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soggybagel
Aug 6, 2006

I'm A Lonely Boy


I haven't watched a pregame show since around 2009 and my life is better because of it. Also living on the west coast is a curse and a blessing. I'm a fat slob so I like sleeping in. So sometimes a Sunday 10am wake up is too early. But it's nice to have the 2nd game slate done and its only 3:30pm.

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Anals of History
Jul 29, 2003



Sash! posted:

The NFL shows don't seem to hit this one, but the college does: why should I care what Washed Up Coach or Washed Up Player that Couldn't Hack It in the NFL thinks? Haven't the demonstrated that they are objectively bad at football?

Was wondering that yesterday with a graphic that covered Gerry DiNardo's coaching background to somehow establish his credibility. Left off that stint in the XFL for some reason.

R.D. Mangles
Jan 10, 2004



I'd pay a buck to get Matt Millen as a draft day analyst.

FuzzySkinner
May 23, 2012



Whenever I hear Tom Rinaldi's voice, I generally change the channel.

I just don't get the appeal of the "Oprah" human interest story.

Captain Internet
Apr 20, 2005

HOTLANTA
IS WHERE YOUR HEART IS


FuzzySkinner posted:

Whenever I hear Tom Rinaldi's voice, I generally change the channel.

I just don't get the appeal of the "Oprah" human interest story.

Human interest stories are specifically not aimed at the fan of the sport in question but rather casual fans or non-fans. They are used to garner interest in a competition that the viewer has no stake in. This allows a spectator to follow a sport for a story-line without knowing the nuances or rules of the game. It is a gateway used to attract more interest.

See the Superbowl where there is an entire media week that focuses on storytelling and less on analysis. Hell, I was rooting for France in a World Cup a few years back even though I don't follow footie because I like the character of Zidane that the announcers presented to me.

Short answer, they aren't for you.

zakharov
Nov 30, 2002

Tater Love


Crosspost from the Journalism thread


Olbermann tears apart that idiot columnist who wrote about those greedy NFL players.

BIZORT
Jan 24, 2003



Isn't the only reason you're in an announcing or pre-game booth as an ex-coach because you're a washout? There are the odd few that leave for their own reasons but they're almost all just failures that someone thinks speaks well

Washout or not, they still know more than you do

jeffersonlives
Jul 22, 2007

"Mathewson pitched against Cincinnati yesterday. Another way of putting it is that Cincinnati lost a game of baseball."


BIZORT posted:

Washout or not, they still know more than you do

Depending on who "you" is they often don't; Keith Olbermann, for example, is legitimately more qualified to talk about baseball history than nearly anyone on the planet.

Crazy Ted
Jul 29, 2003



jeffersonlives posted:

Depending on who "you" is they often don't; Keith Olbermann, for example, is legitimately more qualified to talk about baseball history than nearly anyone on the planet.
I think Bizort was referring more to things like knowing the ins and outs of playing, coaching, or front office work.

AsInHowe
Jan 11, 2007

Goal, assist, fight.

Sash! posted:

The NFL shows don't seem to hit this one, but the college does: why should I care what Washed Up Coach or Washed Up Player that Couldn't Hack It in the NFL thinks? Haven't the demonstrated that they are objectively bad at football?

Matt Millen is a lead game analyst for ESPN, despite being a distinct failure at everything he touches post-retirement. Yet, bizarrely enough, he's still talking about nothing every week. It's amazing.

BIZORT posted:

Isn't the only reason you're in an announcing or pre-game booth as an ex-coach because you're a washout? There are the odd few that leave for their own reasons but they're almost all just failures that someone thinks speaks well

Washout or not, they still know more than you do

Sometimes, guys just don't want to get back into coaching. Look at Jon Gruden. That guy has a great gig on Monday nights, and it's pretty much just preparing for 17 broadcasts a year (plus preseason), instead of the total grind that is basically a job requirement for NFL head coaching. Why kill yourself once you've already proven your skills? Why not just do a completely fun job that's far more enjoyable?

The same goes for Jimmy Johnson.

haljordan
Oct 22, 2004

the corpse of god is love.


College Slice

AsInHowe posted:

Matt Millen is a lead game analyst for ESPN, despite being a distinct failure at everything he touches post-retirement. Yet, bizarrely enough, he's still talking about nothing every week. It's amazing.


