. It's the perfect thing for people who are incapable of making good decisions like saving when you can and checking your inventory on occasion, or have been coddled by modern games like Dark Souls. Justin_Brett posted:It's not even a Dragon Quest thing where you lose money, though; you just go back. It's a video game, there's no such thing as little children who are bad at it. There are just people who are willing to play through the harder modes, but there's absolutely no merit to it. What, are you gonna put it on your resumé? It's a "I beat this superboss and all I got was this crappy t-shirt" case. There is no glory in playing difficult video games; only masturbation.
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Nov 9, 2012 19:06
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Justin_Brett posted:Was I saying people are scrubs for using the mode? Huh, I don't remember typing that. Sorry dogg, I interpreted it as "Oh you poor baby, you don't even lose half your gold, stop crying." v Oh, I saw sarcasm like a motherfucker in that "what games need more of is dying." Fur20 fucked around with this message at 20:07 on Nov 9, 2012 |
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Nov 9, 2012 19:56
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Fintilgin posted:I desperately want someone to do a western style game like this, shorn of the anime children, a little more user friendly. Like Legend of Grimrock, but a real return to the Might and Magic, Wizardry style gameplay. Shoot, is there really a demand for a western, possibly cartoony, gameplay-transparent FP dungeon crawl? I thought I was among a very small demographic.
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Nov 9, 2012 20:36
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Heavy neutrino posted:It would probably be successful as a $15 indie title on Steam. That said, I'm not sure I'd call EO gameplay-transparent -- what's your definition of that? I honestly think EO is really pretty gameplay-transparent. It's not necessary to know the precise percentages of buffs or the attack strength of a skill, but knowing how good armor or weapons are relative to other pieces of equipment certainly is. Its bar quests (usually) give you a good estimation of where you should be looking to complete them, it's forthcoming with combat information as far as you'd expect any RPG to be (it's not unfair to keep players blind to enemies' elemental resistances), and it's both very clear with its skill descriptions and (somewhat) forgiving with respeccing in case you screw up or have to make a situational switch. Gameplay-wise, I'd like to see maybe two or three things dumped from the system such as 100% ambush mobs, forced class setups (Salamox, for example, basically required you to use Hexer/Troubadour/Protector/Alchemist, and any situations that didn't demand this composition saw you way too strong to get any reward from the fight), and skill taxes (FOE and damage floor abilities). Oh, inversely useful skills, too, where you learn it, it's reasonably strong and executes at like 112% speed, but then you level it up and it gets stronger but it slowly approaches a 1% execute speed at 5/5 or 10/10. Aside from a few gently caress-yous like those, EO is really pretty fair and forthcoming, the genre considered.
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Nov 9, 2012 21:40
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Jarogue posted:I would replay EO1 to beat because the game gives you a code to get a item at the start for EO2. Or at least just beat the plot boss of EO1 and just get the code from the internet. I actually never had EO1, but aren't the items you get really garbagey poo poo that barely give you an edge even in the early-game?
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Nov 10, 2012 03:05
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My farmer in EO3 was my bro who is an actual farmer IRL. No, not the ganja kind of farmer, I mean like the real kind.
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Nov 14, 2012 03:56
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Well since you can cheese the poo poo out of the true final boss in EO2 with a bunch of Samurai or whatever, I think the hardest one for me was Salamox just because getting the special item required the most specific setup ever. Kill a boss with 99% fire resistance... with fire? Well, poo poo. That's with disregarding his weird non-elemental skills that inflict instant death.
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Nov 17, 2012 05:02
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Rangpur posted:I know it's the boring answer, but Scylla on B15F was the one that had me tearing my hair out and Resting my main party multiple times. Goddamn did beating that thing feel satisfying though. Nah man I was like this close to saying Scylla, haha. gently caress that ho, Harpy and the regular final boss are comparatively easier.
