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  • Locked thread
Bruceski
Aug 21, 2007

The tools of a hero mean nothing without a solid core.

Calax posted:

The way it was referenced (with the Hugo "Side mission) seemed more like he thought that Hugo was the "decoy protagonist". And if it's what you're suggesting rather than what I read into it (it's late, my brain is slowing down so it may be my fault) I think he went over that in the last Hugo post(?) I know that he specifically mentioned that if you'd played Chris first, Hugo's actions would become automatic rather than player driven. And the reason he chose Hugo first was for the stronger impact of Lulu's death. I assume in the long run it's going to be similar, with the first protagonist to come into conflict/work with the other in their story effectively deciding how that scene will play out.

Read "Hugo side mission" as "side mission that Hugo did" rather than "Hugo's mission was on the side." The kids and the treasure hunt that's entirely skippable if you just sleep at the Inn for three days.

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Calax
Oct 5, 2011

Ah.

I think it'll pop up, but only in relation to those kids joining as members of the 108.

yokaiy
Dec 25, 2012

What a handsome tree!
The Melville/Alanis/Elliot sidequest happens at a point where Hugo's and Chris's chapters are not intersecting. Earlier, as Chris, it hadn't happened yet so all three of them were still hanging out. Since we're heading back to Vinay now, Alanis will have already left town as the sidequest already occurred. Melville and Elliot should still be around, though. I'll show them off in the next update.

We'll be seeing Alanis again later, but not in Vinay. She'll be in a very unlikely place.

I'm not sure if that would change if we hadn't done the quest, but I'm pretty sure Alanis was leaving whether or not we'd kidnapped them for adventures anyway, so I'm inclined to believe that we would have gotten the same result, only that we'd (eventually) recruit them at lower levels.

Spoiler: They're part of the 108 and eventually we recruit them. Because that was hard to figure out.

e: Ms. Rune Shop has already shown up, actually. The Blinking Rune person doesn't show up for quite a while.

yokaiy fucked around with this message at 16:44 on Feb 21, 2013

mageofthesands
Jan 2, 2013
Breaking the game down into screenshots actually improves my appreciation of the game. I mean, I always knew this things, but to have a screenshot focusing on a sidelong glance or a subtle (subtle given the art style and age of the PS2, I mean) gesture really clarifies things. I always knew about the other knights suspecting Borus, the Swordsman of Rage, of going all Berserker Rage on the village. What I didn't realize was all those tells Borus gives of the events that happened.

Also, I like words, and I think we need to you do that for all characters. Those character analysis' are really good work, and I think will enhance the LP in the long run. So you get back there and do the Saint Loa Knights, and make links in the main post.

One thing about one of the Zexan Knights not mentioned is Leo's axe. It's big, yes, but it's a military axe. Lots of times the Axe Guy will have a lumber axe or some kind of fantasy fancy axe. Not Leo. His axe looks like something out of the AD&D 2nd Edition Polearm Handbook. Double bladed, for chopping on the return swing. Stout blades, for easier carrying, and less chance of axcidental injury. Spike on the end, in case you need to impale a charging horse. Leo is a credit to Heavy Infantry.

Calax
Oct 5, 2011

yokaiy posted:

Spoiler: They're part of the 108 and eventually we recruit them. Because that was hard to figure out.
Personal Rule for Suikoden:

If it has a portrait, it's either a member of the 108, or a leading bad guy. Has served me pretty well

yokaiy
Dec 25, 2012

What a handsome tree!

mageofthesands posted:

Breaking the game down into screenshots actually improves my appreciation of the game. I mean, I always knew this things, but to have a screenshot focusing on a sidelong glance or a subtle (subtle given the art style and age of the PS2, I mean) gesture really clarifies things. I always knew about the other knights suspecting Borus, the Swordsman of Rage, of going all Berserker Rage on the village. What I didn't realize was all those tells Borus gives of the events that happened.

Also, I like words, and I think we need to you do that for all characters. Those character analysis' are really good work, and I think will enhance the LP in the long run. So you get back there and do the Saint Loa Knights, and make links in the main post.

