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Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


I grew up the son a Deadhead, subsequently became even a bigger Deadhead and hope some day to be able to ruin my child's life too!

The Dead played RFK in DC on June 25th 1995, my 12th birthday. My dad got 4 tickets for himself, my older brother, one of by brother's friends and me. My mom vetoed who said "they are never going to die, you'll be able to see them when you get older". I think we all know what happened 2 months later.

But the older I get I realize I am really more of a Jerry Garcia fan than a Deadhead. I really hate to go see these Grateful Dead spinoff bands go out and prostitute the legacy that Jerry killed himself cultivating. I'm sick to death of going and seeing the disgusting lot kids commingling with weekend warrior yuppies.

I'm also really not too into much after about '76. Something happened during the '75 hiatus, I guess I just kind of feel like they lost some sort of rawness, I miss the Merle Haggard tunes and the silly psychedelic tunes like "St Stephen", "Cosmic Charlie", and "New Potato Caboose".

I have another controversial Dead opinion. I don't like Mickey Hart. I mean I like him as a person and Planet Drum is ok but I actually like a lot more of the shows when he was gone. I feel like Billy is tighter.

Also I like studio Dead. No I Love studio Dead. American Beauty deserves to be in the same conversation as Kind of Blue or Dark Side of the Moon. Anthem of the Sun is also brilliant. I even like the albums most other Deadheads don't like such as Wake of the Flood and Blues for Allah. Also Garcia from '72 is my all time favorite album.

Hollis Brownsound fucked around with this message at Aug 9, 2013 around 01:52

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Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Roark posted:

Added Setlists to the OP - I completely blanked out on that. And seconding Dick's Pick's 19; I had that on in my office the other day while working, and it's a super tight show.


I always feel like Blues for Allah is severely underrated. The studio version of Franklin's Tower is very solid, and I have a weird soft-spot for the almost never played live title track.

The studio version of "Crazy Fingers" is soooo good.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


BigFactory posted:

It's a good album all around. Spirit and Sage isn't much of a song and the title track doesn't really go anywhere, but King Solomon's Marbles is great, and Music Never Stopped is about as good a Bobby song as you'd want to listen to. Yeah, there's only one Bobby song, right? That's gotta put it in top-5 status alone.

My favorite Bobby tune will always be a 3way tie, "Big River", "Me and my Uncle", or "Jack Straw". My least favorite will always and forever be "Feel like a Stranger" with "Black Throated Wind" coming in a close 2nd.

I've done a lot of bitching here so here's my favorite show. August 13th 1975. This will always be my ultimate Help>Slip>Frank, favorite versions of Big River, Crazy Fingers, and Eyes. This show really might be height of Jerry's playing.
http://www.setlists.net/?show_id=0949

It's available as a commercial release as One from the Vault.

I'm also a really big fan of early Dead, I love 69 shows, "Death Don't Have no Mercy", "Lovelight", "Dark Star" ect.... They really lost something with Pig Pen

Hollis Brownsound fucked around with this message at Aug 9, 2013 around 19:39

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


LordPants posted:

Hey I think ACE is like one of the best "Grateful Dead" albums ever writ. I guess I'm in the minority there...

"They're not people son, they're Bobby fans" - My Dad

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


BigFactory posted:

Pigpen was the 2nd best keys player in the dead. Hornsby was the best. Keith would be 2nd but he brought Donna along.

Pigpen might have been the 2nd best keys player but he's also the 2nd favorite vocalist, after Jerry. I love the riffing he does in tunes like "Love Light" and "Good Lovin", some of that stuff is absolutely hilarious, theres a 71 east Fillmore show where he goes on a 5 minute riff about picking up a prostitute in New York.

Edit: I also love pre 1970 Dead and you're right Mickey was a big part of the sound back then but I just feel like as the years went on he got lazier and the drums in general got kinda bland. 8-24-1968 has the single greatest performance of "Death Don't have no Mercy", it's just soul crushing, in a good way. I can't find it on Archive.org but it's commercially available as "Two from the Vault"

Hollis Brownsound fucked around with this message at Aug 14, 2013 around 22:09

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


elentar posted:

That Veneta show is no joke, well overdue for the vault treatment. Everything they learned during the Europe Tour went into those sets, and it shows. Nearly every version is a potential best ever, including of course the soul-searing Dark Star.

I've never heard that show but I' really interested in "He's Gone", it's one of my favorite tunes and they didn't play it much.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


h_double posted:

I can't remember if "Pigpen Killed Brent" was actual t-shirt I saw or just an idea I had. Arguably my favorite Dead t-shirt I DID see was just big block letters "IF I HAD A SHOTGUN, I'D BLOW YOU STRAIGHT TO HELL".