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Nov 17, 2012 06:05
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Fungah! posted:Not sure what exactly to do with the Zodiac, might just subclass him to Farmer or something and throw the five points into Zodiac skills. That sound any kind of good? This one's a horrible idea because you should never mix your farmers with your mains. I did this the first time I played EO2 and I only beat the normal final boss with 1HP left on my Protector because he had that "chance to survive mortal blow" skill, doing all of ~45 damage per hit. Isn't there a Zodiac/Ninja sub build that makes everything cost like 1TP?
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Nov 17, 2012 19:07
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TurnipFritter posted:Were they also responsible for the squirrels? Or the scorpions? Because if so, gently caress them right to hell.
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Nov 22, 2012 05:25
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Complexcalibur posted:That's just one of the things you have to train yourself out of. Just like how you have to train yourself out of holding onto rare consumables the game gives you three stratums before you can make your own. That one Nectall you get in EO2 is probably going to be used somewhere on the third stratum. Alternatively, you just put a Dark Hunter in your party and grind your mains to like 40 on Hellion and Chimera.
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Nov 24, 2012 19:38
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Dr Pepper posted:Poison is great early game, I'd say max it out first, and when it starts to fall in usefuless to Rest the Hexer. By the time it starts to get useless, you'll be on the sixth stratum and might as well just grind to 70 and Retire instead.
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Nov 26, 2012 00:03
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Thuryl posted:I think you might have to actually walk on every space on the floor: just painting them in doesn't cut it. More than that, it cared if you drew walls and everything.
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Dec 12, 2012 09:10
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Not really a fan of Gunners or War Magi, having used both extensively for the exact same reasons as you. They're horrendous and don't believe anyone who says you can sub them for a Medic. I might use one in a gimmick team of a War Magus and four Hexers. Dark Hunters, Hexers, and Ronins are broken as poo poo though, yeah. You can kill almost anything but bosses (oh wait no you CAN kill a few of them) with the Dark Hunter's Climax skill (at max level, they only have to be at 55% HP or less for it to succeed 100% of the time if it hits). Ronin of course have that stupid Overhead skill, but I don't really like to use 'em. You'll want a Protector, though. When you absorb an elemental attack with their skills, it also nullifies any status effects that would've come with.
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Jan 9, 2013 20:55
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Bellmaker posted:Any chance you can go into why they're both horrendous? I can see why the Magus can be seen as trying to do too much and not being any good at any of it, but what don't you like about the Gunner? I just never really got that much worth out of the Gunner myself, having used it to clear the main storyline. It was nice having a competent fighter from the back row, but its TP growth is pretty disappointing and if you start going into passives or non-elemental attacks, you'll start spreading yourself thin really fast. Plus they're turtles--and I don't mean like Guile--because y'know, an Alchemist will easily outrun a Hexer in turn order, and sometimes even outspeed a Medic or even Landsknecht, but if you need a Gunner to act in a pinch (barring Snipe, which activates at 300% speed at max level), you're gonna die horribly. Most of its worthwhile attacks are "go last"-type (your Speed is automatically treated as a 1), and if that wasn't bad enough, leveling these skills up increases the damage you take from enemies while you're waiting to execute by up to 2.5x. On the upside from Alchemists, it has a total of 10 less SP tax if you want the higher-level elemental attacks (you do), but capping at 3.4x damage, even with being based on your regular physical attack? No thanks. If you stick with the low-tier elemental attacks, they do move at normal speed with no defensive penalties... but they only do like 1.5x damage at tenth level, which seems like a hell of a waste to me. Alchemist, on the other hand, has the tradeoff of skill tax and absolutely nothing else. All their spells activate at normal speed, and at max level (10 ranks), they drop their second-tier spells at something like 7-8.5x TEC strength before calculating weakness and the extra 55% weakpoint bonus you get from Lv5 Analysis. Their first tier spells are I wanna say roughly half that. The downside? To get the full library of