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Mind_Taker
May 7, 2007

He's the best mindfuck yet


DrBouvenstein posted:

I've read that that's a valid strategy to throw other contestants off their game. The downside is it also throws you off your game. That's what Watson did, and he was programmed with "optimal strategy" or whatever.

You also pick out of order if there's not much time left and you just need to answer the bigger bucks questions to have a shot at winning.

I think it's more because over time the Daily Doubles have proven to be the fourth clue down most often (either the $800 question in Jeopardy or $1600 in Double Jeopardy). Ever since the Watson creators used this strategy it seems like a lot of contestants are doing this as well.

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osukeith161
Dec 19, 2004

by Y Kant Ozma Post


DrBouvenstein posted:

The downside is it also throws you off your game. That's what Watson did, and he was programmed with "optimal strategy" or whatever.

I always felt that Richard, I think that is his name, should get all the credit for Watson. Sure, he didn't do the programming, but he laid out the strategy of how to win. (He is the guy who held the record before Ken Jennings. He kind of points out that it is a television show, and if they asked contestants for difficult physics equations every other question, they wouldn't have viewers. So, he studied the main things of a variety of categories, and admits "guessing" most of the answers with what is the most cited/quoted thing in the area of the question.) If you step foot on a Jeopardy stage without knowing all your presidents, you are at a loss. There are constant categories and subjects that always come up.

I am not discounting the winners. They are sharp people, but it has been shown there is a method to winning outside of being smart. Hell, even the contestant search flat out states that getting all the questions right doesn't matter, it is still a show. They don't want a week of 12 librarians or attorneys rattling off answers. They have to have variety.

JAMOOOL
Oct 18, 2004

I LOVE TWO AND HALF MEN!! YOU 20 SOMETHINGS ARE JUST TOO CYNICAL TO UNDERSTAND IT!!

Every Jeopardy fan should read Ken Jennings' book Brainiac, you can get it on Amazon for like a buck and it's very entertaining and contains some valuable info; what you guys are saying ITT is basically correct but the real skill apparently was just timing the buzzer (which is the one thing Watson could do better than both other contestants) as apparently your average Jeopardy contestant could probably get 70%+ of the questions right in a vacuum.

Soothing Vapors
Mar 26, 2006

plz control u toxic hatsculinity



tk posted:

I get so angry when the contestants start choosing the clues out of order. Especially when it's a category with a weird theme and the first clue kind of eases you in.

ME TOO! I think it was last week they had some sort of "alliterative clues about an alliterative name" category. Douchebag started at 1600, got the daily double, and had no clue how to answer it because he didn't start at the beginning.

It gave me joy.

JAMOOOL posted:

Every Jeopardy fan should read Ken Jennings' book Brainiac, you can get it on Amazon for like a buck and it's very entertaining and contains some valuable info; what you guys are saying ITT is basically correct but the real skill apparently was just timing the buzzer (which is the one thing Watson could do better than both other contestants) as apparently your average Jeopardy contestant could probably get 70%+ of the questions right in a vacuum.

Yeah, I always got the impression Watson was so dominant because he's a goddamn computer who could buzz in almost instantly. Jennings and that other dude clearly were trying to buzz in, they just couldn't beat the computer.

The Human Cow
May 24, 2004

hurry up

If anybody wants some more in-depth information about the audition process and what the day of taping is like, I typed up a couple blog articles here (audition) and here (taping).

raditts
Feb 21, 2001

The Kwanzaa Bot is here to protect me.

KilGrey posted:

So you'd be the OCD contestant?


I just remembered, my oral surgeons wife was on Wheel of Fortune and won one show. She got like, $2,000 for the main game, won a trip to Fiji due to a lucky spin and puzzle solving and then won the $25,000 prize. I was irritated as hell because her husband charged me $12,000 for the 20 whole minutes he took to take my wisdom teeth out. Fuckers didn't need that money.

Holy poo poo, $12,000 to take out your wisdom teeth?!

JAMOOOL
Oct 18, 2004

I LOVE TWO AND HALF MEN!! YOU 20 SOMETHINGS ARE JUST TOO CYNICAL TO UNDERSTAND IT!!