Sometimes, guys just don't want to get back into coaching. Look at Jon Gruden. That guy has a great gig on Monday nights, and it's pretty much just preparing for 17 broadcasts a year (plus preseason), instead of the total grind that is basically a job requirement for NFL head coaching. Why kill yourself once you've already proven your skills? Why not just do a completely fun job that's far more enjoyable?

The same goes for Jimmy Johnson.

Jimmy Johnson has a great life. Hang out in Miami most of the year, do the broadcasting thing and hawk dong pills on the side.

Also it really is amazing to see coaches once they've retired because they no longer look like they're constantly on the verge of suffering a massive rage-induced stroke.

haljordan fucked around with this message at Sep 1, 2013 around 04:42

jeffersonlives
Jul 22, 2007

"Mathewson pitched against Cincinnati yesterday. Another way of putting it is that Cincinnati lost a game of baseball."


Crazy Ted posted:

I think Bizort was referring more to things like knowing the ins and outs of playing, coaching, or front office work.

Eh it still depends on what they're talking about and where their expertise is. A lot of coaches and managers at this point (especially the fired ones, which I suppose is what BIZORT was getting at) are behind the times on the strategic and informational stuff, since most major sports are evolving pretty quickly. Alternately, a lot of them are lovely at communicating their knowledge and just come across as cliche machines.

AsInHowe
Jan 11, 2007

Goal, assist, fight.

haljordan posted:

Jimmy Johnson has a great life. Hang out in Miami most of the year, do the broadcasting thing and hawk dong pills on the side.

Also it really is amazing to see coaches once they've retired because they no longer look like they're constantly on the verge of suffering a massive rage-induced stroke.

And with that great life, why would you give it all up to watch film for 16 hours a day?

I figure Jimmy actually "goes to work" 18-20 days out of the year, and that's just to a TV studio in LA. Great life.

haljordan
Oct 22, 2004

the corpse of god is love.


College Slice

AsInHowe posted:

And with that great life, why would you give it all up to watch film for 16 hours a day?

I figure Jimmy actually "goes to work" 18-20 days out of the year, and that's just to a TV studio in LA. Great life.

That's why I have a real hard time believing Bill Cowher would take another coaching job. I realize guys like him have that endless competitive drive, but he's already got a Superbowl ring. Why try to get back into that lifestyle now? Not like he's got anything left to prove.

I would like to see him stop making those horrid Time Warner commercials though.

LARGE THE HEAD
Sep 1, 2009

"Competitive greatness is when you play your best against the best."

"Learn as if you were to live forever; live as if you were to die tomorrow."

--John Wooden


Captain Internet posted:

Human interest stories are specifically not aimed at the fan of the sport in question but rather casual fans or non-fans. They are used to garner interest in a competition that the viewer has no stake in. This allows a spectator to follow a sport for a story-line without knowing the nuances or rules of the game. It is a gateway used to attract more interest.

See the Superbowl where there is an entire media week that focuses on storytelling and less on analysis. Hell, I was rooting for France in a World Cup a few years back even though I don't follow footie because I like the character of Zidane that the announcers presented to me.

Short answer, they aren't for you.

...which is why the Manti Te'o/Lennay Kekua thing garnered so much coverage on broadcasts. Here was a very high-profile, talented athlete who made up an entire story about a girlfriend dying of cancer. Sociopathic behavior makes for great TV.



e: Also I love this Gus Johnson call.

LARGE THE HEAD fucked around with this message at Sep 1, 2013 around 06:02

Grittybeard
Mar 29, 2010


AsInHowe posted:

And with that great life, why would you give it all up to watch film for 16 hours a day?

Gruden apparently does this even though he hasn't coached in years. He's probably weird by any definition of coach or announcer or human being though.

MustLoveContras
Feb 22, 2012

Win one for the Gipper!

The only time Joe Buck gets halfway excited is if it's a Cardinals game. I guess he casts so many games because he is "neutral" and doesn't piss off the fans of the other team like a homer announcer would. Nothing is worse than trying to watch a game and having to listen to the other teams biased announcers.

Anyway, everyone hates Joe Buck, but I have to like him somewhat because his dad was the voice of the Cards.

Now Dick Vitale on the other hand... I would rather not hear about the time he had dinner with Coach K or whatever during the middle of a basketball game. And those awful catch-phrases and he never stops shouting them out...

Man, I'm getting steamed just thinking about college ball... I also can't stand all the rear end kissing Bobby Knight gets from the other commentators. It's almost as if they are afraid of him. Oh yeah, and what's the deal with all the former Dukies on ESPN? Makes me sick I tell ya h'what.

