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Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Jewce posted:

I think I made a mistake getting the HP Chromebook 13 instead of just a Toshiba Chromebook 2 w/ i3 or just base dell Chromebook 13 and saving some money.

I know deep down I won't ever use the hp in any way that the Toshiba can't handle. I'm trying to justify keeping the HP though cause it's nice, but it's just so clear that it's overkill for me.

It's just so fun to use though.

The HP is simply so much nicer than the Toshiba, even if the latter has a great display & speakers. Also don't forget that Toshiba has stopped making them, so take that for whatever it's worth. You'll probably appreciate the HP in the long run even if you'd ultimately be satisfied with the Toshiba.

The Dell is another story, particularly if you'd go for one with a touchscreen; it's nice to use in a different way. It's probably one of the best Chromebooks all-around, but the HP is still impressive in terms of materials, features, portability (due to slimness & weight,) and being pretty cool & quiet (fanless.) It's kind of the 2016 Pixel, since Google probably isn't going to release one this year and they assisted HP with the design. I can tell you that the design & build isn't as nice as the Pixel, though.

Honestly, if I was recommending a good first Chromebook I'd probably suggest the Toshiba Chromebook 2 3 :colbert: if they were still making them, but for an experienced Chromebook user* I'd suggest stepping up to either the HP or Dell. You didn't make the wrong decision, they're just different designs. You'll probably appreciate the Type-C ports in the near future and will be satisfied that you didn't go with the Dell.

*I say "experienced Chromebook user" in reference to someone who's used them before and knows the benefits and limitations of the OS, and who would benefit from having a "nicer" machine to work on despite the fact that cheaper Chromebooks work the same. This led me to decide to buy a Pixel for myself.

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Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Poison Mushroom posted:

Posting from my new Vivobook, and first impressions are good!

Keys themselves feel nice, though they feel a little oversoft underneath? I have some slight concern that they might start to go out after a while, especially since I'm normally a pretty heavy typer. Screen is nice and wide, wish it had some more vertical resolution, but that's mostly nitpicking. The tiny hard drive isn't a huge deal since I just got a $30 microSD card at the same time. Currently playing FTL while I type this post and it's working great. My mental checkpoint for whether I should try a game is, essentially, "can I imagine this running on a tablet", and for the most part, that's worked out as a metric.

Maybe in a couple months, I'll regret not getting a used thinkpad but right now, I'm pretty happy with this tiny baby computer.

Edit One more little nitpick is that the trackpad is a little weird about its right clicks, half the time it thinks I'm left clicking if I push too close to the far edge of the button.

Some laptop keyboards are good, but most are not known for being fantastic; regardless of the type of keyswitches they'll probably last you the life of the machine. I've never heard of a keyboard actually wearing out, as it's far more likely that a damaged keyboard came from someone spilling something on it. Beyond that you could probably replace it if that actually did happen. Your best bet would be to get a good mechanical keyboard and hook that up at your desk if you're a serious typist.

If you think your laptop doesn't have enough vertical resolution, well just keep in mind that this exists:

(and I have one!) :psyduck:

Trackpads are another component where some are great, but mainstream ones can be pretty mediocre. I hear Macbooks have good keyboards & trackpads especially, but I don't use Apple stuff so can't confirm. (My Chromebook Pixel has good HIDs though.) Anyway, modern trackpads have software-configurable options for recognizing different areas and assigning different functions; you should be able to adjust this on your system but you can do things like add or remove scrolling areas along the sides, change the left/right bias for detecting clicks, and adding gestures. Have you tried doing a two-finger tap for right-click? Two- or three-finger scrolling/app-switching? Poke around in the Synaptics (or whatever) utility, you can probably get your trackpad working the way you'd like it to. (What I'm getting at is that you can probably ignore the trackpad buttons and just use taps to initiate mouse clicks if those buttons aren't behaving they way they should.)

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Gray Matter posted:

Looking for a laptop for my wife as her primary computer. Ideal budget $500, can stretch if need be.

Things she does:
Photo editing
Netflix
Web browsing
School

Things I would like:
1080p
core-i3 or better
IPS panel

A couple questions:
Does "photo editing" mean "Photoshop only" or just "light photo editing with any appropriate tools?
What falls under the "school" category? Does this mean "specific Windows programs" or just stuff that can be accessed within a browser?

What I'm trying to get at is if a Chromebook will work for you guys. They'll check every box except "run specific Windows programs."

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



There are some ChromeOS photo editors: Pixelr, Polarr, Piconion; you could also easily install Ubuntu and use GIMP. If, however, you absolutely need to run Windows applications locally (and can't run them remotely on a spare PC at home like I do) then that's fine. I would suggest checking a deals site like woot.com, which frequently has all sorts of Windows laptops. For example: http://computers.woot.com/plus/dell-business-class-laptops-17?ref=w_gh_cp_4_wp_3

Grog posted:

Are there any good laptop options under $500 CAD for someone who still insists on getting a manufacturer's warranty? My dad's laptop got some kind of drink spilled onto and into it, it no longer boots, and he doesn't want to spend the quoted $300 to replace the motherboard. I took it apart and tested the hard drive, and that still works so he can at least get his data off of it. He just wants something for basic tasks like Word and other documents, web surfing, and some basic YouTube watching.

While they're generally under his budget, I kind of doubt that he'll be convinced by the idea of buying a used T430 off of ebay.

Ok this sounds exactly like a job for a Chromebook! They can do everything you mentioned, are often cheap, and yes you can just buy a new one with a warranty. User misuse (like spilling something on it) usually isn't covered though since that's not a manufacturer defect. You'd have to get a 3rd party "everything covered" warranty, maybe through Squaretrade? Also there's a new model, the Acer Chromebook for Work 14 that is ruggedized and specifically has a spill-proof keyboard that drains through the bottom: http://www.acer.com/ac/en/US/content/professional-series/acerchromebook14forwork

I actually just got one of those, it's nice and the $350US Celeron model would be fine for your Dad and within your price (although I'd suggest the $600US one which upgrades several components, most importantly the display, but this isn't essential.)

There are other Chromebooks that would be fine, though, you don't have to go straight for that one. If you tell me exactly what you're looking for (size/portability, etc.) I can offer other suggestions.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Grog posted:

Sorry, should have mentioned that my parents also have a slightly older network-attached laser printer and there are only Windows and Mac versions of the controller software (which has to run on each networked machine). They shut down the other networked computer when it's not in use, so the Google Cloud Print workaround probably wouldn't work. I believe he also uses a couple of other Windows-specific programs, but those might have alternatives on Chrome OS. The Chromebook for Work also doesn't seem to be available here. If I could convince him to buy a Chromebook, there's currently a 14" HP Chromebook for $330 at Best Buy. Would that be decent? I have no idea if it would be "good enough," and the 11.6" model has more RAM and storage space, but nope (he gave a more definitive answer of "I think I'm too old to switch over to those new things" for the idea of a Chromebook). From what I've seen, he would probably have issues with anything below the 14" range just in terms of being able to easily read things.

Is there a minimum model of CPU/APU and amount of RAM I should be looking for on any given Windows laptop? I think his previous laptop had either an i3-4100U or i5-4200U and 4 GB of RAM, so that and a cheap 5400 RPM hard drive are what he's used to. I know my ideal would probably be to find something with a decent i5 and an SSD, but that's not within his budget. This is a time when those refurb ThinkPads seem like they might be a good idea, but again, it's not my choice to make.

There's currently a Dell Inspiron 3000 15.6" on sale at Best Buy for $499.99 that seems like it might be okay and is just at the limit of his budget, although he'll never use 1 TB of space and probably won't use the touchscreen much. From what limited benchmarks I found, the i3-5015U in that Dell seems to be around the same kind of performance as the i5-4200U. There's also an HP with an A8-7410, but that seems to perform better in certain things and then significantly worse in others.