The Human Cow posted:

If anybody wants some more in-depth information about the audition process and what the day of taping is like, I typed up a couple blog articles here (audition) and here (taping).

Excellent story! But...uh...it seems to cut out at an important part.

KilGrey
Mar 13, 2005

You know how to whistle, don't you, Steve? Just put your lips together and blow...



raditts posted:

Holy poo poo, $12,000 to take out your wisdom teeth?!

I can't tell if you are 'holy poo poo'ing' because you think that's high or low. It's actually not that bad.

The Human Cow
May 24, 2004

hurry up

JAMOOOL posted:

Excellent story! But...uh...it seems to cut out at an important part.

Here, experience my shame.

Sirotan
Oct 17, 2006

Sirotan is a seal.


I love Jeopardy but I always feel bad for the people that don't win, they only get a $2,000 or $1,000 consolation prize. Wheel of Fortune is the game to play for maximum cash potential even though I sometimes feel my IQ lowering as I watch people miss-guess puzzles.

Really can't stand Alex Trebek, when he retires (which I hope is soon), I want Ken Jennings as the new host. He is so loving funny, if you aren't following him on Twitter you are missing out.

Glenn_Beckett
Sep 12, 2008

When I see a 9/11 victim family on television I'm just like 'Given the existence as uttered forth in the public works of Puncher and Wattmann of a personal God quaquaqua'

osukeith161 posted:

He kind of points out that it is a television show, and if they asked contestants for difficult physics equations every other question, they wouldn't have viewers. So, he studied the main things of a variety of categories, and admits "guessing" most of the answers with what is the most cited/quoted thing in the area of the question.)

I coach my students' high school Scholastic Bowl team, and I'm always honestly shocked at how much harder and more specific the questions for a high school competition tend to be than Jeopardy! is.

That said, I can still slaughter high-schoolers at both Jeopardy! and Quiz Bowl. I say this because I am a small and petty man who cares about beating children 10-14 years his junior. Ugh what a piece of poo poo.

KilGrey
Mar 13, 2005

You know how to whistle, don't you, Steve? Just put your lips together and blow...




I don't think you have anything to be ashamed about. Even though you didn't win you still did very respectably. How much did they tax the money you won? Also, did you take down the "Becoming a Jeopardy Contestant" entry? I read the one about going on the show and you got a pretty good laugh out of me with this part:

The Human Cow Blog posted:

We headed back to the green room to be re-made up and to take one final bathroom break. I remember standing in the bathroom, looking in the mirror, and trying to center myself and calm down. It reminded me too much of Dirk Diggler at the end of Boogie Nights (with one big difference), so I gave up and went back to the set.

I think I heard Ken Jennings talking about how important 'buzzer timing' is on the show and you covered that as well. I noticed in the video that you can hear you guys frantically pressing your buttons. Is that why sometimes a person will go on a 5 question tear? They found the rhythm of the buzzer for a moment? Does getting a question wrong or them cutting to a commercial break this rhythm?

Glenn_Beckett posted:

That said, I can still slaughter high-schoolers at both Jeopardy! and Quiz Bowl. I say this because I am a small and petty man who cares about beating children 10-14 years his junior. Ugh what a piece of poo poo.

The Teen Jeopardy shows are always my favorite because I can at least answer those!

KilGrey fucked around with this message at Nov 28, 2012 around 22:42

Bondii
May 31, 2003
King of The Cider Farm

I went and saw a taping of the finals of the Teen Tournament last week with my girlfriend. We sat right in front of the losers of the previous rounds. During the commercial break, which they do in the real amount of time commercials would be airing, the audience is allowed to ask any question they want of Trebek. One of the guy teens asked between giggles, "So, Alex, boxers or briefs?"

Trebek paused a moment. Stared him down, and said "thongs."

KilGrey
Mar 13, 2005

You know how to whistle, don't you, Steve? Just put your lips together and blow...



Also, thank you to whoever suggested Ken Jennings twitter:

Ken Jennings posted:

Every night around 11pm, NPR falls asleep and in its dreams it becomes smooth jazz or maybe the BBC World News.

Ken Jennings posted:

Hey little kids calling your parents by their first names: see you again when you drop out of art school & move back home in 15 years!

