The Resume and Interview ULTRATHREAD: they saw Amazonian attributes

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Ask/Tell > Business, Finance, and Careers > The Resume and Interview ULTRATHREAD: they saw Amazonian attributes

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seacat: Dec 9, 2006

ScaryJen posted:

I've gotten conflicting advice about whether saying this or listing my references is the way to go. Am I better off leaving them out entirely?

Do not under any circumstances list your references on your resume. Reference-checking is one of the last stages of the hiring process. If you're a reference, do you really want your contact info plastered all over the place every time someone applies for a job?

"References available upon request" isn't an absolute red flag, but it's just so unnecessary. Of course you have references available upon request. I mean, what are you going to do if a potential employer wants to check references before making a final offer, "go gently caress yourself, my resume didn't say I had any"?

# ¿ Jun 11, 2013 00:25

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# ¿ Apr 25, 2024 15:16

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Grumpwagon posted:

Is it a really bad idea to just show up at a place I'm particularly interested in working? I'm just out of school (computer science), with a pretty thin resume, so I haven't exactly gotten a great response to my initial round of (online) applications (including to this company). This company isn't a particularly prestigious destination, but they branched off from a company I know is good, and the job description really fits me perfectly.

EDIT: If it's not a really bad idea, how should I approach it? Should I be wearing a suit? Ask to talk to the recruiter for this job? Or should it just be a more casual "just checking out the environment" kind of visit?

It's a really, really bad idea. Seriously, do not do this. you're not going to stand out the way you think you will and there is a 99% chance they will just tell you to go away and apply online anyway. The only exceptions are hospitality, food service, and retail.

# ¿ Jul 3, 2013 17:42

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Bugamol posted:

What's the consensus (if there is one) on objective statements? I've heard 50/50. Half think it's useless and don't read it or view it negatively and half seem to think it needs to be there. Is it safer to just have one on there?

Useless at best, if you're going to be wasting space you might as well go the whole nine and add "References available upon request". Your objective is to get an offer, any hiring manager knows that.

# ¿ Jul 12, 2013 02:15

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

spwrozek posted:

My wife currently is employed. She had 2 interviews a couple weeks ago. She got a job offer to one last Friday. She called the person she interviewed with for the other one (the job she would rather have) monday (cell and office) trying to find out what they were thinking. She hasn't heard back. I work for this company and know the guy isn't on vacation (she would work at a different office thankfully).

How long does she wait to call back again? She needs to know at some point... I don't plan on calling the guy but I could if I needed too (not a good approach imo).

Did she tell them she has an offer in hand when she called?

If not she should call them one more time & mention that she has an offer for which the company is awaiting a decision <insert timeline here>. That might accelerate their timeline or at least hopefully get a response.

quote:

How long does she wait to call back again? She needs to know at some point... I don't plan on calling the guy but I could if I needed too (not a good approach imo).

It looks like you're aware of it, but do NOT do this, it is a terrible idea in 99.9% of situations to mix your personal and professional life in this way. To any sane hiring manager it'll make her seem like she's unable to handle her job search on her own. The only scenario in which it would help involves yourself and the hiring manager being pretty crooked to some degree.

She might just have to let this one go, although her choice is much easier since she won't be depending on this offer to pay the bills.

# ¿ Jul 17, 2013 03:15

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Jon Joe posted:

I have an interview tomorrow for an internship position where I also need to turn in a r�sum�. I only had one piece of thick, high quality paper and a printing error left it with some repetitious text on the back. Now I need to choose, do I hand it in explaining to ignore the back because it was a printing error, or do I turn it in on regular paper without the error?

It's 2013. Nobody gives a poo poo about resume paper, especially for an internship. Print it on regular cheapo copy paper and stop wasting your money. As long as it's clean, white paper without folds, staples, poo poo stains, etc, it's fine.

# ¿ Jul 22, 2013 23:25

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Grumpwagon posted:

So I got a job offer today, pending a background check. I've never been worried about a background check before, but I'm freaking out about this one a little bit. I really want this job.

The reason is, in a move that seems incredibly stupid now, and definitely not something I'd do again, I fudged the date of my first job to make it more recent. I'm just out of school, and I don't have much relevant experience, so I moved this job up to occupy a time that I held an irrelevant job.

The background check form explicitly says that they may interview former employers. How likely is it that they actually do this, and will uncover this? I have to imagine it won't reflect well, but is that enough to rescind the offer?

Should I just hope it doesn't come out? Admit it now to get ahead of the issue?

Either way, lesson totally learned. The moral of the story: In what should be obvious, don't lie on your resume (at least not about things this easily checked up on).

You may or may not be screwed here, it's really hard to say. What's the job? "Background check" can refer to anything from a criminal background check & drug test to a thorough investigation. The more "professional" the job the more likely they are to verify dates of employment. Or they might not bother to check, but then if you're up for promotion with the same agency in the future they may go over your whole history.

How much exactly did you lie? A month off on your start/end date is probably not a big deal. If you are claiming a year of work experience you do not actually have that will get your offer pulled pretty quickly.

Whatever you do don't admit to them you lied. That will get your offer rescinded about 100% of the time.