second-tier elemental spells, you gotta pay 5 points into Fire Magic, Ice Magic, and Thunder Magic and 5 into their first-tier spells before unlocking the second tier stuff, a whopping 30-point tax. Gunners is just 5 in Guns and 5 in each of the first-tier elemental shots, a slightly-less painful 20-point tax for not even half damage potential that also makes you take twice-and-a-half damage and always go last. If you're concerned about MP consumption on an Alchemist, don't be. Just put ten levels in TP Up and you'll have 200% TP. Gunners, you put ten levels into TP Up, yeah, of course you'll still get that 200% TP. That's like 60 instead of 30  Plus Megido is a loving monster spell. The closest Gunner gets to that is Ricochet which, while good, will just never cut it because their TP growth is awful and the enemies you want to do the most damage to often resist physical-type damage. Four Megidos will end a fight against almost anything, and you'll have the TP to support that in a single encounter; four Ricochets will just piss 'em off and you'll have to eat a TP restorative at least once. On Alchemists, stay away from the multi-target spells (this includes the Blades and Gravity stuff you were rightly scoffing at). They're an SP trap. The Phys spells are more for if you want to put an Alchemist in a conditional drop-harvesting party. --- War Magus is just too spread out and in terms of healing is critically crippled. If you want revives in the middle of a dungeon, you better bring a lot of Nectar, because War Magus doesn't get it. They're expensive! War Magus also doesn't get Cure/Salve 3, which is your bug-out holy poo poo emergency spell (Cure 2 isn't bad either because it executes pretty quickly, but if you're in dire straits, you want the guarantee full heal that the third-tier restoratives give you). WM doesn't support itself well in dungeons, its only source of TP healing being Cursecut, which has a hard 60% accuracy, and only works if the target is Cursed (by a shoehorned Hexer)... plus if you go Sword Magus, you're gimping your cures. Medic, sure, she eats up TP too and can't restore it unless you learn TP Regen (which has a ridiculous--if very helpful anyway--skill tax), but she also gets shittons more TP than a War Magus. War Magus vs Medic... War Magus has a passive that restores up to 5HP every round in combat; Medic has a skill that restores 1% HP per rank after every combat. War Magus seems really nice in the first three floors, but 5HP per complete round (no heals at the beginning of combat, though Medic's TP Regen suffers from the same problem) is really disappointing once your characters reach, like, tenth level. It's not even useful in terms of survivability since in-combat endurance is a war of double or even triple-digit numbers, not 5HP per encounter maybe. War Magus is worthless in combat unless you frontline them, too, since their weapons are all melee-ranged. This means exposing your healer, which is never fun; on the other hand, you only have two other frontliners out of the group you listed (Ronin and Dark Hunter), so you never know. Also, choosing between Staves, with their middling Strength but very nice TP and TEC bonuses, and Swords since WM perhaps somewhat obviously can't use War Edge skills with a Staff. Medic, I mean, you go into Medic knowing they're a rear-row class. But if you were absolutely loving dead-set on frontlining a Medic, Caduceus is actually a pretty entertaining skill, which has to be used with a Staff, which happens to be the only kind of weapon a Medic can use. --- I've always found Gunners better for, y'know, your gathering team. They're not heavy hitters like Alchemists, but they have a lot of mook utility thanks to poo poo like Weakshot and 2-Hit (both of which are really unreliable, don't get them unless you're lazy like me), plus they're one of your only sources, short of like two Whips and the lovely Raiper, of Piercing-type damage for getting those weird conditional drops. I know I probably make 'em sound like bustas, but they have their place. It's just nowhere near bosses. War Magi don't belong anywhere near anything, except perhaps for those bar requests that ask for one. In which the commissioners probably stuff them in a sack and hit them with sticks while telling them how useless they are. Fur20 fucked around with this message at 08:00 on Jan 10, 2013 |
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Jan 10, 2013 07:58
