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Angry Diplomat posted:Or even kludge in a conditional check that fires when a creature tries to enter a vehicle tile from outside the vehicle, manually checks whether that tile has any edges or corners not surrounded by other tiles of the vehicle in its design, and blocks the movement if it doesn't. It wouldn't be perfect, but it would probably prevent like 95% of the weird vehicle-phasing shenanigans that occur. or say you can only enter a vehicle from outside when you're moving into an open door/window, bare frame, or broken structure then add something for bicycle/motorcycle seats
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Feb 28, 2019 17:45
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Evilreaver posted:an endgame eyyyyy i'd be a lot more likely to accept bad stats or weird starts if there was some sort of end game i could build toward. as it stands the end game is to get a lot of stuff and then get bored, which actually is fine insofar as it kept me interested long enough to develop a love for this game, but it does mean you have poo poo like "anything less than optimal stats is unacceptable" because it makes that goal take geometrically longer.
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Feb 28, 2019 19:34
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Greader posted:In regards to stats chat, one idea I had which I wonder if it would fix things is a mix of that mod and how it works now. Basically have stats up to a certain threshhold be raisable by skill increases or some other way that is doable for players in the early to midgame, and then once they reach a sort of "natural peak" you would have to search for CBMs and mutations to increase it further. That way you would avoid the problem of being unable to drag bookshelves around while also avoiding the problem of becoming the Hulk because you read enough magazines about how to take a tire off. the real issue is that if you, say, start everyone out at 8 in every stat and then have various Events that give you +1 to the stat or whatever, the game just becomes an event hunter until you've knocked them all out because stat gains are more important than nearly anything else you could be doing until you have them like think about a "if you punch a punching bag 100 times, you get +1 str" thing - why NOT beeline to a punching bag and then hit it 100 times? it's tedious by design better to just say that people start out as Normal People but with a few traits, some of which might be being extra strong. say, there's a bunch of Extra Stat traits that give an equivalent of +2 to the stat, and the existing things (like trap detection) are balanced out assuming everyone is at 8 across the board. then you can say I'm A Strong Person and the mutations are meaningful, but you don't have to worry about stat application at char creation or going through makework to increase it through the game (until you get to mutation roulette, at least)
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Feb 28, 2019 19:51
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the stat thing is eminently solvable if you just make the +2 passive stat mods stackable the same way power storage mods are, up to a certain stat level (let's say 14 for the sake of argument) so the biggest difference between someone who starts at 6 str and 10 str, in the longest term look at things is that the former needs 4 mods to softcap strength and the latter needs 2. if you want to get more stats from there you have to mutate. the mods are not that common and they're almost entirely exclusive to labs, which are among the most dangerous places in the game right now, so i feel like it solves the problem neatly without doing anything crazy.
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Feb 28, 2019 20:20
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Stat growth same as skill growth: as used, slows down as numbers get higher, rusts with disuse. Increasing rust speed puts a soft cap on stats, mutations and implants don't count against you. This also essentially demands the "no hard limits/requirements" fix from earlier. Also I would quadruple stat and skill gains up to your record highest level, ie if you get level 10 mechanics and it rusts down to 8, each exp point used on mech is quadrupled until you're at 10 again. You retain recipes and abilities granted by high levels (if any exist), you just work at the lower speed/effectivity until you are back up to speed.
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Feb 28, 2019 20:36
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Coolguye posted:so the biggest difference between someone who starts at 6 str and 10 str, i still hate this, since it's just newbie bait
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Feb 28, 2019 20:41
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Evilreaver posted:Stat growth same as skill growth: as used, slows down as numbers get higher, rusts with disuse. Increasing rust speed puts a soft cap on stats, mutations and implants don't count against you.
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Feb 28, 2019 23:24
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I'm a skill rust apologist, I think it could be made into a good mechanic with some thought and polish 
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Feb 28, 2019 23:28
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yea for sure, i'm just saying i'd need some convincing
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Feb 28, 2019 23:29
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I'm solidly anti-skill rust but pro-actual physical rust. Put rust monsters in the game.
