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Tree Goat
May 24, 2009

argania spinosa
I feel like it was SA where this happened (or, more likely, “happened”). British expat wanted to try American PB&J but was so used to buttering sandwiches that they started slathering on a layer on butter, then pb, to the shock of the crowd

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Quorum
Sep 24, 2014

REMIND ME AGAIN HOW THE LITTLE HORSE-SHAPED ONES MOVE?

Teriyaki Hairpiece posted:

True southern cornbread is dense and tasteless and made in a cast iron pan and requires butter and honey.

:hist101: Fun fact! This breaks down very heavily along racial lines, with black southern cooks using sugar and white southern cooks avoiding it. The split seems to date to the early 20th century, when cornmeal production shifted to mechanized mills and the corn used in the process shifted from sweeter white corn to the earthier yellow corn.

BonHair
Apr 28, 2007

Tree Goat posted:

I feel like it was SA where this happened (or, more likely, “happened”). British expat wanted to try American PB&J but was so used to buttering sandwiches that they started slathering on a layer on butter, then pb, to the shock of the crowd

This is a debate I've had in Danish workplaces at breakfast: butter under jam/Nutella or not? It extends to lunch, with liver pate too.

The right answer is either no butter or the superior Nutella+chocolate, optionally with peanut butter on top.

Phlegmish
Jul 2, 2011



Tree Goat posted:

I feel like it was SA where this happened (or, more likely, “happened”). British expat wanted to try American PB&J but was so used to buttering sandwiches that they started slathering on a layer on butter, then pb, to the shock of the crowd

I never put butter on my bread. I feel like this was more common among my parents' generation, although I don't think they do it anymore (so might actually even be a post-war habit).

Ras Het
May 23, 2007

when I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child - but now I am a man.
My grandma considered margarine an abomination when I was a kid

3D Megadoodoo
Nov 25, 2010

Ras Het posted:

My grandma considered margarine an abomination when I was a kid

My grandma and her friends would go to Sweden to buy butter because it was hell of cheap there. IDK why, I bet I could learn the reason from Kirjeitä myllystäni

Rebel Blob
Mar 1, 2008

Extinction for our time



Translation by 111mitch, nobaraotome, & usrnimhome posted:

1. According to a (the) survey, the cross section running from east to west was completed first. This panorama is a drawing of what the Kowloon City District might have looked like at its liveliest. We used remnants from every day life in addition to written documents and oral testimonies to develop it. When you look at the entirety of Kowloon City District, vibrant with various lifestyles, you'll see the form of a city rich with possibilities.

2. There are sitting- and squatting-type toilets

3. Propane gas is used in the kitchen

4. Living room with a chandelier

5. Wooden partition between rooms with a transom

6. Wooden barracks clustered around building made of reinforced concrete

7. Basically no natural light can get into many of the rooms, but they are brightly lit with fluorescent lights

8. There are signs all over the eastern and northern sides of the outer wall

9. Kitchen for steamed bread

10. Production facility for whole-roast pigs. The loft area is for ingredient storage.

11. "Long cheng lu," the main passageway on the east side. A hallway that doesn't get a lot of natural light.

12. Pharmacy of traditional Chinese medicine. The loft is accessed via ladder.

13. Swindler (or maybe pimp???) hanging out in the hallway

14. Noodle making facility

15. This guy doesn't have any work to do, so he is just hanging around.

16. Factory for plastic toy parts

17. Real estate office that sells only property within Kowloon City District

18. A dead-end hallway.

19. The 2nd and 3rd floors are mahjong parlors

20. Cafeteria/restaurant

21. Office of the Hong Kong "Black Society" (a mafia-like group), used in connection with the building next door. Above and below are other enterprises they run, such as a strip club.

22. "Guangming Street," the main passageway

23. Garbage collection area

24. Spinning mill

25. Sheet metal shop

26. Bakery

27. Toilet paper production facility

28. Garbage collection area

29. This wall is shared by the buildings to the right and left. Which was built first?

30. Hallway called "Longjin Alley"

31. Stores often have pleated shutters at the entrance

32. Constantly leaking

33. Delivering whole chickens

34. "Laoren Jie," a main passageway (it means "old man street")

35. Cafeteria/restaurant

36. If you open the window, you'll hit the building next door

37. Dentures arranged in the show window of a dentist's

38. "Longjinyu Lane"

39. On their way back from the senior center. Is this person showing off their caged bird?

40. Surgery in progress. The family is waiting in the next room

41. "I'm running away before I get caught!"