Peanut President
Nov 5, 2008





I can't hate Vitale. I will never ever hate a commentator who is having fun calling a game.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?


Peanut President posted:

I can't hate Vitale. I will never ever hate a commentator who is having fun calling a game.

His heart is in the right place but in practice he's really bad.

Sash!
Mar 16, 2001



Anals of History posted:

Was wondering that yesterday with a graphic that covered Gerry DiNardo's coaching background to somehow establish his credibility. Left off that stint in the XFL for some reason.

He's actually the one that made me start thinking this.

I mean...if he's like "What the Wolverines need to do in the second half is X," I'm thinking "given how bad you were at Indiana, I'm not sure your course of action will be the correct one."

FuzzySkinner
May 23, 2012



jeffersonlives posted:

Depending on who "you" is they often don't; Keith Olbermann, for example, is legitimately more qualified to talk about baseball history than nearly anyone on the planet.

There's also a few "washouts" who indeed can be good analysts.

Sam Posey is a guy that did IndyCar color commentary during the 80's, and 90's. His career in the sport was less than spectacular to say the least (popular writer Robin Miller even said, "He talked more than he ever drove), but he was excellent in the booth. His knowledge and enthusiasm of auto racing made him an excellent commentator. Here's what he does now:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PjspoYmUc0

Jon Beekhuis is another one of those guys. He only raced in 15 Indy races in his career. He made a move to be a pit guy, and his knowledge of the technical side of the sport is pretty incredible. He even has the nickname "Professor B".

Compare that to Mario Andretti, who was an amazing driver, but just flat out awful in the booth.

haljordan
Oct 22, 2004

the corpse of god is love.


College Slice

MourningView posted:

His heart is in the right place but in practice he's really bad.

Hearing the phrase "Diaper Dandies" come out of his mouth really creeps me out for some reason.

Peanut President
Nov 5, 2008





MourningView posted:

His heart is in the right place but in practice he's really bad.

CHECK OUT THIS POST, BABY! THIS GUY IS A REAL PTPER! A DIAPER DANDY!

edit: B M O C BAY-BAY!

Crazy Ted
Jul 29, 2003



MourningView posted:

His heart is in the right place but in practice he's really bad.
He didn't really start off that loud and obnoxious either. If you can find clips of his very early days at ESPN, he gets excited but doesn't really shout or rant or anything like that. Then again, it probably helped that the first announcer Vitale worked with at ESPN had the production crew cut his mic during a game because the guy thought Vitale was talking too much.

I still can't believe he coached in the NBA. If I was one of his players, I think I would have killed him.

BIZORT
Jan 24, 2003



He's a normal guy that has a schtick. There's no way he talked like that to NBA players. He was a bad coach and none of his players respected him but still.

Opie and Anthony had him on the air once talking to him for a good 5 or 10 minutes telling him he wasn't on the air yet so he was just a regular guy and it was nice.

Joe Buck and Chris Berman annoy me more. Berman shoehorning those stupid nicknames in whenever he can and Buck acting like it pains him to watch a sporting event are a lot worse to me than a guy, who really does know his stuff, getting overexcited. He has dumb nicknames and schtick but that is literally all Berman has

BIZORT fucked around with this message at Sep 2, 2013 around 00:44

The 7th Guest
Dec 17, 2003



Ahahaha Craig James was fired after only a couple of days

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/co...orts-southwest/

quote:

SI.com has learned that the veteran broadcaster will no longer appear on the network. Fox Sports executives were not happy with the hire by the regional network, according to sources, and the hire had not been fully vetted at the highest levels of Fox Sports management. A formal agreement had not been finalized, even though James appeared on FSS on Saturday night. "Craig James will not be making any further appearances on Fox Sports Southwest's football coverage this season," said a Fox Sports spokesperson, when asked for a comment.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?


I'm sure Vitale is a super nice dude he's just not good at analyzing basketball games and is a parody of himself. I remember one game a couple years ago where a player dove over the table for a lose ball and clobbered his partner, forcing Vitale to go it alone for the two most horrifying minutes ESPN has ever broadcast. He does seem like he's having fun though so good for him.

LARGE THE HEAD
Sep 1, 2009

"Competitive greatness is when you play your best against the best."

"Learn as if you were to live forever; live as if you were to die tomorrow."

--John Wooden


Yeah, Dick Vitale the character took over Dick Vitale the broadcaster sometime in the mid-1990s. That said, on Twitter he shows flickers of an individual behind the TV makeup.