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Feb 28, 2019 23:47
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reignofevil posted:Fix zombies getting into cars when they are pointed diagonally. You mean you don't appreciate the feature of having a 5 dimensional car
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Mar 2, 2019 05:01
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mormonpartyboat posted:the real issue is that if you, say, start everyone out at 8 in every stat and then have various Events that give you +1 to the stat or whatever, the game just becomes an event hunter until you've knocked them all out because stat gains are more important than nearly anything else you could be doing until you have them Yeah, that's absolutely fair. Besides, my worry about a cap that stats can be raised to before hitting a peak is that with the way the game is going, said peak would be at some stupid level of just low enough where you can't do a bunch of neat poo poo/it gets annoying. Maybe removing the stat system itself and having perks that can be gained for bonuses to learning/accuracy/hitting poo poo would be a better solution like you suggested.
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Mar 2, 2019 05:52
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I know this thread is pretty dead but the new hunger system is the pinnacle of realism over game play or fun. Now food or drink you eat slowly travels through your character and you are unable to eat or drink too much at any one time. It is hilarious and stupid.
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Apr 23, 2019 23:40
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Holy crap I didn't know it could get any more dumb. 
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Apr 23, 2019 23:45
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God bless this game.
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Apr 24, 2019 00:04
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How long before the community counterattacks with a mod enabling SS13 levels of poo-terrorism?
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Apr 24, 2019 00:13
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Nothing quite like it
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Apr 24, 2019 00:13
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luv to realistically simulate biological processes in my game about human corpses being animated by splinters of a literal god from another dimension
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Apr 24, 2019 00:14
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I don't agree with the design decision but is it actually a big gameplay hindrance not being able to choke down a whole turkey in one sitting? Like how much does this actually impact play?
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Apr 24, 2019 01:02
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It mildly to moderately impacts play but 100% of the impact is sheer pointless annoying tedium.Peachfart posted:I know this thread is pretty dead but the new hunger system is the pinnacle of realism over game play or fun. Now food or drink you eat slowly travels through your character and you are unable to eat or drink too much at any one time. It is hilarious and stupid. Not only that, something about the way they implemented it hosed up portioning and you seemingly have to slam like 3 litres of water/half a dozen sausages to go from "very hungry/thirsty" to vaguely satisfied. Compared to older versions, the current build requires you to spend a baffling amount of time micromanaging the simple act of consuming food and drink. It's probably not going to be a deal-breaker if you like the game anyway, but considering it adds literally nothing, not even any kind of hamfisted overture towards "balance" or "challenge," I'm fairly comfortable calling it a dumb, bad, and unfun change. This loving devteam, man 
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Apr 24, 2019 01:03
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Speaking of dumb changes to the food system it is generally better to go run over a zombie child and eat his powdered candy stick than it is to work hard and try to grow crops to survive. I challenge anyone in support of this to try and fill up on powdered candy stick.
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Apr 24, 2019 01:18
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Yeah, they coded in a nutrition system that punished / rewarded you for eating junk / healthy but it wasn't working right so they added in a default to on mod that disables it. Why not fix that instead?
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Apr 24, 2019 04:26
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I think the thing is that Cataclysm doesn't really have a "dev team". It has a bunch of random open source coders with their own ideas about how the game works and then a couple of admins that decide whether or not an addition goes in the main branch. So you get a lot of weird inconsistencies because of people who decide no, MY way of doing this is better, or people who just plain don't know about an existing system, or don't want to bother trying to figure it out to make changes.
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Apr 24, 2019 06:30
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ostensibly the repo owner is supposed to gatekeep that but we're all aware at this point exactly how big of a loving idiot that guy is right now
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Apr 24, 2019 06:40
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Kevin Granade is an rear end in a top hat.
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Apr 24, 2019 08:00
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Are there builds available from before all these shenanigans happened or did you have to be lucky enough to save a copy before everything changed? Also it sounds like somebody played unreal world and thought the stomach filling system in that game was a good idea. I've always wanted to fix food by attaching it to morale and having more complex cooking increase morale more than just peanut butter between two pieces of flatbread. If I were the lead on this project I would turn this into a zombie game where you can do your own silly things as well as make it a quest for gourmet food in post-apocalypse.