# ¿ Aug 1, 2013 01:11

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

C-Euro posted:

I know I shouldn't count my chickens before they hatch, but I want to be ready in case they do hatch so I'll ask it anyway- I had an interview this morning for Job A that I thought went really well, and I expect to hear back from them within a week (it's for a part-time teaching position and classes start next Monday). However, I've also been told by a staffing agent that she's going to set me up to interview for Job B that would almost certainly offer more hours and a better pay rate, but at this rate I might not even interview there until next week, or the end of this week at the earliest. If Job A calls next week and wants to hire me before I hear back from Job B, what should I say to them? I'm also meeting with said staffing agent today- is it out of line to tell her that I need to interview with Job B ASAP? Should I ask Job B to make a quick decision because Job A might be (or has) made me an offer? It'd be nice if I could work both Job A and Job B part-time but I have no idea if that will be an option (and doubt that it will be).

quote:

Tell no one anything. Wait for offers. Pick best one. If you have to quit after a week so be it.

I really don't suggest anything like the bolded part. It offset by the the fact that this is academic and part-time, and it's highly unlikely your contract won't allow you to leave, but you'll still be burning bridges and pissing people off. I'm guessing from your previous posts that this is a paid TA position for a college or university. I spent a few semesters TAing before going to industry and both times someone left before their contract was up it hurt pretty bad.

In real world jobs obviously accepting an offer, especially FT/permanent, is a serious commitment even for a mediocre job and you'll develop a pretty bad reputation quickly hopping around like that. Don't get me wrong I'm not some dick sucking company loyalist, but you really have to weigh such a choice carefully since hiring takes a huge time investment and hiring managers do talk to each other.

quote:

I accidentally let it slip to my staffing buddy that I interviewed with Job A

This on the other hand is not a big deal at all, especially with a staffing company. They know you're interviewing with other places, it's not going to hurt you.

seacat fucked around with this message at 23:16 on Aug 19, 2013

# ¿ Aug 19, 2013 23:12

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

CarForumPoster posted:

I wanna use a free faxing service like fax zero to send resumes/cover letters. Think that looks tacky if they place ads on it?

Yes, thats tacky. It looks like you're too broke to spend $0.15 or whatever to fax something from Kinko's. I'm not trying being a dick, I've been that broke, but that's just what most hiring managers will think.

Where/What industry are you applying that prefers faxes to e-mails for the initial app? I've actually applied to places that require me to fax materials in (academic hospital positions are notorious for this), but the resume/cover letter form was via online app.

# ¿ Aug 25, 2013 22:09

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

C-Euro posted:

I know I just asked this, but when you interview somewhere and they say "we'll get back to you" is it ever OK to call them back before they call you? I had a pair of interviews last week and both claimed they would let me know early this week, but for personal reasons I'm kind of freaking out right now and really need to know if I got either of them.

It's fine to call or email once after they've had reasonable time to consider you. Any more and you'll cross the line into being annoying.

# ¿ Aug 26, 2013 15:55

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Irritated Goat posted:

I'd like to get some pointers for my fiancee's resume. She's in the Design portion of newspapers (copy editor is her current job). She's looking for a job here to come live with me so I'd like to get her something she'll benefit from. Any blank spaces are removed personal information she's not comfortable with giving out online.

Do not list references on a resume, ever. Nobody has an infinite amount of good references, why blast their info all over the place when applying for jobs? Reference checking is usually one of the last steps in the hiring process. If they ask to speak to your references before interviewing you run for the hills (academia excluded)

The design, I don't know, I mean its cute and not terribly annoying like some "wacky" resumes but the fact that I had to spend more than 10 seconds just to calculate how much total experience she has b/c it's offset in pale grey is a bad sign. I'm not in the newspaper industry though.

Why are the bullets so gigantic, is that a newspaper style thing? I literally haven't picked up a newspaper since 2004

seacat fucked around with this message at 00:06 on Aug 29, 2013

# ¿ Aug 29, 2013 00:01

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

C-Euro posted:

Well, tomorrow's Friday and I haven't heard back from the Wednesday job. That interview was set up by a recruiter, I last spoke to her on Monday and she said she was trying to follow up with the manager that I interviewed with. As a hiring person, who do you recommend I call first tomorrow- the recruiter or the manager? I last spoke to the manager last Friday, if that makes a difference.

Unless the hiring manager specifically told you it's OK to contact them, call the recruiter. Many hiring managers who work through recruiters prefer not to be contacted directly.

# ¿ Aug 30, 2013 01:55

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

C-Euro posted:

I'm still waiting to hear back for an interview I had nearly two weeks ago, but today I had a recruiter call me offering me an interview on Thursday for a position that I'm pretty qualified for. How up-front should I be in this interview about the fact that I have another pending hiring decision on my head? I could see it going one of two ways:

A. If I do well they might think "oh we better make a decision on this guy soon before someone else scoops him up", and if they're leaning towards hiring me then that pushes them further in that direction.

B. If I come out with it they might think "look at this smug jerk, if he's waiting on another offer he'll probably get it/be happier there", and if they're leaning away from hiring me then that pushes them further towards that decision.

