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DelphiAegis
Jun 21, 2010


The Iron Rose posted:

wait really? Was it literally called god mode? What horrible naming!

e: welp there's egg on my face now. though i would humbly suggest the control panel completely replaces any need for it.

Maybe that was just internet slang for it, but you just rename a folder to "{ED7BA470-8E54-465E-825C-99712043E01C}" and it displays all the settings in a convenient list. Coming from XP -> 7, it was a nice list of familiar items while showing the newer stuff. I will humbly accept that the control panel in Win10 replaces the need for it though, you're right. I'm just old and set in my ways.

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Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!



Dear User,

You are typing your password in wrong. Sorry. I do it sometimes, too. The computer doesn't randomly gently caress your password up. There's nothing wrong with your keyboard. Nobody is hacking your account. The reason it "always works when I'm there" is because you slow down and type it like a human instead of going Boston Terrier on it.

Sickening
Jul 15, 2007

Black summer was the best summer.

EpicCodeMonkey posted:

Windows 7 had type-and-search in its Start Menu as well. The key differentiator is the the one in Windows 7 actually worked.

You donít actually use windows 10 do you?

lament.cfg
Dec 28, 2006


when i die, bury me inside the lambic store





Sickening posted:

You donít actually use windows 10 do you?

Macro$haft Winblow$ 10, no thanx

Polio Vax Scene
Apr 5, 2009




is the whole needing to opt out of a dozen data sharing things still a thing in windows 10

regulargonzalez
Aug 18, 2006
UNGH LET ME LICK THOSE BOOTS DADDY HULU YES YES GIVE ME ALL THE CORPORATE CUMMIES ADBLOCK USERS DESERVE THE DEATH PENALTY, DON'T THEY DADDY?
WHEN THE RICH GET RICHER I GET HORNIER


Hot take: the best Windows desktop OS was not 7, not 10, nor even 98. It was Server 2008 with Desktop Experience installed.

regulargonzalez
Aug 18, 2006
UNGH LET ME LICK THOSE BOOTS DADDY HULU YES YES GIVE ME ALL THE CORPORATE CUMMIES ADBLOCK USERS DESERVE THE DEATH PENALTY, DON'T THEY DADDY?
WHEN THE RICH GET RICHER I GET HORNIER


Polio Vax Scene posted:

is the whole needing to opt out of a dozen data sharing things still a thing in windows 10

Technically yes, but the decrapifier powershell script takes care of that along with miscellaneous other tweaks.

bobmarleysghost
Mar 7, 2006





I don't mind win 10. Disable the tracking poo poo and the rest is breezy.

Weedle
May 31, 2006





Sickening posted:

If windows 10 is bad, what is good?

powershell

The Fool
Oct 16, 2003



Sickening posted:


If windows 10 is bad, what is good?

Mountains

wolrah
May 8, 2006
what?


stevewm posted:

AAAHHHHHH loving Spectrum.

We have service in one of the former BrightHouse areas. We have a static IP, so we get the pleasure of being stuck with both a modem AND a router from them. Service keeps randomly dropping. It will work anywhere from 1 hour to 1 day, and then just quit until the modem and router are power cycled. Tech after tech keeps saying the router is dropping the v4 address assignment and only keeping the v6 (that is not valid anyways).

They replaced both the router and the modem and it still keeps doing it.

They don't know why it is happening.

We have been ending up with these piles of poo poo more and more recently and it's mind bogglingly bad. Every time they have something different wrong.

According to the tech who did the last install I was present for, apparently for whatever reason their DOCSIS 3.1 modems are not capable of supporting a static IP natively. Why they've chosen to use those modems for business service given that limitation I have no idea.

SyNack Sassimov
May 4, 2006

Let the robot win.
            --Captain James T. Vader

regulargonzalez posted:

Technically yes, but the decrapifier powershell script takes care of that along with miscellaneous other tweaks.

Yeah, WinDC is worth its weight in gold. As long as you don't use -allapps or remove the Store, you're left with a completely usable Win10, just without all the crap. (I made the mistake of removing the Store on one of the first MDT setups I did - did not take long for that to become a problem).

I do have to wonder how much of the hate is because people aren't using a decrapified version of Win10 - I would hate that poo poo too. But with all the bloatware removed and a custom start menu/taskbar layout (or just starting blank and pinning what you want), it's just as clean and nice as Win7 was.

All that said, Win2000 will always hold a special place in my heart - I kept using that as long as I possibly could and as I recall only spent a year or two using XP before switching to Win7. (Which came out in 2009, so, you do the math).

stevewm
May 10, 2005


wolrah posted:

We have been ending up with these piles of poo poo more and more recently and it's mind bogglingly bad. Every time they have something different wrong.

