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I'm all about CNCs and such, I've built one myself and have plans to build a much bigger/better one, I think they're awesome and fun and...if your goal is to make PCBs, why not just chemically etch them? It's pretty darn easy and requires minimal investment. You don't even need your own laser printer, you can get a pack of toner transfer sheets and get it printed at kinko's or wherever. Get some TRF foil to go with, and you can even make solder masks and silkscreens.
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Nov 4, 2013 22:29
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That's fair, I was just curious what the motivation was. I've done muriatic acid + hydrogen peroxide etching, and man, it's a cinch. You don't need a ton, either: put a few tablespoons of etchant in a zip log bag with your board and you're golden. Ziplocs withstand the etchant just fine, and make it so you need a lot less. Anyhow, carry on, just wanted to chime in there.  For what it's worth, the mill I currently have was actually designed for doing circuit boards. I liked the design, but wanted a bigger envelope (designed with a 6x6 envelope which I expanded to 12x12) so now of course the tolerance is awful as you approach the edges.  My current plan is a Joe's 4x4 built as a 2x3, and when I finally have enough shop space, I'll partially rebuild it as a 4x8 so I can drop sheet goods on there.
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Nov 4, 2013 22:58
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Those are fantastic.
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Nov 12, 2013 14:12
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Yeeeeeeaaaaaah, they clearly have an understanding of where error comes in: it's all at the steppers. 
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Nov 21, 2013 21:10
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Yeah, they seem to be not at all shy about taking theoretical max accuracies and using them as actual, real-world values. "These steppers with this gearing means I can get .00000001 mil accuracy! I did the math!"
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Nov 22, 2013 03:22
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Is it plastic? I'd say it was either a) injection molded, or b) a flat sheet that was heated and formed in a press.
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Aug 12, 2014 22:45
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Ah, hard to tell from the pic. Maybe some sort of vacuum mount? Or, it just had tabs or what have you that were taken off after machining, that's pretty easy.
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Aug 12, 2014 22:54
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That's not to say you can't use a spoil board, but that sits on the table surface as a sort of secondary sacrificial surface.
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Oct 7, 2014 02:07
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There's already software you can dump on an arduino, then you upload gcode via usb and it'll handle all that stuff. The reason things work the way they do is because, I believe, when all this stuff started, a single thread was all you got, no extra cores or processors or whatnot, so timing wasn't such an issue, as well as all the controller boards being very simple and being controlled via parallel. Embedding a microprocessor on such a board back then would have been prohibitively expensive and add an un-necessary level of complication. Literally no reason to add a second processor into the mix when, at that point, it would be adding nothing. These days, of course, computers are more complicated beasts, but there's still a lot of value in the simple driver board, and then it's up to the engineer to provide a solution that can adequately signal that board. So we stick with the standard parallel port, and do the timing in software. On a side note, EMC2 is 100% free and handles all this stuff just fine and dandy, so if you're not tied to windows, check that out, I love it.
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Oct 14, 2014 02:23
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Since this is the cnc router thread now, I thought I should post the latest on my joe's 4x4. It's been a slow project because kids and work and all that, but I got some parts in just today that let me bolt a few extra pieces on and get (manual, free coasting) motion. Pretty pleased with how smooth it is, I had to catch it to keep it from running off the end of the rails. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5o5hPsV_zEQ
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Oct 28, 2014 22:43
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Maybe this is a good place to ask: I understand there are some macros for Mach that'll let you square up a twin-drive axis, like with a slave motor, where it'll drive them both until it hits a home switch, and then keep driving just the non-homed one a little bit until it also hits a home switch. Is that actually a thing? And a reasonable thing to do? And is there any way to do it in EMC2?
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Nov 18, 2014 04:20
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When they list these as A x B, am I getting it right that A is the depth of the channel and B is the width? In my case, I need one channel to carry two 1/4" cables and one 3/8" cable, and the other to carry four 1/4" cables and one 3/8" cable. Plus whatever else I decide to add in later, so I'm thinking for the one axis, I'd need something, say, 1 1/4" wide, and for the other, 1 3/4" or so? Or maybe just 1 1/2" and then 2", that's maybe easier.
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Dec 16, 2014 00:19
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You don't actually need 2x the axis length, though? Like, if you have one mount on the carriage and one mount on the axis, when the carriage is at, we'll say 0, the bend would be in the middle of the rail, and when the carriage is at MAX, the bend will be at the end of the rail. You'd never get the bend to go beyond that halfway mark, the track only has to go from the midpoint of the rail to the end and then up and over, or at the other extreme, up and over and then along the rail. Of course that means you still need a cable guide for the un-moving portion of the track, but there's no need to do it with chain. That said, it looks cooler, and being as cheap as it is, I probably WILL do the whole thing in chain. But still.
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Dec 16, 2014 02:35
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And in all fairness, unless you're ordering by the foot, it's just easier to say "gimme two lengths" and be done with it. Which is what I just did. Sure hope it gets here before the far end of the shipping date range which is early February, though.