I feel like scenario A is the more likely of the two but at this point I'm not leaving anything to chance. My hope is that it won't come up at all, but if they ask or if it slips out then what do you think?

I wouldn't bring it up for the risk of B (which is unlikely btw, but possible). It is a completely different scenario if you had an offer in hand but you do not have one. What I would do is ask about the timeline for their position and not go any further than that. They may need someone last week and be ready to make an offer. Or they may be willing to wait 3 months for the perfect applicant.

If you do get an offer from company A a day after you interview with company B it is completely acceptable to call company B, let them know you have an offer, and ask where you stand. (or vice versa). Just remember, you don't have an offer until you have an offer.

# ¿ Sep 3, 2013 22:56

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

CelestialScribe posted:

I nailed a second interview at a big corporate firm on Monday - but today it's Wednesday and I didn't hear anything yesterday.

Should I be worried? Or does it usually take a couple of days to get a call offering the job?

It doesn't mean anything. It can take weeks for offer paperwork to go through.

I would be more concerned about worklife balance if they're interviewing you on a national holiday.

# ¿ Sep 3, 2013 23:05

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

CelestialScribe posted:

I'm in Australia! Good to know nothing is wrong though.

Sorry for being myopic

Not strictly speaking about you, but there's a common theme of post-interview stressing and hand-wringing ITT. I've only been in a hiring manager position for about a year but I strongly suggest that after an interview you move on psychologically and continue your search. I completely sympathize since I was a struggling science grad barely four years ago and would constantly overthink everything, "followed up" too much, lost sleep at nights agonizing, etc. Seriously, after you hand in an app, after an interview, after a second interview, after a recruiter chat, whatever, even if you are 1000% sure an offer is coming, you'd be doing yourself a favor to move on.

Seeing it from the other side, hiring just takes more time than candidates think. In just a little over a year at I've seen the budget for a position been revoked overnight to alot money for industrial equipment, offer letter delayed for 2 weeks (!) because the only HR person (small company) had a family medical emergency and our company made the retarded decision that only HR could make the official offer, going to the third-string candidate five weeks after the initial interview after the first two dropped out, and my top pick candidate for a lab technician being vetoed by my boss (who has since then been fired) to hire someone who was a total fuckup and quit showing up two weeks in. All that poo poo sucks, it's unfair, not the candidate's fault, and to be fair my company is fairly mismanaged, and I'm not saying it will happen to you, but that's a slice of what makes offers take so long.

Seriously, after a good app or interview give yourself a pat on the back (if good), vent a little and shake it off (if bad), and change focus to your next application. It's easier said than done especially when you need to pay the bills. But if you can steel yourself to do it you will have a more successful job search as a result.

Here's a link I recommend from former nonprofit manager Alison Green on the subject (her blog in general is quite good, actually):

http://www.askamanager.org/2012/07/how-long-should-you-wait-to-move-on-when-you-havent-heard-back-from-an-employer.html

# ¿ Sep 4, 2013 01:00

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Just The Facts posted:

I'm completely revamping my resume because employers are avoiding me like the plague. Is it necessary to spell out Bachelor of Arts or is BA sufficient without looking lazy?

Nobody cares.

# ¿ Sep 12, 2013 02:38

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

neogeo0823 posted:

I've got a section on my employment history that I'm really not to happy with. Basically, the oldest job on my resume, I worked for 2 years and did a lot of good stuff, then after that I worked at a few different retail places over the course of a year, with one job highlighted as it's the "significant" job during that time, then my current job as my latest one. The problem is that while I worked that 2nd job, I did nothing worthwhile, and it's been very hard for me to quantify anything worth putting on my resume for it.

So, my question is, could I do something like the following:

[JOB 1]
YEAR-1 - PRESENT
[ACCOMPLISHMENTS]

Retail - Various
YEAR-2 - YEAR-1

[JOB 3]
YEAR-4 - YEAR-2
[ACCOMPLISHMENTS]

and get away with it? Or would that not be advised?

IMO you can't think of your retail experience adding any value to your applications, leave it off and use the space to beef up your two significant jobs. A resume is a marketing document, not an exhaustive account of every bit of your time. Yes, you will have a time gap, but that is incredibly common these days and you can just tell them you were temporarily working in retail jobs while [fill in the blank]

You didn't give much info as to why you went from Job3 to retail (moved, fired, laid off, quit, etc.) so without that it's hard to go into more specifics.

# ¿ Sep 21, 2013 02:53

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Xeom posted:

I hope this is the correct thread to ask this, I tried asking in the engineering thread, but nobody responded.

I have two possible GPA's to put on my resume, my school GPA and my cumulative GPA. My school GPA is just my current schools GPA(Florida State), while the cumulative GPA is both my FSU GPA and my community college GPA. My school seems to report both to me, but I am not entirely sure what they put on my transcript.

The question is then should I put my cumulative GPA on my resume? I am majoring in chemical engineering, my school GPA is sub 3.0, while my cumulative is over 3.0.