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Bellmaker posted:I like my Hexer in EO2, but I feel like I'm not using him right early on. I've been pumping points into his Poison skill but even about 7 points in it doesn't seem very reliable and it's very TP expensive. I like what he can do but I kinda feel like I'd be getting more mileage out of an Alchemist at the moment... Once you master Poison, you'll have a fine mook-killer on your hands and you can move towards learning/mastering the spell that disables the enemy's defenses (the one that requires five levels in Scavenger), which is really nice to have around for bosses in general, though there's one specific gimmick boss you literally need it for later on. This has the added benefit of requiring some levels in TP Up, meaning your MP woes will clear up noticebly. After that, the offense/defense debuff spells are all great. Just remember that you can stack no more than three debuffs on an enemy at once, so I honestly tend to skip Leaden since that's so much more situational than Sapping and Frality. I've never really seen them as a status-inflicting sort of class--you're running a Dark Hunter too, right? Which means you wanna stay out of her territory and skip the Hexer's Bind spells, too--beyond Poison. 250-400+ damage per round to every enemy at full mastery? And bosses with Poison unique drop conditions? Yes, please. There's also a strategy involving casting Revenge at 1HP, but I've never learned or used it. Though if I had to guess, it involves being at 1HP (and probably some Medic CPR shenanigans). Fur20 fucked around with this message at 05:30 on Jan 17, 2013 |
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Jan 17, 2013 05:22
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Bellmaker posted:I don't really get retirement. The recruit is supposed to have "advanced stats", but what does that mean, an extra stat point all around? These boosts refresh every time you retire and they aren't cumulative, so until you raise the level cap to 80 (at which point everything will increase by 1), you'll always retire with +7 stats and 7 bonus SP. I could be misremembering the boosted stats and they might be more weighted towards the higher levels, like you'd only get +1 at 30 and +4 or 5 at 70, but I'm like 99% certain you get +10 if you retire at 99.
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Jan 22, 2013 07:29
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So will the actual game only have, what, six or seven classes to start, or does the demo version have fewer classes? I'm not seein' everything I want for my main party. Do Runemasters come with Hexer magic or something, or did they just outright remove the skill overlap and my status/debuff guy would be the Sniper?
Fur20 fucked around with this message at 23:43 on Feb 9, 2013 |
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Feb 9, 2013 23:41
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Oh man this demo is fuckin' sick, I can't wait until the real release. Day one purchase, definitely. I love the music, too.
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Feb 11, 2013 06:49
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So I figure someone will know this from the Japanese release, but all I turn up looking for it is internet bitches moaning about how they can't import EO4 or whining about how Casual Mode is ruining their nintendos. I can generally rely on y'all at SA for a direct answer, though, so: How does the level cap work in the full game? Is it 70 +1/retirement at the current cap like in the older titles? Or is it something better like 70 +10/retirement, 'cause that would be much more bearable.
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Feb 12, 2013 19:58
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McDragon posted:Also poked the other cave with the airship. Think when the full game is out I will hit them up first. If I can bullshit my way past the evil kangaroos again. Fur20 fucked around with this message at 05:01 on Feb 14, 2013 |
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Feb 14, 2013 04:53
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There are rare FOEs too? Guddamn. I wonder if I was just lucky or if they always spawn as the last FOE on a screen. I went from 9 to 10 in a single fight against the Nomad Baboon, he gave something like 8000 EXP. I was worried that his whole thing would be that he'd run away, but as it turns out, he just gets crazy powerful instead. Almost one-shotting my Fortress with Guard Formaton up? Scary.
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Feb 15, 2013 19:52
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My gripe with the Dancer is that they're row-based. I'll definitely deputize one for the sixth slot(?) if someone offers them as their guild ambassador, but there's no way they're coming anywhere near my main party otherwise. Maybe if there's a gimmick fight like Salamox.
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Feb 16, 2013 03:54
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So I got the EO4 soundtrack and I'm listening to it when suddenly, I realized that the arrangement is basically from Japanese police procedural dramas from the 80s. Tons of farty, dramatic trumpets and drawn-out strings. They still run them in Hawaii, and for good reason: they had this type of over-the-top music for like every scene you can imagine. "Questioning any old witness... TENSE DRAMATIC MUSIC WITH BLARING TRUMPETS" "Walking down the street... TENSE DRAMATIC MUSIC WITH BLARING TRUMPETS" "Epilogue where everyone's just hanging out congratulating each other... TENSE DRAMATIC MUSIC WITH BLARING TRUMPETS" And I think it's great.