I LOVE bootleg Dead shirts. I had a Box Of Rain shirt as a kid that I adored, and similiar shirt to the CandyMan shirt that just said "PLEASE DON"T MURDER ME" that I wore throughout high school.

h_double posted:

Do you mean just their earlier (66-67) shows, or are there some later shows where it's just Bill?

The later shows around 72

h_double posted:

What? Wake of the Flood and Blues For Allah are spectacular. I know they're a little obscure but I didn't realize there were people who straight up disliked them. The only album I used to flat out dislike was Shakedown Street, but even that I've come to have a soft spot for.

I like most of Shakedown Street, the first dance at my wedding was to "If I Had the World to Give". I just really don't care for the song itself. I mean it's not the song itself I guess but I hate that it's the only Dead song people put on the Jukebox at bars.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Can we also talk about how great a lyricist Robert Hunter was? I am of the opinion that he was every bit as good as either Bob Dylan or Paul Simon. Just reading the lyrics to "Ripple" can send chills up my spine.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Cemetry Gator posted:

Box of Rain has such great lyrics. I mean, the lyrics are so layered. It's very oblique without being so cryptic that it sounds like bad poetry. If I could write a line as good as "This was all a dreamed we dreamed one afternoon" I'd be satisfied. But a whole song?

Box of Rain would be a perfect song is the mix was better.

And maybe if Phil didn't sing it.

Brokedown Palace is also a very nearly perfect song

quote:

River gonna take me
Sing me sweet and sleepy
Sing me sweet and sleepy
all the way back back home
It's a far gone lullaby
sung many years ago
Mama, Mama, many worlds I've come
since I first left home

Robert Hunter really understood American folk tradition and lore and retells it in such a meaningful way. Brokedown Palace is in itself a Steinbeck reference, "Brown eyed Women" is an amazing retelling of Prohibition/Great Depression Era in the United States

quote:

In 1920 when he stepped to the bar
he drank to the dregs of the whiskey jar
In 1930 when the Wall caved in
he paid his way selling red eye gin

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


The Fresh Prince posted:

Ugh, Lesh deserved to sing Box of Rain.

I don't really care that he sang the song, I just feel like Phil was the least strong singer in the Dead from an objective standpoint and it would probably have been a better sounding recording with Jerry singing it. Part of being a Deadhead is getting to make fun of Phil, he is goofy motherfucker and a terrible singer but we all still love him

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


h_double posted:

Donna vocals.


Well yeah for certain that album is weird iteration of the Dead, you can practically hear cocaine coming out of the speakers and France is by far, the worst Dead tune ever. I grew up on Working Man's Dead (another criminally under rated album) and American Beauty. My first foray into Arista era Dead (aside from Touch of Grey) was Terrapin Station , which is a good bridge to Shakedown Street but is an infinitely better album. Terrapin Station is another album that never really gets the recognition it deserves, the 1st side suite is amazing, Prophet and Fire are both great on there and I always love Sampson and Delilah.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


I've really been in love with "Row Jimmy" recently, recommend me good versions of it!

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


deChippewa posted:

I have never listened to much of The Grateful Dead specifically but Jerry Garcia? Yes. I think the Pizza Tapes contain some of his finest work as a musician (and drat Tony Rice and David Grisman? The perfect trio.). I like to play the guitar myself and when I listen to all three of them...well the instruments/hands do the talking(Also makes me wish I knew my way around a mandolin). If i had to pick one song though it would be their version of House of the Rising sun, and I could have sworn for the longest time Bob Dylan's version was my favorite. (Here's that Rising Sun by the way https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QflkWyrvxgA)

I agree but I'll amend it by saying that his some of his finest work with David Grisman. But I prefer Shady Grove or Jerry Garcia and David Grisman over The Pizza Tapes. I would honestly like the Pizza Tapesbetter without Tony Rice, listen to Knockin on Heaven's Door https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UbpANkYhjHM. Jerry's solo is melodic and tasteful then Tony Rice comes in his solo is just so garish.

Also this might be the best thing ever recorded:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mj2V63dSQtc

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


I guess this a good time to post my favorite youtube video of all time https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcJUuxv8oCE.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Juaguocio posted:

I've heard that some joker dosed the Mansion that night, and looking at Mickey, it's not hard to imagine.

It was Owsley, he was mad that the Playboy After Dark sound guys wouldn't let him run sound for the band. At least that's Rock Scully's story from "Living with the Dead", which if you all haven't read is well worth reading.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


h_double posted:

The part at the end with the audience dancing to Lovelight is the best part.

Pigpen singing Lovelight is such a heartbreaking thing of beauty.

The whole segment is actually on youtube and is also pretty drat awesome. Jerry and Tom playing "Mountains of the Moon" is awesome and just the thought of Jerry talking to Hef is hilarious. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wx6OAfvlxTs

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


BigFactory posted:

Beats Ratdog.

