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Mr. Prokosch
Feb 14, 2012

Behold My Magnificence!
I just finished my third re-watch of season 2. The first time I watched it I cringed when Ziggy was in screen. He was such a gently caress up the only question was how he was going to gently caress things up for himself and for the characters I had real sympathy towards.

Second time I watched it, I was fascinated by the journey and the little clues along the way pointing towards what was going to happen.

This time? I cringed again but it was because of the emotional abuse Ziggy endured. Maybe it's the years between re-watches but I really feel for Ziggy. I wouldn't have withstood that kind of abuse over years any better than him. The way his cousin, his friends, his own father talk to him? I wouldn't have been able to stand it a day, let alone years, and you can be drat sure I would have responded with complete exile or violence eventually.

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Mr. Prokosch
Feb 14, 2012

Behold My Magnificence!

Groovelord Neato posted:

what is this newspaper bullshit.

Season 5.txt

Mr. Prokosch
Feb 14, 2012

Behold My Magnificence!
Yeah, remember that conversation between Rawls and Landsman, where Landsman points out that McNulty had a really dumb partner and that gave him his attitude? I think he was right. McNulty can be smart, but he's rarely the smartest person in the room. Not if the room has Bunk, Lester, or Rhonda, or someone from most of the non-cop cast in it. But like Landsman says, when McNulty bites down on something he never lets it go, which can be an asset even if letting go is sometimes the smarter move. McNulty isn't some super genius, he just gives a poo poo when it's not his turn to give a poo poo.

This might connect to a larger commentary on the nature of intelligence and self image in our culture.

Mr. Prokosch
Feb 14, 2012

Behold My Magnificence!
That poo poo reminds me of something a relative of mine who was kind of connected to drug/gang poo poo told me. Ex-military guys are really valuable. They have very relevant training personally and they can pass a lot of it on, they have some discipline, they're often comfortable with killing people. They're also often easy to recruit for the same reason a lot of veterans are homeless. A young veteran or two coming back to your run down neighborhood is a dream come true.

Chris always struck me as a veteran and a real boon to the Stanfield organization.

Mr. Prokosch
Feb 14, 2012

Behold My Magnificence!
Yeah, Avon would murder a man for testifying, Marlo would do it because he thought he might have given him a funny look.

Mr. Prokosch
Feb 14, 2012

Behold My Magnificence!
I don't see Marlo as representing neoliberalism. I see him as an embodiment of all the principles of the Game. This is the ideal person the streets of Baltimore produces. The Game exists in capitalism so has many of the same features, but reputation is Marlo's ultimate drive. If he was all about predatory neoliberalism he'd be more happy to sell out and escape Baltimore.

Mr. Prokosch
Feb 14, 2012

Behold My Magnificence!

awesmoe posted:

how does that mesh with his ending, where he gets basically what stringer (the actual capitalist) wanted and bails on it to go back to the corner?
yes he's about the ruthless pursuit of power at the expense of all those around him, but that story's older than capitalism is.

reflecting on him, it's interesting that he doesnt explicitly reflect the main theme of the show (imo: the corrupting and exploitative forces inherent in any institution). he cares for his people and they don't get chewed up and spat out because of him (Michael explicitly sets himself apart from marlo's institution and that's why things happen how they do).

I think he does, in the sense that he is the product of the Game's corrupting force. He didn't resist and question as most characters did, he was a perfect student who molded himself to those forces. He's the street side of Rawls and Valchek, people who understand their system and do exactly what it demands of them.

Yeah, I think the Greek is pure capitalism, Marlo is the Game.

Mr. Prokosch
Feb 14, 2012

Behold My Magnificence!
Brother Mouzone's power was time travel.

Seriously he might as well have been those typewriters in season 1.

Mr. Prokosch
Feb 14, 2012

Behold My Magnificence!

White Rabbit posted:

I painfully got through the fifth episode of that Way down in the hole podcast, what a poo poo show that was. There was barely enough insight to fill in 12 minutes. They spent maybe that much time comparing characters to LeBron James and some other NBA players, I guess I'm too European to care.

I didnt mind the first couple episodes but the best part was actually hearing quotes from the show now that I think about it.

I'm disapointed cuz they manage to gently caress up talking about the wire, which I didnt think possible. Do they eventually keep their focus on the show and do they have interesting guests at some point?

Yeah, I've listened to all of them and they don't really change. The hosts both worked in sports so they are waaaaay too into sports metaphors and the kind of meaningless filler sports talk you hear from sports shows that aren't actually sports.

Sometimes they have good insights though, and they usually have a solid take on the Wire. Their deep dive into Ziggy was on the money and the 'side bars' are funny even if they aren't about the Wire.

Mr. Prokosch
Feb 14, 2012

Behold My Magnificence!
Now that you've watched the Wire, here's what you should do:

1. Watch the Sopranos again
2. Watch the Wire again
3. Think about them both and what they're saying as works of art and social commentary
4. Check if you still think Sopranos is better

My ranking of seasons:
4
1
2
3
5
All other television

I think people don't give 1 enough credit for establishing everything, including themes that are explored much later. Season 5 has some real issues that stem from David Simon having a self-insert and being too close to the newspaper world and having too many grudges without someone to check him.

I recently watched Patriot and it was pretty great. I'd say it's better than the Sopranos, but still doesn't come close to the Wire.

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Mr. Prokosch
Feb 14, 2012

Behold My Magnificence!
I like how it shows why changes in cadet training just aren't enough.

First day on the job: "Remember all that poo poo they taught you? gently caress that poo poo, this is Baltimore."

Easy as that.

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