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Best Producer/Showrunner?
This poll is closed.
Verity Lambert 49 7.04%
John Wiles 1 0.14%
Innes Lloyd 1 0.14%
Peter Bryant 3 0.43%
Derrick Sherwin 3 0.43%
Barry Letts 12 1.72%
Phillip Hinchcliffe 62 8.91%
Graham Williams 3 0.43%
John Nathan-Turner 15 2.16%
Philip Segal 3 0.43%
Russel T Davies 106 15.23%
Steven Moffat 114 16.38%
Son Goku 324 46.55%
Total: 696 votes
[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

 
  • Locked thread
Chokes McGee
Aug 7, 2008

This is Urotsuki.

Jurgan posted:

I don't know about everyone else, but for me I start associating people on forums with their avatars. So I'd been picturing you as John Hurt, and then I see this video and you're probably younger than I, and it's just a weird disconnect.

What about me? :stare:

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primaltrash
Feb 11, 2008

(Thought-ful Croak)

Chokes McGee posted:

What about me? :stare:

You're a kitty!

Big Mean Jerk
Jan 27, 2009

Well, of course I know him.
He's me.
I'm a spacemen

Fungah!
Apr 30, 2011

I'm fungah

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

A bracing glass of carrot juice!
Am I the puppet or the puppeteer? Who can say.

Although I am going back to studying (crossing over to maffs) so maybe I'm Adric Brush after all

The_Doctor
Mar 29, 2007

"The entire history of this incarnation is one of temporal orbits, retcons, paradoxes, parallel time lines, reiterations, and divergences. How anyone can make head or tail of all this chaos, I don't know."
Who am I...?

DoctorWhat
Nov 18, 2011

A little privacy, please?

The_Doctor posted:

Who am I...?

It's WHO! AM! IIIIIII!!!???
:colbert:

Bicyclops
Aug 27, 2004

MrL_JaKiri posted:

Am I the puppet or the puppeteer? Who can say.

No, no, you've got it all wrong. This is for the Seventh Doctor avatar!

Jurgan
May 8, 2007

Just pour it directly into your gaping mouth-hole you decadent slut

The_Doctor posted:

Who am I...?

I'm Jean Valjean!

Shard
Jul 30, 2005


Sadly I'm a lowly poster unwilling to pay the cash for the privilege of looking through the archives. Thanks anyway :).

CobiWann
Oct 21, 2009

Have fun!


"All things must die."

Washed up on the sandy shores of a paradise island, a wild-eyed shipwreck survivor is rescued by the wife of Daqar Keep, the richest man in the galaxy.

Her name's Perfection. He's the Doctor. Together, they face a journey into the dark heart of this mysterious island, to discover the deepest secrets of this timeless cosmos. That's if the giant crabs, killer crocodiles and murderous natives don't get them first.

Meanwhile, fellow travellers Charley and C'rizz have their own ordeal to endure, in the grip of the Doctor's most dangerous rival. And in a universe that's facing extinction, even the best of friends may soon become enemies...

This life is almost over. And not everyone will make it to the next...

Paul McGann is the Doctor in The Next Life.

Cast

Paul McGann (The Doctor)
India Fisher (Charley Pollard)
Conrad Westmaas (C'Rizz)
Daphne Ashbrook (Perfection)
Stephane Cornicard (Keep)
Paul Darrow (Guidance)
Jane Hills (L'Da); Stephen Perring (The Kro'Ka)
Don Warrington (Rassilon)
Anneke Wills (Lady Louisa Pollard)
Stephen Mansfield (Simon Murchford)
Jane Goddard (Mother of Jembere-Bud)

Written By: Alan Barnes and Gary Russell
Directed By: Gary Russell

Trailer - http://www.bigfinish.com/releases/popout/the-next-life-230

X X X X X

It all comes down to this.

The body horror of Scherzo and The Creed of the Kromon. The dystopia of The Natural History of Fear. The split personalities of The Twilight Kingdom and Caerdroia. The religious folly of Faith Stealer. The haunting The Last. All of the Doctor’s experiences travelling through the Divergent Universe, with his best friend Charlotte Pollard and the alien C’rizz at his side, have lead up to this moment. With the TARDIS once again under his control (as much as it ever could be), the Doctor is prepared and ready to confront the person he came to this universe to find; his former idol and now possible enemy, the father of Time Lord society himself, Rassilon.

Is this story, the big payoff to two seasons and eight audio plays where narratives are woven together, questions are answered, and the mettle of a Time Lord, a human, and a Eutermesan are tested under temporal fire, a worthy finale to the Divergent Universe arc?

Well, it’s MUCH better than Zagreus, I’ll give you that!