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Apr 24, 2019 12:12
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It's a public Github, so you can download any build you want or even fork it and make your own build with the specific PRs you want.
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Apr 24, 2019 13:12
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Yeah, their little barebones release website has tons of experimental/unstable releases available for download, going back a little ways. I'm pretty sure it just draws those directly from the github, so I'd bet you can grab just about any specific experimental release you want, if you're willing to dig for it.
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Apr 24, 2019 14:45
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They made eating food a pain alongside keeping food a pain, a sealed jar of pickles shouldn't be able to rot just because it froze once and a loving egg shouldnt be able to be labeled "mushy and tasteless", its a loving egg.
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Apr 24, 2019 16:38
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Oh agreed, the 'thaw' system is also dumb.
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Apr 24, 2019 17:07
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Peachfart posted:Oh agreed, the 'thaw' system is also dumb. It's extra stupid and it's one of the many reasons I hate the CDDA discord and subreddit, you can't talk about any mechanic you think is stupid without catching immediate downvotes or half the chat ganging up on you while singing the dev's praises. Freezing food is supposed to allow it to keep for a long while (or at least until you find it in the back of your freezer and toss it out) not make it inedible until it thaws into another inedible state.
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Apr 24, 2019 17:31
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Well if you don't like it, why don't you join the github and make changes you want? 
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Apr 24, 2019 17:42
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AppleDan posted:It's extra stupid and it's one of the many reasons I hate the CDDA discord and subreddit, you can't talk about any mechanic you think is stupid without catching immediate downvotes or half the chat ganging up on you while singing the dev's praises. Freezing food is supposed to allow it to keep for a long while (or at least until you find it in the back of your freezer and toss it out) not make it inedible until it thaws into another inedible state. That's not to say any of these things make for fun gameplay, of course. Just because something is realistic or even just attempting realism, that doesn't mean it's a good idea to put it in your game.
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Apr 24, 2019 17:55
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Wasn't there someone named Coolthulu making/maintaining a fork with less of the tedious realism crap? How is that going along?
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Apr 24, 2019 17:58
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Yeah but did it loving rot immediately afterwards? Absolutely not, and in a zombo apocalypse you will eat that syrupy egg.
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Apr 24, 2019 18:33
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queserasera posted:Are there builds available from before all these shenanigans happened or did you have to be lucky enough to save a copy before everything changed? Also it sounds like somebody played unreal world and thought the stomach filling system in that game was a good idea. You usually only have a few different stacks of food, and food recipes are useful consolidation than nutrition inventing or nutrition mandatory. Eating is as simple as cramming it in Food has different nutrition density but it only matters if you are recovering from starvation or doing constant manual labor and causes cool stuff like ravenously eating that beautiful beautiful pike after subsistence rations of wild vegetables. Unreal world is not a game about raiding future tech laboratories to turn into JC Denton then build a 200mph car tank to drop a nuclear bomb next to a transdimensional monsters hive. URW has barebones nutrition that is probably a little more than Cataclysm even needs but again it's another case of making GBS threads or getting off the pot at being a dungeon based roguelike or a survival game. It's so bad at survival compared to URW I'm still not sure why it's even trying.
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Apr 24, 2019 18:34
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But if we don't focus on boring minutiae that doesn't make the game more fun, or retooling the crafting interface for the tenth time, we might have to finally make new content or address the utter lack of endgame.
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Apr 24, 2019 20:07
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FEATURE REQUEST: eggs delicious at all times
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Apr 24, 2019 21:42
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Inexplicable Humblebrag posted:FEATURE REQUEST: eggs delicious at all times It's already a feature of real life! 
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Apr 24, 2019 22:12
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Inexplicable Humblebrag posted:FEATURE REQUEST: eggs delicious at all times RabidWeasel posted:It's already a feature of real life!
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Apr 24, 2019 22:43
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