One thing about one of the Zexan Knights not mentioned is Leo's axe. It's big, yes, but it's a military axe. Lots of times the Axe Guy will have a lumber axe or some kind of fantasy fancy axe. Not Leo. His axe looks like something out of the AD&D 2nd Edition Polearm Handbook. Double bladed, for chopping on the return swing. Stout blades, for easier carrying, and less chance of axcidental injury. Spike on the end, in case you need to impale a charging horse. Leo is a credit to Heavy Infantry.

Well fine, maybe I will! :colbert:

But not right now.

Part of the reason I didn't gush over Leo's axe is because we actually haven't seen much of it yet. He and Percival haven't been part of combat yet -- they weren't part of the main force sacking Karaya so they didn't go with Chris on her trip to the Grasslands, and they didn't ever actually engage in combat against Hugo & co while chasing them down. So I could talk about their weapons until the cows come home, but it wouldn't mean much until they actually get to be in a fight.


Calax posted:

Personal Rule for Suikoden:

If it has a portrait, it's either a member of the 108, or a leading bad guy. Has served me pretty well

Yeah, that's a pretty good estimate. Especially the former part of that sentence.

atelier morgan
Mar 11, 2003

super-scientific, ultra-gay

Lipstick Apathy

mageofthesands posted:

One thing about one of the Zexan Knights not mentioned is Leo's axe. It's big, yes, but it's a military axe. Lots of times the Axe Guy will have a lumber axe or some kind of fantasy fancy axe. Not Leo. His axe looks like something out of the AD&D 2nd Edition Polearm Handbook. Double bladed, for chopping on the return swing. Stout blades, for easier carrying, and less chance of axcidental injury. Spike on the end, in case you need to impale a charging horse. Leo is a credit to Heavy Infantry.

An axe being double bladed is actually a very good sign that it's for cutting wood, rather than people. You can't do any real damage with a backswing because of the way a chopping motion works but it was real handy to be able to just turn your axe around if it got dull while chopping wood in the middle of the forest.

Axes meant for killing people wanted to be weighted forward to maximize the power of a chop to burst shields or mail and tended to be much smaller than you'd think.

This is as wide as an axe you'd hold in one hand got:



This has been your pointless medieval weaponry distraction for the page!

Eruza
Sep 4, 2011

yokaiy posted:


I'm not sure if that would change if we hadn't done the quest, but I'm pretty sure Alanis was leaving whether or not we'd kidnapped them for adventures anyway, so I'm inclined to believe that we would have gotten the same result, only that we'd (eventually) recruit them at lower levels.


As a person who has missed that sidequest multiple times (:downs:), I can say that Alanis does leave regardless, and you can recruit all 3 the same way as if you had done it. I don't remember if their dialogue changes much if you haven't done it though.

yokaiy
Dec 25, 2012

What a handsome tree!

UberJew posted:

This has been your pointless medieval weaponry distraction for the page!

I approve of weaponry distractions, feel free to do so whenever you like. Character designs I can break open, but I'm not as good when it comes to weaponry, sadly.

Eruza posted:

As a person who has missed that sidequest multiple times (:downs:), I can say that Alanis does leave regardless, and you can recruit all 3 the same way as if you had done it. I don't remember if their dialogue changes much if you haven't done it though.

I think the only real difference is the kids saying "Who are you and what do you want?" rather than "Oh hey, Hugo, what's up? Wanna go on an adventure?" later in the game, or something along those lines.

Probably going to have an update for you tonight or tomorrow, the next part is actually on the short side as we're wrapping up Chris's chapter. Her first two chapters are considerably shorter than Hugo's and Geddoe's (especially compared to Geddoe), but that's probably not a bad thing with all the politics shoved into them.

e: Also the emulator wigged out on me a bit, so get ready for that. It's not too bad but it's definitely... well it sure is a thing. You'll see.

yokaiy
Dec 25, 2012

What a handsome tree!
Chris Chapter 1.5 - Singing the Same Old Song



Chris returns to Vinay del Zexay with no great fanfare this time around.