Ken Jennings posted:

We make our kids leave money under our pillows every time one of their adult teeth grows in.

Ken Jennings posted:

Yeah, I don't care if your kids are cute. The little girl from Escape to Witch Mountain is now one of the Real Housewives of Beverly Hills

Ken Jennings posted:

Al Roker shouldn't be allowed to host holiday parades until he gets fat and jolly again.

Ken Jennings posted:

SAPIENS! (no homo)

Ken Jennings posted:

when my kids ask where babies come from, I tell them a claw machine. a claw machine full of babies.

KilGrey fucked around with this message at Nov 28, 2012 around 22:45

JAMOOOL
Oct 18, 2004

I LOVE TWO AND HALF MEN!! YOU 20 SOMETHINGS ARE JUST TOO CYNICAL TO UNDERSTAND IT!!

He follows a bunch of FYADers if I'm not mistaken.

Glenn_Beckett
Sep 12, 2008

When I see a 9/11 victim family on television I'm just like 'Given the existence as uttered forth in the public works of Puncher and Wattmann of a personal God quaquaqua'

JAMOOOL posted:

He follows a bunch of FYADers if I'm not mistaken.

Therefore he pretty much rocks. Also he might follow one of the FYADers I know irl. I'll ask him.

raditts
Feb 21, 2001

The Kwanzaa Bot is here to protect me.

KilGrey posted:

I can't tell if you are 'holy poo poo'ing' because you think that's high or low. It's actually not that bad.

My insurance isn't that good and I just had a wisdom tooth pulled a few months ago for a little over $100. So yeah, that sounds pretty goddamned high.

Sirotan posted:

I love Jeopardy but I always feel bad for the people that don't win, they only get a $2,000 or $1,000 consolation prize. Wheel of Fortune is the game to play for maximum cash potential even though I sometimes feel my IQ lowering as I watch people miss-guess puzzles.

If I remember correctly they used to get whatever they finished with, but then people were reluctant to make risky bids for Final Jeopardy so they just went with the standard loser prizes.

The Human Cow
May 24, 2004

hurry up

KilGrey posted:

I don't think you have anything to be ashamed about. Even though you didn't win you still did very respectably. How much did they tax the money you won? Also, did you take down the "Becoming a Jeopardy Contestant" entry? I read the one about going on the show and you got a pretty good laugh out of me with this part:


I think I heard Ken Jennings talking about how important 'buzzer timing' is on the show and you covered that as well. I noticed in the video that you can hear you guys frantically pressing your buttons. Is that why sometimes a person will go on a 5 question tear? They found the rhythm of the buzzer for a moment? Does getting a question wrong or them cutting to a commercial break this rhythm?

Thanks! I think the links between the blog posts are broken, but the links in that post should both work. As far as taxes go, California takes (I think) 10%, and then the rest is taxes as income. Since it's taxed as income, however, you can deduct travel expenses (flight, hotel, food) for both the trip out there and the trip to audition. That's what my accountant told me, at least.

The whole game is buzzer timing. Basically, if you're good enough to make it to the show, you probably know 80% or more of the answers. Once you get the rhythm down, you're golden - if you watch my video, you can see what I'm talking about at the end of Regular Jeopardy when Bob runs the sports category. I knew the last half of the column, but I couldn't buzz in. For most of the game, I could buzz in at will, but I didn't get the categories I needed - I'm a huge pop culture geek, and geography and history kill me. I'm still bitter when I see Final Jeopardy categories like "Billboard Number 1 Albums" come up when I'm watching at home.

KilGrey
Mar 13, 2005

You know how to whistle, don't you, Steve? Just put your lips together and blow...



So if someone is in the zone when it comes to the buzzer and is running the board for a bit, how do you break his rhythm? Can you? Is it possible to buzz ahead of him in those cases or do you just have to wait it out?

Glenn_Beckett
Sep 12, 2008

When I see a 9/11 victim family on television I'm just like 'Given the existence as uttered forth in the public works of Puncher and Wattmann of a personal God quaquaqua'

KilGrey posted:

So if someone is in the zone when it comes to the buzzer and is running the board for a bit, how do you break his rhythm? Can you? Is it possible to buzz ahead of him in those cases or do you just have to wait it out?