As far as printing is concerned, how often do they actually need to do it? If it's only occasionally, then they can manage by using GCP and turning on a PC when necessary. If they frequently need to print, then they can just leave the PC on for longer durations. The same for Windows programs; set up GCP and CRD on a PC and connect to that when necessary. It's not hard! And the "too old to switch over" doesn't make sense unless he doesn't use a Web browser now; if he can manage to figure out Chrome he can use a Chromebook. Does your Dad still have one of these or has he upgraded to a smartphone?
:colbert:
Be realistic, this is not rocket surgery. There are quite a few 14" models to choose from, and the Acer 15 is nice. That HP 14 is not recommended; it only has 2 GB of RAM and a slow Atom CPU; aim for 4 GB and an N3xxx CPU at a minimum, preferably a Celeron 2xxxU or 3xxxU. If he doesn't need to use something portable then you could hook up a Chromebox to any large LCD panel for ease of viewing. It looks like Chrome devices are hard to find out of the US; could you order from amazon.com (not .ca)? They have pretty much every device I'd recommend.

I understand that ChromeOS devices don't work for some people, but this scenario is almost exclusively limited to those with no access to a Windows machine for occasional remote access. It sounds like this is not the problem here and your Dad is being a big babby. If you're offering your help you need to tell him that he needs to be willing to accept your advice or he's on his own. If I can make Chromebooks work with the occasional remote access to a Windows system then trust me, they're going to be more than sufficient for whatever he's doing.

If you insist on a Windows machine, however, aim for i3 / 4 GB RAM / SSD. The latter is significant, don't settle for a system without an SSD as the boot drive. There are way too many Windows laptops for me to recommend specific models, and I'm specializing in Chromebook advice on the forum. (If you don't want to take my advice then you're on your own. ;))

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Sir Lemming posted:

I just left my job, and consequently I no longer have my work laptop, which I was using for plenty of other stuff too. So now I'm jonesing to buy my own laptop (for the first time). I'm willing to spend around $1000 for something nice, if necessary, because I'm possibly going to be using this to show off some graphic/interface design stuff to potential employers.

Because I'm interested in web design stuff, I'm very strongly considering a 2-in-1 convertible device. I also want it to be comfortable for programming, so a screen on the larger end of the spectrum is preferred. And I'm kind of a resolution whore but I guess I could live with 1080p. (OLED is the dream, but from what I've read it looks like I'd have to wait a bit longer than I'm really able to for that.)

I wouldn't say no to a "gaming laptop" but it's very low priority. I already have my desktop and Steam Link for that. I mainly just want something that's not likely to lag too much during a CSS animation of a photo, or an emulated mobile device. I may also be interested in using it for music/audio production (Cakewalk, Logic, stuff like that).

Other than that, I guess disk space is a partial deciding factor. Probably wouldn't do anything less than 500GB.

You're interested in a convertible (flip around from laptop-to-tablet) or 2-in-1 (which often but not always refers to a tablet with detachable keyboard hybrid device)? The only thoughts I have are that these devices tend to be thin & light, with middling input devices. The convertibles have to be comfortable to hold as a tablet, so can't be too big and thus don't generally have large displays or great keyboards. "Detachables" are similar, except they tend to be top-heavy as the tablet contains most of the important electronics. These types of devices have tradeoffs that conflict with your desire to have a comfortable work device. I mean it's not that you can't get a nice device like a Surface, and the Lenovo Yoga line also comes to mind.

Grog posted:

He still has a flip phone, actually. Neither of my parents uses a smartphone, and they're reluctant to move over. They don't like dealing with technological change and don't like any further complications to the way they do things. I explained to him that a Chromebook would be enough for his needs and that he'd be getting an SSD with it instead of a standard hard drive, but he still wants the Windows laptop. Unfortunately, he's pretty set in his ways and I don't expect I'll convince him in this case. I can do it when it comes to buying/upgrading the hardware in their tower, but he doesn't care as much about the laptop and just wants to be able to go pick something up locally within his initial budget and have it be done.
Again, this is unfortunately about the way he uses these things. He sits on the couch with the laptop on the table or in his chair with it on his lap and he likes being able to type on physical keys.

Believe me, I'd rather he get a better deal for his money, but I don't think it's going to happen this time. Sorry to have wasted your time, people. Thanks for the advice, in any case.

Interesting. With that in mind, I'm sure there are still plenty of Windows options for you (but part of the reason I'm specializing in Chrome stuff is that the Windows devices have bored me.) The main issue is going to be finding a device locally as it seems a lot of the hardware we have available in the US isn't available over the border (or overseas for that matter.) I think your best options will be to find your preferred sellers (whether that's Amazon or a local store) and just filter the devices to find one; I can't really recommend something that isn't available to you for purchase.

Ralphus posted:

Is Lightroom considered "light photo editing"?
I've got a 2015 Toshiba Chromebook 2 with the i3 CPU. I mainly use it for Netflix, surfing the internet, and playing music over bluetooth via Play Music. However, I also occasionally want to do some photography stuff, mainly Lightroom-esque things. My issue is that whenever I try to use Polarr to edit/ develop a .NEF (RAW) file the entire laptop shits all over itself and runs super slowly. Is this because of Polarr or is it a hardware issue? I'm going to try some other photo apps but I figued I'd ask here too. I'd really hate to buy a Windows laptop as I love using ChromeOS so I'm hoping maybe I'm missing something simple/ obvious. I actually am going to sell the Toshiba and will probably replace it with a Dell Chromebook 13 and throw a 256gb SSD in it as I'd like something a little more rugged, but other than the photo issue ChromeOS does everything I need it to.

I think Lightroom qualifies as "light" photo editing, especially because you can apparently do it via a Web interface and don't need to install anything (Photoshop and GIMP would be the heavier-duty programs that come to mind.)

I'm guessing your issue is not software or hardware, but network-related because you mentioned RAW. How big are the files you're trying to edit?

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Ralphus posted:

They range from 8mb or so up to 24mb. I wonder if putting a bigger SSD in the laptop would help, I could copy the files directly onto that then try to edit them. I try to keep the files small since the laptop has such a small amount of storage space and I usually end up editing them right off the SD card. Once I can run android apps on it I bet Lightroom will work decently too. It's *doable* right now, but just really slow and kinda clunky.

But as far as I'm aware, the Web-based photo editors actually require you to upload the photo and work on it remotely, rather than doing the work locally. That's why you'd experience delays when trying to work on a 24 MB file; you have to wait for it to upload, then the server performs your edits, then it downloads the results, etc.

I'm not an expert on all of those Web-based photo editors though; I think I used Photoshop Express once, and it was fine, but the last significant photo editing was on my Windows desktop with GIMP. I'll bet you'd get good results if you use Crouton to install Ubuntu and then run GIMP. I don't think you have to upgrade the SSD at all (unless you were going to do it anyway.)

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Hadlock posted:

HP announced a new 11.5" chromebook for $189, it's wholly unremarkable except for the fact that it has two USB-C ports and gets 12.5 hours of battery life.

For whatever reason, it doesn't appear to charge from those USB ports, the spec sheet explicitly says it charges via the 4.5mm barrel port.

That USB-C charging Chromebook 13/14 looks pretty interesting though.

Wait, which Chromebook is this? The HP 11 G5 with touchscreen option is the newest one I've heard about, and I can't find any previews that say it has Type C ports. :confused:

The failure to use the Type C ports for charging is huge, though. :(

Truga posted:

USB-C charging sucks though. I guess not as bad as normal usb charging would be because it works both ways, but I still don't like it. There's a lot of resistance happening plugging/unplugging it and it feels like if I accidentally tug the thing the wrong way a bit too much I'll annihilate it.

And no, I'm not bitter because my chomebook doesn't support video over usb-c, and instead only has those ports to charge through, why'd you ask? :v:

Are you saying you're having an issue with the actual cable/connection? Because actual charging over Type C works great, it's a fantastic technological improvement. I had a Pixel LS that made what I'd describe as a perfect connection between the Type C cable & port, but it was exchanged because it had a fan issue. The replacement Pixel has a stiffer connection, but it still works fine, so yeah, there seems to be some inconsistency in Type C connectors. What Chromebook do you have, though, that has Type C but doesn't support at least DP over Type C? (I don't know if any of the Type C-equipped devices utilize TB, I don't have anything to test that with.)