According to the tech who did the last install I was present for, apparently for whatever reason their DOCSIS 3.1 modems are not capable of supporting a static IP natively. Why they've chosen to use those modems for business service given that limitation I have no idea.

All the cable COs that force you to use their own router can suck it. Ugh.

Really this is as bad as the turd AT&T hoists upon UVerse customers..... "Sure, here is your 500Mbit connection, but you can only access it through this "gateway" built with consumer level router technology from 2001. Have fun!"

Edit: Continuing my rant... Why is cable/DSL co. provided equipment such poo poo usually? I deal with several fiber providers... replacement ONTs are rare. Their first troubleshooting step isn't to reboot the ONT.

It seems like cable COs would have less support calls just using equipment that wasn't poo poo.

stevewm fucked around with this message at 18:39 on Apr 8, 2021

Methylethylaldehyde
Oct 23, 2004

BAKA BAKA


stevewm posted:

All the cable COs that force you to use their own router can suck it. Ugh.

Really this is as bad as the turd AT&T hoists upon UVerse customers..... "Sure, here is your 500Mbit connection, but you can only access it through this "gateway" built with consumer level router technology from 2001. Have fun!"

Edit: Continuing my rant... Why is cable/DSL co. provided equipment such poo poo usually? I deal with several fiber providers... replacement ONTs are rare. Their first troubleshooting step isn't to reboot the ONT.

It seems like cable COs would have less support calls just using equipment that wasn't poo poo.

Support calls are way cheaper than millions of nicer modem/router combo units.

Also you can generally get just a modem if you bitch at them in person. Business internet generally uses dumb modems, and if you sweet talk them, you can generally get one of those provisioned instead.

wolrah
May 8, 2006
what?


Methylethylaldehyde posted:

Support calls are way cheaper than millions of nicer modem/router combo units.
A plain modem that just modems and nothing else should be cheaper still and much harder to gently caress up.

Unfortunately way too many people think a fully integrated combo unit is a good thing.

quote:

Also you can generally get just a modem if you bitch at them in person. Business internet generally uses dumb modems, and if you sweet talk them, you can generally get one of those provisioned instead.
That's the whole point we're complaining about, with some services such as AT&T U-Verse and now Spectrum's DOCSIS 3.1 static IPs the ISP does not offer an option to not use their garbage.

There is a hack for AT&T that involves proxying 802.1x through a Linux or BSD router of your choice to their gateway but I haven't found any comparable workaround for Spectrum.

EpicCodeMonkey
Feb 19, 2011


Sickening posted:

You don’t actually use windows 10 do you?

Yes, I use it, every day. As as OS it's fine, but I can't be the first person to point out that the start menu search in it is completely broken compared to previous versions.

Win 7 search was a dumb string check that meant results were consistent and showed up in a stable order until something new was installed.

Win 10 seems to be using rand() as its sorting algorithm and frequently doesn't find obvious matches like "device" not showing "device manager" as the first result. Without consistent results it means muscle memory can't develop to quickly launch things effectively.

EpicCodeMonkey fucked around with this message at 22:16 on Apr 8, 2021

i am a moron
Nov 12, 2020

Gettin' woke about vaccines

The search is so hosed itís insane, but itís also literally not something I use ever because the eight apps I need are pinned to the taskbar

xzzy
Mar 5, 2009



i am a moron posted:

The search is so hosed itís insane, but itís also literally not something I use ever because the eight apps I need are pinned to the taskbar

What? No, it's great.

*taps windows key, types notepad, notepad++ is still the second option after notepad.exe despite never once in the history of this install have I run notepad.exe*

Paladine_PSoT
Jan 2, 2010

If you have a problem Yo, I'll solve it



xzzy posted:

*taps windows key, types notepad, notepad++ is still the second option after notepad.exe despite never once in the history of this install have I run notepad.exe*

Click on the search bar and look for "Indexing options"
Select "Start Menu"
Click "Modify"
Check your program files directories to add them to the index
Save and close.

Notepad++ can then show up higher because it's indexed and found first, though it's not guaranteed.

Edit: If you just want notepad.exe to completely disappear, open C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu\Programs\Accessories and delete the notepad shortcut.