42. Meat processing (separation) facility

43. Precision machining factory

44. Tai Chi Chuan studio

45. Bird shop

46. Even a place like this gets made into a room

47. Pot scrubber factory (Tawashi are little pot scrubbers you use to clean cooking pots.)

48. Leather tanners

49. "Chun qun" ? with celebratory poems written on them are stuck on the left and right of the entrance, and 横技 with horizontal writing is/are stuck on the upper portion [of the entrance]. Wooden tags that protect the entrance gate with the protection of property gods are always worshipped as if one is speaking with/dealing with the floor.

50. A road that breaks through the walls and connects four structures

51. A store that sells miscellaneous goods such as gold and fuel

52. The middle second floor has a higher ceiling [than this]

53. Stairs that seem like they're leaning on the neighboring building

54. Let's water the flowers

55. A lonely old person?

56. A double genkan (entrance) door used as precaution

57. There's no elevator, so moving here is very difficult

58. There are barely any safety railings on the roof. This kind of swing set is completely thrilling.

59. "Race me to the roof!"

60. "Wait up, sis!"

61. "Thanks for your business, I brought the water." (I guess a water porter bringing water for someone's bath)

62. “Good timing!”

63. In this slapdash building, the thickness of the walls and floors and height of the ceiling is different in different places.

64. It's unusual to have a bathtub

65. "Aah, I slept well"

66. "Hurry up and come out of the bathroom!"

67. Hallway connecting to the next building

68. Sunroom overhanging the neighboring roof

69. Trees grow despite the absence of soil

70. "Let me hang out with you guys"

71. "If you don't behave, I'll give you a big shot"

72. "Happy Birthday to you!"

73. Even more partitions in an already-small room

74. Wholesale adult toy store

75. "Hup, hup!" (sound you say when you toss something)

76. The god/gods of their faith are placed on the altar, and beneath the household protection gods are enshrined

77. The surgeon has expanded his business into the next building

78. Covered balconies projecting from the outer walls like birdcages

79. "ThiSqueak is our kingdum!" (The rats live in the vacant room)Are these two men discussing youth?

80. Toilet and kitchen separated only by a partition screen

81. Taking a bath in the kitchen

82. Doctor's office with a surgery

83. "What a pain to go all the way down to throw this away, hup!"

84. Water porter

85. Sausage production facility

86. Unlicensed medical office

87. Hairstylist

88. Elementary school

89. Gambling den

90. "There's no good food here right meow!" (Spoken from the perspective of a cat, literally "There's no good food today")

91. Studying in a corner of the steamed bread kitchen

92. Basking in the sun, he feels like he has gone to paradise

93. Shooting up drugs?

94. Below is a food production facility, and above is a dwelling

95. A courtyard on the roof. Precious space where children can play in safety

96. The roof bristles with television antennae. The wires follow the outer wall and connect to every home.

Koramei
Nov 11, 2011

I have three regrets
The first is to be born in Joseon.

Phlegmish posted:

I never put butter on my bread. I feel like this was more common among my parents' generation, although I don't think they do it anymore (so might actually even be a post-war habit).

I did it for my entire life because I assumed it was just sorta a thing you do, until I stopped a few months ago and I honestly can't even tell the difference 95% of the time. I don't have particularly discerning tastebuds but still.

Badger of Basra
Jul 26, 2007

BonHair posted:

This is a debate I've had in Danish workplaces at breakfast: butter under jam/Nutella or not? It extends to lunch, with liver pate too.

The right answer is either no butter or the superior Nutella+chocolate, optionally with peanut butter on top.

Nutella+chocolate seems unnecessary.

SlothfulCobra
Mar 27, 2011

It makes a difference on toast, but if there's anything there other than butter, it might not be noticeable.

And I think a lot of that may just be butter as a salt-delivery device, plus it's nice to have the wetness of melted butter on dry toast.

Deltasquid
Apr 10, 2013

awww...
you guys made me ink!


THUNDERDOME

Phlegmish posted:

I never put butter on my bread. I feel like this was more common among my parents' generation, although I don't think they do it anymore (so might actually even be a post-war habit).

My grandparents and parents did it and I picked up the habit until I discovered one day that none of my friends had butter at their house.

I think butter works really well with eg cheese. Otherwise it's kind of dry to just have cheese on bread. It's not necessary for some stuff like salami though.

Conversely, my grandfather would slather butter on bread before slathering on the nutella. It's way too greasy but it's my kind of comfort food every now and then.

Carbon dioxide
Oct 9, 2012
Probation
Can't post for 4 hours!
It's actually good to use margarine once in a while because by law they're required to add vitamins A and D to it here and it might otherwise be hard to get enough vitamin D from other foodstuffs (your skin can generate it if you live in a sunny enough place but that's not the case in winter if you're at high enough latitudes.)

3D Megadoodoo
Nov 25, 2010

Carbon dioxide posted:

It's actually good to use margarine once in a while because by law they're required to add vitamins A and D to it here and it might otherwise be hard to get enough vitamin D from other foodstuffs (your skin can generate it if you live in a sunny enough place but that's not the case in winter if you're at high enough latitudes.)

