Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us $3,400 per month for bandwidth bills alone, and since we don't believe in shoving popup ads to our registered users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
«17 »
  • Post
  • Reply
Juaguocio
Jun 5, 2005

Oh, David...



Nice, is that an extra from the GD Movie?

It's too bad the Wall was such a logistical and financial nightmare, because it had such an amazing sound. There are some great audience recordings from 1974 that capture that live "feel" incredibly well.

Phil's bass setup is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard of (from here):

quote:

Phil is using a new quadraphonic bass, the electronics of which were designed and built by George Mundy and the body and pickups by Rick Turner. The new bass has the same versatile qualities as the old bass: three pickups (bass and treble pickups covering all the strings, and a quad pickup which has a separate signal for each string); on each of the bass and treble pickups there are controls which enable him to select 1) the band-width of the filter, 2) the center frequency of the filter, 3) the kind of filter being used and 4) mix unequalized unfiltered direct sound with the filtered sound. The variety of sounds which can be achieved on the bass is the result of the many different combinations of these variables which can be used. The new bass has a frequency response with a crisper tone, and two quad pickups instead of one, the new one being a frequency-detector pickup. The main addition to the new bass is a Digital Decoding Circuit such that ten push buttons on the bass allow Phil to select any one of sixteen quad spatial arrangements of his speakers, and eight in stereo mode

The bass guitar system has two columns of fifteen inch tranducers stacked 18 high. Four power amplifiers are used as the bass requires more power for equal loudness. Since teh instrument has the capability to operate with individual outputs on each of the four strings, the array can be fed in this manner which makes it possible to play chords on the bass without intermodulation.
36 15" speakers! It's no wonder people who went to Watkins Glen say that the sound was crystal clear from half a mile away.

Oh wait, Watkins Glen was 1973, so they didn't have the full Wall yet. They must have been using some other crazy PA for that show.

Juaguocio fucked around with this message at Mar 24, 2015 around 07:31

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Ha, I never realized those doofy mics were actually two out of phase omni's.

I wonder how worth it really was to have this amazing system , only to have the vocals sound like poo poo all time.

Noise Machine
Dec 3, 2005

Today is a good day to save.



Fun Shoe

Are there any shows that have the Wall and are of high quality to actually hear it well? I'm enough of a nerd that I'm more interested in actually hearing this thing in action rather than a good dead show.

e: but if it's a kickin' show then that's not bad either

Juaguocio
Jun 5, 2005

Oh, David...


Noise Machine posted:

Are there any shows that have the Wall and are of high quality to actually hear it well? I'm enough of a nerd that I'm more interested in actually hearing this thing in action rather than a good dead show.

e: but if it's a kickin' show then that's not bad either

I really like the "matrix" versions of 1974 shows that combine soundboard and audience recordings. Check out the Eyes and Playing->Scarlet->Playing from 08/06/74, or the Jam->Ship of Fools and Dark Star->Spanish Jam->U.S. Blues from 06/23/74.

Planet X
Dec 10, 2003

GOOD MORNING

Yiggy posted:

Can someone explain to me why Billy hates John K?

Where'd you hear this?

Yiggy
Sep 12, 2004

"Imagination is not enough. You have to have knowledge too, and an experience of the oddity of life."


Planet X posted:

Where'd you hear this?

He maligned Furthur and their choice of John K quite a bit over the years. It seems Billy wanted a lead man that didn't hone his chops aping someone else's style, no matter how skilled he may have become at doing it (both in his own right as an improvisational instrumentalist and at mimicking the one style everyone has been aching to replace since its death).

Yiggy fucked around with this message at Mar 28, 2015 around 14:29

BigFactory
Sep 17, 2002



John K was the best part of furthur and Bobby was basically the worst.

Llyr
Mar 24, 2010

Music is the best


Recent Dead fan here. I've listened to their studio albums from Workingman's Dead to Blues For Allah and now I want to try their live stuff. I'm finding it daunting though. I know Europe '72 is recommended but I prefer the songs off Allah & Flood. Also, which Europe album do I get? The one that is a mix of the tour or one of the complete shows? Since I love the 73-75 materiel, any live show recommendations?

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Llyr posted:

Recent Dead fan here. I've listened to their studio albums from Workingman's Dead to Blues For Allah and now I want to try their live stuff. I'm finding it daunting though. I know Europe '72 is recommended but I prefer the songs off Allah & Flood. Also, which Europe album do I get? The one that is a mix of the tour or one of the complete shows? Since I love the 73-75 materiel, any live show recommendations?