What doesn't?

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Roark posted:

The Donna Jean Godchaux Band. It is bad.

BigFactory posted:

Vince Welnick's Missing Man Formation? They sound really bad these days.

I was totally unaware of the existence of either of these groups, touche.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


BigFactory posted:

Furthur's actually pretty good, especially if you like hearing Grateful Dead songs played really, really slowly.

My only other criticism is that they tend to jam out every song, even songs the Dead used to play pretty straight, and while I get that they're not trying to be a cover band, jamming isn't what they do best. But it's still a fun night out. Beats Ratdog.

Honestly this is my biggest criticism of pretty much all the Dead spinoffs and "Jam Bands" in general. The Grateful Dead weren't a jam band, they were a rock band that could "jam". The biggest difference is that they jammed on good songs, they didn't write songs to be a vehicle for jamming, like Moe. I might argue that Phish is less "jammy" but let's face it, Phish songs are loving dumb (this coming from a huge high school Phish fan). They have about 5 good songs and about 100 dumb as gently caress circus sounding songs.

Good Phish Songs:
1. Fast Enough For You
2. Bouncing around the Room
3. Billy Breathes
4. Roggae

Every single other song has such dumb lyrics that it completely distracts me from the musical performance aspect.

Moe songs I remember the name of:
?

The Grateful Dead started with writing good songs that people can connect with, then started jamming them out. Not writing songs over 15 minute jams.

edit: Sorry I just loving hate Jam Bands

Hollis Brownsound fucked around with this message at Sep 24, 2013 around 00:44

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


BigFactory posted:

Phish is better prog rock band than a jam band. Jam bands are pretty stupid. Billy Breathes is a good song, though, and is neither prog rock nor jam band stuff.

I'll agree with all of that. Honestly I wouldn't dislike Phish quite so much if people would stop comparing them to the Dead.

Anyway I'm off the hate train.

Robert Hunter just won a lifetime achievement award from The Americana Music Association http://www.dead.net/features/americ...ievement-award, which is great but I really think he needs to be held on the same level as Bob Dylan.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Juaguocio posted:

"So blow your whistle, hate train
take me far on down the track..."

I've been into September '72 big time lately. The boys were playing tight and intense during this period, and tight intensity is where it's at for me. My favorites so far are the 17th and 21st, which appear on Dick's Picks 23 and 36, respectively.

I generally agree, I really like 70-72 a lot and the few 75 shows. But I'm really digging some of the sleepy/dreamy late 70's stuff. I especially have been digging some of the really slow versions of St. Stephen from the late 70's.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Roark posted:

I'm obviously a huge early 70s fan, but I've actually been getting into the late 80s/early 90s stuff. It's really uneven, but the stuff that's great is great (although the stuff that's bad is really bad). I've really been digging the March 1990 shows in Maryland, and there's some great Scarlet Begonias>Estimated Prophet jams (not songs that I'm usually a huge fan of).

Yeah it's easy to hear a bad late 80s-90s Dead Show and get turned off to the whole period, which sadly did happen to me for awhile.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Waltzing Along posted:

Just read through the thread and kind of sad to see so little mention of Brent.

One could argue that the end of the Brent run, after Jerry got off heroin, was the high point in their career. From the end of 87 till brents death the music just got better and better. Without a Net was recorded during the fall 89 and spring 90 tours and includes the wonderful Branford Marsalis Eyes of the World.

They had played with Miles in the early 70s, but he was miles ahead of them and they could barely keep up. But by the time March 29, 1990 rolled around, they had progressed a great deal as musicians and created something wonderful.

Even the band themselves view that time as something special. If you look at pictures and video they look happier and healthier. Unfortunately, after Brents wife left him, he crashed and the band was never the same again.

Yeah but his songs were terrible.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2E9pl2YHDdk

But really they're not a "weird" band but check the album"Anthem of the Sun".

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Check out "Infrared Roses". It's a compilation of a bunch of "space" jams. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXJWpQ4wF9Q

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


BigFactory posted:

Yeah they all stink but that's the best of the worst. Tons of Steel might be the worst song in thier catalog. His covers kinda rule though. I'm thinking of a Dear Mr Fantasy maybe on without a net? that's really good.

That's truth.

I also don't really like his singing. I would have liked his voice by itself, he's got a nice gravely, bluesy sound and he's by far the best and harmonizing, but it just didn't mesh well with everyone else.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


RE Phish: Phuck Phish.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


trans fat posted:

Deadheads I've met in real life have seemed almost offended that I would dare to prefer studio Dead to live Dead on some occasions. Box of Rain is a perfect example of this, in that I've yet to hear a rendition of it that really, really captured what it has on American Beauty. Given how emotional and personal of a song it is, it disappoints me that I can't really hear some great soul-bearing jams. Please guide me, wiser Deadheads.