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Truga posted:

Afaik the current chomebook pixel does not do DP over usb-c? Every google hit is telling me that, but if they are lying to me I'll be a very happy camper.

And yeah, it's a very stiff connection, but at the same time the connector itself feels flimsy to the point I'm never sure I won't rip it off every time I pull it out at the end of workday :v:

Oh, well I'd rather have the cable disconnect (like a breakaway connector) than pull my $1k+ device to the floor.

And I'll see if I can come up with something for you about the Pixel & DP-out.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Sir Lemming posted:

Ah, didn't even realize there was a difference. Yes, convertible is what I meant. Ultimately the way it feels as a laptop will be more important to me than the way it feels as a tablet, as I plan to use the former more often. I like the idea of the different form factors combined in one device; not necessarily concerned about being able to hold it for long periods of time.

I'm fairly sure I've seen a Lenovo device that looks like what I want; maybe it was a Yoga. Speaking of which, has their whole spyware controversy subsided or is that still a thing? I realize Windows 10 is pretty much just as "spyware" as anything Lenovo did so it's probably a moot point.

Yeah, the problem is that there isn't quite standardized terminology; "flip", "convertible", "hybrid", "2-in-1", etc., so I had to ask for clarification to see exactly what you wanted. You could get something like the Yoga 15, with a 1080P 15.6" touch display, i7, and a 940MX, which isn't exactly gaming-conducive but is better than your typical integrated graphics.

Truga posted:

https://griffintechnology.com/us/breaksafe-magnetic-usb-c-power-cable

I'm super tempted to buy this for this exact reason.

I looked into that. I think I turned it down because the Amazon reviews mentioned things like how it's rather large and is liable to snap off itself and damage the port, etc.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Hadlock posted:

The HP 11 G5 absolutely has Type-C ports, they're listed on the HP spec sheet on their website, I'm not going to dig for it now. Maybe they're USB 3.1 but they're the new small oval type connector.


We have Pixels plugged in to U3415W displays at work, pretty sure that is DP or mDP, I will check on friday

http://www.laptopmag.com/articles/hp-chromebook-11-g5-features-price

Yeah, I'm not seeing the Type C ports on the G5. There's definitely not one on the right side, and that thing in the back by the hinge on the left side is probably a lock slot. I've looked at as many photos as I can find and I haven't read any writeup that mentions Type C. I'd think they'd put that front and center, but everything they've written about the G5 has focused on it being cheap, with an optional touchscreen and ARC support.

As Truga discovered, you can definitely get DP out from the Pixel 2's Type C port via Alt Modes; see these accessories available for sale (that I've had since I bought my LS):
https://store.google.com/product/usb_type_c_to_displayport_cable
https://store.google.com/product/usb_type_c_to_hdmi_adapter

Here's my Pixel LS connected to an ASUS MB169C+ (amazon.com/gp/product/B01C83BE06), so, native DP-over-Type C:


The Pixel OG of course has a miniDP but only a couple of 2.0 USB ports.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



KingColliwog posted:

TL:DR ==} buying a terrible computer for my mom on very short notice. Are ACER and HP as bad as I remember? Is Dell better? Mostly asking about fiability here

blehhh so my mom is buying new laptop (or may be a desktop) tomorow and she decided to ask me for advice tonight. I have until tomorow morning to give her advice and that's not long enough for me to do any real research on this because I have to take care of the baby so I'm turning to you guys for help. Thank you in advance for taking a few minutes

She has to buy it at best buy canada (warranty money) so the choices are quite limited. She has about 1200$ to spend and she wants a big touch screen (15'' if possible) an i5, 8GB of ram and a DVD player. She's going to use this to do mom stuff like invite me in terrible games on facebook, watch some DVDs to help her learn english, pay her bills and that's probably it. DURABILITY is probably #1 the main thing I'm looking for help with because she keeps buying terrible terrible laptops that break.

She's looking at these right now. Which one would be the least horrible choice (keep in mind : favor durability)

Acer Aspire R 14 (R5-471T-534X)
Intel® Core™ i5-6200U processor Dual-core 2.30 GHz
14" Full HD (1920 x 1080) 16:9
Intel® HD Graphics 520 with Shared Memory
8 GB, LPDDR3
256 GB SSD

HP envy x360 (15-W158CA)
i5-6200U processor
15.6" diagonal FHD IPS LED-backlit touch screen (1920 x 1080)
8 GB DDR3L SDRAM (1 x 8 GB)
500 GB 5400 rpm SATA SSHD

DELL inspiron 7000
i7-6500U
15.6'' screen (1920 x 1080)
8GB ddr3 ram
1 TB HDD

oh god now she's adding an "all in one" HP computer that has the whole thing in the screen. Is this as bad as I imagine in terms of durability?

HP pavillon 23-Q119

Ok, um, I'll see if I can help. First, what is "fiability?" Was that a really weird typo of "durability" as you wrote later on? If so, and you genuinely need something durable, the go-to option has been Panasonic Toughbooks. They are huge clunky bricks though, and are probably not what you're looking for, but are nevertheless perhaps the most durable laptops. Thinkpads are also known for durability, but this also extends to many "business-class" or "education" laptops, since they're often handled roughly as they're owned by someone else. Honestly though, why does she keep destroying laptops? In almost 25 years I've never destroyed a laptop.

Next, brands kind of don't matter because laptops can be made by one party (an OEM) and branded something else. You can certainly get good Acers, HPs, Dells, etc. In this case, I don't think the brand of laptop matters since the "durability issue" is probably related to the user.

Of those laptops, the first two are of the convertible design, which is fine, but I'm not sure if they're going to be more or less durable for her than a regular-hinged laptop (like the 3rd one you listed.) I guess a 360 hinge is less likely to break because it's made to go all the way around maybe?

There's nothing wrong with that all-in-one, but if that kind of thing is in the cards I think you have two choices: go with a cheap laptop so that when she destroys it she won't be out much, or go with a desktop. If she doesn't need a laptop, get any desktop and pair it with a large touch display. It'll do what she wants and there will be less for her to drop or whatever.

As far as specs are concerned you don't need an i5 or 8 GB of RAM to watch video, play browser games, and browse the Web (to pay bills or whatever.) All 4 of your choices are overkill. I understand you're under time pressure, but I think you're going at this the wrong way. Can you get her to postpone her purchase so you have more time?

My serious recommendation is to watch her DVDs on a set-top player and big-screen TV, and get a Chromebook (yes, I'm recommending Chromebooks to everyone.) The latter will do everything you mentioned, be secure, and be effectively maintenance-free. They also tend to be cheap, so she can drop it or do whatever the hell she does to destroy laptops.

kaschei posted:

My 5 year old laptop got kicked in the face today. Money's tight but I don't want to buy something worse than what it's replacing.

Old laptop: HP 4530s, seemed like a steal on black friday 2012. Now I hate HP forever. 2nd generation i5 means what today? Are 5th generation i3s better?

Most taxing use is CivV, most common is browsing the internet. I think the AMD card in the probook used to be necessary for Civ V? but it looks like Intel integrated is sufficient for that.

I'm seeing refurbished Thinkpads with i3s for $314, or i5s for $411. (Which Thinkpad series do I need to avoid? IIRC T and X are the "good" ones but are L/E/whatever decent?)

Or an inspiron i5-5200U for $329?

Are any of these obvious (to you guys) mistakes, is there somewhere else I should be looking?