We got D in the milk, as God and I will it.

Count Roland
Oct 6, 2013


Interesting stuff. The walled city was quite the thing. I wonder if there's anything comparable in the world today.

Platystemon
Feb 13, 2012

BREADS

Groke posted:

Family lines die out all the time, though. Here in Norway we have really high-quality census data from 1801/1802 (much treasured by genealogists); turns out the modern population is descended from something like 25% of everyone who lived here back then. The rest of the family lines just kind of petered out in the meantime.

(Or emigrated; but that accounts for maybe 15%, not 75%.)

Far enough in the future, you’re either an ancestor of everyone or an ancestor of no one.

Soviet Commubot
Oct 22, 2008


Quorum posted:

:hist101: Fun fact! This breaks down very heavily along racial lines, with black southern cooks using sugar and white southern cooks avoiding it. The split seems to date to the early 20th century, when cornmeal production shifted to mechanized mills and the corn used in the process shifted from sweeter white corn to the earthier yellow corn.

This actually is a really fun fact, thank you.

Ras Het posted:

My grandma considered margarine an abomination when I was a kid

Your grandmother was a wise woman.


In this map blue regions are majority salted butter, orange unsalted butter and the number what percentage of the majority type of butter.

Teriyaki Hairpiece
Dec 29, 2006

I'm nae the voice o' the darkened thistle, but th' darkened thistle cannae bear the sight o' our Bonnie Prince Bernie nae mair.
I lived a Winter broke and without heat in my apartment some years back and a big thick slice of toast slathered with melty butter is the greatest and most enjoyable affordable luxury. George Orwell's "tea and two slices".

shades of blue
Sep 27, 2012
Fat? Not good! Why would you salt your food? Just eat it straight up you baby.

Ras Het
May 23, 2007

when I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child - but now I am a man.
Intriguing reddit find:

VictualSquid
Feb 29, 2012

Gently enveloping the target with indiscriminate love.

Ras Het posted:

Intriguing reddit find:

Really makes me wonder what they mean by "normal" conservatism, that presumably isn't religious or nationalist.

A Buttery Pastry
Sep 4, 2011

Delicious and Informative!
:3:

VictualSquid posted:

Really makes me wonder what they mean by "normal" conservatism, that presumably isn't religious or nationalist.
Just pure authoritarianism, no attachment to any ideology or religion.

steinrokkan
Apr 2, 2011



Soiled Meat
Secular Kemalist (CHP) vs Hardline Ultra-Nationalist (MHP)?

Count Roland
Oct 6, 2013

A Buttery Pastry posted:

Just pure authoritarianism, no attachment to any ideology or religion.

That's not what conservatism is though, and authoritarianism can overlay most political ideologies.

Tei
Feb 19, 2011

Ras Het posted:

Intriguing reddit find:

Proposed changes on the russian map.

Green: this parts of russia will turn into grasslands before 2023
Blue: land that will be underwater permanently or semipermantly
Red: permanent volcano/lava wasteland, gifted to the colacola company and communist communities
Yellow: surface covered in concrete to attract skateboard turists

Phlegmish
Jul 2, 2011



Teriyaki Hairpiece posted:

I lived a Winter broke and without heat in my apartment some years back and a big thick slice of toast slathered with melty butter is the greatest and most enjoyable affordable luxury. George Orwell's "tea and two slices".

Looking forward to your novel, Down and Out in Paris and London ???

dwarf74
Sep 2, 2012



Buglord

Teriyaki Hairpiece posted:

I lived a Winter broke and without heat in my apartment some years back and a big thick slice of toast slathered with melty butter is the greatest and most enjoyable affordable luxury. George Orwell's "tea and two slices".
Toast with melted butter and cinnamon sugar is my childhood

Phlegmish
Jul 2, 2011



Count Roland posted:

That's not what conservatism is though, and authoritarianism can overlay most political ideologies.

I am also curious as to the difference between normal conservatism and Ottomanism in a Turkish context, or why nationalist 'conservatism' is conservative at all when it represented a radical break with the past not that long ago.