I've never heard of anyone averaging GPAs from multiple schools. My advice would be to find out what the official paperwork (your transcript from FSU) says. I know my community college credits transferred, but the grades did not, but maybe your uni's rules are different. If your degree granting school's paperwork says < 3.0, leave it off, if it's > 3.0, put it on. Honestly though in Chem-E I wouldn't worry too much unless you barely graduated with a basement GPA somehow. In school-prestige obsessed professions like law it's different but I've been working in the chemical sciences for years and nobody really gives a poo poo about GPAs as long as you got the BS.

# ¿ Oct 15, 2013 01:25

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

systran posted:

Also keep in mind that after you do what Aquatic Giraffe just said, you should modify the resume every single time you apply for a job by looking at the specific requirements/desired skills for wherever you are applying.

That's a little overkill. I hire in lab chemistry, not chem-E, but most entry-level jobs "targeting" a certain major have a lot in common. You don't need a different resume for each position until you have at least 5-10 years experience, you're just wasting your time. For example, I had a few resumes when I was entry-level: one for lab analyst jobs, one for instrumental service jobs, and one for sales jobs. You might have one for process engineer, one for plant quality engineer, etc. (totally making things up based on indeed.com postings -- I am not a Chem-E).

Also the more often you change, the more often you have to proofread because we all make mistakes and a resume must absolutely, no doubt, be PERFECT grammatically. Unless you have a very patient partner/family member/roommate willing to read your resume with every minor alteration

However, you should absolutely modify your cover letter with every single application. If you're not writing a cover letter for each application, you're doing yourself a disservice. Hiring managers come across many, many, many resumes.

If you're truly lost and don't know where to start, I recommend you go to http://www.askamanager.com and read every post in both her Cover Letters and Resumes section. The caveat is that she is a nonprofit manager, not a technical person, but management and hiring is much more about people skills than technical skills and her advice is generally excellent. I've applied most of her principles when hiring and applying for my lab and in several of the previous ones I've worked, with success!

# ¿ Dec 20, 2013 15:23

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

StarSiren posted:

Curious, do employers call people in to offer jobs in person?

I've been through essentially 4 rounds of interviews for a position I'm absolutely ecstatic about pursuing. I get a call today letting me know they've gone through my references and want me to come in and meet one-on-one with the person who would theoretically be my boss. I'm not sure what to expect or if I should prepare for something in particular, or what.

No, I've never heard of this happening. They're just having you meet someone within the company. It would take some sadistic fucks to force you to accept or reject an offer point blank in person.

# ¿ Jan 31, 2014 02:39

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Magnetic North posted:

I assume this is normally done by email now? And do you normally have to send it back to them with your signature?

Yes, except for some very serious high level positions (or those with an employment contract) where there may be heaps of legal paperwork to sign it's done by e-mail, and you e-mail them back confirming you accept the offer. You may or may not have to physically sign it and send it back, just depends on the company.

# ¿ Feb 13, 2014 01:22

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

moflika posted:

Does every other format other than chronological send out instant red flags? Functional seems weak, but combined seems like a good way maybe to ease up on the whole flight risk aspect. Is combined format still going to be an instant red flag?

absolutely, and absolutely. Sorry, if you're sending anything but a chronological resume you might as well write "I'm trying to hide unemployment/prison/job-hopping/whatever" on it.

# ¿ Feb 18, 2014 00:06

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Zarin posted:

Let's chat about GPA for a moment.

A lot of these applications want a GPA to go with the degree. Since I'm looking for entry-level, that's kind of a thing.

Short story: I tried Electrical Engineering right out of High School, and played too much C&C Generals. My grades sucked; after 3 years I transferred from a 4-year institution to a 2-year and scooped a degree in Mechanical Maintenance. Got a job in that field, was like "OH SO THIS IS WHAT YOU DO WITHOUT A DEGREE" and went back to the original 4-year institution for a Bachelor of Science in Accounting. (I should have probably transferred schools instead.)

Accounting GPA: 3.72 (Hello ladies)
Overall Cumulative GPA: 3.06 ()
Cumulative GPA Last 60 Hours: 3.90 - My career advisor suggested I add this to the resume; he says it is a reasonably common metric, and shows I was a pretty dedicated student. (Coincidentally, I took 61 hours of classes at the 4-year after I went back).

On the job application, would it be considered disingenuous to put my Major GPA rather than my Overall Cumulative? My cumulative isn't terrible, but I know some of these places want their accounting applicants to be as high as possible, and sometimes over 3.25+. (For the record, I have all three on my resume; the 3.90 is a reference only thing and I would never consider putting it on a job application)

No employer really cares about your undergrad GPA or your grades your backstory as long as you get the degree. Grad schools care. Employers hiring bachelors graduates, even entry-level, don't. It is on most applications but most applications also ask you to list every single employer you have ever worked for and your salary at each and all sorts of stupid poo poo.

Also, always assume your college career advisor knows dick about anything until proven otherwise. They are notorious for giving idiotic suggestions. In this particular case he's basically advising you to invite questions about stuff before got your insanely awesome accounting grades when presumably you don't want to talk about that. Also I've never seen or heard of anyone putting "past 60 hours GPA" on a resume.

So on your resume you would put:
EDUCATION
The University of Whatever May 2014
Bachelor of Science in Accounting
GPA: 3.72 (Major), 3.06 (Overall)

On applications just put 3.06. It's not like it's bad or something.