Most non-Atom-based Intel CPUs are great nowadays. It's one thing if you're doing high-end gaming, but for everything else you'll probably be fine with an i3. I'm not an expert on Civ or all the different Thinkpad models, but my recommendation for you, since you don't have strict system requirements and don't want to waste money, would be to take a peek at the various offerings at Woot, an Amazon-owned outlet (http://computers.woot.com/?ref=cp_gh_cp_4). Check out the various models available for sale and then just Google the specs and Civ benchmarks. This way you're not stuck looking for a specific model and get a better price on a refurbished system.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



KingColliwog posted:

thx. Fiability/durability as in good component that have less chance of frying. I doubt she'll drop the laptop since it probably won't move all that much!

I know she doesn't need something that powerful, but that's what she wants. She does not understand that her computers get slow because she put terrible stuff on them, not because they don't have good hardware. There's 0% chance of me convincing her otherwise. I've been trying for years to get her to buy cheap laptops but it won't happen.

I'll probably try to push her toward a desktop since I think she'll be happier with that and they tend to survive longer, but if she decides to pick a laptop out of those three, is there any reason to pick one over the other or should they all have more or less the same lifespan if used correctly

"Fixability?" "Viability?" I really don't think she's been the victim of multiple instance of laptop hardware failure. It's either user-caused (physical damage) or perhaps electrical damage from power surges?

By all means, if she's fine with a desktop then go with that; you can get her a "cute" SFF system. Then if you ever need to fix anything it's still going to be easier than trying to repair any laptop.

Of those three laptops, they're not that dissimilar in terms of specs, but I'd say take the Acer because it has an SSD over the HP's hybrid and the Dell's HDD. The Dell doesn't appear to have a touchscreen, and the other two mostly differ in display size.

I still think you should just get her a Chromebook and wait it out until she gets used to it and realizes it will pretty much always work perfectly. The Dell Chromebook 13 is excellent, has a touchscreen option, and is well within your budget even at the upper end (and you don't even need more than the base Celeron, but the i3 will be a fine upgrade.)

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



kaschei posted:

Is woot's "Factory recertified" the same as micro center's? Is recertified really better than refurb? I thought it was a weasel word.

Edit: and there's absolutely no reason to look at amd right? Even Apus seem to underperform integrated graphics

Recert/refurb aren't "regulated" terms so you'd have to dig deeper to see what they mean, but for all intents and purposes you could take them to mean the same thing. You're not going to find the same product available as both refurbished and recertified, except if two different places list the thing differently. It's possible for the refurbishment process to be done by the OE or by a third party, which further complicates things. It's also possible that a device wasn't actually damaged, just opened and returned, and could be "recertified" as in inspected and repackaged and is effectively "new open box."

I have purchased tons of refurbs, specifically from Woot and specifically PC hardware, and I can't think of a single issue. If it's a newer [consumer] device they're usually in very good condition; older devices, particularly business laptops can be a little more dinged up but you're not going to get something actually damaged, like with a broken display or whatever. Plus there's still a brief warranty period so anything actually wrong should be pretty obvious right away and would be covered. I even bought a random "grab-bag" 5+ year old laptop from Woot last year and it works great; a little blemished but I upgraded to Win10 and it's solid.

AMD's CPU/APU stuff isn't really competitive with high-end Intel chips (in terms of CPU performance.) It's not bad, just not as performant or power-efficient. The A10 (and possibly A8) APUs are probably worth considering though; they have decent graphics performance for being integrated (they still generally lead Intel in integrated graphics in terms of the chips that are readily available, but Intel is catching up; see the Iris Pro 580.) The lower-class APUs are probably not worth your time if you're looking for graphics performance. Pick a specific laptop though and look up benchmarks for that hardware; you may be looking at a device that is perfectly fine for your uses. You shouldn't completely discount AMD hardware though.

For example, I have a (refurbished, from Woot) HP Envy with an AMD A10-4600M APU, which has Radeon 7660G integrated graphics; not only did I receive it in "like new" condition, it's OK for lower-end games, although it can't play Civ V (http://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-Radeon-HD-7660G.69830.0.html). You could use this (http://www.notebookcheck.net/Computer-Games-on-Laptop-Graphics-Cards.13849.0.html) as a tool (restrict to Civ V or whatever other games you play) to see if a specific refurb can run the game, or to see generally where you should be aiming.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



DrManiac posted:

So I finally have enough to replace my old laptop (a asus g51 from best buy that lasted me like 8 years)


My budget is ~$600 which looks like could net me a used version of something similar. All I really care about is if the laptop is sturdy and decent at playing video games.

You're going to have to be specific when talking about games. You can get something to play Minecraft, LoL, and WoW for that price, but if you expect to play any demanding games you need to look harder.

The Lenovo Ideapad Yxxx series is decently sturdy and intended for gaming. Their current models are Y700 (http://shop.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/ideapad/y700-series/) but I have a Y500 from a few years ago that's quite decent with an i7 and dual 650M GPUs.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Hadlock posted:

From the OP

Yes, I am familiar that Ideapads are not Thinkpads; I have both.

The Iron Rose posted:

lol @ calling ideapads sturdy. I've had to have mine repaired literally a dozen times because various components keep failing on me, or the hinges break. I treat computers quite delicately, and I literally repair computers for my job.

Don't buy ideapads.

I am sorry you're having such bad luck with yours, but mine is in one piece. Not sure what to tell you, man. :shrug:

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



The Iron Rose posted:

actually, that is a fair point. I used that ideapad to take notes with all the time, bring it to work because we play overwatch at lunch, and have put it into checked baggage a number of times. even if you're careful that'll take a toll.

If you're just moving it around the house and don't anticipate taking it outside of the house much it'll probably do you fine. still plasticky and poo poo and not durable in the slightest, but if you don't expose it to much that can damage the laptop it probably won't be a problem.

To answer blowfish's question, it's just for around the house. I barely have time to game as it is, and I certainly have no time to do so while at work. If I need to kill some time while I'm out I can live with just playing Android games on my phone, and I have much more portable laptops if I absolutely must have one with me. (I carry a thin & light Toshiba Chromebook 2 in my backpack and it barely feels like it's there.)

The Ideapad's definitely not Thinkpad-sturdy, but it works for it's intended purpose of a quite-reasonably-priced gaming laptop. That's why I'd still recommend it for that unless there's some other go-to mid-range gaming laptop. I'm sure the Ideapad Yxxx line is fine for taking to LAN parties or whatever, but I wouldn't suggest dragging it along to school or work as your main general-purpose system; even though the Y500 I have is only 15.6", it's still quite bulky & heavy.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Butt Savage posted:

How's this portable monitor working for you btw? Sometimes I like to work in the living room and having a second monitor for reading PDFs and such would be super useful.

This one in particular is nice, and it happens to be AFAIK the first portable Type-C panel. It's not the only one I have, though; I've a couple of the DisplayLink panels, USB2 & USB3. Those work pretty much as you'd expect, although they're actually using the DisplayLink driver and the USB connection for data (and power, so you often have to plug into two ports,) whereas the Type-C one is actually connecting to DisplayPort through the USB3 Type C Alt Mode. This particular one is only really usable on the Pixel, HP 13, Acer 14 for Work, and Lenovo 13 Chromebooks (plus any applicable Windows laptops) but ChromeOS is gaining native DisplayLink support in a future update so all of those older panels will then just work out of the box.

So depending on what system you're running you could totally make use of the above display, otherwise woot.com often sells the aforementioned DisplayLink monitors cheap. Ideally look for a 1080p USB3 panel, but even a 16" 720p USB2 display will only cost like $60.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Motley posted:

With the next generation of cards coming out "soon", is it still okay to buy a gaming laptop. My laptop right now is over eight years old and I am about ready to throw it out the window. I'm looking for mid range gaming laptop, and was thinking about the 970m, specifically https://this to use a desktop replacement while I am in college. Would the new cards coming out sooner or later make enough of a difference to warrant waiting, and will the be around this price point? I really can't go much more expensive than the laptop I linked and it looks like a pretty good deal to me, has all the specs I need. Convince me I'm wrong please.

While I don't know which Asus you were trying to link, I can try to help you out. If you're dealing with a failing 8-year-old laptop, then you're really overdue for replacing it. However, it will probably be a good idea to wait for the GTX 10xxm-equipped laptops; the Pascal desktop GPUs are a significant increase in power and efficiency over Maxwell.