Mutter "hey, enjoyable human being."

Alex reads the answers at a pretty steady rhythm, but nobody's gonna buzz in perfectly every single time. Their roll will end eventually. Usually it seems to end more or less with whatever category they ran.

Discount Viscount
Jul 9, 2010

Watch Out!


Glenn_Beckett posted:

I coach my students' high school Scholastic Bowl team, and I'm always honestly shocked at how much harder and more specific the questions for a high school competition tend to be than Jeopardy! is.

High school students also have the benefit of studying a lot of that material as basically their jobs and it's all in pretty recent memory, plus with 10-12 people up there total you've got good odds on someone knowing a specific detail.

Where it really differs from Jeopardy! is in the math content, because probably all but one person on a high school quiz bowl team is in calc or pre-calc. Every third question was probably a math question when I did quiz bowl. Math was a popular subject for the bonus questions as well since they were multi-part ones and you divided the work among the whole team.

We had cheat sheets like the aforementioned and spent portions of practices going over those common trigger words and their answers. Persian poet = Omar Khayyam, Southern author = William Faulkner, Elizabethan = start thinking Shakespeare, etc. One time during the league season I was watching Jeopardy! and the final category was "Southern Authors" and I said aloud "I bet it all, the answer is William Faulkner," and it was. They drilled Faulkner into our heads that season as he seemed to be showing up a lot in the question pool for whatever reason that year.

KilGrey posted:

The Teen Jeopardy shows are always my favorite because I can at least answer those!

Watching the Tournament of Champions is a good way for those who consider themselves decent at regular Jeopardy! to learn humility. The Ultimate Tournament was loving brutal to play along with (as it should be) and fun to watch.

Glenn_Beckett
Sep 12, 2008

When I see a 9/11 victim family on television I'm just like 'Given the existence as uttered forth in the public works of Puncher and Wattmann of a personal God quaquaqua'

J-archive has been added to the OP. Let us rejoice!

In Rainbows
Feb 26, 2011


Discount Viscount posted:


We had cheat sheets like the aforementioned and spent portions of practices going over those common trigger words and their answers. Persian poet = Omar Khayyam, Southern author = William Faulkner, Elizabethan = start thinking Shakespeare, etc. One time during the league season I was watching Jeopardy! and the final category was "Southern Authors" and I said aloud "I bet it all, the answer is William Faulkner," and it was. They drilled Faulkner into our heads that season as he seemed to be showing up a lot in the question pool for whatever reason that year.


I was watching an episode with my grandparents and the topic for final Jeopardy was something like "Modern English Authors" and I said "William Golding" just because. When Trebek starting reading the answers it mentioned rowdy kids. Obviously Lord of the Flies and my answer was right. My grandparents thought I was a goddamn psychic

But my god do I do poorly with Jeopardy questions about classical music and plays. I'll have good guessing streaks about everything else and then wham, something about a play. I should get cultured.

Tide
Mar 27, 2010




I've tried for years to get my mother to test for this show but she won't do it. She's scary smart and dings every answer, it seems. Smokes us all in Trivial Pursuit. But she's terrified she'll freeze up then turn psychotic grandmother and beat Trebek over the head with a microphone or something.

Sadly, I took after my father in the brains department and have inherited the CRS disease.

osukeith161
Dec 19, 2004

by Y Kant Ozma Post


Tide posted:

I've tried for years to get my mother to test for this show but she won't do it. She's scary smart and dings every answer, it seems. Smokes us all in Trivial Pursuit. But she's terrified she'll freeze up then turn psychotic grandmother and beat Trebek over the head with a microphone or something.

I've taken about 4 of the online tests. Made it past the initial written part of the college screening when it was on campus. Do not do this. I don't want this to come off as sounding like I should have gotten on. I played on the Academic Challenge team and will readily admit that most of my schoolmates were far brighter. A handful of my friends can beat me on any day in trivia. However, I have one friend who has tried every single Jeopardy entrance test that he was able to do. Every one. It drives him mad. It is his white whale.

So, take your mom to some pub trivia. Something where she can flex her muscle and have a good time. Do not get her started on the jeopardy pursuit. Like I mentioned, it is a show, not a true contest to find the trivia wizard of the US. She could very well be the smartest trivial knowledge person in the world, but that won't mean she gets on the show.