# ¿ Feb 20, 2014 03:33

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Magnetic North posted:

What's the current etiquette on calling to confirm the status of an application? How long to wait, etc? Some googling is telling me "don't" which is weird because I hear anecdotally that you do better if you show the initiative and call them.

This question keeps coming up and it's really simple no matter what industry you're in.

If you want to check on an application, don't. If they haven't contacted you after you sent in the app to bring you in for an interview, they're not interested. It's not necessarily because you hosed anything up, there were just more people who were better for the position. Move on.

If you wish to check on your candidacy after an interview, the appropriate way is to e-mail whoever interviewed you one week after the interview with a ONE OR TWO SENTENCE e-mail and then never contact the company again. E.g. "I enjoyed talking about <specific aspect of widgets> at Widget, Inc and was wondering if you had made a hiring decision yet". If you didn't get their business card that's your fault and correct it next time. If they refused to give you their business card after an in-person interview they are probably someone you don't want to work for. If you don't hear anything back after the one-week letter, you didn't get the job. Move on.

For fucks sakes whatever you do, do NOT call anyone, HR or otherwise. It doesn't show initiative or whatever the baby boomer-era advice is, it just interrupts the hiring manager/HR in the middle of what you're doing and fucks up their day. If everyone who interviewed called to "check up" on the status of their candidacy they'd be fielding these calls all day. They can respond to your e-mail whenever they want but nobody in charge of hiring wants to be interrupted by a phone call.

seacat fucked around with this message at 05:22 on Mar 26, 2014

# ¿ Mar 26, 2014 05:20

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Big Ol Marsh Pussy posted:

Hello I'm here with the stupidest question of all time: I got an e-mail from someone from HR to set up a phone interview, but I can't tell from the name if it's a man or a woman and googling the name doesn't help me. How do I address them in my reply?

"Dear [Jordan/Casey/Jamie/whatever], I'll be available at 10:00 AM Monday, would that work well for an interview slot?".
Unless they flash a MD or PhD in their sig then it's Dr.Lastname.

Honestly, although I'm sure there are some extremely stuffy workplaces where people address each other by Mr/Mr/Mrs whatever 99.999% of the normal work is fine going by first names unless, again, a doctorate is involved. Hell, our 4 person C-suite insists we call them by their first names and they're all 60+ white conservative males.

# ¿ Mar 29, 2014 05:40

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Sprite141 posted:

So I have a question about the GPA I'm listing on my resume. I graduated with my bachelor's in mechanical engineering with a 3.69. I'm now a master's student, and I took an undergrad course that I did poorly in. The cumulative GPA on my transcripts now lists my undergraduate cumulative GPA as 3.63, as that undergrad course doesn't affect my graduate GPA. So now I don't know what to list.

I'd like to put the GPA I graduated with on my resume, but anyone checking my resume would have to check my graduation date and find the undergraduate GPA on my transcripts at that time to see the correct GPA. Needless to say, this isn't something I'm comfortable just hoping someone would see this. I know some people put their major and cumulative GPAs separately, so I could just do that. But because the GPA drop occurred after I graduated, does it even matter? I could just omit my undergrad GPA, put "Cum Laude" as I graduated with honors and rely on my graduate GPA of 4.0. The thing is that I've only been a master's student for a year, I am graduating next semester and I have no real world experience other than an RA position, if that even counts. Several of the places I'm applying to have a minimum GPA requirement, and I think that leaving out my undergraduate GPA would not be viewed kindly. I mean, both GPAs meet the requirements so that isn't an issue. I just don't want to be held up later down the road because of a course I took after I got my degree, or someone omitting my application altogether because of it. I suppose I could just put the smaller GPA, but that might be an issue down the line if they see I graduated with a higher GPA than that. Does anyone have any recommendations on what to do?

Nobody* gives a poo poo about GPA. Especially graduate school GPA. Put whatever your school reports for your undergrad in case they check.

But honestly, really, seriously, nobody* gives a poo poo about GPA. In any case, 3.5+ in mech-e is top tier any way you slice it, you're not a philosophy major.

* real world employers (omitting med school, law school, etc)

# ¿ Mar 30, 2014 14:29

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Aquatic Giraffe posted:

So I had my interviews yesterday.

The one unofficial "come by and meet everyone" one was them putting out feelers for when they have the budget for an additional person later this year so there might be a job materializing there in the future. They told me I should keep in touch and told me they'd keep me in mind for when they have the budget to hire additional people. How do I go about reminding them that I exist during budget season without being pushy? I'd feel weird emailing them periodically going "so... you guys hiring yet?" I added them on LinkedIn and I'm planning on letting them know when I'm settled in the area, is that sufficient?

The tiny company seemed shady as all hell though. No HR department, no benefits, no PTO and would be a large pay cut from my current job. I'd probably have better benefits working full time retail.

They can go gently caress themselves. Do not go back to them. It sounds like they wasted your time for a job which might exist, not an actual opening. WTF? You took time off for that?

# ¿ Apr 6, 2014 06:12

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

the posted:

A friend referred me to this site. I applied and they called me back the very next day. This is the first opportunity that I've ever had anyone respond to this quickly, and I've been applying to jobs for the past 4-5 months.