Can you get a cheap ($200-300) laptop/Chromebook now for schoolwork and then save up while you wait for actual gaming laptops with 10-series GPUs in a few months? Again, your link didn't work so I can't see the specs/price you were referring to.

If you absolutely need something now, this could work for you:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834233160
Good battery life with a 970m.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



The Iron Rose posted:

Here's the thing though. I can build a machine the size of the razer core for the cost of the razer core that's almost certainly more powerful than any laptop you connect it to, especially once you factor in the price of the GPU. It's just not a smart buy.

That's true, and your strategy makes more sense if someone just needed a gaming desktop. We discussed this more in the Intel thread (and the posts below yours) though, and the point of external graphics is mainly to boost the capabilities of portable systems. Overall it's not the cheapest solution, but it has some specific use cases.

Motley posted:

Sorry, I managed to screw up the link...

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B015QZVAF2/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=A2TC87EJKQMY9O

This is what I am looking at. Not as long of a battery life as the machine you linked me, but it is quite a bit cheaper. Thoughts?

That looks fine as a gaming laptop. The thing is, you're not going to want to carry that around and use it for schoolwork. It's just massive and heavy. Look at the dimensions:

Item Weight 8.4 pounds
Product Dimensions 12.5 x 16.4 x 1.7 inches

:eyepop:

Even if the size & weight don't bother you, and it's the only thing you carry around, it's still ridiculously bulky, much more so than is appropriate for something you'd expect to carry to every class. By all means get it as your gaming system, but leave it back in your dorm room or whatever; buy a Chromebook (cheap, light, long battery life) to bring to class. You have several options:

Asus Flip: amazon.com/dp/B00ZS4HK0Q
Asus C201: amazon.com/dp/B00VUV0MG0/
Acer R11: http://www.ebay.com/itm/142046557228

The Flip is a fantastic, tiny device with a touchscreen, convertible display, several-hour battery life and it only weighs 2 pounds; it's a great device at ~$240 for like-new Amazon Warehouse Deals. The C201 is pretty much the non-convertible version of the Flip, and this one's even cheaper. The Acer R11 is a little bigger, and a little faster version of the Asus Flip, and it's less than 3 pounds; prices are in the $200-250 range generally for refurbs on the Acer eBay store.

A bigger device will be slightly less portable but easier to view & type on. Whatever device you buy, definitely go with one with 4 GB of RAM and not 2 GB.

Wilford Cutlery posted:

My brother in Canada needs a new laptop and asked me what I thought of this one:
https://www.amazon.ca/ASUS-F556UA-AS54-15-6-inch-Full-HD-Windows/dp/B01CGGOUJM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1467745423&sr=8-1&keywords=laptop+ssd

It seems okay, although the wait time to ship could be an issue. It will spend most of its life sitting on a desk. No gaming, just internet, music and Skype.

Any thoughts on it?

That's total overkill for Web browsing, music streaming, and video chatting. It's nice, but overkill. Presumably he's going to tote it around occasionally based on your description, so I won't recommend any kind of desktop, but take a look at the Chromebooks I listed above. There are more I can recommend if you're interested, but all three of those would suffice. The one snag is that there's no native video/audio chat supported yet for ChromeOS, but there are a couple workarounds.

First, those three Chromebooks are on a list of devices that, over the next year or so will be able to run Android apps, including Skype:
https://sites.google.com/a/chromium.org/dev/chromium-os/chrome-os-systems-supporting-android-apps?rd=1

In the interim, there's a way to just install a full Linux distro and use the Linux Skype application on your Chromebook:
http://www.howtogeek.com/199857/how-to-use-skype-on-your-chromebook/

So while Chromebooks are not for everyone, they would certainly suffice for your brother based on what you said he needs to do, and you'd end up spending half of what you were thinking.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



MustelaFuro posted:

I'm in need of a new laptop and could use advice on choosing one. I don't have any sort of brand loyalty, I intend to use it for things like photomanipulation and video making. It's unlikely I will need it to do anything more demanding than those. The thing I care most about is reliability and lifespan. I don't really know where to start or if any companies are known for their reliability, etc. I don't have any specific price point in mind, but something cost efficient would be great. Thank you.

In the past Thinkpads have been known for reliability, and more generally business- or education-class devices are intentionally more durable. Beyond that you can get ruggedized, mil-spec devices - think Panasonic Toughbooks, or the Acer Chromebook for Work.

With that in mind you'd probably most appreciate a Thinkpad with decent hardware (i5 or i7, 8 GB RAM or more) and most importantly a decently-sized boot SSD (preferably in the ~500 GB range); all of that will satisfy your needs and perform well. I don't think there's a specific Thinkpad model to recommend, just take a look at new or refurbished ones and see what you can get for your budget.

BrainDance posted:

Well, I hadn't thought about a lot of that, this just shows how far behind I am in all this. I don't think I'll need an extra drive bay, but USB C, I don't even know what that would be used for. Was that what that one guy was using to have like a tablet-like screen attached to his computer? It sounds like something I might want to have. I don't even know what other features I'd specifically need that aren't just standard on everything because I don't even know what exists.

USB 3.1 Type-C, in addition to having higher bandwidth, can be used for bidirectional charging (100 watts either way) and Alt Modes, which means things like DisplayPort and Thunderbolt through the Type-C physical connection. On top of that it's a tiny, reversible connector that's just pleasant to use compared to years of pain-in-the-rear end USB Type A & B connectors. The best use-case for a Type-C connection is for attaching the PC/laptop to a monitor with a built-in hub, so the PC sends video out and the monitor sends power (and input from your HIDs) back to the PC. Imagine bringing your laptop back home and having only a single connection to dock it. This display would do just that, assuming the 30 W it outputs is enough to charge the laptop: amazon.com/gp/product/B01B64O3M4/

Beyond that, those other monitors I was talking about are different from your typical desktop monitor because these are built for portability, and don't need external power beyond what one or two USB ports can provide.

Motley posted:

Is there any predictions as to when the 10xx series equipped laptops are coming out. I'd really like a laptop before my fall semester starts but I can wait if I have to. Also, I assume they'll seriously break the bank, yeah?

It'll be close; I'm going to be on the safe side and say you're probably going to start school before you find a deal on an appropriate gaming laptop.

foutre posted:

Is the consensus that the Razer Stealth + Core is better than a 13 inch Alienware + Graphics Amplifier?

I got an Alienware R2, and was planning on getting a graphics amplifier + graphics card once the 1060 etc. come out. I chose the Alienware over the Razer because in part because it had better specs for the price (the 16gb of RAM was an especially important difference, I'm going to be doing a good bit of data analysis etc. on it)/seemed more upgradeable, as far as I could tell, and second because the Alienware graphics card dock is $170 to the Razer Core's $499, which is basically the price of the video card I would buy to accompany it.

Does this logic seem reasonable/does anyone have experience with something similar? I know Alienware has a bad reputation, but as someone that's going to be moving a lot/have limited living space for the next few years, needs a laptop for class/travel and wants to game this seems like an appealing solution.

The Alienware stuff is fine, but the downside of the AMP is that it's proprietary; Razer's solution is "better" because it'll work on anything that supports TB over Type-C, although at the moment that's limited to a couple Razer laptops and the Skull Canyon NUC. There's nothing wrong with getting the AMP now since you already have the Alienware laptop.

Red_Fred posted:

Is Windows 10 Pro recommended for laptops becuase it has bitlocker and laptops generally have more chance to be stolen? Are there cheaper solutions that would work with Home? Does encryption of the drive makes use slower?