Riptor
Apr 13, 2003

here's to feelin' good all the time


osukeith161 posted:

I've taken about 4 of the online tests. Made it past the initial written part of the college screening when it was on campus. Do not do this. I don't want this to come off as sounding like I should have gotten on. I played on the Academic Challenge team and will readily admit that most of my schoolmates were far brighter. A handful of my friends can beat me on any day in trivia. However, I have one friend who has tried every single Jeopardy entrance test that he was able to do. Every one. It drives him mad. It is his white whale.

Yeah, this is me. So angry

Gene Hackman Fan
Dec 27, 2002

a worker of thankless jobs
a host of unwatched game shows
Mad, Red,
& Nude Online.




Riptor posted:

Yeah, this is me. So angry

I have been trying to get on Jeopardy off and on since the Teen Tournament of '96. Ever since then, three of my friends have already been on, and a fourth friend just got an invite to an in-person audition a couple of weeks back when they had a contestant search in Cleveland.

There really ought to be a support group for nerds like us.

ComposerGuy posted:

They should just bring back the turning letters anyway. They lost something when it went digital.

To be fair, they did save a lot of downtime with the change. In the old, old GSN reruns, you could see the puzzle board's reflection on the contestant backdrops as they towed it off stage for a PA to change all the letters and flip all the trilons back around.

But I totally agree with you, they really lost something in the aesthetic in going with the touchscreens.

KilGrey
Mar 13, 2005

You know how to whistle, don't you, Steve? Just put your lips together and blow...



Glen_Beckett posted:

Mutter "hey, enjoyable human being."

This was all I could think of when I was watching Jeopardy the other night and it made me giggle like an idiot the whole time. I tried to pick which contestant I thought was most likely to do this.

...yes, I'm easily amused.

CarbonCpy posted:

But I totally agree with you, they really lost something in the aesthetic in going with the touchscreens.

One of my favorite parts used to be when Vanna would get to a letter before it lit up and would just stand there with her hand on it staring like, "hurry the gently caress up!"

InsensitiveSeaBass
Apr 1, 2008

You're entering a realm which is unusual. Maybe it's magic, or contains some kind of monster... The second one. Prepare to enter The Scary Door.

CarbonCpy posted:

I have been trying to get on Jeopardy off and on since the Teen Tournament of '96. Ever since then, three of my friends have already been on, and a fourth friend just got an invite to an in-person audition a couple of weeks back when they had a contestant search in Cleveland.

I tried to get on a Teen tournament when I was captain of the quiz bowl team. Several years later, the quiz bowl captain of my high school makes it to the finals of the tournament, only to blow it on the second day final jeopardy.

Is it whale season online test time yet?

Parasol Prophet
Aug 31, 2012

We Are Best Friends Now.


I grew up with both Jeopardy and Wheel of Fortune. Watched it with my parents as a baby-- my dad is convinced that Wheel had something to do with me learning to read early. He actually got on an episode of Wheel of Fortune when I was nine, won about $8000 and a car, which we sold to fix our house's terrible roof.

I tried out for Kid Jeopardy in a different city every summer from ages 10-12, made it past the initial test to a mock game every time but never got chosen. I got to see the actual Jeopardy studio one year because the audition was held in Los Angeles/Culver City.

Basically what I'm saying is Merv Griffin dominated my childhood. Occasionally I think about trying out for Jeopardy again, but I think if I couldn't make it as a dorky kid, I sure as hell couldn't do it now.

Rousimar Pauladeen
Feb 27, 2007

I hate the mods I hate the mods I hate the mods! I HATE THE MODS I HATE THE MODS I HATE THE MODS! Hey wait a minute why do the mods hate me I'm contributing to the conversation I HATE THE MODS I HATE THE MODS I HA


I was so pissed nobody got Final Jeopardy right last night. What's even worse is it's not like Minnesota has a ton of hall of fame rock stars but they all picked the wrong one.

mattfl
Aug 27, 2004


Does anyone remember when on Wheel the contestants used the money their won during the game to buy prizes?? No one I know remembers that, I'm not making that up am I?

