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pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Jerusalem posted:

Omar, Brandon and Bailey are laying out a plan of attack for their next heist. The crude drawings in the dirt of the layout of the streets

We see the police doing exactly this in S03E01, though their gang has twice as many people. A testament to Omar's efficiency.

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pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Fragmented posted:

Jesus talk about giving a gently caress when it ain't your turn to give a gently caress. I'm sure we can handle more than one of you doing write-ups on the same episodes.

Or, if y'all really get your poo poo together, combine the effort into a single super excellent write up.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Awesome job comes along bort, Jerusalem (as usual), and 3Romeo! Nice to get some new voices in there too.

comes along bort posted:

Thanks, man. The hard part is balancing between having something decently lengthy and not getting too far out in the tall weeds with masturbatory over-interpretation, which is ridiculously easy to do.

Don't worry about the tall weeds, go as far as you want.

We're all sitting here in a thread retelling, nearly shot for shot, every episode of one of the meatiest TV series there is. Anyone scared of a few extra words is long gone.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



cletepurcel posted:

I think Snoop was a bit more of a psychopath than Slim. Early in season 5, when Marlo is forced to be quiet because the cops are watching, she complains about not being able to kill people. And Slim would never have done stuff like torturing Butchie (he says so himself) or the conversation in the hardware store. Mind you that was on Marlo's orders but still.

I think you're right about the orders part. Slim Charles was a very loyal soldier. If Avon ordered him to make sure Butchie felt the pain, I don't see him saying no.

I think you're also right about Snoop though. She could torture someone like that without being asked.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



And it might be hard to recruit soldiers willing to do their two days if their reward is death.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Jerusalem posted:

Part of it is lashing out against a subconscious realization that what they do makes no appreciable difference, part of it is believing that this violence is the only thing the dealers understand/respect, and I'm sure there is also some part of it that fulfills some need/desire to inflict violence/dominate or otherwise influence power over somebody (anybody!) else. Look at Officer Walker, I'm sure he didn't just appear in the world fully formed, and if anything seems to piss him off it's when people don't pay him the respect he thinks he is owed or act like they are in some way above him/worthier than him.

All that said, there are assholes in any group. There's probably dozens of Walkers and Colicchios in the department, and there doesn't need to be so many, but you'll always get a few.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Oh poo poo, Jerusalem replied to The Wire: The Rewatch thread!

...

That's not the next episode

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Jerusalem posted:

Is there anything I should be doing differently in these write-ups, by the way? I had hoped that they were extensive enough/asked enough questions/raised enough points that they would generate a little more discussion on the episodes themselves, the overall themes of a particular season, contrary opinions on how particular scenes played out and what we should take from an episode etc, and that doesn't really seem to be happening.

I'm a lazy gently caress who prefers to enjoy your hard work and contribute nothing in return. The write ups are great.

I am starting to get that semiannual itch to rewatch, though, and I plan on doing so with your write ups in hand. Maybe I'll start necroing your old write ups and add to them as I go?

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Jerusalem posted:

I hadn't considered it from that point of view, but you're right - Prez was extremely naive about the depth of the problems in the school even though he'd spent years as police, including 2-3 years with inside access to the everyday world of the drug trade.

Or he didn't want to believe the corner had so thoroughly invaded the schools. Willful ignorance can be just as powerful.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



cletepurcel posted:

I think even if Marlo hadn't been arrested he would have tried to off Michael eventually.

Totally agree, but for a different reason: Michael has the potential to dethrone Marlo one day. I bet Marlo can smell that possibility on someone from a mile away. Keep your enemies closer and all that.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



comes along bort posted:

The one thing that was really unrealistic is Prez's class looked like it had at most about 20 desks. No way he'd have a class that small.

His class has a 50% attendance rate and the school makes up for budgetary shortfalls by not replacing busted desks!

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



ChikoDemono posted:

To be fair, Carcetti doesn't murder people on a whim.

Maybe not, but he sentences loads of schoolchildren to life without education. On a whim.

If you want to tally murders then sure, no comparison. I wonder how close it'd be if you tallied lives ruined.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



frenton posted:

The first time I watched the Wire I hated season 2 so much. I was so invested in the Barksdale organization that I almost didn't want to like all the new characters. After many rewatches of the entire series it's grown on me so much that I think season 2 is actually the strongest one. I love the Sobotkas and the Greeks and dock workers and SWEET BEATRICE RUSSELL so much!