Paladine_PSoT fucked around with this message at 00:26 on Apr 9, 2021

bobua
Mar 23, 2003
I'd trade it all for just a little more.



lmao

Look, disable cortana, run this decrapify script, install launchy, never disable the store but don't load office from the store, add areas you want to search to the index manually, don't use the actual settings menu use the search function(after you fixed it) to load the old control control panel from the version of windows you liked, do security updates as they come out but wait a while on feature updates those aren't QA'd anymore. When loading or reloading, use airplane mode or you'll be forced to create a microsoft account.


Windows 10 is my favorite desktop OS and you couldn't pay me to go back to an earlier version, but if you can't understand why anyone else feels differently your dism needs its health restored.

Volguus
Mar 3, 2009


bobua posted:

lmao

Look, disable cortana, run this decrapify script, install launchy, never disable the store but don't load office from the store, add areas you want to search to the index manually, don't use the actual settings menu use the search function(after you fixed it) to load the old control control panel from the version of windows you liked, do security updates as they come out but wait a while on feature updates those aren't QA'd anymore. When loading or reloading, use airplane mode or you'll be forced to create a microsoft account.


Windows 10 is my favorite desktop OS and you couldn't pay me to go back to an earlier version, but if you can't understand why anyone else feels differently your dism needs its health restored.

Fedora is my favourite OS and you couldn't pay me enough to use windows. My employer pays me well enough to use ubuntu, and that's the most I can stand. With that being said, I had to "setup" windows 10 for my sister, on her brand new Dell tower PC. Mostly everything went fine, but one thing that really (and I mean really) pissed me off is their requirement to make a microsoft account. If I remember correctly they used to have a "Skip this" or "Use local account" link in their introductory wizard. They don't anymore, and you have to make their lovely MS account. You can, of course, disable it afterwards and use a local account, but it's quite irritating to see that. And even after that, they insist in using a PIN to login. WTF? It's a home computer, the family uses it, it will have one account only, jesus, let me make my own choices if I want to be secure or not. I understand the updates being forced on users, but all these flakey "security" mechanism are just theatre. PINs, passwords, face-recognition, ugh. Everything is possible however, and we managed to convince that little piece of poo poo to take a hike and stop bothering us. But it shouldn't have been that hard, it shouldn't have been that seemingly impossible.

That's not an OS I would like to use. Ever.

Thanatosian
Apr 16, 2013

Angrier, Bitterer Man


Grimey Drawer

Volguus posted:

Fedora is my favourite OS and you couldn't pay me enough to use windows. My employer pays me well enough to use ubuntu, and that's the most I can stand. With that being said, I had to "setup" windows 10 for my sister, on her brand new Dell tower PC. Mostly everything went fine, but one thing that really (and I mean really) pissed me off is their requirement to make a microsoft account. If I remember correctly they used to have a "Skip this" or "Use local account" link in their introductory wizard. They don't anymore, and you have to make their lovely MS account. You can, of course, disable it afterwards and use a local account, but it's quite irritating to see that. And even after that, they insist in using a PIN to login. WTF? It's a home computer, the family uses it, it will have one account only, jesus, let me make my own choices if I want to be secure or not. I understand the updates being forced on users, but all these flakey "security" mechanism are just theatre. PINs, passwords, face-recognition, ugh. Everything is possible however, and we managed to convince that little piece of poo poo to take a hike and stop bothering us. But it shouldn't have been that hard, it shouldn't have been that seemingly impossible.

That's not an OS I would like to use. Ever.
Just don't connect the device to the internet and it lets you create a local account.

Yeah, it's loving dumb and annoying.

Sickening
Jul 15, 2007

Black summer was the best summer.

Has anyone ever try to tell you why using Linux for desktop is better while not sounding totally crazy?

ď I ran into a small problem in windows 10 that is fairly trivial , let me fix this by using using this other OS that is known for being user friendly.Ē

Sickening fucked around with this message at 03:06 on Apr 9, 2021

Spring Heeled Jack
Feb 25, 2007


I use Ubuntu desktop on my XPS and itís nice?

Windows 10 on my desktop tho so I can go shooty shooty in CS:GO.

Fart Amplifier
Apr 12, 2003



Volguus posted:

And even after that, they insist in using a PIN to login. WTF? It's a home computer, the family uses it, it will have one account only, jesus, let me make my own choices if I want to be secure or not. I understand the updates being forced on users, but all these flakey "security" mechanism are just theatre. PINs, passwords, face-recognition, ugh.

So the parents, who are possibly using their computer to do banking and taxes, are going to be using the same admin account that their kids are using? What's to stop the kids installing a browser extension to make cats appear in web pages but instead it sends all their passwords and banking information to Russia? And passwords are "security theatre"? Separate user accounts for everyone is an objectively better experience for the end user and is objectively more secure.