Sirotan
Oct 17, 2006

Sirotan is a seal.


mattfl posted:

Does anyone remember when on Wheel the contestants used the money their won during the game to buy prizes?? No one I know remembers that, I'm not making that up am I?

I used to watch Wheel of Fortune reruns on Game Show Network years ago and yes, when the show first started the money you won had to be spent on items that decorated the sets. It would be stuff like dinner wear, outdoor furniture, trips, etc.

Wikipedia says: The shopping element was eliminated from the syndicated version on the episode that aired October 5, 1987, both to speed up gameplay and to reduce the taxes paid by contestants.

Glenn_Beckett
Sep 12, 2008

When I see a 9/11 victim family on television I'm just like 'Given the existence as uttered forth in the public works of Puncher and Wattmann of a personal God quaquaqua'

Frot Lesnar posted:

I was so pissed nobody got Final Jeopardy right last night. What's even worse is it's not like Minnesota has a ton of hall of fame rock stars but they all picked the wrong one.

I could NOT believe how stupid they were for being like "oh, american icons, pulitzer, rock and roll hall of fame, minnesota... I GUESS I'LL PICK LITERALLY ANYONE BUT BOB DYLAN BLEEP BLORP I'M A RETARD ROBOT"

SamBishop
Jan 10, 2003



mattfl posted:

Does anyone remember when on Wheel the contestants used the money their won during the game to buy prizes?? No one I know remembers that, I'm not making that up am I?

gently caress yeah, of course! You got to see their dopey disembodied head in a little oval as they picked stuff out.

I too... am a Jeopardy! superfreak. I love the show, and keep "forgetting" to try out. I might get through because I'm a dork and they tend to pick awkward folks, but hooboy do I know I would turn beet red and completely freeze up when game time started.

Alfred P. Pseudonym
May 29, 2006

And when you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss goes 8-8


You haven't lived until you've been utterly dominated in Quiz Bowl by a 5-day Jeopardy champ. It was like 4 or 5 years ago and I still have flashbacks.

escape artist
Sep 24, 2005

"Slow train coming"

"Slow quality poster coming to the threads about the shows I like."

"No, really, jokes aside, post more in The TV IV because you make good points and don't suck."


Honestly guys, I am a huge nerd about Jeopardy. I keep score and everything. I very well could have won tonight's episode with Indonesia as the final answer-- it all would have come down to if I could ring in faster than those other people. There were a few questions nobody got right that I did.

In high school and into college, it used to be a ritual to get myself and my stoner friends together, every night at 7pm, we'd watch Jeopardy and keep score. I don't smoke weed anymore, so I don't see those people, and needless to say I know a lot more now and have quicker reaction time, etc. But I still keep this ritual going.

BrooklynBruiser
Aug 20, 2006


Glenn_Beckett posted:

I could NOT believe how stupid they were for being like "oh, american icons, pulitzer, rock and roll hall of fame, minnesota... I GUESS I'LL PICK LITERALLY ANYONE BUT BOB DYLAN BLEEP BLORP I'M A RETARD ROBOT"

Frankly, I guessed Prince too, because in my head Bob Dylan is so associated with Greenwich Village and New York that I forgot he was from Minnesota.

Cemetry Gator
Apr 3, 2007

Do you find something comical about my appearance when I'm driving my automobile?


Sirotan posted:

Really can't stand Alex Trebek, when he retires (which I hope is soon), I want Ken Jennings as the new host. He is so loving funny, if you aren't following him on Twitter you are missing out.

My favorite Ken Jennings moment was in response to this answer:

"This long armed gardening tool also means an immoral seeker of pleasure."

Jennings buzzes in and says "What is a hoe?" He's incorrect, and then he flashes this poo poo-eating grin, and the audience loses it.

Trebek asks him "Is that what they teach you in Utah?"

The correct question was "What is a rake?" I still contend that Jennings was correct and that they made a terrible choice in wording.

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Tambreet
Nov 28, 2006

Ninja Platypus


Muldoon

Cemetry Gator posted:

The correct question was "What is a rake?" I still contend that Jennings was correct and that they made a terrible choice in wording.
I agree. I've seen that clip a few times and while it's funny, I don't see why it's wrong.

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