The port city was far enough away from the battlefield that returning to a peaceful village felt surreal.



News travels fast, it seems.

No use hurrying to our punishment -- an afternoon with the Council -- so let's go a bit out of the way and check out the rest of Vinay's citizens as well. There have been some changes in NPC dialogue, but the majority of the citizens continue to simply swoon over her visage. As before, I'll be showing off the interesting new ones.



What do these people think a war is -- a baseball game?

: "Hey, Lady Chris! Yes!! Way to go, Lady Chris! The Savior of Zexen!"



They mean well. She knows they mean well, at least. And yet...

: "I was so worried! I heard you'd fallen into the barbarians' trap! Those wretched Grasslanders!"

: " Lady Chris! Oh, thank goodness! I heard you were surrounded by barbarians! I thought you were a goner!"

You know, there wasn't that much of a time lapse between the "barbarian trap" and the burning of Karaya Village and return of the knights. Zexen messengers must be VERY efficient at their jobs.



Seeing as Percy was nowhere near battle, yes, I assume he is both safe and sound.

: "L-lady Chris!! You're safe! Thank goodness!!"

: "When I heard you got caught in a barbarian trap, I nearly cried!"

The man by the shop says nothing new. Zexen messengers must be both very efficient in timing, and very spotty in service providing, as only about half the city seems to have gotten the message.



This guy just sort of makes me happy.



The crowd in the background has nothing new to say. Which I guess is actually pretty sad; those children have been waiting for their father to come home "tomorrow" for quite a few days now.



You know, while you're out on the battlefield, the faux peace in this town seems so distant and unreal.



: "What next! Women in coats of armor, eh? What's the world coming to?"

Hahaha...



Interestingly, Alanis is still in town. The three Saint Loa Knights don't have any new dialogue, though.



Well, looks like we can't put it off any longer. Time to meet with the Council.

Also, I just now decided to turn off the corner mini-map. Why it took me this long, I'm not sure. From now on, I'll probably just have the mini-map on our first time in a town so you can get a feel of the layout, then keep it off.



Chris approaches the Council Hall, and is met by the marshal.

: "Lady Chris, let me guide you. This way, Madam."

He unlocks the door, and ushers us in as the screen fades.



However, we are not taken to the meeting room, but to a small church that is housed downstairs.

: "Please wait here, we will call you once everything is ready."

He leaves immediately. She waits until he's out of earshot to voice her concerns, though.



Really I just wanted a screen of Chris saying "Balderdash." My life is pretty complete right now.







She takes a few steps further into the church. It's really quite beautiful.

But the nice architecture is hardly what's on her mind right now. She takes a few moments to gather her thoughts, directing her attention to the ceiling.



Chris is not much for religion, but some heavenly guidance might be nice right now.



(Pretend my emulator didn't fritz out -- for some reason it really didn't like flashbacks.)

When she closed her eyes, the fire seemed to burn both hotter and redder in her memory. And also seemed to get attacked by a MissingNo. No complaints here.



: "His anger towards Borus and the other knights... Could it have been meant for me?"



Closing her eyes again, she can see the older boy, hugging his dear friend. They were only children, this shouldn't have happened...



: "No, I knew I'd face animosity when I chose the life of a knight."





: "I am a Zexen Knight, through and through."

The messenger comes back in.



: "We are ready to proceed. This way, madam."

: "Thank you."

She hesitates long enough for him to bring it up.

: "Is there anything wrong?"



: "No, thank you. I was just absorbed in my thoughts."

He gives her an awkward look and cocks his head to the side.

: "Absorbed in thought?"

"I've never heard of such a thing!"

: "Yes. I was thinking of what I could do for Zexen."

: "Surely you jest! I know of no more dedicated Zexen than you."

For working for the Council, this guy isn't actually that horrible.

Chris begins to walk out of the church, but stops just short of the doors to turn back to the man.



Maybe she just had to hear it from someone else to believe she was doing the right thing.

We rejoin Chris in the middle of her meeting with the Council.



It seems to be going less than well.

: "Indeed we do."

She stands, slamming her hands on the table.



: "It was the enemy who first breached the agreement, was it not?"