There's an official release called "One from the Vault" it's mostly stuff from Allah and Flood, best recorded versions of "Eyes" "Help/Slip/Frank", "Crazy Fingers". Easily my favorite Dead Show. The playing is incredibly on point.

algebra testes
Mar 5, 2011

Step 3: I re-examine my personal biases



Lipstick Apathy

Llyr posted:

Recent Dead fan here. I've listened to their studio albums from Workingman's Dead to Blues For Allah and now I want to try their live stuff. I'm finding it daunting though. I know Europe '72 is recommended but I prefer the songs off Allah & Flood. Also, which Europe album do I get? The one that is a mix of the tour or one of the complete shows? Since I love the 73-75 materiel, any live show recommendations?

From '73 (which includes Flood material) Dick's Picks 19 & 28

For Blues Material, anything from ~ May '77 is great, so Dick's Picks 29

In regards to Europe '72, the Album Europe '72 is a nice collection of bit and pieces so that's a good starting point.

All of which, afaik, is on Spotify so that's an easy place to start.

Yiggy
Sep 12, 2004

"Imagination is not enough. You have to have knowledge too, and an experience of the oddity of life."


We listen to old dead sets all day at work. My manager is partial to late 80's shows but all the MIDI stuff kind of grates on me a little. My sweet spot right now is December 1977. 12/26 is great. Cow Palace NYE is one of my favorite live CD releases.

Juaguocio
Jun 5, 2005

Oh, David...


Llyr posted:

Recent Dead fan here. I've listened to their studio albums from Workingman's Dead to Blues For Allah and now I want to try their live stuff. I'm finding it daunting though. I know Europe '72 is recommended but I prefer the songs off Allah & Flood. Also, which Europe album do I get? The one that is a mix of the tour or one of the complete shows? Since I love the 73-75 materiel, any live show recommendations?

I made an effort post about Europe '72 a while ago: http://forums.somethingawful.com/sh...0#post427281283

The compilation albums are a good introduction, but if you want to get into complete shows (which you should), I'd recommend April 8th or May 26th.

Septic Knothead
Jul 23, 2009

Boris S Wart
The Second Meanest Man In The World


Yiggy posted:

We listen to old dead sets all day at work. My manager is partial to late 80's shows but all the MIDI stuff kind of grates on me a little. My sweet spot right now is December 1977. 12/26 is great. Cow Palace NYE is one of my favorite live CD releases.

Is that NYE' 76 into '77 and has a rather strange "Playin' In The Band?" I remember liking that one quite a bit. I'd also like to put in a plug for 1976 shows in general. Mickey was being integrated back into the band and the tempos were slower than normal on some shows. There are some great NFA -> St. Stephens in 1976 and I seem to recall a super long Slipknot! from Portland that year. Give '76 a shot if you have a chance.

1000 umbrellas
Aug 25, 2005

We thought we'd base our civilization upon yours, 'cause you're the smartest animals on earth, now ain't you?

Short interview with Bill Kreutzmann on NPR's Morning Edition in promotion of a new memoir:
http://www.npr.org/2015/05/12/40422...zmann-dont-rush

Nothing surprising, but he sounds well and it's nice to hear from a lesser-heard voice.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


1000 umbrellas posted:

Short interview with Bill Kreutzmann on NPR's Morning Edition in promotion of a new memoir:
http://www.npr.org/2015/05/12/40422...zmann-dont-rush

Nothing surprising, but he sounds well and it's nice to hear from a lesser-heard voice.

That interview cemented a couple things I'd always thought:

1. Cocaine ruined The Dead

2. He's the second coolest member

Juaguocio
Jun 5, 2005

Oh, David...


I found Billy's book at the library today. On a quick flip-through, it seems pretty well written, and has a lot more detail than other Dead books I've read.

algebra testes
Mar 5, 2011

Step 3: I re-examine my personal biases



Lipstick Apathy

Hollis Brownsound posted:

That interview cemented a couple things I'd always thought:

1. Cocaine ruined The Dead

'77 was the broke and strung out on coke year, which is what makes the music being so good so incredible.

Juaguocio
Jun 5, 2005

Oh, David...