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Feb 19, 2013 07:49
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I actually like these new text boxes, it's like they know their target demographic is getting older so they have to give us huge old people font  It's better than the old EO text boxes for sure. Same color scheme, but I took issue with those pixely letters. The hi-res font is very nice, but they probably coulda done something better with it than Times New Roman. The white-on-tealgreen is just the EO colors, and as much as I'd like to be able to change the window flavor to this, well, you just get used to it.
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Feb 19, 2013 21:03
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I'm still not 100% on how you're supposed to actually run into Pookas. I hit one by pure luck because it ran up against one of the other skyships. Is there a specific thing you can do to trick the AI? Or am I just gonna have to wait for the ship part that makes me move two tiles instead of one?
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Feb 20, 2013 05:33
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LibbyM posted:I can not find Culantro for the life of me out of this north most gathering spot.
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Feb 20, 2013 19:40
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It sounds like each rank is 10% HP instead of loving 1% like EO2.
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Feb 20, 2013 21:53
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Couldn't you fake those with Farmers, though? Just go in and cast that lollygagging skill like twenty times.
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Feb 20, 2013 23:13
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Complexcalibur posted:If nothing else, it's a lot less painful to read than Cass's 'Oirish' accent from EO2, or Missy's 'Stupid' accent from EO3.
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Feb 24, 2013 03:18
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The Moon Monster posted:I can't decide whether or not I want a runemaster in my party for 4. On the one hand it has possibly my favorite EO character art ever (although the Bushi and Hoplites come close). But on the other hand they're so painfully boring compared to the other damage dealing classes. I can't decide whether I want a Runemaster/sub-Mystic or a Mystic/sub-Runemaster. Runemaster is great because I love glass cannon magic nukes, but on the other hand, Mystic looks sooooooo 
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Feb 25, 2013 23:14
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ThisIsACoolGuy posted:I like the combat and visuals and everything but the map drawing (while I understand why it's there) feels really really tedious. quote:My current team is (I can't recall their actual names so work with me) Warrior, Dancer, Iron Wall (I think?) and in the back is a Medic and RuneMaster. Is this a bad set up?
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Feb 26, 2013 09:45
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Fuuuuuuck, this makes me wish I hadn't ordered from Amazon. I wanna share my lovely guild with you assholes!
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Feb 26, 2013 20:49
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MinionOfCthulhu posted:How do you...get them to do damage? I'm still playing the demo but my Nightseeker does barely any damage, and his weapons aren't awful. Their proficiency lets them do bonus damage to status-afflicted targets. It takes a basic slash that does ~15 all the way up to the 30-40 range.
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Feb 26, 2013 22:53
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So I checked out my Amazon order and they're sending my copy out on March 14th. Not "arrival date," but "leaves the storehouse date." At least, they were until I told them to gently caress off and went on a Retail Adventure today. But I forgot that this is Maui, where we get triple-A titles a week after their release dates. Walmart said "Well we might have it in this afternoon after the boat gets here." Best Buy said nothing because we don't have a Best Buy on this backwoods rock. Gamestop said, "What's Etrian what no do you want WoW" So I caved and now I have the digital copy. Where do I generate my guild's QR code?
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Feb 27, 2013 01:05
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It's stylized meiQ you PLEBEIAN  I hope this is clear enough, I don't have an SDCard reader. Seriously. Grabbing these QR codes is so fun, haha. This is so dumb and I love it. Fur20 fucked around with this message at 04:08 on Feb 27, 2013 |
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Feb 27, 2013 04:04
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The fact that you can crit when using skills with Snipers really improved my view of them.
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Feb 27, 2013 04:52
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goldjas posted:Anyone who didn't make this dude their medic is probably dead to me I had to go with his other color, the alternate is more David Tennant.
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Feb 27, 2013 06:11
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