The Fool
Oct 16, 2003



Volguus posted:


And even after that, they insist in using a PIN to login. WTF? It's a home computer, the family uses it, it will have one account only, jesus, let me make my own choices if I want to be secure or not. I understand the updates being forced on users, but all these flakey "security" mechanism are just theatre. PINs, passwords, face-recognition, ugh.


this is a dumb take

Volguus
Mar 3, 2009


Fart Amplifier posted:

So the parents, who are possibly using their computer to do banking and taxes, are going to be using the same admin account that their kids are using? What's to stop the kids installing a browser extension to make cats appear in web pages but instead it sends all their passwords and banking information to Russia? And passwords are "security theatre"? Separate user accounts for everyone is an objectively better experience for the end user and is objectively more secure.

Yes they will, as this is what they want. There is nothing stopping the kids from installing a browser extension, just like there is nothing stopping the parents from installing malware. It is a choice, consciously made. Is it more secure to have 100 accounts for every pet in your house? Yes. Is it comfortable, desirable, something that the parents want to do? No. At the end of the day, that's the gist of it. You can hate it all you want, you can scream all you want "but viruses", it is how these particular people want to use their computer. And yes, I am annoyed and it does piss me off that MS made it harder for me to achieve what I wanted to. Harder than it should have been.


Sickening posted:

Has anyone ever try to tell you why using Linux for desktop is better while not sounding totally crazy?

“ I ran into a small problem in windows 10 that is fairly trivial , let me fix this by using using this other OS that is known for being user friendly.”

You have to define better. Linux is definitely not better for my sister. It is certainly better for me.

Biowarfare
Nov 8, 2010

I JUST WISH THIS WAS A PONY SO I COULD JERK IT WHILE I PLAY WOW

Volguus posted:

Yes they will, as this is what they want. There is nothing stopping the kids from installing a browser extension, just like there is nothing stopping the parents from installing malware. It is a choice, consciously made. Is it more secure to have 100 accounts for every pet in your house? Yes. Is it comfortable, desirable, something that the parents want to do? No. At the end of the day, that's the gist of it. You can hate it all you want, you can scream all you want "but viruses", it is how these particular people want to use their computer. And yes, I am annoyed and it does piss me off that MS made it harder for me to achieve what I wanted to. Harder than it should have been.


heres a better take: microsoft wants to be able to easily tell the telemetry of different people using the same computer apart

Volguus
Mar 3, 2009


Biowarfare posted:

heres a better take: microsoft wants to be able to easily tell the telemetry of different family members apart

I definitely get that. Doesn't mean I'm happy about it.

Fart Amplifier
Apr 12, 2003



Volguus posted:

You can hate it all you want, you can scream all you want "but viruses"

You're the one making insane statements like passwords being "security theatre".

Volguus posted:

it is how these particular people want to use their computer.

Yeah because nobody who should know better has helped them understand the risks.

Buff Hardback
Jun 11, 2019



Even though I use a MS account, I still force Windows to make a local account.

Only because the user folder when you link a MS account on OOBE ends up being a truncated email, so I make it a local account so I get "Buff Hardback" as the user folder, then go ahead and link it to my MS account.

bobua
Mar 23, 2003
I'd trade it all for just a little more.



Can you even share stuff like an itunes library between multiple accounts these days? I haven't had to try anything like that in years but separate user accounts was absolutely stupid for extremely common family use cases with almost all software.

SyNack Sassimov
May 4, 2006

Let the robot win.
            --Captain James T. Vader

Volguus posted:

If I remember correctly they used to have a "Skip this" or "Use local account" link in their introductory wizard. They don't anymore, and you have to make their lovely MS account. You can, of course, disable it afterwards and use a local account, but it's quite irritating to see that.

They do, in fact, still have it, but you can be forgiven for thinking they don't because they've definitely moved the option to the disused file cabinet behind a door with a sign on it saying beware of the Ballmer. It's now that you have to click I think offline account on the first account setup screen, and then on the next screen where it then prompts you once again for a Microsoft account, click the very small "Limited Experience" link at the bottom left, and you'll be allowed to set up a local account.

Which, yeah, that's loving terrible, but I can see why they're doing it since they want to compete with Google's ease of use and that means pushing everyone to being able to use the cloud services with no friction. (Not saying it's a good thing, just that I see why they're pushing it so hard). That is the advantage Google has - the Google account is already the one account so there's no confusion in using other Google services, but if Grandma tries to set up OneDrive with her local Windows account suddenly she's got the extra hassle of registering for a Microsoft account.


bobua posted:

Look, disable cortana, run this decrapify script, install launchy, never disable the store but don't load office from the store, add areas you want to search to the index manually, don't use the actual settings menu use the search function(after you fixed it) to load the old control control panel from the version of windows you liked, do security updates as they come out but wait a while on feature updates those aren't QA'd anymore. When loading or reloading, use airplane mode or you'll be forced to create a microsoft account.