I'm really enjoying Deal so far. After the introduction, the co-author pretty much gets out of the way and lets Billy ramble about whatever, so reading the book is kind of like hanging out and listening to him tell stories. The phrase "a lot of acid" pops up literally dozens of times.

algebra testes
Mar 5, 2011

Step 3: I re-examine my personal biases



Lipstick Apathy

Juaguocio posted:

I'm really enjoying Deal so far. After the introduction, the co-author pretty much gets out of the way and lets Billy ramble about whatever, so reading the book is kind of like hanging out and listening to him tell stories. The phrase "a lot of acid" pops up literally dozens of times.

Let me guess the words "we never really did" are not the ones immediately preceding?

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Juaguocio posted:

I'm really enjoying Deal so far. After the introduction, the co-author pretty much gets out of the way and lets Billy ramble about whatever, so reading the book is kind of like hanging out and listening to him tell stories. The phrase "a lot of acid" pops up literally dozens of times.

I love the part in the NPR interview in which he calls acid his "college experience".

Blast Fantasto
Sep 17, 2007

USAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!


Speaking of books, I'm reading through this right now and it's very good.



It's a bit boilerplate history at the beginning, but then the chapters take an interesting structure. Each chapter is titled after a specific date and it tells the band story through those chosen dates/shows.

Yiggy
Sep 12, 2004

"Imagination is not enough. You have to have knowledge too, and an experience of the oddity of life."


Bookchat. The Grateful Dead Reader is an edited volume of interviews, articles, fan publications and ephemera published by oxford university press. Its a good read. Some of the stuff is chaff but most is good. One of my favorites was an old relix insert called Ouroboros that detailed the financial breakdown circa '77 of the grateful dead operation from touring staff, ticket sales, production and equipment, transportation, etc. A few good Jerry interviews. Some history.

Final Blog Entry
Jun 23, 2006

"Love us with money or we'll hate you with hammers!"

There's a new Bob Weir documentary on Netflix streaming called The Other One. Nothing groundbreaking in it, but it's a good watch. A bit about Bob's early life and a Bob-centric telling of the band's journey and his relationship with Jerry. Lots of archival footage and new interviews with Bob and others.

Septic Knothead
Jul 23, 2009

Boris S Wart
The Second Meanest Man In The World


Final Blog Entry posted:

There's a new Bob Weir documentary on Netflix streaming called The Other One. Nothing groundbreaking in it, but it's a good watch. A bit about Bob's early life and a Bob-centric telling of the band's journey and his relationship with Jerry. Lots of archival footage and new interviews with Bob and others.

Was there any mention of the Mickey and the Hartbeats era? I always wondered what Bobby and Pigpen thought of that.

Final Blog Entry
Jun 23, 2006

"Love us with money or we'll hate you with hammers!"

Huh, I was completely unaware of that piece of Dead history. It wasn't mentioned, but it would certainly be interesting to hear Bob talk about.

OniKun
Jul 23, 2003

Cheap Mexican Labor since the late 80's

The Other One (Netflix Documentary) was great, but I had some problems with it.

Obviously, like Phil's book, the history has been a tad whitewashed for the sake of his family and kids. I mean, they still go in to how Bobby was basically the only attractive guy in the band and got laid constantly, but they skip over him getting kicked out of the band for a period of time, and other things.

Somehow they managed to interview Phil, Mickey, and Billy, but only get a few usable lines out of them. I really have a hard time believing that all Phil has to say is "He had killer weed!" and I don't understand why we had to listen to Peter Coyote wax nostalgic about the 60's, nor do I get why we had so much Sammy Hagar. Even Mike Gordon of Phish only gets less than ten seconds - but Sammy Hagar is on screen for a ton of time?

Bobby implies that the hero worship of Garcia was partially what lead Jerry to heavy Heroin use, and then the documentary spends 30 minutes covering the end of Jerry's life. I thought this whole section was pretty fluffy and useless, and I would have way rather have heard Bobby talk about something, or even maybe have one of his long-term bandmates say more than how good Bobby's weed was.

I did really appreciate how the documentary went into detail about his rhythm work, though. I hear way too many people insulting Bobby's guitar playing during shows, people without any musical background or understanding. He's an insanely talented rhythm player who, like Sammy Hagar said, seems to know every possible inversion of every drat chord in existence. He had an impeccable sense of timing, too.

It's a drat fine documentary, all things considered. I really enjoyed it, and that psychedelic cartoon for The Other One (the song) was great.

Juaguocio
Jun 5, 2005

Oh, David...


LordPants posted:

Let me guess the words "we never really did" are not the ones immediately preceding?

Anyone who hung around with Owsley got really, really, really high. Even if they didn't want to.