I'm in the same boat, and I wonder if it has to do with familiarity. I guess it's possible to love season 2 immediately on first viewing but it seems pretty rare. I know I haven't seen much (any?) other TV about blue collar union workers, and beyond the superficial level I didn't really get how it fit in with the show until the second go round. This thread helped a lot too, explaining how it's just another side of the same coin.

If, I dunno, I knew more about my grandpa as a steel guy then maybe it would've made sense right away. Whereas I've been to middle school so failing schools makes a bit more sense to me, and I've seen cop shows and drug shows on tv so my total inexperience there at least has a bit of a fallback.

Season 2 sneaks up on you.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Lutha Mahtin posted:

I'm on my first trip through season 2 and I "got" how the docks storyline is showing a different facet of how systemic issues affect the working class, but it's jarring to have the show basically split in half now: one half involves characters and plots that I'm already invested in, and the other half starts out with me being apprehensive over whether it's going to be a "heh, unions are mobsters amirite" caricature. It's clearly not (and I'm only at episode, like, 5?), but it was still jarring at first.

Right, I got the "white folk getting hosed too!!" angle the first time, but I shared that apprehension that the show was going off into the weeds somewhere or totally dropping all these awesome characters from season 1. That apprehension took awhile to disappear, probably until season 3, when it's made clear that the world of season 1 still exists.

(It sounded less tautological in my head.)

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Ainsley McTree posted:

It's been said before, but it's very normal to be super confused the first time you watch the show until around 4 or 5 episodes in. The show doesn't really make any effort to explain what it's talking about to you, you have to sort of pick it up through context, and it can take a few episodes before it clicks. Stick with it!

Yep, it took me a few tries to actually get into the show. I'd get an episode or two in and realize I had no idea who anybody was. Probably didn't help that I would start watching it in bed as I was falling asleep.

Totally worth it though.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



I love how when the streets are all abuzz with the (for once, true) rumour of Omar's death, the journalist at the newspaper doesn't even give a second glance at his name. The biggest, most fearsome/mythologized name in one world isn't even recognizable in the other.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



drunken officeparty posted:

This plotline about them moving everyone to a vacant street to openly sell drugs is kind of testing my limits on believability.

To be fair, exactly nobody thinks it's a good or workable idea except for the one guy with just enough power to get it going.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



the_american_dream posted:

I can stretch my believability to literally everything but Brother Mouzone but he's still a great written character without the superhuman stuff

Sometimes I see Mouzone as an embodiment of "out-of-town gangsters". Seemingly from nowhere a bunch of local boys get got, and the rumours start going around that some scary hired guns have arrived for a brief stay. It's a bit of literary shorthand to just make it one guy instead of a larger crew.

This obviously falls apart when Chris and Snoop go dropping the New York (?) soldiers when they get trivia questions wrong. Really I'm just making excuses, but I'm at peace with it.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Lester's a manipulative dick, he just gets away with it most of the time by being right. Even the time when his methods are wrong, faking the serial killer, I remember he goes all out to avoid actually touching anything with his own hands. He gets McNutty to do the dirty work, and merely enables it.

It's been awhile since my last rewatch (about due for one actually) but that's how I remember it.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



RichardDunn posted:

I do have a s2 question that I somehow missed. What is with Valchek's big hard-on for catching Frank? The only thing I can remember is the stained glass church window. That would be hilariously ridiculous if all the poo poo that happened in S2 was because Frank got a better window than Valcheck. lol

I read that scene as them having some vague grudge against one another. Probably from some past, similarly small-time bullshit. I forget, does Valchek recognize the name Sobotka when he hears it? Or does he have to look him up. Either way I don't think there's any real evidence of a longstanding grudge from the text of the show.

It could also be some beef Valchek has with longshoremen in general, maybe from some past case, and he decides to take it out on the current union head.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Rile the thread by proclaiming season 5 as your favourite. Do it.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



ChikoDemono posted:

It seems to me more like Slim, Wee-Bay, Chris all knew what they were doing was some evil poo poo and accepted it as a job. They are killers and they make no qualms about it.