She gives him a strained stare as he finishes his words.



: "We needed enough time for the Zexen Knights to regain their strength after losing both the captain and the vice captain."



: "I heard that you burned down a Karayan village, one of the Six Clans of the Grasslands. That was quite an accomplishment, and should be highly commended."



: "All the better to enhance the reputation of the Silver Maiden, who saved her army from danger and exterminated the barbarian village. This will be heard of even as far as the holy Harmonia and Dunan."

: "I do not seek glory for such a deed. The attack on the Karayan village was only intended to rescue our men. It was not an act of bravery."

: "Do not be so modest. We value your accomplishments very highly. Your stand against the barbarians gives credence to your title of 'White Hero.' "

: "Can't you see how this current state of confusion within the Karayan forces offers us a great opportunity."

She takes a moment to calm herself before continuing. When she finally speaks, her words are slow, clear, and laced with bitterness.

: "Our job is to protect the Zexens and their land. If the council wishes to invade another land..."



:sbahj:

: "By weakening the Grassland forces, you ensure the strength of the Zexens, do you not? I might also add that this is a council decision. It's your duty to serve our will."













: "Let me give thanks to our Goddess for allowing us this occasion to gather here today."

: "Let me give thanks to our Goddess... For allowing us this occasion to gather here today."



Well, that went well.



Borus and Louis await the good news outside of the Council Hall.



: "Milady, how did the summons go?"

: "They formally promoted me to captain for burning down the Karayan village, and, to celebrate the promotion, we were ordered to attack the Lizard Clan."



: "Are we leaving for the Brass Castle immediately?"

: "It's too late to travel today. We'll sleep here and embark at first light."

: "Yes, Milady. Let me walk you home."

Well, that could have been significantly better.



Upon returning to her house, Borus bids her good-night.



: "Good night, Lady Chris. Shall I call for you in the morning?"

: "Not necessary, but thanks, Borus. Take care of yourself -- don't drink too much tonight and oversleep."

: "You can depend on it. I will behave myself."

Making Louis get drunk is actually noted to be a favorite pastime of the Zexen Knights. I don't think it ever really goes well. At least not for Louis.





: "I would have contacted you sooner, but I was called back at short notice."

: "Not to worry, milady. We are always here to serve you, whenever the need."



: "Whew! I'm terribly tired."

If that was his hint to leave her, he doesn't take it. Instead, he lingers for a few moments, before speaking up.

: "If it's not too much of a bother, might you spare a few minutes, madam?"

: "Sure. What do you need?"



Pointing this out because it was a nice animation touch, but she actually scootches forward to the end of the sofa before standing. Like the way normal people get off of chairs and sofas.



: "Lady Chris."





: "This coat of arms is..."

: "Yes, milady, this belongs to the Lightfellow Family. And..."

: "It is! It belonged to my dear father..."

: "As you say, milady..."



: "A Grassland boy brought it here in your absence. Don't worry. He was paid fairly for his efforts."

No he wasn't. Hugo didn't ask to be paid. :colbert:



: "A boy from the Grasslands..."

You may notice the emblem on the mantle in the background matches the one she's holding.

She muses on this news, as the scene fades, signaling the end of the chapter.



And here is the blurb.

For some reason, plot says that the Zexens are going to attack the Lizards, but the blurb says the Lizards are going to attack the Zexens. Hm.

Next time, we explore a new cast!

vilkacis
Feb 16, 2011

yokaiy posted:

What do these people think a war is -- a baseball game?

"Behold the power of the True B-Ball Rune!"


Ah well. As much as I appreciate Chris, it is time for the best character. :unsmigghh:

cdyoung
Mar 2, 2012
What I love and hate about Suikoden is that aside from an RPG with semi-turn based strategy elements is that there's ALWAYS politics going on in the background of the games, but you almost never see it. And Suikoden III has probably some of the heaviest background action ever. I'd seriously recommend that people check out the manga adaptation of the game to see all the stuff not shown in the game proper. (like how Hugo and Feather became best friends for example, since it's In Media Res ingame.)

yokaiy
Dec 25, 2012

What a handsome tree!

vilkacis posted:

"Behold the power of the True B-Ball Rune!"