Sash!
Mar 16, 2001



I pretend he's like that all the time, screaming catchphrases about ultra-mundane stuff around the house.

Crazy Ted
Jul 29, 2003



Sash! posted:

I pretend he's like that all the time, screaming catchphrases about ultra-mundane stuff around the house.
That's the way I prefer to think of him too, imagining him going to some drive-thru at 9:00 am to order his breakfast and scaring the hell out of the staff.

I know Billy Mays used to go to the drive-thru lanes at fast food places in-character just for the hell of it.

Alfred P. Pseudonym
May 29, 2006

And when you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss goes 8-8


It's not delivery, it's DiGiorno BABYYYY!

FuzzySkinner
May 23, 2012



http://www.awfulannouncing.com/2013...ally-weird.html

quote:

But things might also get a little bit weird as Cowherd and ESPN try to take the zaniness to a strange new level. Here are some other segments planned for the show:

Digital originals – original digital shorts featuring Cowherd debuting on You Tube during the week will be used going in and out of breaks, including interviews with Bristol “Car Wash” guests conducted in a prop closet

Fake infomercials for “Colin-created” products

Cash, Car, Kids Game – viewers can play along from home and make picks with Cowherd.

ESPN seems to specialize in giving the viewer exactly what they don't demand.

haljordan
Oct 22, 2004

the corpse of god is love.


College Slice

quote:

“This won’t be your typical pregame show because I’m hosting it and I’ve never played in the league and I don’t even know that many people who did play in the league," Cowherd said in an ESPN press release Tuesday.

"I only host a radio show and a TV show for ESPN, when am I ever going to meet football players?!"

I was laughing until I remembered THIS is what's replacing 'Outside the Lines'.

haljordan fucked around with this message at Sep 4, 2013 around 16:23

Akileese
Feb 6, 2005



FuzzySkinner posted:

http://www.awfulannouncing.com/2013...ally-weird.html


ESPN seems to specialize in giving the viewer exactly what they don't demand.

I have to imagine there's a few executives in a giant pissing match to see who can greenlight the worst possible shows while losing the least amount of viewers. This sounds wretched. Frankly, if it didn't have lovely sounding sketch comedy in it, the show might not be too terrible.

Anals of History
Jul 29, 2003



Had the misfortune to listen to Cowherd belt out his own version of "Sweet Caroline" trying to mock Josh Bennett after Boston media decided they should care about his golf game. It was the most miserable, cringe-worthy skit possible. Felt levels of embarrassment that I thought I left behind in middle school. Twenty-two minutes of that sounds like Hell on Earth.

That show and that format should have gone to Bomani Jones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBeXkYSzXzw

FuzzySkinner
May 23, 2012



Could always go where the XFL went, and do an Opie and Anthony Pre-game show.

Cowherd is literally the worst radio personality I've ever come across.

BIZORT
Jan 24, 2003



I feel like anyone can talk about sports and sound decent and sort of know what they're talking about so when anyone else does it except sportscasters then I'm fine with it. I don't usually listen to people talk sports at me but it isn't offensive to hear it, I guess. Conversely, when you're in such a dumb profession to begin with like sportscasting and you're trying to do literally anything else then you will sound like a loving idiot.

BasicFunk
Feb 26, 2011

How's your Funkentelechy?


Anals of History posted:

Had the misfortune to listen to Cowherd belt out his own version of "Sweet Caroline" trying to mock Josh Bennett after Boston media decided they should care about his golf game. It was the most miserable, cringe-worthy skit possible. Felt levels of embarrassment that I thought I left behind in middle school. Twenty-two minutes of that sounds like Hell on Earth.

That show and that format should have gone to Bomani Jones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBeXkYSzXzw

I would watch a TV show that was nothing but Bomani Jones talking about poo poo. If FS1, NBCSN, really wanted to challenge ESPN, they'd give this man an hour of TV time every night.

haljordan
Oct 22, 2004

the corpse of god is love.


College Slice

Seriously, Colin Cowherd in "original digital shorts"? Who the gently caress thought this up? It reeks of another desperate attempt to manufacture viral videos, which is impossible. I guarantee whoever suggested the idea is also a big fan of The Lonely Island. "We'll just do what they do!"

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Groucho Marxist
Dec 9, 2005

Do you smell what The Mauk is cooking?


It should be pretty good, Cowherd will just emulate like the shows he's finds the funniest, like Amos and Andy.

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