The Next Life is where it all ends. Big Finish presents the grand climax of a story two years running, where the Doctor, Charley, and C’rizz find themselves at the very heart of the Divergent Universe, finally understanding all its secrets and grand designs. They also find themselves in the middle of a power play between Rassilon and another shadowy figure as the wall between the universes become thin, with a chance to return home is within the Doctor’s grasp. It’s grand, it’s has its moments of humor and tension, the cast is stellar, and as I mentioned, it’s leaps and bounds about Zagreus, Big Finish’s last attempt at a long, epic serial. But it suffers from its own set of problems; while it’s less bloated than Zagreus, there’s still a lot of padding, some confusion as to what exactly is going on, and just a general sense of missed opportunities, all leading to one simple statement summing up the Divergent Universe story arc; “thank God it’s over.”

Just because the Doctor is one again behind the center console of the TARDIS doesn’t mean he’s fully in control. Pulled into the gravity well of a blue planet, the crash-landing of the TARDIS finds the Doctor washed up on a sandy beach. Charley, meanwhile, finds herself in the presence of her own mother, moments before the adventuress snatches the clothes of a young porter in order to stow away in the ill-fated R101, where should would have died if not for the interference of the Doctor. And C’rizz awakens in the presence of his wife L’Da on the morning of their wedding…just hours before the invasion of their homeland by the Kromon. The three companions make their way back to each other; C’rizz in the presence of Guidance, member of the Church of the Foundation; Charley at the side of Keep, the richest man in the universe; and the Doctor with Perfection, a strange woman who happens to be Keep’s wife. And watching it all, with his servant the Kro’ka, is none other than Rassilon himself…

Alan Barnes. On one hand, he gave us Zagreus. On the other hand, he gave us Storm Warning and Neverland. Barnes, with Gary Russell sharing the co-writing duties, seems to have learned a good lesson from Zagreus and its incredibly bloated run time of four hours. Clocking in at about three-and-a-half hours, The Next Life moves at a much better pace than its predecessor. There’s still moment of padding that could have been cut out, but they are fewer and far between. Barnes and Russell keep the action moving. Even when the scene is mostly conversation, it is at least somewhat related to the unfolding plotline, such as the scene where the Doctor and Perfection casually discuss Keep’s importance as they pull leeches off of each other’s back.

This writing choice on one level, but it creates a sort of paradox. On one hand, there’s a lot of information being thrown at the listener, while on the other hand this serial did not need to be over 220 minutes long! This being the final story set in the Divergent Universe, Barnes and Russell obviously wanted to wrap everything up. This leads to a strange mix of the main players slowly figuring out the little clues and leading to the small “aha” moments that all add up to several revelations about the supporting cast and just how they tie into the final fate of the Doctor’s time in their reality. They’re very well done by virtue of being very easy to miss on the part of the listener the first time through. However, the shortened story arc also leads to several infodumps, including a 15-20 minute sequence where six people have three different conversations about why linear time doesn’t exist in the Divergent Universe and just what the important of the blue planet is to the proverbial grand scheme of things. The overall concept is interesting, but it’s just laid right out there, plain as day, in an interesting but still dull manner. And it doesn’t help that the concepts aren’t given anytime to gestate in the imagination of the listeners before the dialogue has moved onto the next concept. It’s not the fault of the actor or the writers, but another story or two might have really been helpful in giving more weight to the concepts, leading to more of a “oh, that’s REALLY interesting” reaction from listeners instead of a “huh…ok, and we’re moving on apparently” response. Adding on to this problem is the fact that The Next Life absolutely jams in every single continuity reference it can get away with. Suddenly, events from Zagreus, Scherzo,, and Caerdroia are casually bounced about after barely being mentioned in the previous audios. Charley even drops moments from Storm Warning and Neverland! Zagreus suffered from being one big continuity wank, and The Next Life avoids the worst of its excesses, but it’s still a bit jarring after months of mostly self-contained audios. It’s as if Barnes and Russell realized that they needed to actually tie the Divergent Universe stories, themes, and concepts together into an actual narrative, instead of just providing lip service to the concepts!

With all that said, The Next Life managed to feel incredibly long and sort of pointless. Six episodes of information, chases, captures, conversations, confrontations, and it all still felt very lackadaisical and meandering. The threats don’t feel threatening and the plot manages to jump all over the place. With all the information being delivered to the listener, for most of The Next Life runtime, very little feels important or noteworthy! And at no point does this hit home than, after seven audios of the Kro’ka talking about the Divergents, his mysterious masters, the ones running all these experiments, the beings so deadly and so dangerous that they were locked up in another universe, Keep off-handedly mentions that he killed them and absorbed their energies and abilities.



In the final book of The Dark Tower series, in order to make newly introduced bad guy Mordred , who turns out to be the ultimate Big Bad of the series, look like a major threat, Stephen King had him kill Randall Flagg. Flagg, who had been the villain in several King novels including The Stand and The Eyes of the Dragon and was one of the big overarching villains of King’s entire mythos, was casually jobbed out to Mordred to make Mordred look better. Flagg, who survived standing at Ground Zero of a nuclear explosion. It didn’t work there, and not even introducing the Divergents before there were killed by Keep sure as hell doesn’t work here. It’s the ultimate case of everything and the kitchen sink being jammed into The Next Life and it only serves to weaken the overall story.