Ah well. As much as I appreciate Chris, it is time for the best character. :unsmigghh:

No offense to Hugo and Chris, as I think they're both wonderful, but I've been waiting for this since I started this LP.

:getin:

cdyoung posted:

What I love and hate about Suikoden is that aside from an RPG with semi-turn based strategy elements is that there's ALWAYS politics going on in the background of the games, but you almost never see it. And Suikoden III has probably some of the heaviest background action ever. I'd seriously recommend that people check out the manga adaptation of the game to see all the stuff not shown in the game proper. (like how Hugo and Feather became best friends for example, since it's In Media Res ingame.)

Normally, I would agree with you. Except, at the point we're at in this game, I wouldn't. The manga doesn't cut corners when it comes to CRAZY BIG SPOILERS. I'll be making note of when certain volumes become "safe" to read, but at this point not even the first volume is entirely safe and spoiler-free.

The part where he befriends Fubar is pretty cute, though. If you guys don't mind buttloads of pictures (I guess if you minded you wouldn't be reading this LP in the first place), I can probably dig it up and post it here. Same goes for some other points in the story.

But yeah. Right now? Stay away from the manga.

Tallgeese
May 11, 2008

MAKE LOVE, NOT WAR


To fix flashbacks, you have to switch to software mode temporarily. Press F9 to swap between Hardware and Software mode.

CVE
Jan 27, 2012

Tallgeese posted:

To fix flashbacks, you have to switch to software mode temporarily. Press F9 to swap between Hardware and Software mode.

Would I only have known before I played through the game with the start of this LP :argh:

As much as I like the next character I think I prefer Chris over him. too seldom do you see a strong female lead. But thanks to the Trinity Sight System we don't have to choose so everything is well.

Testekill
Nov 1, 2012

I demand to be taken seriously

:aronrex:

Now it's time for someone that is barely connected to the other stories but still feels like a whole lot of poo poo is going down. Are you going to play as Thomas after Geddoe?

yokaiy
Dec 25, 2012

What a handsome tree!

Tallgeese posted:

To fix flashbacks, you have to switch to software mode temporarily. Press F9 to swap between Hardware and Software mode.

Oh, sweet. Thanks. I'm not sure if I'll go back to get those shots, but in the future I will. I'm still sort of new to this PS2 emulator thing. :blush:

CVE posted:

Would I only have known before I played through the game with the start of this LP :argh:

As much as I like the next character I think I prefer Chris over him. too seldom do you see a strong female lead. But thanks to the Trinity Sight System we don't have to choose so everything is well.

Chris is still easily one of my favorites in this game, yes, but this man is just so :allears:. There's a point in the game later where he pretty much secured his place as my favorite character, and I cannot wait until we get there. (It won't be for a really long time though.)

Out of curiosity, are you playing along or did you get super ahead of me?

Testekill posted:

Now it's time for someone that is barely connected to the other stories but still feels like a whole lot of poo poo is going down. Are you going to play as Thomas after Geddoe?

He's actually quite connected to the story. It's just in a very unusual way. And good gosh, yes. A lot of poo poo is going to go down.

Yes, I will.

Verant
Oct 20, 2012

Go on an adventure ordained by fate?
-->Okay.
-->Eh.

vilkacis posted:

Ah well. As much as I appreciate Chris, it is time for the best character. :unsmigghh:

Ahhh, yes, the zany adventures of...Erk!

Erk in danger! To be continued...

Testekill
Nov 1, 2012

I demand to be taken seriously

:aronrex:

yokaiy posted:


Chris is still easily one of my favorites in this game, yes, but this man is just so :allears:. There's a point in the game later where he pretty much secured his place as my favorite character, and I cannot wait until we get there. (It won't be for a really long time though.)



If you're talking about the part that I'm thinking of, you need to GIF it because it is both badass and hilarious.

yokaiy
Dec 25, 2012

What a handsome tree!

Verant posted:

Ahhh, yes, the zany adventures of...Erk!