Like at the Playboy After Dark taping, where he decided to dose the coffee machine: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qsL3X6ARgVI

Billy says that Hefner couldn't put two words together when he tried to talk to them after the show.

algebra testes
Mar 5, 2011

Step 3: I re-examine my personal biases



Lipstick Apathy

OniKun posted:

It's a drat fine documentary, all things considered. I really enjoyed it, and that psychedelic cartoon for The Other One (the song) was great.

It's tough that any documentary about the Dead is always going to end up about Jerry.

Great doco though, Jerry underwater is

Yiggy
Sep 12, 2004

"Imagination is not enough. You have to have knowledge too, and an experience of the oddity of life."


I've been working in a hippy esque shop for a couple of months now and the only thing they play all day is old grateful dead tapes from an extensive collection that got converted into digital. My increased and prolonged exposure to the dead from all eras has given me the chance to realize that alot of Bobby's songs are p bad.

BigFactory
Sep 17, 2002



Yup. So are a lot of pigpen songs, Donna songs, and Brent songs.

Planet X
Dec 10, 2003

GOOD MORNING

I thought the fact that Lee Ranaldo of Sonic Youth cited Bob Weir's playing so highly was interesting.

Juaguocio
Jun 5, 2005

Oh, David...


Billy has some interesting insights into the songwriting process in his book. In a nutshell:

-Phil's songs were the most complex and difficult to figure out, but Billy feels like there's too much theory and not enough swing in many of them.
-Bobby wrote some good songs, but a lot of clunkers too. Billy points to "Lost Sailor" as one of his least favorites.
-Brent's songs were fun to play, but Billy doesn't think they were really Dead tunes.
-Jerry's songs were always the best. He would have all the fundamental grooves worked out before he brought anything to rehearsal, and Billy would know what he needed to play right away. He says playing Jerry's songs was like being conducted by the music itself.

Yiggy
Sep 12, 2004

"Imagination is not enough. You have to have knowledge too, and an experience of the oddity of life."


Come on Billy this one is way worse

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5MWb7fXOgSY

Blast Fantasto
Sep 17, 2007

USAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!


Sorry, I don't buy in to the whole Bob Weir sucks thing. Like the entirety of Ace is killer + Sugar Magnolia + his singing the Marty Robbins and Merle Haggard covers.

Jerry is definitely the most talented, but it wouldn't be the Dead without Bob Weir.

BigFactory
Sep 17, 2002



Blast Fantasto posted:

Sorry, I don't buy in to the whole Bob Weir sucks thing. Like the entirety of Ace is killer + Sugar Magnolia + his singing the Marty Robbins and Merle Haggard covers.

Jerry is definitely the most talented, but it wouldn't be the Dead without Bob Weir.

You never would have heard them if it was the Bobby Weir Jug Band. They would have all had straight jobs by '68.

algebra testes
Mar 5, 2011

Step 3: I re-examine my personal biases



Lipstick Apathy

Blast Fantasto posted:

Sorry, I don't buy in to the whole Bob Weir sucks thing. Like the entirety of Ace is killer + Sugar Magnolia + his singing the Marty Robbins and Merle Haggard covers.

Jerry is definitely the most talented, but it wouldn't be the Dead without Bob Weir.

I am with you, and I think Music Never Stops is some hot poo poo as well.

But c'mon, Lost Sailor, Throwing Stones, Saint of Circumstance are all pretty lame imo.

BigFactory
Sep 17, 2002



Bobby's bad songs are offensively bad, where Jerry's bad songs are just boring for the most part. Its his vocal schtick in concert that puts him over the top.

algebra testes
Mar 5, 2011

Step 3: I re-examine my personal biases



Lipstick Apathy

I also am an unabashed fan of "Easy to Love you" and whatever the other Go To Heaven Brent tune was.

BigFactory
Sep 17, 2002



LordPants posted:

I also am an unabashed fan of "Easy to Love you" and whatever the other Go To Heaven Brent tune was.

I love Brent tunes but I'll also admit that most of them suck. Easy to Love You might be the best one. Tons of Steel is the worst. Most of them could have been Richard Marx songs.

BigFactory fucked around with this message at May 29, 2015 around 15:20

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


"Looks Like Rain" and "Black Throated Wind" own a special place in the category of; how fast can I skip this song?

Also yeah Brent songs are pretty terrible, but I don't listen to too much Brent era dead so it doesn't really bother me all that much.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply
«17 »