One thing I can say for Alan Barnes is, for the most part, he gets the Eighth Doctor “right,” almost as well as Lloyd Rose does. Maybe it took getting the TARDIS back for the Doctor to really FEEL like the Doctor again, as McGann comes off very well in this story. This is Paul McGann at his loosest, his most casual, and maybe his most enjoyable performance since Invaders from Mars or the first half of Seasons of Fear. Maybe McGann also realizes that The Next Life is the end of the tunnel and decides to just have a little fun. The back-and-forth dialogue between himself and Perfection is a bit reminiscent of himself and Charley during their first adventures together, and his casual dismissal of Keep’s threats goes right along with it. When things do get serious, so does the Doctor, but it’s not the bored delivery we saw in The Last. It’s the Doctor making the same tough choices and quick decisions he had to make in Neverland, before the Doctor was infected with “anti-time.” Now that he’s been cleared of that infection (another casual dismissal thanks to the rushed writing), important things such as, oh, the Doctor’s portrayal are moving back to the way they were. I really think McGann might have felt that spark to play the Doctor once again after the way this “season” was a vast improvement over the previous one, and as such he sparkles in this story.

Charley, as well…back to normal! She’s the feisty, glib tongued, quick to react adventuress listeners fell in love with back in Storm Warning. Seeing her being flat out bitchy towards Perfection, maybe even jealous of her, also came off very well. It wasn’t case of “I want the Doctor, you can’t have him,” it was “who the hell are you and why are you messing with my friend?” Finally, there’s no question about the “love” between the Doctor and Charley; it’s as strong and as platonic as love can get. It just took a LOT longer for that question to get settled than necessary! But we also see Charley channel Evelyn Smythe a bit in this story. She admits to her “mother” that she’s becoming sensitized to death thanks to her travels with the Doctor, which makes a good bit of sense if you consider that Charley has been, from a technical standpoint, in more serials than several television companions! The sheer amount of amazing and terrible things she has seen should have affected her, and it all comes out when she wonders if Rassilon is right; if the Doctor was willing to abandon her to sacrifice himself to save reality from anti-time, would he be willing to abandon her again if it meant he could return home? We all know the answer to that question, but India Fisher sells that moment of doubt well, considering how different the Doctor has acted during his time in the Divergent Universe. It’s a case of McGann playing the Doctor as “back to normal” and Fisher going for “has the Doctor changed for the worse?”

And then there’s C’rizz. Finally, after six audios of character development by inches, the truth behind C’rizz being a bit bland is revealed. C’rizz is a sort of mental chameleon. He adapts himself and his personality to his situation and those around him. On one hand, it explains why he so easily adapted to the soldiers in The Twilight Kingdom, going so far as to picking up a gun and using it quite well after his anguish over using a gun in The Creed of the Kromon. It also explains his “sudden” interest in religion in Faith Stealer. On one hand, Conrad Westmaas does as good as job in this story as McGann and Fisher, when looking solely as how he works with the material he’s given. He shares the same suspicion of the Doctor as Charley does when Rassilon attempts to sway him, and when Rassilon uses that suspicion to offer him his heart’s desire, his wife back, C’rizz jumps at the chance, Westmaas making the whole thing believable with his emoting. On the other hand, though…C’rizz’s other big secret comes out in The Next Life…that he was once a member of the Church of the Foundation and committed scores of murders in the name of that religion. In one scene, we find out that C’rizz is hearing the voices of his victims. In another scene, we find out that Conscience, a holy man, is actually C’rizz’s father and has been waiting for him to crash on this planet, and that he will drown C’rizz to purge the Doctor’s influence from him. The very next scene, C’rizz is chanting the Foundation’s equivalent of Hail Mary’s, and a few scenes later, he’s betraying the Doctor to Rassilon. Westmass does what he can, but the way the material is presented doesn’t do him any favors.

To quote another reviewer who sums it up much better than I could…C’rizz is Adric 2.0!

By this point, I was wondering if there was a “lost” Divergent Universe episode somewhere that had been accidentally wiped by Big Finish which explains more about C’rizz, the Divergent Universe, and all the things that are being rushed through by this point...

The supporting cast is very solid. We’ll start with Keep, the physical embodiment of the Divergent’s stolen powers, played by Stephane Cornicard in his only Big Finish appearance. A Frenchman in the Divergent Universe? It makes sense in the end, as Cornicard’s performance reminded me of Louis Jourdan’s turn in the 1982 movie Swamp Thing. Both are evil men obsessed with immortality, and Cornicard takes it a little further. His shift from French big game hunter to walking manifestation of an entire alien race is very well done, as he walks the fine line between “melodrama” and “overacting” very well, taunting the Doctor and showing Rassilon a trick or two along the way as well. Don Warrington concludes his Big Finish turn as Rassilon with this story. Even though the listeners could easily see through the lies he tells Charley and C’rizz, Warrington really sells it with smooth conviction, planting just that small seed of doubt with a lie that contains a hint of the truth. His rising anger and frustration as his plans fall apart around him completely fits the idea of a frustrated Time Lord who’s not as all-powerful as he believes himself to be as he rants and rails against the Doctor even though he thinks he’s already “won.” His final fate caused me to shudder, as the “rebooting” of the Divergent Universe sees him in the very same round test chamber that the Doctor and Charley inhabited in Scherzo…but this time, it’s the Kro’ka he’s sharing the experience with! And as the slimy, out for himself, will sell out his masters at the drop of a hat Kro’ka, Stephen Perring is once again in fine form, more smug and superior than he was in Caerdroia now that he’s at the side of Rassilon.