Erk in danger! To be continued...

Oh. Oh you just killed me.

I was going to wait on this until the Erk stuff had started, but...

http://tindeck.com/listen/xgel

You may thank the lovely Zosephine for this.

For those of you who don't want spoilers, I'll be reposting this at the proper time, as well.

Testekill posted:

If you're talking about the part that I'm thinking of, you need to GIF it because it is both badass and hilarious.

I'm going to attempt to kidnap a better computer for this very purpose. If any moment gets turned into a gif in this LP, it is going to be that one.

While we're at silly things, though, I doodle a thing.


AradoBalanga
Jan 3, 2013

yokaiy posted:

While we're at silly things, though, I doodle a thing.



Beautiful. A perfect palette cleanser for the madness that the FE Rom Hack just produced.

Verant
Oct 20, 2012

Go on an adventure ordained by fate?
-->Okay.
-->Eh.
This is the LP that just keeps on giving. :allears:
Please don't stop doodling, yokaiy, these are magnificent!

Zosephine
Dec 31, 2012

Even my tail feathers concur.
Well now I'm imagining any of the characters not in the current chapter chilling out in the green room.

No one is drinking tea angrily in this wonderful, ethereal, actually kind of grimy place. Upon each chapter's end and the return to the Trinity Altar, the voice of the mysterious Stage Manager manifests and announces the next character.

Lulu has already gone out for drinks at this point.

LimburgLimbo
Feb 10, 2008

yokaiy posted:



And here is the blurb.

For some reason, plot says that the Zexens are going to attack the Lizards, but the blurb says the Lizards are going to attack the Zexens. Hm.

Next time, we explore a new cast!

This is probably a translation error. If they're saying it in Japanese the way I think they are then it would just say basically [Lizard] [Attack] with context telling whether the attacks are against or from the Lizards. Japanese being a highly contextual language you get this stuff a lot if you're translating with multiple people are aren't really well coordinated.

vilkacis
Feb 16, 2011

Hell yes, Hitman Bravo! This thread is definitely going places. :allears:

CmdrKing
Oct 14, 2012

Maybe if I called it 'Interpretive Stabbing'...
This little scene in the church is one of the things that makes Chris work as a character. It continues on from the scene in Karaya, where cutting down a child clearly bothered her. She shrugs it off to do what needs done, and while it continues to bother her when she's left alone with her thoughts in this scene, she again mulls it over and decides that while it might be distasteful, it's in the past and all she can do is move on. She manages to be an emotional, responsive character without wallowing in her emotions unchecked.

It's the sort of nuance and subtlety that Suikoden as a whole was surprisingly good at, and one of the key ingredients that made Tierkreis not feel like a Suikoden game; it has some of the broader themes and trappings, but little of the politic and none of the subtle character moments. Very much in-your-face sledgehammer style storytelling.

Verant
Oct 20, 2012

Go on an adventure ordained by fate?
-->Okay.
-->Eh.

CmdrKing posted:

It's the sort of nuance and subtlety that Suikoden as a whole was surprisingly good at, and one of the key ingredients that made Tierkreis not feel like a Suikoden game; it has some of the broader themes and trappings, but little of the politic and none of the subtle character moments. Very much in-your-face sledgehammer style storytelling.

wontknowunlessyoutrywontknowunlessyoutrywontknowunlessyoutry

To say Tierkreis was a disappointment would be an understatement. Boring characters and gameplay mechanics that resembled generic jRPGs rather than the Suikoden series left an awful taste in my mouth a couple of hours in.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry
As time goes on I expect we'll see Chris's reasons for not stepping down. Probably because who else is going to protect Zexen?

Raitzeno
Nov 24, 2007

What? It seemed like
a good idea at the time.

Glazius posted:

As time goes on I expect we'll see Chris's reasons for not stepping down. Probably because who else is going to protect Zexen?

Honestly I'd be more afraid that they'd find someone who was more a straight-up toady for the council, or at least someone similarly terrible-minded. Would you step down from a position of power to "protect your ideals" if you knew that, for example, Roland was going to be your replacement? For now, from where she's at, she can at least mitigate some of the awful decisions of the Council.