To be honest I don't know if you're going to take much of a performance hit with full-disk encryption, but it's not a bad route if you have sensitive data or just want to be vigilant. You can get a Win10 Pro OEM key for $30, so don't let the price hold you back: https://www.kinguin.net/category/19429/windows-10-professional-oem-key/

Bloody Hedgehog posted:

Any thoughts on the ASUS Vivobook E403SA? My mom needs a new laptop, and she doesn't need it for much. Email, photos, the web, typical mom stuff. I would go with a Chromebook, but she has a few Windows programs she likes, and introducing her to a new OS when she's only just comfortable with Windows after years and years would be a tough sell.

EDIT: Also she's in Canada, so no access to a lot of the refurb deals.

It looks like a good deal. It seems to be following Asus' recent philosophy of reasonably-priced laptops with decent hardware and nice materials. Go for it.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



mobby_6kl posted:

Speaking of that, it seems that the Amp doesn't do any port replication, it just has that one input and GPU outputs, and that's it. Which is a huge bummer, IMO, having gotten used to using my Thinkpads with the UltraDock.

The connector is an external PCIe link side-by-side with a USB connection; the Amp has 4 USB3 ports. So you can use it exactly how you'd expect to, as a docking station. :hfive:

NewFatMike posted:

Apparently having a bunch of stuff plugged into the Core can negatively impact its capabilities also. Again, this is based off one article so that's why I'm being a little cautious about it.

That does kind of suck if you wanted to keep an external SSD with all your games on it attached to the Core or a hard wired connection for your twitchy shooters. The only thing I would really use in there is a controller dongle to minimize any of that unless you're maybe using a midrange GPU and not trying to max everything out.

But still, a 10-15% performance hit is much better than I had feared. Hopefully we'll have more benchmarks soon, although the ones I read were published a few weeks ago. I'm really hoping Anandtech publish one.

You'd be fine with having your mouse/keyboard connected to the Core. Adding Gigabit Ethernet and external storage would definitely require more bandwidth but I think it'd work out OK.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



The max is 100 watts per the USB PD spec, but other than that, yeah, it's pretty sweet.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



foutre posted:

Thanks for all the info on the Alienware Amp.

On a related note, I was looking through the VR requirements (thinking about potential cards to put in in the future) and it looks like the processor in the Alienware 13" might end up being a bottleneck in the future, certainly for VR but maybe in general. It's a Dual Core i7-6500U. Would having a processor like that as opposed to a quad core end up limiting its ability to play games that the external GPU would theoretically allow for?

I've got a very rudimentary knowledge of tech and am not really sure what the difference is between U/HQ/etc.

On this whole subject, the thought that comes to mind is that this is exactly where the external graphics has a use. If you got the Amp now, used it with your current laptop for a while, then you could keep the Amp and video card to use with the next laptop once you grow out of it. Of course, this is partially negated by the fact that the Amp is a proprietary solution, so at best you'd have to buy another Alienware laptop, but the scenario would hold true with something like Razer's generic Core.

Verus posted:

I'm considering the ASUS zenbook flip UX360CA-DBM2T as a birthday gift for my girlfriend. She would only use it for microsoft office, youtube, facebook, etc, but I'm concerned about the strength of the Core M processor. Is it strong enough for all that and for a decent amount of multitasking?

It's quite a nice convertible laptop, and the Core M is fine for all that. I think that if she's only using it for light applications like those you mentioned, then it's a little overkill for the price. There's nothing wrong with buying it as a gift, but if you had other things in mind she'd be fine with a $400-600 laptop and then you could spend the difference on something else. But yeah, it's just fine for the uses you mentioned.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



If you can return that laptop for a full refund and then get a non-proprietary alternative then by all means do it. If you were already stuck that wouldn't be the end of the world, but at this point you at least now have the choice. One potential issue is that the Razer Core itself is $500, or $400 with the purchase of a Razer laptop to go with it. Currently it's expensive to enter into the world of external graphics.

foutre posted:

Good to know, thanks. I didn't realize what that meant, just had a vague idea that one was better and definitely wasn't weighing that like I should have been.

To expand on the mobile Intel CPUs a bit:
U = ULV (low power, always dual-core, plus HT on everything except Celerons)
H = Hyperthreading
Q = Quad-core

More info here:
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/02/pentium-core-i5-core-i7-making-sense-of-intels-convoluted-cpu-lineup/

For an example, a 6770HQ has 4 cores, 8 threads, and Iris Pro 580 graphics.

Atomizer fucked around with this message at 07:05 on Jul 9, 2016

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



dissss posted:

The 'H' part doesn't mean hyperthreading it means BGA packaged (which all the current mobile CPUs are)

Here's a quad core non-HT processor: http://ark.intel.com/products/88959

Hmm, you're right that that's a non-HT CPU. So H doesn't mean HT, which ultimately means for his purposes he can just ignore the H in any CPU models he shops for. Edited the previous post for clarity.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



kanonvandekempen posted:

So my old laptop is getting close to the end of its lifespan after 7 or so years of faithful service and its time to get something new. I would like to get something that can play typical pc games well enough. I'm talking things like paradox games, total war games not on high settings, cities skylines, those sort of games. I'm not planning on running The Witcher on my small screen, but I want it more to complement my ps4.

What are my options, and what should I pay special attention to?

What CellBlock said: look for something with a 970m if you need it now, or wait for the 1060m or better. A quad-core i7 would also be a good idea, with 8 or 16 GB RAM and an SSD boot drive is a must.

goodness posted:

After having a desktop for the last 5 years I am looking to buy a laptop for school related usage. So mostly office suite and internet browsing.

Budget would be 5-800 or so. As long as it can run word, excel, firefox and not be slow it will be a good option. I don't want to overshoot when a cheaper $600 option would be perfectly satisfactory.

Regarding Windows version, I haven't used a Windows 7 or 10 laptop ever. Is 10 actually good with all the fancy laptop stuff or should I stick with 7.

Win10 is like the best parts of 7 & 8 combined into an OS that runs better than either of those on older hardware. Don't stick with an old OS out of stubbornness.

There was a decent $300 Toshiba convertible on meh.com a couple days ago but it's sold out, so I would suggest looking at the plethora of laptops available on woot: http://computers.woot.com/?ref=w_gh_cp_4_wp_8

If all you need is office and a Web browser then $600 is overkill. You can do all of that on a $300 laptop, and indeed a $300 Chromebook if you're ok with Office Home (https://www.office.com) or Google Docs, and Chrome over Firefox (although you can use Crouton to install Ubuntu and then run Firefox.) Asus Flip, Acer R11, Toshiba CB 23, and the Acer CB 14 are all fantastic choices and are in the $200-300 range; the Acer CB for Work 14 and Dell CB 13 are also a little more expensive and even better. If you want more info on Chromebooks let me know, otherwise my recommendation for a Windows laptop is to just get a cheap refurb from Woot listings.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Shbobdb posted:

I have no idea? It said solid state or something like that. It was between a better motherboard (i7 vs i5) or a normal hard drive and SSD.

The last computer that I owned, not counting cell phones, was a gifted Dell Inspiron 1500 from ~2006. So I really have no idea what I'm talking about and when I try to educate myself people look at me like I'm from the moon and assume I have a lot oof knowledge that I don't have.

You definitely want a SSD as your boot drive due to all the reasons already mentioned. Speed, power consumption, etc.

A SSHD or hybrid drive is a combination of a small SSD (think flash memory USB drives) for caching (storing frequently-needed data in fast local storage) and a regular spinning hard drive with platters for the actual bulk storage. The goal is to have most of the performance of an SSD with the capacity and price of a HDD. These are fine for secondary disks, like storing your games or whatever but we strongly recommend a decent-sized SSD for your OS and a few frequently-used programs.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Monolith. posted:

What laptop would you all recommend for an artist who uses a Cintiq and does light to medium gaming? I was leaning towards the Y700 but any other options would be helpful. Budget is no more than 800.

Define "light to medium gaming." Are you talking Minecraft, LoL, WoW, etc? You need to look at the system requirements for each of your games, mainly with regards to the GPU. See what kind of hardware you need for those particular games because then your choice of laptops will be quickly filtered down.