Paul Darrow is a name well-known to British science fiction fans, as the greedy and reluctant rebel Kerr Avon in Terry Nation’s 1970’s sci-fi series Blake’s 7. Currently reprising the role for Big Finish’s Blake’s 7 range, Darrow turns in a stellar supporting performance, going 180 degrees from Avon to play the devout Guidance, member of the Church of the Foundation. It’s not camp, it’s deadly serious devotion as he’s determined to save C’rizz from himself and the Doctor’s influence, all the while seeking for the crucible of the Foundation’s faith, located on the blue planet. I couldn’t believe it was Paul Darrow I was listening to after seeing him in a few episodes of Blake’s 7, that’s how convincing I found his turn as Guidance.

And…Perfection. If there’s one thing you can say that’s positive about the 1996 Fox Doctor Who movie, aside from just how dashingly handsome Paul McGann looked, it was that the Doctor and Grace Holloway, his companion for the movie, had great chemistry together. Daphne Ashbrook reunited with McGann, playing Perfection, wife of Keep and someone with a vested interest in the fate of the universe…and the Doctor as well. Because of Fox holding the rights to the movie and the characters within (this bums me out, because I’d love to see a The Two Masters episode or audio with Alex Macqueen and Eric Roberts attempting to out-act each other), Ashbrook can’t reprise her role as Grace, but in The Next Life she doesn’t attempt to portray her either. Perfection is charming, smooth, sauve, and one hell of a gold digger, but she hates her husband with a passion and even the money doesn’t temper the anger. Ashbrook and McGann hit right off, as if nearly a decade hadn’t passed since they lasted acted opposite one another, bantering and flirting (from her end) as the Doctor tries to figure her out. The verbal catfights between Charley and Perfection must have been a ball to record because it sounds like Ashbrook and Fisher are having the time of their lives. Ashbrook deserves all the praise for coming back to Doctor Who in such grand fashion. When Perfection reveals HER part in the proceedings, and it’s one hell of a reveal that made he sit up (even if it goes back to the “continuity cramming” I mentioned earlier), the final episode suddenly becomes a three-way dance as Keep, Perfection, and Rassilon all trying to take advantage of the Doctor’s situation even as the Doctor tries to walk the tightrope between them.

As I said to open this review, it’s all come down to this. Eight audios, three characters, three villains, a whole bunch of plot, continuity references aplenty, secrets reveals, twists, turns, betrayals, reveals, horrible fates, the Divergent Universe resetting itself and changing, maybe for the better but possibly for the worse, thanks to the Doctor’s presence…and the whole big huge story arc ends with the Doctor telling Charley and C’rizz that they better become friends or else he’ll keep them trapped in the Divergent Universe for all time. So, unless his companions kiss and make up, he’ll throw all their lives away.



That pretty much sums up the Divergent Universe arc as a whole. All these great ideas, the possibility of really changing up the game, exploring a place with time as we know it doesn’t exist, and it all ends with a parent telling his children they won’t get any pie. There’s no sense of “wow, that was a fun ride!” Instead, it’s a feeling of relief that, thankfully, the Doctor is back among what he knows and what he’s familiar with. The Divergent Universe arc should be best remembered as a handful of good plays and a wealth of great ideas all wasted because of a rushed ending and not taking advantage of all its myriad opportunities.

However, the final line that ends The Next Life is one hell of a “welcome home…”



Synopsis – Rushed metaplot points and “tell don’t show” mean that the big finale of the Divergent Universe arc falls flat, overshadowing a great and diverse cast of main and supporting players. 3/5

DoctorWhat
Nov 18, 2011

A little privacy, please?

Spikeguy posted:

Sadly I'm a lowly poster unwilling to pay the cash for the privilege of looking through the archives. Thanks anyway :).

Jerusalem posted:

You know what's great? The Doctor's Wife is great.