Allegedly, my friend is claiming that he was told the pay for this is $66,000 a year. For an internship. And they'll train you and then place you in the company. Doesn't this all seem too good to be true?

It actually seems to be pretty legit. 99% of the time if you want to know if a company/position is a scam, googling "<company> scam" will tell you in about 30 seconds. As far as I can tell this is Metlife operating a ... technology hub (?) somewhere?

http://www.triplepundit.com/podium/metlife-opens-research-innovation-hub-north-carolina/

I'm more confused about what your friend was told though. It depends on the field but internships don't typically last a full year so I wonder if he is extrapolating. That pay is high but not ridiculous (it's not uncommon for engineering internships to pay $25-35/hr at good companies)

Anyway, it's worth looking into. I don't see any obvious signs of a real scam like a group interview where they spring on you that it's a 100% commission sales job and you have to buy a startup kit for $400 or something. I mean they seem to have real job postings and everything *shrug*

# ¿ Apr 15, 2014 00:30

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

drat Bananas posted:

I have a really stupid question: What would my generic position title be, for job-searching purposes? At my last job I was a "Petroleum Analyst" which is not very specific; I worked for an oil and gas company and formatted well production data into nicely formatted spreadsheets and imported that into an in-house database. From there I kept all the records up to date, ran reports using the database's tools, corrected the records as needed, etc. My guess would be "database analyst" but my Googling makes that title sound much more technical than what I did - coding, etc, I have no computer science background other than a couple of classes that I did awfully in.

So... what would you call me?

That's a perfectly fine to use and you're way overthinking this. That's actually a pretty cool sounding title that might get you a second glance where just "Analyst" might not get a second glance. Although since I work in a chemistry lab my first though is you were running analytical tests on petroleum. Of course none of that matters since your resume will describe your accomplishments and what you actually did much more that the actual job title which can often be incredibly misleading

Now if you were a Project Manager I might think of switching it up just for search engine purposes. I swear 50% of people I work with are Project Managers and they all do completely different poo poo.

Generally though, it's not a great idea to change your "official" HR stamped job title. But that's OK because your resume and cover letter matter much more!

# ¿ Apr 17, 2014 17:41

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Diver Dick posted:

I'm working my way through the thread this morning, and I had a quick question. What is the general consensus on omitting experience or "crafting" a resume? My wife has been actively seeking employment since graduating with a master's degree in the same field as her bachelors, and has consistently (sometimes inside of 24hrs) been rejected due to "overqualification" or not matching the "experience level required". She is very interested in a specific type of work, and more than happy to take a job with an undergrad/entry level payscale to start her career.

I have read articles about omitting direct references to an advanced degree, replacing it with something along the lines of "500 hours of additional professional training, including ..." But I have never personally known this to be effective. Any thoughts on this?

A resume is a marketing document designed to get you an interview. It is not a complete account of every single thing you have ever done. Don't lie (e.g. extending dates of employment to cover up periods of unemployment, making jobs or qualifications that don't exist, etc), but you can omit anything you want that makes you a weaker candidate. If she thinks her master's degree is holding her back, take it off. However, she ~~may~~ will be asked to explain what she was doing during those years. That's where she will have to lie. Depending on the intensity of her background check they may discover she was in grad school those years. But honestly, that doesn't happen with most vanilla positions, they just check to see if you're a child molester/been locked in the insane asylum/etc.

We get resumes from desperate PhDs and masters grads for entry level lab tech positions all the time. I am not going to hire someone with a doctorate to take pH readings 80 times a day.

# ¿ Apr 18, 2014 16:02

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Jerome Louis posted:

I have a potential second interview coming up (done over Skype) for a food/beverage producing company. The role they would be hiring me for is to assess/solve some QA issues. I already have a very solid idea of how to address that issue, would it be too much for me to put together a few slides around how I would approach the issue and then center the second interview around my approach?

Have you ever worked in quality before and do you understand the function of QA in manufacturing (especially as compared to QC, most people tend to confuse the two)? You're already a few steps ahead by planning, you just gotta make sure you answer the right questions.

(I understand you can't reveal the issue specifically, maybe you could give some generalities that don't identify you. I've been working in quality for 5 years and hiring for 2).

# ¿ Apr 24, 2014 03:31

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

the posted:

Since it can't hurt, here's my resume.

I had it reviewed by a career counselor for my department who strongly encouraged the format (Educational experience at the top, classes, research work, then listing the jobs at the end). She said for entry-level jobs, they will be most interested in what I've completed at university. I would appreciate your comments, though.

What kind of job are you trying to get?

Also, like most college career counselors, yours is worthless, has probably never had a real job, and should be fired. Do not talk to her again. No employer cares about your classes or your research. For bachelors all they want to know is "completed degree (Y/N)?" and in some cases "what's the degree in?" What they care about is work experience, most importantly FT positions and internships. Yes, even if it's a part time job at Arby's, or even if it was before college.

So I guess what I'm saying is you're going to have to tear it down and start from scratch, and put your actual jobs at the top.