RelentlessImp
Mar 15, 2011

yokaiy posted:

: "What next! Women in coats of armor, eh? What's the world coming to?"

Hahaha...

In keeping with the game text, I think you meant "Ha, ha, ha..." :colbert:

This is actually a pretty interesting LP. I stopped playing Suikoden after II, so this is all new to me. The round-robin style of chapters looks like an odd way to do things, though.

ED: What? Why did I put IV? Braiiiiiiiin x.x

RelentlessImp fucked around with this message at 19:47 on Feb 23, 2013

yokaiy
Dec 25, 2012

What a handsome tree!
An Interlude - Runes

While we've got a bit of a (probably very short) lull going, as we're changing to a neutral character who doesn't show up in either of the first chapters for Chris or Hugo, let's talk about a core mechanic of the Suikoden series -- Runes.

Runes represent magic. The details are a bit vague, but generally if you slap one onto one of your hands (or your head, or wherever), you become able to use the magic they contain. They're not terribly rare. Sure, not everyone has one, but a lot of people do, and it's a big enough part of peoples lives that there's a rune sage in almost every town who's willing to help you stick one on yourself, or a tutor to help you learn how to use them better.

However, there are also special runes, called True Runes. There are only 27 in existence, and they vary in attributes from things that make sense, like the elements, to things that make less sense, such as punishment or soul-eating.

These True Runes, unlike their normal, common counterparts, are more-or-less sentient. You don't just stumble upon one and start using it. No, these runes choose their wielder.

And they're also huge assholes.

In fact, they're basically parasitic gods, who find someone they think will best suit their agenda, and then drag them along on an adventure.

So where did these super runes come from?

Suikoden Creation Myth posted:

In the beginning, there was "darkness."
Then, finally, the "darkness" shed a "tear."
From that "tear," the brothers Sword and Shield were born.
Sword bragged that he could cut anything. Shield replied that he could protect anything.
Then, the brothers began a legendary battle for seven days and seven nights.
At the end, Sword cut Shield, and Shield smashed Sword.
Sword became the sky, Shield became the earth, and the sparks from the battle became the stars.
And the jewels that adorned Sword and Shield became the True Runes--
The runes that all other runes were born from."

The Sword and Shield, the first rune-gods of the universe, shattered into the planet and also a bunch of little rune-gods, pretty much. And, much like the original Sword and Shield, the 27 True Runes do not get along. (Suikoden II had the best example of this, where two friends ended up with True Runes that hated each other, and drove the two to opposite sides of a war.) Some of them don't get along with the world either (as seen in Suikoden IV).

Suikoden games generally revolve around a True Rune, and the sap unlucky enough to end up with them. And war. Often over True Runes or because of True Runes.

In Suikoden I, we had the Soul Eater Rune, which led the main character to become an exile, and then wind up at war with his previous home-nation. It also led to the devouring of several peoples' souls who had been close to him.

In Suikoden II, we had the Bright Shield Rune versus the Black Sword Rune (technically two halves of the same True Rune). The Runes attached themselves to two best friends, and then led them away from each other, dictating for them to be at the heads of two opposing forces, also sparking a war. There was also the Beast Rune, which attached itself to an entire town because why not, and drove that nation into madness, which definitely helped with the sparking war thing.

In Suikoden IV, we had the Punishment Rune, which decided that it would make one poor guy's life absolutely miserable because everyone in that game was incompetent. Also, that guy was exiled and left to die on an island with only a cat and two sidekicks. Oh, and there was another war. Because it's not a Suikoden game without being a general in a war.

And so on.

Like I said, True Runes are assholes.

So why am I bringing this up?

Because we've mixed up the equation a bit in this game. We had a war that was supposed to end, but was rekindled into a second war. However, we've yet to see any True Runes.

HMMMMM.

yokaiy fucked around with this message at 07:24 on Feb 24, 2013

RentCavalier
Jul 10, 2008

by T. Finninho
The real problem with three protagonists is that the game takes three times as long to actually get to being good--i.e. open for recruitment and poo poo.

yokaiy
Dec 25, 2012

What a handsome tree!