I think your $800 max price limit will restrict you to recent, used laptops; any new gaming-competent system will likely run >$1k.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Monolith. posted:

Definitely not WoW but more like TF2. Ill have to talk to my friend tonight to get some more info. I was checking that Barnes and Noble link in the OP and the Y700 was 800ish.

Ah, I just learned about that B&N link recently myself, although I was waiting for the touchscreen-enabled version of the Thinkpad 13 Chromebook to show up before bothering to check the link.

A Y700 with a 960m will be OK; not the best mobile GPU, and not the best thing you can get so close to the 10x0m series launch, but doable. Given that TF2 is a ~9-year-old game, it will run fine on that laptop, and if that's the most demanding game you play then go for it.

Hadlock posted:

Well so far so good on the C201 chromebook. It actually has about 7.5-10 hours of battery life depending on screen brightness etc. I'm a pretty heavy user computationally so I would expect 8+ hours of use at 3/4 brightness.

It's plenty snappy. I would imagine having 4GB vs only 2GB RAM makes a pretty dramatic difference. Keyboard is good for the price class. Screen is about as good as you can expect on a $170 laptop, which isn't mind blowing, but it's perfectly servicable for 99% of the population. I say this being the user of an IPS display PC laptop and 2015 Macbook Pro.

No issues doing video playback, either Youtube or Netflix. Facebook, Chrome etc work fine and I'd say it's at least 90% as snappy as my 2012/3 era i5 laptop with 8GB RAM.

The trackpad is super responsive. Scrolling, mouse movement etc feels really good. The click is about 50% heavier than I'd like, but I'm probably biased having used the Apple Force Touch trackpad for about 8 months now.

Developer mode is pretty easy to get setup, as is installing crouton. I'm using it to work on my Golang side project.

Case/frame/build quality is good for the price. The only thing that worries me is that the soft rubber foot pads are going to wear out within a year. At $170 I expect to replace the chromebook with a new model in ~18 months anyways.

grade:
as a full time replacement laptop: 6.5/10
as a "loving around online sitting on the couch" device: 9/10

Good choice, especially for the price. The C201 is basically the non-convertible version of the Flip. 2 GB of RAM is doable if you restrict yourself to no more then a handful of tabs, but otherwise I strongly, strongly, strongly recommend 4 GB at a minimum. The Chromebook I'm using to type this right now has 16 GB of RAM, to illustrate how serious I am about this topic! :) The Rockchip is surprisingly snappy for what you might expect; it's also in the Haier/Hisense Chromebooks and the Chromebit, among others.

Chromebooks' touchpads are all engineered to work that way; they're all great to use, although there are physical differences between them (some have nice, smooth, glass panels like this one, others use rough cheap plastic.)

I'm going to work on a Chromebook megathread at some point.

Red_Fred posted:

This may be a dumb question (and sorry if so!) but am I right in thinking that I can put any brand of ram in my Lenovo x250? I've struggled to find the spec in the service manual but I can find a bunch of other brand ram which seems to be the right spec based on the 'Lenovo' brand upgrade.

As others have said, "brand" doesn't matter, match the specs, but keep in mind that even if you get the right modules, some aren't compatible in all systems. This isn't something you'll run into too much, it's just a possibility. You'll generally have better luck if you get a matched pair, but if you just add in another module keep an eye out for system instability. It'll most likely be fine though.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Gray Matter posted:

Having a hard time deciding between these two refurbished T430's:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834331716&ignorebbr=1

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834331719&ignorebbr=1


The listed specs are identical, but neither of them specify the max resolution. From what I've garnered it could be either 1366x768 or 1600x900. Lenovo rep I chatted with via the site said there's no way for him to tell.


One says it is "Grade A" and "Refurbished". It carries a 90-day warranty, and from speaking with the rep "Grade A" indicates it is free from cosmetic damage.

The other says it is "Microsoft Authorized Refurbished". This one has a 1-year warranty, but makes no claims as to cosmetic condition.


I am not in the habit of buying refurbished items, but I'm trying to pick up a decent laptop for my wife on the cheap. Which way do I go here?

Refurbs are fine, they'll have a little wear and tear but not enough to make a difference. If you actually did get something full of cat hair or covered in coffee/pop/whatever then you can just exchange it right away (or get a refund if they have no more.)

I'd like to be able to tell you that the slightly more expensive one might have the higher-res display, but to be on the safe side assume both are just HD.

The "MS-refurbished" one has the same warranty info (90 days) as the other one, so I'm not sure where you got 1 year. If that was the case then I'd tell you that for peace of mind the extra $15 is probably worth the extra warranty period. As it stands, one of the questions answered by a customer states they received one with the higher-res display, so you could consider taking a gamble on this one for that reason alone.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Ehud posted:

What do you guys think about this NewEgg open box deal?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834154242R

I would be using it for regular boring laptop stuff and some gaming (Overwatch and maybe a few other new-ish games - I don't need to run things on SUPER ULTRA MAX settings though)

How much was this going for?

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007




Here's a couple more:

http://www.chromepare.com/
https://www.starryhope.com/chromebooks/chromebook-comparison-chart/

Really, the only ChromeOS buying advice you need is this: Get a Celeron-U and 4 GB of RAM. Everything else is gravy.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Rap Record Hoarder posted:

Shopping around for a decent laptop for a cousin who is going off to college in the fall and came across this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Lenovo-...icep&rmvSB=true

Would this be suitable for your basic college student writing papers, watching videos, etc? Ideally this thing would last 2-3 years until we can scrap enough cash together to get something newer and better.

I'm not going to be "that guy" and suggest a goddamn Macbook when you've clearly set a price and mentioned money being an issue, but I will be the obnoxious guy who keeps recommending Chromebooks. You can spend less than $400 and get everything you mentioned covered: productivity software (Google or MS if you prefer,) Web browsing, multimedia streaming, etc. On top of that you can run pretty much anything in Linux, and many models will gain access to Android apps over the coming months. If you really need Windows you can use Chrome Remote Desktop.

There are several models I can recommend, depending on what you're looking for in terms of size/portability, including but not limited to the Acer 15 (the biggest Chromebook, but with solid performance and build quality,) the upcoming Asus C301 (a 13.3" display and a notable 64 GB of local storage,) or the Acer R11. The latter is a touchscreen convertible and has pre-release access to Android apps on the Dev channel, and is regularly in the $200-300 range refurbished on Acer's eBay store. The Dell 13, Acer 14, Acer Chromebook for Work, Lenovo Thinkpad 13, Lenovo Thinkpad Yoga 11e, Toshiba 32, and Asus Flip are all other options with varying caveats (price for most of them, an ARM CPU for the last one, and questionable durability for the Toshiba.)

I could continue if you're interested, but yeah, a Chromebook will work for your use case.

Edit: Unrelated to the above, but Woot has one of those portable USB monitors that I was talking about :
http://computers.woot.com/offers/aoc-16-usb-powered-portable-led-monitor-79
It's only HD resolution & USB2, but it'll work. Plug in the double-ended USB cable, install the DisplayLink software and you're done; future versions of ChromeOS will have DisplayLink built-in.

Atomizer fucked around with this message at 07:03 on Jul 18, 2016

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



kanonvandekempen posted:

Would buying this be a terrible mistake? this price point is about the maximum I want to spend for my home laptop.
http://www.benl.ebay.be/itm/Asus-N5...2UAAOSwXshWs7qt

Idea is home use, and playing games that are not on the PS4, mostly strategy games, settings don't have to be highest.

I wouldn't suggest getting something with a 950m even for low-intensity strategy games; the 960m is kind of mediocre as-is. You may unfortunately run into problems finding decent gaming systems in your area of the world, however. I'm assuming from that TLD that you're in Benmark?:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zPv9_9duV6o

Virtue posted:

He uses team viewer now and is not interested in switching so I think Windows is the best bet. Maybe Mac. I think the jump to chromeOS is going to be a hard one though

There is no "jump to ChromeOS;" if you can use a Web browser you can use a Chromebook. That line of reasoning is really getting annoying.