However, while I would question the distribution, I don't think the map (legend) is completely useless, it does illustrate the reasons behind Erdogan's success, as his ideology is a careful balance between and blend of all three types.

steinrokkan
Apr 2, 2011



Soiled Meat
Erdogans's conservatism has always been very much postured against the conservatism of the Republicans / military. And he only pivoted towards MHP style ethno-Turkish nationalism and neo-Ottoman revisionism after his original islamist conservative alliance started to wane in power, and it was a sign of weakness. Prior to getting his lunch eaten by Kurdish nationalists in his usual strongholds, he was the great Satan the MHP hated above anybody else. He can't be said to blend the three strands as they actually exist in Turkey, and definitely not that this blend is what got him to power.

steinrokkan fucked around with this message at 13:38 on Oct 29, 2020

Phlegmish
Jul 2, 2011



steinrokkan posted:

Erdogans's conservatism has always been very much postured against the conservatism of the Republicans / military. And he only pivoted towards MHP style ethno-Turkish nationalism and neo-Ottoman revisionism after his original islamist conservative alliance started to wane in power, and it was a sign of weakness. Prior to getting his lunch eaten by Kurdish nationalists in his usual strongholds, he was the great Satan the MHP hated above anybody else. He can't be said to blend the three strands as they actually exist in Turkey, and definitely not that this blend is what got him to power.

Hmm. Pedantic, but I'll allow it. I am aware of all of these things. I say he does blend elements of all three, just that there are limits to that combination, since their full-blown versions are inherently mutually contradictory. He can't 100% play the nationalist card the way his enemies do, since that would weaken his Islamist and 'Ottomanist' credentials, and so on. And regardless of whether or not it was a sign of weakness, the fact that he pivoted the way he did means that he recognizes the appeal of all three.

steinrokkan
Apr 2, 2011



Soiled Meat
The point is, he initially didn't have Ottomanist or ethno-Nationalist tendencies, quite to the contrary, and that is what actually allowed him to become powerful in the first place.

Count Roland
Oct 6, 2013

So, what is Ottomanism, and how does it differ?

I know Erdogan poses with dudes in ancient armour and seems to see the former territory of the Empire with a certain rapacity.

Are there downsides? The empire was *the* Caliphate for centuries-- is Ottomanism inherently religious? The empire was multi-ethnic-- is this a problem for Turkish nationalists?

Or is it a sort of low risk play to harken to the old days of glory and empire?

Dommolus Magnus
Feb 27, 2013

Soviet Commubot posted:

In this map blue regions are majority salted butter, orange unsalted butter and the number what percentage of the majority type of butter.


Interesting how it is strongest in Bretagne. Yet another crime against humanity we can blame on the Brits.

Also very disappointed at Alsace-Lorraine, they should know better.

Phlegmish
Jul 2, 2011



Brits out of Bretagne, give the land back to the OG Gauls

Guavanaut
Nov 27, 2009

Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998



Toilet Rascal

Count Roland posted:

So, what is Ottomanism, and how does it differ?
afaik
Ottomanism - Everyone gets to play a part regardless of religion, the empirestate is multi-ethnic and multi-religious, but when it tells you what to do you all have to listen.
Islamism - Muslims get to play a bigger part regardless of ethnicity.
Nationalist - Ethnic Turks get to play a bigger part regardless of religion.

steinrokkan
Apr 2, 2011



Soiled Meat
Neo-Ottoman politics usually refer to the doctrine of becoming a regional power with a sphere of influence, not to actually restoring Ottoman institutions, and ideas like recognition of the multi-ethnic nature of the current Turkish state tend to be rejected by the people who subscribe to it.

Islamism also isn't mostly about the role of Muslims, but about the degree of secularism enforced on society.

It's a question what the authors of that map meant by nationalism, but I suppose it refers to exclusionary Turkish ethno-nationalists and their closely linked allies pan-Turkists.

steinrokkan fucked around with this message at 15:27 on Oct 29, 2020

Badger of Basra
Jul 26, 2007

How many non-Muslim Turks are there?

A Buttery Pastry
Sep 4, 2011

Delicious and Informative!
:3:

Count Roland posted:

That's not what conservatism is though, and authoritarianism can overlay most political ideologies.
Conservatism is just defering judgement to some authority in the past. If you’re a Generic Conservative, clearly you just want someone, anyone, to tell you what to do since you can’t even be bothered to pick a specific past.

Take the plunge! Okay!
Feb 24, 2007



Badger of Basra posted:

How many non-Muslim Turks are there?

Probably around 10-15%, mostly atheist. It’s hard to know exactly because the state just assigns your religion at birth according to your parents’ religion.

Milo and POTUS
Sep 3, 2017

I will not shut up about the Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. I talk about them all the time and work them into every conversation I have. I built a shrine in my room for the yellow one who died because sadly no one noticed because she died around 9/11. Wanna see it?

A Buttery Pastry posted:

Conservatism is just defering judgement to some authority in the past. If you’re a Generic Conservative, clearly you just want someone, anyone, to tell you what to do since you can’t even be bothered to pick a specific past.

drat not sure if that's better or worse

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Tei
Feb 19, 2011

[no, now that I think about it, I was wrong]

Tei fucked around with this message at 19:41 on Oct 29, 2020

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