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Dec 16, 2014 04:05
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Aurium posted:You can also get them out of the doors of minivans. Junkyards and the like are a cheap source. Oh that's fun. Where does it usually sit? In case I decide to take a field trip just for kicks. I'm guessing in the floor of the van below the door? As opposed to unrolling inside the door?
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Dec 16, 2014 05:03
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Question: what sort of process do you go through to square that up? I'm trying to figure out how best to square my joe's 4x4.
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Dec 17, 2014 01:10
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froward posted:An acquaintance has built himself a CNC mill with motors, and wants help with the software. I'm considering helping him, because he is a nice person and I would like for him to be my friend. But I've no idea how to start on such a thing. They run gcode. There's lots of free software out there for converting vector stuff to gcode. For actually running the gcode and turning motors, mach3 is the gold standard, but emc2 is free and comes on a livecd. Is that what you're asking?
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Sep 16, 2015 22:49
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This place sells kits that might interest you: http://www.cncrouterparts.com/nema-23-cnc-electronics-c-48_22.html?osCsid=s0j8ov6cfihia637re08k8sdt3 Or, at the very least, you can use their kits as a guideline for sourcing your own parts.
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Sep 28, 2015 04:57
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Vcarve pro defaults to 2x bit diameter for end mills, but it hugely depends on material and bit specifics and feed rates and all sorts of factors that it takes years to figure out by experimentation. With that in mind, there's a tool out there that attempts to provide that wisdom, but I forget what the darn thing is called. But you give it various parameters from your setup and it guides you on DoC and feed rates and such. I'm on my phone right now so I can't effectively dig it up myself.
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Oct 1, 2015 17:21
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Someone mentioned OnShape in the 3d printing thread the other day and I've been playing with it, it's pretty slick and I'm fully enjoying it. I use and love vcarve pro as a pretty much complete toolchain for my cnc router work, going from zero to final gcode in a single program, but that's $$$.
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Nov 16, 2015 03:50
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The trial won't let you generate gcode I'm pretty sure, although they do have sample files that you CAN generate gcode from, in case you want to actually give it a full run-through with your setup. I think the free monthly projects they include on their email list are also able to generate gcode with the trial version. Also I'm not sure if it's still a thing, but it used to be that any major releases that dropped within a year of purchasing a license were granted for free (they're usually about $150 to upgrade through major versions) so that's worth looking into, as well. Also they have a pile of good tutorial videos that are totally worth watching.
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Nov 16, 2015 05:18
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Modi1024 posted:Do the computer controlled paper vinyl cutters fit in here? I've been looking around but am not seeing a thread for them. Unrelated to that: i've been having trouble with my joe's 4x4 I built. My y-axis, the one that's driven by two motors in parallel, one at either end of the gantry, seems to be screwed up somehow. When I try to run an actual program, the motor at the far end keeps crapping out, I can't tell if it's just skipping massive numbers of steps, or if it's actually stopping altogether, or what, but the two ends get horribly out of whack and it goes all pear-shaped on me really quickly and only gets worse the longer it runs. It's running on a g540. Really, just straight up this kit of electronics: http://www.cncrouterparts.com/4-axis-diy-nema-23-electronics-kit-p-75.html I'm not sure how best to trouble shoot this. At one point, before I had my cable chain installed, I did accidentally snag one of the cables and pull it taught, I'm wondering if it may have been damaged? Like make not enough to break continuity since I can still jog it around without issue, but maybe enough to damage the shielding which is hosing higher frequency stuff? Any thoughts on how best to troubleshoot this? Really hoping I don't have a bum g540. Using EMC2 on a fairly aged computer, is it also possible the software is running into too much jitter and causing missed steps on the slaved motor?
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Nov 23, 2015 00:16
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mds2 posted:One tip, if you are using a shapeoko: in F-engrave go into general settings and turn off "enable arc fitting" or you will gently caress up your poo poo. Is that just G61 vs G64? The former being exact stop, the latter being constant velocity. If so, yeah, G64 can get bent.
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Nov 25, 2015 19:01
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But you'd get two spoil boards out of it, and a bunch of scrap, right?