My absolute favorite episode of the 6th Season, and it still stands up on a rewatch. Perhaps I like it so much because it fits in so nicely with my personal interpretation of The Parting of the Ways, in that what saves the Doctor isn't so much Rose as it is the TARDIS possessing Rose's body. Regardless, it's a story with a great concept, wonderful little sci-fi ideas, creepy patchwork "companions", an elegantly inhuman antagonist, mindgames with the companions and some genuinely touching dialog between the Doctor and his TARDIS - both between him and Idris' body and also at the end when the Doctor realizes that the TARDIS can still hear and understand him

That's not to say it is a flawless episode. There are a few problems, but they're so small and inconsequential that it feels petty to even bring them up. Perhaps the most telling is that the TARDIS' first human appearance feels overdone from a verbal standpoint - it feels like the actress is trying a little too hard to be out there and "wacky". That said, her physical mannerisms are perfect - the TARDIS isn't used to her current "container" and kind of stumbles about, arms swinging wildly, trying to come to terms with emotional responses and chemical processes. I love her confused use of tense too, particularly after that initial appearance where she calms down somewhat and sits about pondering exactly what is going on, how she is feeling and her struggles to encapsulate her experiences into words. Referring to the Doctor as "my thief" is very cute and the arguments they have later on further goes into the depths of their relationship - "this is the time we talked" as the TARDIS puts it, and it's neat to see them not only enjoy the experience but also take the opportunity to vent some of the frustrations they have with each other. The Doctor won't follow instructions (he always pushes the door instead of pulling on it) and brings home "strays". The TARDIS is temperemental and doesn't always go where he wants it to. Her retort of,"I always take you where you need to be" is perfect, and the Doctor's smile is great.

It's no surprise really, but Matt Smith does a wonderful job in this episode. The emotional range on display is very impressive, from his glee at getting Time Lord "mail" (I love this callback to The War Games), to his barely buried rage when he realizes the trap he has walked into; to his weeping begging to the TARDIS not to "go" now that he has finally been able to communicate with it. His careful delaying of House while he waits for the Idris body to finally die is nicely handled too - he's constantly casting worried glances in her direction, torn between knowing that her death will save them and not wanting her to die, while trying to keep House from just wiping them out.

House is a brilliant villain, a lovely bit of sci-fi weirdness - a living planetoid in a tiny bubble outside the skin of the universe, rebuilding the crashed inhabitants who end up there to entertain himself, dumping TARDIS matrixes into bodies to burn them out so he can feed on the energy inside (based on what we see in Season 7, that is a LOT of good eating). His elegant, bemused voice is a wonder - even though I know it's Michael Sheen I'm amazed that it is Michael Sheen! - and the long stretch of the episode during which he torments Amy and Rory is appropriately chilling. This does lead into one of the other few problems with the episode though, the lack of budget is telling in that all we get to see of the TARDIS interior are the corridors. Seeing some corridors is a fun thing for classic Who fans, and they are used very appropriately, but imagine just how weird and frightening this Neil Gaiman story could have been if they'd had the budget or set design that a story like Journey to the Centre of the TARDIS enjoyed? That's always been a fine line for Doctor Who, often the frustrations and limitations of a limited budget can see gold produced (Jaws initially featured a hell of a lot more of the shark, for instance, but it looked so awful they went with suspense and imagination instead, thankfully). They certainly use what they have effectively, the various split-ups that are forced on Amy and Rory are horrifying, particularly when Amy turns a corner and finds Rory's long dead corpse in a corridor that has been absolutely covered in furious scrawlings calling for Amy's death - imagining the torture that would cause Rory (who once waited 2000 years outside of a box for her) to hate Amy is far more effective than anything they could ever show us. Similarly, the old Rory she finds that moans,"THEY COME FOR ME! EVERY NIGHT THEY COME FOR ME!" is far more effective than actually showing whatever "they" were.

The return of the old console room is a nice callback, though it would have been cool to see an even older one. We kinda sorta get that with the jury-rigged TARDIS console that the Doctor and the TARDIS build while bickering like the old married couple they are, but it's another minor thing to complain about given how neat it is to see the Eccleston/Tennant console room again. The Doctor's return to the TARDIS saves Amy and Rory by killing the Ood ("another Ood I failed to save" quips the Doctor), and we get another neat callback, this time to Castrovalva, as the Doctor explains to House how to gain the momentum to escape into the real universe. That moment where it seems House has killed everybody is handled so well, with the near silent shots of the now empty TARDIS, before everybody appears in the current console room where the Doctor once again shows he is one step ahead of everybody (except the TARDIS herself, for whom time is a completely different thing) and has played House into getting them exactly where he wants. Idris' body dies, the TARDIS matrix emerges in the one place House did not want her to be, and you get a great bit with the Doctor listening to House be murdered - "you're so much smaller on the inside" the Doctor warned it, a nice counter to the TARDIS earlier asking if all humans are really "so much bigger on the inside", which itself is a play on how humans usually react to their first entry into the TARDIS itself. The whole story is like this, really - a great story on the surface that also goes deeper. It makes references to both itself and other stories across the entire run of the show, but does it in a way that doesn't alienate the viewer.