Honestly there are only a couple songs from "American Beauty" that I prefer live. "Truckin" and "Candyman" might be the only ones. But everything else on that album is so perfectly captured that I don't want to hear it any other way.

RE: Box of Rain, required Phil to sing live, that's all I really need to say.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


'Here Comes Sunshine' is a terribly underrated Dead tune.

I've been kind of been in off the Dead kick recently, which I frankly kind of needed. But I'm feeling the itch again and it might be time to start exploring some of the 80s stuff I've tuned out.

Anecdotally, I was at local bar in Washington PA at noon, when a bunch of oil field workers put on the Without a Net version of 'Eyes', we got to talking about the Dead bought me and my boss a beer. It was sweet.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


BigFactory posted:

Donna's still kickin'.

Proof that their is no god.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


LordPants posted:

https://archive.org/details/gd1968-...59.sbeok.flac16

Todays listening for me. I wasn't taken aback by the start, but everything from the other one onwards was

Honestly 68 might be my favorite year. It's dumb to try to say any year is objectively better than another but I love the early experimental Dead and I'll never get enough The Eleven-> Death Don't Have no Mercy

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


I picked up the 90' Nassau Auditorium show. It's pretty good, it's got some of the symptoms of late era Dead that kinda turn me off, cheesy keyboard patches, Brent's voice, the sound of Death creeping up on Jerry. I'm kinda unimpressed with Branford, he's good sounding on Bird Song and Dark Star, but he KILLS on Lovelight. That's the groovinest Lovelight they played for probably 15 years prior.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


I'll try to dig it up, but there is a really funny story about John Cippolina from Quicksilver taking forever to tune between every song because of his constant use of the bigsby on his SG and the audience not realizing that it wasn't a song.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Personally, I have zero interest in watching Trey play with the Dead, it's so hippy dippy crossover for me, and I hate Phish and Trey by extension. All my personal feelings aside, I just also don't think his sound/style really mesh all that well.

I love Phil, Mickey, Bobby, Bill, but I still feel there is no Grateful Dead without Jerry. I'm content to continue to listen to old shows and remember them before they were a novelty act.

Septic Knothead posted:

Has anyone actually come out and said what's the deal with Bobby? Heroin? I mean say what you will about Jerry, he never collapsed on stage.

Correct if I'm wrong but I thought Bobby was the first member to get clean, and has been clean for quite a long time.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Arms_Akimbo posted:

Celebrating GD50 in the gooniest way possible.



I thought that was sheet of acid first, which didn't really seem that goony at all, but you're right, it is goony.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Juaguocio posted:

Goddamn, Pigpen died 42 years ago today. I need to dig up some classic Pig tracks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AboYGlsrFw

"Pigpen, did you say gently caress?"
"I SAID gently caress!"

Pigpen wasn't the most musically accomplished member of the Dead but if you read Rock Scully's book, he seems to think that Pigpen may have been the most influential early on and the most responsible for their image and persona.

When he died the Dead really lost that rough edge that I think made them so great in the 68-72 period.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Ha, I never realized those doofy mics were actually two out of phase omni's.

I wonder how worth it really was to have this amazing system , only to have the vocals sound like poo poo all time.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Llyr posted:

Recent Dead fan here. I've listened to their studio albums from Workingman's Dead to Blues For Allah and now I want to try their live stuff. I'm finding it daunting though. I know Europe '72 is recommended but I prefer the songs off Allah & Flood. Also, which Europe album do I get? The one that is a mix of the tour or one of the complete shows? Since I love the 73-75 materiel, any live show recommendations?

There's an official release called "One from the Vault" it's mostly stuff from Allah and Flood, best recorded versions of "Eyes" "Help/Slip/Frank", "Crazy Fingers". Easily my favorite Dead Show. The playing is incredibly on point.

Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


1000 umbrellas posted:

Short interview with Bill Kreutzmann on NPR's Morning Edition in promotion of a new memoir:
http://www.npr.org/2015/05/12/40422...zmann-dont-rush

Nothing surprising, but he sounds well and it's nice to hear from a lesser-heard voice.

That interview cemented a couple things I'd always thought:

1. Cocaine ruined The Dead

2. He's the second coolest member

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Hollis Brownsound
Apr 2, 2009

by Lowtax


Juaguocio posted:

I'm really enjoying Deal so far. After the introduction, the co-author pretty much gets out of the way and lets Billy ramble about whatever, so reading the book is kind of like hanging out and listening to him tell stories. The phrase "a lot of acid" pops up literally dozens of times.

I love the part in the NPR interview in which he calls acid his "college experience".

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