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Nov 28, 2015 01:08
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Bad Munki posted:Unrelated to that: i've been having trouble with my joe's 4x4 I built. My y-axis, the one that's driven by two motors in parallel, one at either end of the gantry, seems to be screwed up somehow. When I try to run an actual program, the motor at the far end keeps crapping out, I can't tell if it's just skipping massive numbers of steps, or if it's actually stopping altogether, or what, but the two ends get horribly out of whack and it goes all pear-shaped on me really quickly and only gets worse the longer it runs. It's running on a g540. Really, just straight up this kit of electronics: http://www.cncrouterparts.com/4-axis-diy-nema-23-electronics-kit-p-75.html So I've been thinking more about this. I did a continuity check and everything looks hunky dory. And then this post was made: Methylethylaldehyde posted:On the other hand, the 24v spindle is a hunk of poo poo, it never cuts anything right, and I'm reasonably certain the EMF it's kicking out is what's causing my machine to lock up and abort early. Time to see if inventables just ships me a dewalt mount or if I have to argue with them some more. And it mad me realize that my whole rig (computer, monitor, power supply for steppers/g540, and router itself) are all running on the same circuit, and worse, off the same extension cord directly. It's a dedicated 15A GFCI (at the breaker) circuit for my workbench, so there's nothing else at all on it when this is running, not any lights or anything like that, but I'm wondering if the router might be messing with the power enough to cause the g540 to glitch out, even though it's behind a 48V 12.5A power supply. Part of my suspicion here is based on the fact that I really only have this issue when I'm actually trying to cut something. I can make it play the mario brothers theme or whatever all day long without any problems whatsoever, no apparent missed steps, but once I have that router running and cutting something, then I start getting issues. How on earth would I go about measuring something like that? It's a hitachi m12vc, if that matters. If that is the problem, would running the router on a separate circuit likely help? Or would I need some filtering equipment? Bad Munki fucked around with this message at 17:48 on Dec 4, 2015 |
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Dec 4, 2015 17:25
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...is that some sort of veneered mdf, or is it actually plywood? I honestly don't think I've ever seen mdf with veneer on it, weird.
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Dec 4, 2015 19:39
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Huh, interesting. In that case, I wouldn't sweat the blowout, the difference in mediums is going to be a headache there, between the mdf, the veneer, and the adhesion between. Possibly consider just milling that veneer off before doing a test run, even, if you have a bottom-cleaning bit handy.
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Dec 4, 2015 19:47
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Oh, you know, I never mentioned it, but if you start doing dry runs with pink/blue foam, for the love of christ make sure you have dust collection in place. It doesn't quite get everywhere like mdf dust does, but that's only because the static cling is so god awful. Even if it's you standing there like a goober holding a shop vac near the work piece.
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Dec 4, 2015 20:16
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I think the resin or whatever in mdf would have to be worse, and it certainly can't be worse than his eventual goal of brass. Another option would be machinable wax, which is really just wax with a quantity of ldpe mixed in. Bonus: it's cheap in the first place, and you can save the chips and melt them back into the original block, making for excellent re-use potential.
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Dec 4, 2015 21:40
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I like vcarve a ton, but even for my hobbyist use I do occasionally find it lacking in the CAD department from time to time. Although I think the most recent version fixes most of my complaints (namely, tangent operations.) Maybe I'll upgrade again in a year or two. Still have a bad taste in my mouth about the last one: after being a repeat customer for several upgrades, I bought an upgrade and then a week later, a new release came out with some major enhancements that I specifically wanted. I wrote to them multiple times about possibly getting a grace period on the purchase so that my week-old purchase wouldn't be out-dated, but they apparently just decided to completely ignore me. Like wtf, guys.
Bad Munki fucked around with this message at 21:28 on Dec 31, 2015 |
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Dec 31, 2015 21:26
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Upgrade?
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Feb 19, 2016 14:00
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Parts Kit posted:I suppose this still counts as subtractive since an incredibly fine abrasive is involved but there are jeweling fixtures and bits for mills. They are used to create a pattern of shiny circles on a part for purely aesthetic reasons. The goal isn't to remove material, just create a pleasing pattern. Those same guys appear to be working on friction welding BONE. http://www.woodwelding.com/index.php/?page=idea-concept-bonewelding
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Mar 8, 2016 15:21
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And the cost of fuel to melt them down.
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Mar 22, 2016 21:14
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Is there an expected price point? Because drat.
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Apr 14, 2016 03:46
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Brekelefuw posted:To add to that because Ambrose and I are in Canada: Converting to metric dollars can be tricky.
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Sep 1, 2016 19:38
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If you don't get McMaster-Carr in Canadia, I weep for you.
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Sep 1, 2016 20:59
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CrazyLittle posted:1/8" shank or bust! AND. The word you were looking for there was AND.
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Jan 9, 2017 19:39
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They’re certainly just silently hitting a “normal” key or whatever it’s called in f360. Like, in Onshape (am I the only one still using that?) hitting ‘n’ sets the view to be parallel to the normal of the selected plane, so you’re looking straight at it, and it’s something I do without even thinking about it.
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Oct 21, 2020 15:23
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This is kind of a long shot, but the laser thread seems to be locked and I'm not aware of a new one, so I'll try here: Anyone in the Des Moines area got a laser they'd be willing to do some wood burning with for me? Money's on the table. Only gotcha is that it's a late addition to the project and while there's no hard end date, I don't want to stall completion so I'd be hoping to get it done within a week.  If there's a better place to ask, I'm happy to take this there.
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Sep 2, 2021 03:12
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Good point, I forgot about them, cheers.
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Sep 2, 2021 03:50
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