The Doctor and the TARDIS say their tearful goodbye, Moffat manages to get in a little foreshadowing for the revelation at the end of A Good Man Goes To War, and the episode ends with a gleeful Doctor dancing happily around the console room, secure in the knowledge that the TARDIS might not be able to talk to him anymore, but it's still there. It's a wonderful standalone episode that could have fit in to any season of the show - if it had been in Season 5, it probably would have lifted that season up to my undisputed absolute favorite of ALL of Doctor Who. About the only sour note for me in their goodbye is that they insisted on having the TARDIS barely audibly call out,"I love you!" as her body burns out (as Rose's would have if the Doctor hadn't taken all the energy out of her), there was no need to include that, it's present in every single element of the story and going out of their way to have her say it just indicates a belief that the audience just wouldn't be capable of understanding it without it being right out there in the open. The love that the Doctor and the TARDIS have for each other is indisputable, it's the entire point of the title of the episode - they are an old married couple, two halves of the same whole, and THIS, this crazy old/new borrowed blue box is the Doctor's true life partner and equal - she's what River has always wanted to be but will always only be a pale imitation of, she's what a confused Rose thought she could have been after having her brain flooded with a mind so far beyond her own that all she remembered at the end of it was a bright light, being kissed, and an endless love for the Doctor.

The Doctor's Wife is just a fantastic, wonderful and deeply moving episode. As emotionally satisfying as it is packed with tension and fantastic quirky little sci-fi nods; a loving nod to continuity that stands as a story in its own right. Season 6 may have its problems overall, but it has a number of very good single episodes, and this episode is the absolute best of the lot.

Shard
Jul 30, 2005

Thanks love. ^^^


Content: Did anyone else get a horrible gut punch feeling when it is revealed what happened to the last people who went to Utopia. I don't think any other media this side of Stephen King's short story Jaunt has given me as much a feeling of dread. It's the idea that the ultimate fate of everyone is death and the best you can do is enjoy it while it lasts. And that's great but man I usually expect a little more hope from my Doctor Who. Unless I'm wrong, that's still the ultimate fate of humans right? Or did one of the resets change that since that Season?

Shard fucked around with this message at 20:20 on Aug 20, 2014

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?

CobiWann posted:



Synopsis – Rushed metaplot points and “tell don’t show” mean that the big finale of the Divergent Universe arc falls flat, overshadowing a great and diverse cast of main and supporting players. 3/5

As it stands, it's a pretty good representation of the Divergent Arc as a whole. Somehow both rushed and taking too long, never quite living up to its potential, inconsistent characterization and everything is held together by the performances of Paul McGann and India Fisher. It's not bad, but it could have been so much better. There was so much potential, and it was pretty criminal how the deadly Divergents (the impossible things that Rassilon could only imprison but never conquer or control) were wiped out off-screen, a pretty goddamn major thing that gets tossed out all matter-of-fact by Keep. There's some poetic justice and I love that the Doctor risks eternal imprisonment just to scold his "kids", and that cliffhanger ending... :swoon:

Spikeguy posted:

Content: Did anyone else get a horrible gut punch feeling when it is revealed what happened to the last people who went to Utopia. I don't think any other media this side of Stephen King's short story Jaunt has given me as much a feeling of dread. It's the idea that the ultimate fate of everyone is death and the best you can do is enjoy it while it lasts. And that's great but man I usually expect a little more hope from my Doctor Who. Unless I'm wrong, that's still the ultimate fate of humans right? Or did one of the resets change that since that Season?

Some people tried to shoehorn in the idea that the end of the universe was actually a result of Davros' Crucible from season 4 ("the stars are going out") and that since that fate was averted, so was the universe's. I disagree with that, it's a separate thing which on the face of it leaves humanity as the last survivors of a universe suffering from the inevitability of entropy, with no hope and ultimately a sense of pointlessness to it. Like you say, it's not at all the type of "there is always hope" message I expect from Doctor Who, but I will note that it's also not a unique take for the show - there have been other times when the show has pointed out some horrible fate awaiting humanity or the universe in the far future, and generally these horrible futures get overwritten at some later point by the Doctor's subsequent actions (even if that is only implied).

So if it makes you feel better, consider that time is always in flux and that was just one possible end for the universe and humanity and not necessarily the ultimate, inescapable ending. Maybe the Doctor rebooting the universe reset everything to zero and brought us another few trillion-trillion years! Maybe the return of the Time Lords will prevent the natural breakdown of things? Maybe everything dies and gets crushed down to a singularity.... but THAT then explodes with a big bang that recreates the universe and the star-stuff that makes up all life is recycled for the latest in an endless series of universes that will go on forever?

FreezingInferno
Jul 15, 2010

THERE.
WILL.
BE.
NO.
BATTLE.
HERE!

Spikeguy posted:

Did anyone else get a horrible gut punch feeling when it is revealed what happened to the last people who went to Utopia. I don't think any other media this side of Stephen King's short story Jaunt has given me as much a feeling of dread.

Longer than you think, Doctor! Longer than you think!

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?

FreezingInferno posted:

Longer than you think, Doctor! Longer than you think!

Fucccck, I think about that story every so often and get chills.

Azubah
Jun 5, 2007

Jerusalem posted:

Fucccck, I think about that story every so often and get chills.