# ¿ May 1, 2014 09:48

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Good post.

outlier posted:

I just landed a job after an extended period of part-time / casual work and consulting. Admittedly my work is a bit unusual (scientific and academic) but I figured people might get some value - or comfort - out of my experiences:

* Interviews suck. A wise friend of mine made the observation that most are little better than show trials: looking for evidence to justify decisions that have already been made, consciously or subconsciously. And I had some toxic ones, ones that were adversarial or outrageous or betrayed how terrible the job was. One interviewer asked me detailed questions about how to do a particular piece of work ... while making notes not on me but on what I said. He was using me as an unpaid consultant.

It sounds like you've had a pretty hard experience. I've been to probably 10-15 job interviews with maybe 20-30 total interviewers, 4 offers (3 accepted) since graduating in 2007 and honestly only one person at one of those interviews was substantially toxic and rude. Had some disinterested upper management types. I agree if people are toxic to you during the INTERVIEW stage you should run like hell; imagine what working there must be like. Academia is like that a lot though. Lots of dicks.

quote:

* Conversely, I think interviews can be very informative. Bad workplaces, relationships and problems will bleed through, particularly if you ask about them. Always ask, What's the worse thing about working here? Good, helpful bosses will be good and helpful in the interview. And an interview is at least practice for the next interview.

Yeah, I wouldn't agree with phrasing it that way, it's a little bold. Bad interviewers/managers will flip their poo poo, and most good ones won't take offence, but I can think of a couple decent ones that might be put off or think it's unprofessional. Typically I'd ask "What's the greatest challenges of this position/working for the department" or "Where have people struggled the most in this position/department"

seacat fucked around with this message at 23:42 on May 4, 2014

# ¿ May 4, 2014 23:22

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Siroc posted:

I've been trying to avoid putting an "anticipated salary" in job applications whenever possible. Some fields are required in applications.

I'm a grad student chemist. The American Chemical Society publishes the results of a yearly "New Graduate Salary" survey. In the past, this has seemed like a pretty reliable starting point as most of my friends have started out well over the amounts listed in the survey. When addressed with the question above to a particular company, I put about 5% higher than the average on the survey.

I sent the recruiter a quick e-mail thanking them for contacting my department and hope I'm a good fit, and hope to hear back soon yadda yadda. She responded and said thanks for the interest, but she wanted to let me know that the "anticipated salary" I listed was "way above range" for the position.

I'd like to put myself in the position to compete for the job, even if it seems like they're lowballing the hell out of recent grad hires. Should I contact her back and say that I'm inexperienced at this and was solely basing it off that survey? Maybe just not contact her and adjust my application in their system down? Any advice?

What degree (masters/PhD), what specialty if any, what job title and what rough geographical location?

If you're talking about that table from C&E N which breaks down average salaries by years of experience and branch (analytical/physical/etc.) that thing is a load. It doesn't really adjust for geographical location which is a huge deal. I regularly see adverts for my job in hellholes like New Jersey and Port Arthur for 1.5-2x what I make.

Not to say the ACS is full of poo poo or anything. Chem grads are just employed in a VAST varied amount of positions and that survey is way too condensed to be useful.

Since you mentioned a recruiter I'm assuming you aren't applying in academia. Have you had relevant industry experience? If not unfortunately you're just not in a position to negotiate. I'd contact her back and see what their anticipated range is first. If it's too low for you to accept, you'll have to move on and hope it was just a lovely paying company (you'd be surprised what the difference is between two similar companies in the same place for the same position). If you can live on it, your best bet would be to pursue it (amongst other things). It's just really really tough to negotiate as a new grad at any level.

FYI, I'm a quality lab manager who hires analytical chemists/lab technicians. Disclaimer I only have a BS in a chem and do not hire anything above a BS so I can't tell you all that much about grad student job market...

# ¿ May 5, 2014 22:44

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Siroc posted:

Thanks so much for your advice, seacat. Is there any way I could contact you to chat? While I am pursuing my PhD in Analytical Chem, I'd love to ask a few questions to someone who hires scientists. Can I contact you on gchat, irc, etc? I don't think you have private messaging.

Sure, I work a lot of hours so e-mail is the best. I made a dummy account, saseacat@outlook.com, feel free to ask me anything, I just can't go into specific details of my job. As DemeaninDemon said above though PhDs are in a different market, they're above my lab's level to hire but I can help give you at least some guidance since my boss has one.

# ¿ May 6, 2014 03:42

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

UrielX posted:

New to the whole corporate world job search thing. I met with a career person that directed me to use a "functional resume" to try to show skill crossover from past jobs/school to match job duties.

This is all new to me (I've been in EMS virtually my whole adult life).
I could definitely use some help/feedback for my resume.

I've only sent out a few so far, but in this format (customized to each job).

Resume:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bx4t3_oedE6eVWZkRnJyd2d2SHc/edit?usp=sharing

"Functional resume" = "Hiding something". No, not fair. But yes, 99% of hiring managers will see it that way. Do not take advice from that person again.

# ¿ May 6, 2014 18:37

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

UrielX posted:

Well what's the best way to handle this then?

My gap in that time was basically me finishing my B.S.