Also, you're in luck because TV has a ChromeOS extension:
https://www.teamviewer.com/en/download/chrome-os/

If CRD didn't work so well I'd totally use TV, because really, who gives a gently caress what remote software you use? Also, Chromebooks work great for remote desktop; when I use my Pixel (or Flip) to connect to my Windows server the touchscreen works as if it was native to the system (which is otherwise headless.)

Rap Record Hoarder posted:

Chromebooks are something that I've been keeping in mind, given the quality of recent products and the price point. IMO it's the perfect option, but I worry about my relative needing access to some niche program for school and not being able to run it on a Chromebook. I'll talk it over with them and see what they think.

As others mentioned, schools generally have lab areas and provide access to software, so having to run a specific program shouldn't be an issue. Unless the school requires you to have a Windows PC and use a Windows-only program, it's a little overkill to completely rule out ChromeOS just on the premise of a hypothetical Windows application. As I said, you can remote into a Windows system if need be.

Hadlock posted:

The thing I am finding that I miss the most is the keyboard backlight. I'm a pretty stellar touch-typist, but finding that homerow initially can be difficult.

Looks like two Chromebooks currently have that feature, the Google Pixel, and the Dell Chromebook. I didn't realize how much I like the backlit keyboard, but turns out it's really, really important to me.

Yup, backlit keyboards are loving great. Your options are, aside from the ones you mentioned: the Acer CB for Work, HP CB 13, and the Toshiba CB 32. The Acer is great, despite having a plastic chassis. The HP is nice; it has a premium-ish feel, but feels a little fragile and doesn't have a touchscreen like the Pixel (the Pixel 2 still being the best by far.) The Toshiba 2015 has a nice feature set for the price ($300 or $400) but with a mediocre-feeling build and questionable longevity/build quality. The Dell is very loving nice, especially if you get a touchscreen, and the only thing that would complete it is Type-C ports. While the Toshiba is the cheapest of all those options, the other 4 have entry-level models in the $400-500 range that are worth the upgrade.

I would avoid picking up a used or new-old-stock 2013 Pixel, though, as you'll see them in the <$400 range. Despite the build/keyboard/display they have overheating/battery/performance issues (that may be related) that I wouldn't recommend for anyone not knowing exactly what they're in for.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



kanonvandekempen posted:

So you're saying that a laptop with a mobile version of a 1070 or 1080 will be cheaper in September than a laptop with a 970M is right now? Because I find that hard to believe but I guess I could be wrong.

Or are you saying that the 970M laptop will be at least 150 dollars cheaper in September because better models are available? In that case he will have to pay for a cheap and a mid-price laptop for roughly the same amount of money that he was going to spend right now, except he won't be able to play games for a while.

A 10x0m will offer better performance and power efficiency than a 9x0m for the same price brackets. I mean when they're first released there will be price gouging, but once it levels off the 10x0 series will be clearly superior and worth the wait.

On top of that, yeah, older stock, 970m, 980m, etc., will be cheaper as well because of being obsoleted. There's always something better around the corner, but in this case there's a clear reason to wait.

Also if you bought that $150 Chromebook or whatever and eventually didn't need it you could resell it and recoup most of your investment. Since ChromeOS devices basically always work the same, and even get better over time with updates they don't depreciate like other laptops.

But as far as the "being unable to play games until then" goes, yeah, there's nothing we can do about that. :shrug:

Truga posted:

Meanwhile the first thing I do when rebooting my chomebook for updates is turn off the bloody keyboard backlight yet again and wish my pixel would remember that already :argh:

Wait what? You don't use the keyboard backlight? :confused:

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Truga posted:

I hate it because it reflects off the screen

I've never found this to be a problem, and I mostly shitpoast at night. Also, the keyboard backlight turns off when you're not using it, and on top of that, the automatically-adjusting function is disabled when you manually adjust it (until you reboot) so this is probably the source of your frustration.

The Iron Rose posted:

I'm not so sure that this is actually the case. It's often repeated, and true at least on first blush, but there is definitely a release cycle, at least for dGPUs, and it makes no economic sense to buy a product at the end of its life cycle when that product is not heavily discounted as a result, and that is not the case with laptop pricing.

It is the case with desktop gpu pricing, but not here.

No, it's literally 100% the case until GPUs stop being developed. There's always new technology under development, and it's usually an improvement (except in cases like the old GeForce FX series or whatever.) It's just in this case there's a significant reason to wait because of performance improvements as well as efficiency gains.

H110Hawk posted:

This is me, but with a mid-2012 MBP. It is top of the line across the board, specifically the "High Res Anti-glare screen" aka matte finish. This is by and away the most important aspect of the laptop to me. I want something newer/better/faster/etc but whatever it is, it must have a screen of equivalent reflective qualities as this current laptop or my Dell U2713 monitor it's hooked up to. That is more or less my only requirement, and I'm willing to pay to get it. (Well, have work pay, but lets not split hairs.)

Other non-screen based nice to haves in order of preference: Flash based storage, doesn't run linux on the desktop, some number of cpus, some number of gb of ram, 5+ hours of battery life (What I get out my current laptop.), a off the baseline graphics card to make the OS snappy, etc.

I've played with numerous laptops including "retina" macbook pros which are all garbage. I sadly forget the models but a few Lenovos and Dells came across IS' desk as demos and their laptop screen were somewhere between the mac antiglare/dell ultrasharp and the glass screens. After a few hours using each of them I had eye strain.

Any ideas? I probably have a $3,000 budget. I've skipped an entire upgrade cycle to keep this laptop. I have more or less the oldest laptop in the company at this point.

$3k budget for a work laptop. :psyduck: It sounds like whatever you do doesn't even require one nearly that expensive, and all you want out of it is a good display. :wtc:

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



The Iron Rose posted:

Uh, no, not really. Yeah, new technology is always under development. But Kaby lake isn't coming out till the end of 2017, new dGPUs will be out in September and then you probably won't have anything major for another 12-18 months.

I mean unless your definition of 'right around the corner' includes things that take more than several months then no, after september there won't be major new tech relevant for consumer laptops 'right around the corner' unless you're really pushing what 'right around the corner' means.

Anything more than a quarter really shouldn't cound for the purpose of advising consumers on purchasing.

I wasn't making any statements regarding time frames. The point is that yes, there's always going to be something new coming "soon", and in some cases it makes sense to wait. In this case, because the next generation of GPUs is particularly powerful and power-efficient it makes sense to wait a little longer. That's all, don't infer anything else from this exchange.

H110Hawk posted:

It's a good thing "work laptop" is entirely uniform from one person to the next. Thanks for the suggestions.

The idea was that you were just going to blow $3k because it wasn't your money. Which is fine, of course, but I noted that you didn't particularly describe a need for a $3k laptop, you just wanted a nice display. Which, again, is fine.

Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



Truga posted:

Hopefully in 5 more years laptop gpus will be good enough to run poo poo at 1080p on low settings and also not take a giant heatsink while doing it so I can have an ultrabook with good gaming options (although intel HD5000 performs surprisingly well in a lot of games already)

Iris Pro 580 is pretty aight. :shobon:

(I mean the Skull Canyon NUC isn't a laptop but we're heading towards decent Intel iGPUs in laptops.)

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Atomizer
Jun 24, 2007



NewFatMike posted:

First of at least 2 Razer Core videos from LTT:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZSMcKbuEnA

I'm definitely getting more nerdsweats about it. Seems like since the last review I posted the drivers have improved dramatically, which is very very good.

God dammit, Razer, release an HQ Razer Blade Stealth for me to use with the Core. Free me from 970M awful battery life.

I'm still waiting for the Core to drop in price, but yeah I'm looking forward to it eventually.

What's that box at the beginning of the video with 9 goddamn video cards? :magical:
(I spent a few hours watching other LTT vids that I hadn't already seen but didn't stumble upon that one.)

Also, as an aside, that video is available at 4K resolution, but anything above FHD is throttled and stutters on a Core m7-6Y75 for those interested.

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