Like diamonds in the sky.

DoctorWhat
Nov 18, 2011

A little privacy, please?

Azubah posted:

Like diamonds in the sky.

The sky is full of diamonds...

MattD1zzl3
Oct 26, 2007
Probation
Can't post for 4 years!

Bicyclops posted:

To be honest, I got mine for posting in GBS and I just stopped doing that.

We'll have to wait until Capaldi leaves and and That Argument pops up again before anyone actually gets angry enough to BRCT anyone in this thread.


Why did you have to mention that? I'd spent the last year putting the future out of my mind, Let me enjoy just the last few years before that argument comes up again. :smith:

PoshAlligator
Jan 9, 2012

When SEO just isn't enough.
So I'm putting together a little fan project/challenge. I would be interested in knowing what people think or if they would be interested in taking part or hearing more.

It's called Target Novelisations Regenerated, and here is a link to an empty WordPress that will eventually be filled.

The idea is to write sort of Target-esque novelizations of modern Doctor Who stories, but the twist is that they feature different Doctors than they're "Supposed to". Someone who is taking part in the challenge (which is what it is, it's not a full blown project really) is, for instance, doing Midnight with Troughton; another is doing Voyage of the Damned with both Hartnell and T. Baker (actually that's me). Ideally it will be interesting to explore the differences, while at the same time writing around a pre-existing story, but with enough leeway to change things. Of course, Midnight will be called Doctor Who and the Midnight Creature.

It's called Regenerated, but it's sort of like a remix, really.

I'm surprised nobody has done this before, so let me know if they have. If anyone would like to take part or whatever, let me know.

PoshAlligator fucked around with this message at 02:59 on Aug 21, 2014

DoctorWhat
Nov 18, 2011

A little privacy, please?

PoshAlligator posted:

So I'm putting together a little fan project/challenge. I would be interested in knowing what people think or if they would be interested in taking part or hearing more.

It's called Target Novels Regenerated, and here is a link to an empty WordPress that will eventually be filled.

The idea is to write sort of Target-esque novelizations of modern Doctor Who stories, but the twist is that they feature different Doctors than they're "Supposed to". Someone who is taking part in the challenge (which is what it is, it's not a full blown project really) is, for instance, doing Midnight with Troughton; another is doing Voyage of the Damned with both Hartnell and T. Baker (actually that's me). Ideally it will be interesting to explore the differences, while at the same time writing around a pre-existing story, but with enough leeway to change things. Of course, Midnight will be called Doctor Who and the Midnight Creature.

It's called Regenerated, but it's sort of like a remix, really.

I'm surprised nobody has done this before, so let me know if they have. If anyone would like to take part or whatever, let me know.



I've been wanting to cast Colin Baker in Doctor Who and The Empty Child for years. Count me in - I've been meaning to flex my writing muscles..

PoshAlligator
Jan 9, 2012

When SEO just isn't enough.

DoctorWhat posted:

I've been wanting to cast Six in The Empty Child for years. Count me in - I've been meaning to flex my writing muscles..

Oh God, finally I can have the greatest fan project in the world with the backing of the most in the now Doctor Who fan.

That's actually a great pairing, I'm PM'ing you the detes.

e: Oh great you don't have PMs. I'll tumbl you or whatever.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?

I don't know if that idea has legs beyond the initial fun of imagining a different Doctor in those situations, but it IS a fun concept that I'm sure we've all considered at some point or another (hell, all those videos of classic Doctors reading modern day Doctor speeches speaks to that). I imagine that a full novelization is likely to stretch the appeal quite a bit though, even for those who would be likely to read them.

To be fair, I probably wouldn't read any of them so maybe I'm the wrong kind of person to speak on it.

DoctorWhat
Nov 18, 2011

A little privacy, please?

Jerusalem posted:

I don't know if that idea has legs beyond the initial fun of imagining a different Doctor in those situations, but it IS a fun concept that I'm sure we've all considered at some point or another (hell, all those videos of classic Doctors reading modern day Doctor speeches speaks to that).

It's a Target Novelization, it only needs legs enough for 128 pages.

PoshAlligator
Jan 9, 2012

When SEO just isn't enough.
Yeah it's just the fun of going for that sort of style.

It's a very informal sort of thing so if you somehow knock out a solid 45k for a 45 minute story (how???) then cool I guess, and if you just want to do like 10k-20k then that would be fine too. Shorter even. Soft rule is 20k-45k. But like, whatever.

PoshAlligator fucked around with this message at 01:39 on Aug 21, 2014

DoctorWhat
Nov 18, 2011

A little privacy, please?

PoshAlligator posted:

Yeah it's just the fun of going for that sort of style.

It's a very informal sort of thing so if you somehow knock out a solid 45k for a 45 minute story (how???), if you just want to do like 10k-20k then that would be fine too. Soft rule is 20k-45k. But like, whatever.

The Empty Child is a 90-minute story but I'm obviously not going to go nuts.

docbeard
Jul 19, 2011

I love this idea. PM'd.

