Quantum Theory and Racism: Bioshock Infinite [VLP]

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Let's Play! > Quantum Theory and Racism: Bioshock Infinite [VLP]

Abilifier: Apr 8, 2008

I've been waiting for this LP for a while. I don't really buy that many games, and recently when I had the opportunity to get one I eventually chose Hitman Absolution over Bioshock Infinite. I can see already that was an enormous mistake. Well, I'm really looking forward to the rest of the LP, and maybe getting a used copy somewhere if it continues being this good.

# ¿ Aug 26, 2013 04:02

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# ¿ Apr 25, 2024 13:31

Abilifier: Apr 8, 2008

I just got this game, partly because of this thread, and it really is great. The combat is more fun than I expected, since I'm not really an FPS fan, and the game really is beautiful. I'm really looking forward to where this game is going now, the plot is pretty strange. Hopefully it's not all a dream.

# ¿ Oct 3, 2013 19:26

Abilifier: Apr 8, 2008

I just read about Wounded Knee on Wikipedia. Was this covered in the thread yet? Because that little bit of history really adds a lot to the characters of Slate, Booker, and Comstock. I'll add a quick summary if it seems appropriate.

# ¿ Oct 5, 2013 20:51

Abilifier: Apr 8, 2008

Bruceski posted:

It has not and oof, is it nasty. Having been both there and with the Pinkertons it's not surprising that the office flashbacks (hallucinations or whatever you wanna call them, definitely some dream/nightmare and reality intermixed) show him sitting there staring at a bottle.

It's pretty appalling just how much Comstock rewrote history there, he literally reversed the roles played by the Indians and the Cavalry. I haven't taken American history (or any history) since high school, and that was over 10 years ago, so I don't really remember the details of the Wounded Knee incident, but it really does explain Booker's mental state. He could be suffering from some PTSD and his drinking, running up debts, and now going on a hopeless mission could be his own way of trying to kill himself. I'm still playing though, I'm only a little bit further ahead than Sundowner, so I'm sure more nasty and depressing revelations lie ahead.

# ¿ Oct 5, 2013 21:41

Abilifier: Apr 8, 2008

Epic High Five posted:

Please do, it's not really a "battle" and if most people don't know about it, it'll be pretty jarring compared to how it's portrayed in this.

I am by no means an expert on American history, I haven't taken any classes since high school and that was over 10 years ago. I'm pretty sure I learned about Wounded Knee but I had to look it up in Wikipedia to remember anything. Anyway, I know it's kind of :effort:

but the Wiki summary is a pretty good place to start:

quote:

The Wounded Knee Massacre occurred on December 29, 1890, near Wounded Knee Creek on the Lakota Pine Ridge Indian Reservation in South Dakota, USA. It was the last battle of the American Indian Wars. On the day before, a detachment of the U.S. 7th Cavalry Regiment commanded by Major Samuel M. Whitside intercepted Spotted Elk's band of Miniconjou Lakota and 38 Hunkpapa Lakota near Porcupine Butte and escorted them five miles westward (8 km) to Wounded Knee Creek, where they made camp.

The remainder of the 7th Cavalry Regiment arrived, led by Colonel James W. Forsyth and surrounded the encampment supported by four Hotchkiss guns.

On the morning of December 29, the troops went into the camp to disarm the Lakota. One version of events claims that during the process of disarming the Lakota, a deaf tribesman named Black Coyote was reluctant to give up his rifle, claiming he had paid a lot for it. A scuffle over Black Coyote's rifle escalated and a shot was fired which resulted in the 7th Cavalry's opening fire indiscriminately from all sides, killing men, women, and children, as well as some of their own fellow soldiers. Those few Lakota warriors who still had weapons began shooting back at the attacking soldiers, who quickly suppressed the Lakota fire. The surviving Lakota fled, but U.S. cavalrymen pursued and killed many who were unarmed.

By the time it was over, at least 150 men, women, and children of the Lakota had been killed and 51 wounded (4 men, 47 women and children, some of whom died later); some estimates placed the number of dead at 300. Twenty-five soldiers also died, and 39 were wounded (6 of the wounded would later die). It is believed that many were the victims of friendly fire,[citation needed] as the shooting took place at close range in chaotic conditions. At least twenty soldiers were awarded the Medal of Honor.

I also saw this quote from L. Frank Baum, you know, the guy who wrote The Wizard of Oz

quote:

The Pioneer has before declared that our only safety depends upon the total extermination of the Indians. Having wronged them for centuries, we had better, in order to protect our civilization, follow it up by one more wrong and wipe these untamed and untamable creatures from the face of the earth. In this lies future safety for our settlers and the soldiers who are under incompetent commands. Otherwise, we may expect future years to be as full of trouble with the redskins as those have been in the past.

I'd like to think he was being sarcastic. Anyway, this is all from the Wikipedia article, I'm looking through some other sources now. It was a pretty horrifying event, and it really was a stain on the military's history, which wasn't exactly all that great to begin with.

Edit: Here's another link, and it includes an eyewitness account from one of the US soldiers.
http://www.eyewitnesstohistory.com/knee.htm

Abilifier fucked around with this message at 00:19 on Oct 6, 2013

# ¿ Oct 6, 2013 00:07

Abilifier: Apr 8, 2008

Veyrall posted:

The American Revolution

Except that the British Loyalists ended up getting kicked out to Canada. I don't think they were massacred though, so I guess it's better than what usually happens.

# ¿ Nov 28, 2013 01:03

Abilifier: Apr 8, 2008

Rick_Hunter posted:

As for alternate universe Booker, we still don't know if his martyrdom is because of Fitzroy's spin or because he genuinely believed in the Vox's cause.

He outright says in one of the vodka phones in the last update that he doesn't care about the cause and just wants to get close to Elizabeth. Also, I think the actions and violence of the Vox make more sense if you consider that in this universe its leaders include Booker and Slate, both mass murderers.

# ¿ Dec 3, 2013 22:42

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# ¿ Apr 25, 2024 13:31

Abilifier: Apr 8, 2008

George posted:

For the record, the game's PR campaign was trying to emphasize this, and time was spent patting themselves on the back for pointing out how morally difficult this conflict is. gently caress this game forever, and shame on the creeps that made it.

Well, part of this game's plot are certainly underdeveloped, but I think you're being unfair. This is a violent overthrow of an oppressive government right? What exactly do you think is going to happen to the collaborators? And it's not like Fitzroy was ever depicted as a person with restraint. In fact, does she even have any guiding principles or anything, or is she really just out to kill the people who've been making her miserable for years? Personally I don't really have a problem with the way the Vox is depicted, I just kind of wish that they spent more time fleshing out Daisy's character, so the violent aspects of her character don't appear so suddenly.

# ¿ Dec 4, 2013 14:33

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