I mean, Win10 Decrapify is really the only thing you need to run, and it's not like Win7 was perfect out of the box. Every version of Windows ever has needed tweaks to run efficiently (except Windows 2000 where everything was in fact perfect and you might just want some cosmetic tweaks have I mentioned how great Windows 2000 was), and thinking that Win10 is somehow different is rose-colored glasses. It's just that instead of PowerToys or installing Classic Start or whatever else is in this insane article of Windows 7 tweaks , it's running a Powershell script to remove bloatware, so maybe it seems more involved? I don't know, and I'm absolutely not saying Windows 10 is the best OS, I'm just saying that 6 years on from release it's really not that involved or difficult to make it behave nicely.

Biowarfare
Nov 8, 2010

I JUST WISH THIS WAS A PONY SO I COULD JERK IT WHILE I PLAY WOW

SyNack Sassimov posted:

They do, in fact, still have it, but you can be forgiven for thinking they don't because they've definitely moved the option to the disused file cabinet behind a door with a sign on it saying beware of the Ballmer. It's now that you have to click I think offline account on the first account setup screen, and then on the next screen where it then prompts you once again for a Microsoft account, click the very small "Limited Experience" link at the bottom left, and you'll be allowed to set up a local account.

I don't see the option at all if it can detect an internet connection. I only see Local account setup after unplugging ethernet/disabling wifi

ArcticZombie
Sep 15, 2010


I thought this thread of all threads would understand users that don't want to learn a drat thing about computers and just want something that does what they want with the minimal of effort. Literally a single extra step or thing they have to remember is too much, they do not care that it isn't "best practice". Any janitoring whatsoever is too much. If it goes tits up in the exact way you warned them it would? No worries, you'll be there to fix it and then they can go back to not giving a poo poo until the next time. The only way you're going to be able to get these people to do things properly is to make it transparent, the computer should just know who is using it. Perhaps in a corporate environment you have the power to enforce stuff on your users, but family? Good loving luck.

ihafarm
Aug 12, 2004


Biowarfare posted:

I don't see the option at all if it can detect an internet connection. I only see Local account setup after unplugging ethernet/disabling wifi

This is the only way now - if you connect to the internet you canít create a local account through the setup wizard. You donít have to disable wifi, just donít join any networks.

If you do connect the only way to get the local account option back(within the setup wizard) is to re-install.

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!



Volguus posted:

Fedora is my favourite OS and you couldn't pay me enough to use windows. My employer pays me well enough to use ubuntu, and that's the most I can stand. With that being said, I had to "setup" windows 10 for my sister, on her brand new Dell tower PC. Mostly everything went fine, but one thing that really (and I mean really) pissed me off is their requirement to make a microsoft account. If I remember correctly they used to have a "Skip this" or "Use local account" link in their introductory wizard. They don't anymore, and you have to make their lovely MS account. You can, of course, disable it afterwards and use a local account, but it's quite irritating to see that. And even after that, they insist in using a PIN to login. WTF? It's a home computer, the family uses it, it will have one account only, jesus, let me make my own choices if I want to be secure or not. I understand the updates being forced on users, but all these flakey "security" mechanism are just theatre. PINs, passwords, face-recognition, ugh. Everything is possible however, and we managed to convince that little piece of poo poo to take a hike and stop bothering us. But it shouldn't have been that hard, it shouldn't have been that seemingly impossible.

That's not an OS I would like to use. Ever.

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!



My boss is cheap gently caress who will try to use expired coupons at restaurants at lunch and bitch when they aren't accepted, and one time he got us out kicked out of a Quizno's for putting Mt Dew in a water cup.

He's always trying to get vendors to throw poo poo in for free or signing up for all kinds of programs to get free poo poo. Like a loving beggar. It's annoying and kind of embarassing.

Right now he's mad at a vendor who gave us a free product, but as a 'free' user we only get 2 support tickets. "THEY NEVER MENTIONED THAT"

KillHour
Oct 28, 2007






Remind me to tell my sales people to avoid your company.

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Unexpected Raw Anime
Oct 9, 2012



You guys complain about a lot of really mundane poo poo. Setting up windows is the easiest itís ever been

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