Zosephine posted:

Well now I'm imagining any of the characters not in the current chapter chilling out in the green room.

No one is drinking tea angrily in this wonderful, ethereal, actually kind of grimy place. Upon each chapter's end and the return to the Trinity Altar, the voice of the mysterious Stage Manager manifests and announces the next character.

Lulu has already gone out for drinks at this point.

In the green room universe, Chris and Lulu are actually really good friends, and Roland is the kind of guy that always brings candy to share with his coworkers.

RelentlessImp posted:

In keeping with the game text, I think you meant "Ha, ha, ha..." :colbert:

This is actually a pretty interesting LP. I stopped playing Suikoden after II, so this is all new to me. The round-robin style of chapters looks like an odd way to do things, though.

ED: What? Why did I put IV? Braiiiiiiiin x.x

Never. :colbert:

Well, glad to be showing you something new, then. The trinity sight system is definitely odd, but it also works really well. Also, go to sleep.

RentCavalier posted:

The real problem with three protagonists is that the game takes three times as long to actually get to being good--i.e. open for recruitment and poo poo.

We actually get to start recruiting in this next chapter.

Calax
Oct 5, 2011

It should be noted that V kinda turns this on it's head.

The main character doesn't get the actual true rune. That's what kicks off the plot still, by being stapled to his mothers head. It's still a dick though, slowing driving her to insanity/megalomania for thinking she has godlike powers. The Sun Rune (the true rune in question) is used just prior to the game starting, by basically drying up a town completely.

However, the primary conflict, while triggered by the True Rune as a McGuffin, is built around a coup and a civil war. With the true runes taking more of a back seat during the conflict. I'm trying not to give out spoilers, but I will say that as part of the setting, there are two "sister" runes to the Sun Rune, in the Dawn and Twilight runes. All of these can only be worn by the royal family. The same initial disturbance that cause the Sun Rune to be used, also had the Dawn Rune lost.

Is Lulu now taking an all expense paid trip to some Bahama island because his role is complete?

Speedball
Apr 15, 2008

Yeah, in V, essentially... the Sun Rune is a WMD, and its restraining bolts are the Dawn and Twilight Runes. So, anyone who effectively wants to control the big one needs the two little ones.

RentCavalier
Jul 10, 2008

by T. Finninho

yokaiy posted:


We actually get to start recruiting in this next chapter.

I know what you mean and I have words on that subject. But we have to get through Geddoe first, and I have even more words regarding that!

Zosephine
Dec 31, 2012

Even my tail feathers concur.

Calax posted:

Is Lulu now taking an all expense paid trip to some Bahama island because his role is complete?

The characters who die as part of the plot get a bonus. The ones who die via user incompetence get a punching bag in their dressing room.

Lulu is the King of Mai-tais on that Bahama island.

booksnake
May 4, 2009

we who are crowned with the crest of wisdom

yokaiy posted:



Well, try harder.



I'm not sure how big avatars can be on SA, but in case there's any interest, here's a 150x150 version. It got a little wonky in resizing though, whoops.

I am so late but I would totally buy this if I knew how to resize it to 125x125.

Testekill
Nov 1, 2012

I demand to be taken seriously

:aronrex:

RentCavalier posted:

The real problem with three protagonists is that the game takes three times as long to actually get to being good--i.e. open for recruitment and poo poo.


Well, we've already met the best character. We only have to wait until chapter two for the other best character. Whose chapter two? You figure it out.

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yokaiy
Dec 25, 2012

What a handsome tree!

booksnake posted:

I am so late but I would totally buy this if I knew how to resize it to 125x125.

Ask and ye shall (sometimes?) receive.



I had to re-do it so the spazzing didn't turn out quite as well, but I hope you enjoy it regardless!

Testekill posted:

Well, we've already met the best character. We only have to wait until chapter two for the other best character. Whose chapter two? You figure it out.

I think there's actually a pretty good number of best characters in this game. Looking forward to seeing who you're thinking of, though.

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