If I just use a straight chronological resume format, the gap is still there. So wouldn't it be somewhat less effective too?
Because without trying to have the skills section in there, aren't they going to be like " well how did this guy being a paramedic, make him qualified to be X (anything other than a medic)"

Your resume wouldn't pull up on my smartphone earlier. Don't take it personally but that is a horrible mess. A resume needs to consist mostly of employment history highlighting achievements, any relevant educational accomplishments excluding high school, and a skills section.

First, what kind of jobs are you applying for? General desk jockey, forklift driver, neurosurgeon, etc.? So many people ask for advice in this thread not knowing what they want to do, that's totally cool. But you should be targeting your resume to some extent. Shooting that thing all over the place isn't going to do you any favors. Given your bachelors is it something related to the law... paralegal...?

Here's a the most glaringly obvious problems:

Your skills section is not a list of skills, but a list of generic job tasks and vague accomplishments. Proposed measures -- were any enacted? 100 pages of writing -- were they published, or just written? Conducted quantitative/qualitative research -- in what, and what were the results? Procedures resulting in cost savings -- what were the savings? A skills should go after employment and is something like (consider you're a software engineer) SKILLS: C, C++, C#, Perl, Python, PHP, etc. (I'm not a software engineer, just giving an example). It's brief, to the point. What you have in there right now is what most people put in their employment section and it's snoring inducing there too. Also, it's Excel, not excel.
Take your grad school GPA off. Everyone knows nobody gets less than A- in grad school in any discipline.
In fact, consider taking your grad degree off altogether unless it's directly relevant to the job you're applying for. I know that stings. But yes, people will pass you over because they think you're overqualified/too expensive/a flight risk. If you do leave it on, remove "concentration".
I didn't even know "Bachelor of Science and Technology" is a thing. Nobody knows what that is. Just put "Bachelor of Science".
Your employment history should occupy 75% of the page and right now it's about 30%. Despite the fact that you're now a college grad, employers in deskjockeyforkliftneurosurgery will be MUCH more interested in what you did and accomplished working for 7 years as a paramedic crew chief than the fact that you claim to have "Retained composure even when interacting with upset and emotional individuals" (!?)
Don't worry about the resume gap. No sane hiring manager, myself included, would expect someone to work in EMS full time and also be a full-time student regardless of their major.

I probably sound like a dick in this post but I'd rather point out the problems to you here than have you wondering why you've sent out 200 resumes without a single callback.

Oh yeah, don't go back to that career person again. If they looked at that and are encouraging you to apply to jobs with it they should be relieved of their duties.

# ¿ May 7, 2014 00:54

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Oxxidation posted:

Well, back to the job hunt I go. This ship's a-sinking. Does anyone know a diplomatic way to say "I got the hell out of Dodge before the company imploded" if I'm asked why I'm changing jobs?

There's nothing wrong with saying something like "I'm really concerned about my company's financial health and have decided to start looking for something more stable.". Do not go into details and do not badmouth your company, and nobody sane will hold it against you for leaving a sinking ship.

quote:

Much more minor question - do employers really care/pay attention to when resumes are received? I remember hearing somewhere that paperwork sent out on weekends was less likely to be considered, but now that I actually have job experience that seems to be less of an HR thing and more of a general customer-relations issue.

No, that's a complete load. Anyone who cares when your resume was sent is someone you do not want to work for. I've never met anyone who has done any hiring who cares.

# ¿ May 7, 2014 22:18

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Bread Set Jettison posted:

I guess I'm asking where should I specify my 'big' save? Honestly, 7K is chump change to a big company...

Yeah, most people put "Interacted with coworkers in an energetic results-oriented team dynamic with extra focus on synergy". If you really did save 5K, 7K, 10K, whatever the gently caress, you're still ahead of 99% of applicants by at least quantifying results and showing accomplishments.

# ¿ May 10, 2014 00:04

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Xeom posted:

I am trying to get a job as a process engineer

Think long and hard. Are you willing to be on call literally 24/7/365?

Being a process engineer has very little to do with whatever research you've done in undergrad and much more with your ability to communicate between R&D, manufacturing, quality, and sometimes even sales with significant tolerance for agony and the ability to work inhuman hours.

Not saying don't do it, just realize what you're signing up for.

The pay IS really good though.

# ¿ May 14, 2014 02:09

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# ¿ Apr 25, 2024 15:16

seacat: Dec 9, 2006

Xeom posted:

Quick question guys. When writing a cover letter is it essential to address it to the hiring manager?
Also how do you find out who the hiring manager(s) is(are) in some of these bigger companies, or hell even the smaller companies?

"Dear Hiring Manager" is perfectly fine. It sounds a little weird but anyone who has a problem with that is nuts. Honestly, I'd be a little bit worried if someone spent some insane amount of effort trying to track down my name for their cover letter and I don't think I'm the only one.

If you do know their name, generally Mr/Ms X is good to be safe, although 95% of people, even the older crowd, are perfectly fine on a first name basis (in my industry, maybe in more stuffy formal industries it's different). If they have a doctorate you better go with Dr. X.

# ¿ May 15, 2014 17:59

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Ask/Tell > Business, Finance, and Careers > The Resume and Interview ULTRATHREAD: they saw Amazonian attributes

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