CobiWann
Oct 21, 2009

Have fun!
Colin Baker in Cuddlesome. Already outlining it.

Seriously, let me come up with a good idea involving Eight or Six/Peri...

DoctorWhat
Nov 18, 2011

A little privacy, please?
I'm 500 words in and I'm having the time of my life.

Xibanya
Sep 17, 2012




Clever Betty
I won't contribute but I'll have fun consuming

docbeard
Jul 19, 2011

Comedy Option: The Five-ish Doctors Reboot with David Tennant, Matt Smith, and Peter Capaldi trying to get written into "Doctor Who and the Last Stand Of Gallifrey" (starring Colin Baker and Sylvester McCoy, and special guest star Christopher Lee as the Time Warrior). And Chris Eccleston refusing to return anyone's calls unless you spoof Joe Ahearne's caller ID.

docbeard fucked around with this message at 02:36 on Aug 21, 2014

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?

docbeard posted:

And Chris Eccleston refusing to return anyone's calls unless you spoof Joe Ahearne's caller ID.

Tennant: Jon, can you do a Joe Ahearne impersonation?
Jon Culshaw: Yes, absolutely :smug: ......he uh.... he sounds like Tom Baker, right? :ohdear:

Zaggitz
Jun 18, 2009

My urges are becoming...

UNCONTROLLABLE

From the hatewatch thread:

Toxxupation posted:

Random Thoughts:
I really hope that my desire for a more intelligent, clever Rose this season is paid off.

Please help me I might die of laughter.

Linear Zoetrope
Nov 28, 2011

A hero must cook

Zaggitz posted:

From the hatewatch thread:


Please help me I might die of laughter.

Hey, give Rose some credit. On that episode with the alien that eats people through the TV she figures the entire thing out before the Doctor!

I mean, she's still too dumb to know the cardinal rule of Doctor Who: "never leave the Doctor's side", and promptly got kidnapped, but it's a miniscule amount of progress at least!

Bicyclops
Aug 27, 2004

What's funny is that everyone wants that for Rose, and then they sort of get what they wish for in Martha, in theory, as she is an adept doctor with (presumably) a pretty good education, but she spends her entire time mooning over the Doctor instead of using her doctor skills.

Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010


Ignore my posts!
I'm aggressively wrong about everything!

Bicyclops posted:

What's funny is that everyone wants that for Rose, and then they sort of get what they wish for in Martha, in theory, as she is an adept doctor with (presumably) a pretty good education, but she spends her entire time mooning over the Doctor instead of using her doctor skills.

But then we actually got that in Donna, though, so it's okay.

After The War
Apr 12, 2005

to all of my Architects
let me be traitor

PoshAlligator posted:

Yeah it's just the fun of going for that sort of style.

It's a very informal sort of thing so if you somehow knock out a solid 45k for a 45 minute story (how???) then cool I guess, and if you just want to do like 10k-20k then that would be fine too. Shorter even. Soft rule is 20k-45k. But like, whatever.

PM'd as well. Thinking about doing Beast Below as a Seven/Ace story, but not 100% sure yet. The bizarre plot jumps kind of fit with the three-episode weird structuring of seasons 25 and 26. And I can see Sylvester pulling off the "NOBODY HUMAN HAS ANYTHING TO SAY TO ME" bit with a lot more rolled r's.

Astroman
Apr 8, 2001



It's like they cast Fanservice as The Doctor. :allears:

And I think that Target novel pastiche thing sounds absolutely aces and I can't wait to read 'em.

poo poo, you can just do interesting ones alone if you hit the concept of "what if X Doctor died several stories early and regenerated into the next guy."

Loved Tegan and 6 in "A Fix With Sontarans? Well imagine if Davison had bit it oh, in say, Arc of Infinity? Now you have a whole season of C-Bakes mucking around with Tegan, Nyssa, and Turlough. The Doctor trys to strangle Nyssa! Let's see him handle Turlough! And the Black Guardian! :smug: "Change, my friends, and not a moment too soon!"

Or what if 7 had been there for the Trial of a Timelord? 8 in Paradise Towers?

Big Finish should have thought of this years ago. :colbert:

Chokes McGee
Aug 7, 2008

This is Urotsuki.
"Hmm. This 'Pertwee' fellow seems to know what it's all about."
     /

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Forktoss
Feb 13, 2012

I'm OK, you're so-so
Just rewatched An Adventure in Space and Time, and it just keeps getting better every time. They reference it briefly during the Marco Polo scenes, but I love the story Mark Eden tells in one of the documentaries about how Hartnell once got angry on the set and let everyone have it, and afterwards he apologised by buying flowers to all the ladies and, obviously not quite knowing what to get them, giving the men tins of biscuits. :allears: A rock to the head and a biscuit to apologise, that's our sweet old Billy.

PoshAlligator posted:

Target Novelisations Regenerated

That's a really fun idea! Can't wait to see what people will come up with.

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