This rings true to me. To put it another way: can you see Snoop getting out of the game? I can see the others retiring (not necessarily by choice, mind you), but Snoop just seems like she's a permanent fixture. Even Marlo gets out of the game.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.




Hahaha I went in the opposite direction but yep.

He really doesn't seem to have any characteristics aside from being the harbinger of poo poo. If you compare him to, I guess Rawls is his Homicide Department equivalent? it's season-five-problems.txt right there.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



No secret about it, it's just not readily apparent the first time around.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



This thread is a testament to preferring quality over fast turnaround. No rush, I'll excitedly read it when it's ready!

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



I love getting to vicariously watch for the first time again.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



I just finished reading Homicide for the first time and itís basically a season of The Wire (in every positive sense that comparison can convey). Absolutely go read it if you havenít.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Did the thread ever talk about Nicko's pi tattoo on his neck? It looks pretty fresh in one of the later episodes of season 2 and itís prominent in some of the last shots of the season finale. No idea what the significance is but it canít be a coincidence that heís becoming buddies with "the "Greeks"" and gets a Greek letter tat?

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Valchek is a strangely fascinating character. Heís an rear end in a top hat but heís kinda our rear end in a top hat, you know? I canít quite put my finger on it, but heís making me laugh a ton on this rewatch.

Unfortunately he doesnít get a Rawlsian moment of total police competence so I canít tell if heís genuinely good at his job.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Ainsley McTree posted:

There's a beautiful bit of background work in the first episode of season 2:



His computer isn't even on his desk, it's on his cabinet on the back wall of his office, stuck on the "login failed" screen. I'm not sure if the joke is "he's a bad cop" or "he's an old hump who isn't even trying to keep up with modern technology" but either way it's a subtle jab and I'm with it

Sorry for the amazon player screenshot, I'm much too lazy to get a better picture than this

Ahaha love it. Goes with homicide's dedication to hunt-and-peck.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



I was on season five of my rewatch when saying earlier that I enjoy the cop toadies like Valchek. The newspaper toadies are just completely unlikeable and unenjoyable in comparison.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



And for all I know itís an entirely accurate rendition of life at the Baltimore Sun city desk in 200X. Doesnít make it fun to watch.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



I think you mean "has a depo"

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



algebra testes posted:

Can I be honest? I dont understand how David "the System is broken" Simon isnt all for the system is broken candidate.

And please explain it to me using the word "fucknuckle" for maximum authenticity.

My guess is he doesn't see any of the candidates as outside the system, so he picked one who he thought most likely to win and/or do something useful? While pledging to support another candidate if they get the nomination?

Fucknuckle.

Dumb Lowtax posted:

And I guess it's sealioning now if anyone wants to have a conversation at all after someone publicly declares for a presidential candidate, on open discussion forum in a thread they started. Especially if how they did it is wildly inconsistent and off-tone for them, in a way that their fans will have loads of questions about.

Nobody would interpret your reply as interest in having a conversation. You came in hot and got burnt. No big deal, though "badge of honor" is a stretch.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



eleven extra elephants posted:

Completely forgot about this scene but upon rewatch it absolutely slayed me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DY67XaX6oM8

This and when they all run into each other at the movies. Perfect "morning Ralph" "morning Sam" scenes.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Jerusalem posted:

Good point, it IS time for a full rewatch!

Was thinking the same thing. What are the odds!

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Levyís a non-sleazy non-lawyer in one episode of Veronica Mars!

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



empty baggie posted:

Michael Kostroff (Maury Levy) is also currently in the HBO show ďThe Plot Against AmericaĒ.

E: he was also in The Deuce, so I guess David Simon likes him.

Being the brother of the producer of every David Simon show probably didn't hurt.

pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Always forget how much fun some of these characters are. Valchek is such a joy.

Also I like how the first time we see Royce, he's pushing a giant plunger to blow up the towers, and the camera makes a point of catching the actual workers squatting nearby who push the actual button.

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pokeyman
Nov 26, 2006

That elephant ate my entire platoon.



Eau de MacGowan posted:

rewatching in 16:9 and it feels weird

Pagers! In HD!

They did a surprisingly good job though, I stopped thinking about it real quick.

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