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NihilCredo
Jun 6, 2011

iram omni possibili modo preme:
plus una illa te diffamabit, quam multæ virtutes commendabunt



like, I'm still lol'ing at that post

saying that putting an app in docker is making it more complex to operate because it's an extra dependency is like saying that putting your groceries in a bag makes them harder to take home because you bought an extra item

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DoomTrainPhD
Feb 12, 2009



NihilCredo posted:

like, I'm still lol'ing at that post

saying that putting an app in docker is making it more complex to operate because it's an extra dependency is like saying that putting your groceries in a bag makes them harder to take home because you bought an extra item

I put all of the sand directly on the ground because a box for the sand is an extra item.

Mr. Crow
May 22, 2008

Snap City mayor for life


Use podman not docker op.

Mr. Crow
May 22, 2008

Snap City mayor for life


Then you can manage those pesky dependencies with podman auto-update !!!

Mr. Crow
May 22, 2008

Snap City mayor for life


Or not I stopped caring about dependencies 6 years ago :laugh:

Progressive JPEG
Feb 19, 2003



is this the modern equivalent of people complaining about how many kilobytes of disk an executable uses?

Armitag3
Mar 15, 2020

Forget it Jake, it's cybertown.



I hate docker because it slurps up battery on my mac dev machine like some posters' mommas

Cybernetic Vermin
Apr 18, 2005



i hate docker too, and don't even bother having very specific reasons. but obviously it basically one-stop solves deployment/dependencies.

hobbesmaster
Jan 28, 2008



Nomnom Cookie posted:

real alternatives offered by real yospos posters:
* simply do not have more than 3 EC2 instances
* docker swarm
* bake an AMI for each app and run everything in ASGs
* have a single mission critical server that is never allowed to have even a minute of downtime, even for a kernel update

might as well throw in serverless

SYSV Fanfic
Sep 9, 2003



And the cloud was just called "time sharing".

MrMoo
Sep 14, 2000



Nomnom Cookie posted:

can you not mount a volume into multiple dockers using compose? its trivial with kubernetes (i am not suggesting using kubernetes)

Thanks all, I only just noticed this was an option, and also it can be read-only as a bonus.

I'm mixing between different source images for each container, most are simply batch processing and presenting processed content out of memory, the end user also being async stale-while-revalidate. The NGINX container is the only one significantly doing anything, so comparisons can be made.

Nomnom Cookie
Aug 30, 2009





hobbesmaster posted:

might as well throw in serverless

you would think, but no. i don't recall a yosposter ever suggesting serverless as an alternative to kubernetes, despite it being a better choice in many circumstances. they rather pretend that whatever dumb thing their job does is the best

Truga
May 4, 2014


Lipstick Apathy

trip report, i tried updating to latest stable, and then also experimental stuff from upstream yesterday to see how wayland works, and it's still.. not perfect. i lose some 3D performance over X (it's minimal but it's there, 5-10% in worst cases) even with latest wayland/kernel/mesa which i found rather odd because X is supposed to be this antiquated hog that makes everything run bad

variable refresh rate in 3D apps is somewhat jankier. instead of being smooth, i sometimes see it jumping between 70 and 165hz in situations where under X it smoothly follows framerate, and the resulting stutter is noticeable at times, and just disabling vsync ends up being smoother in games that can't keep a steady performance

it works *really* well with plasma, however, refreshing at 48hz when nothing's moving (monitor's lower limit) theoretically saving a bit of power (should be nice for getting a few more minutes of battery on laptops that support vrr), and syncing perfectly when something's moving for real smooth and sharp scrolling/dragging/playback/etc. firefox randomly locks up during video playback, however


also, mumble requires compiling from git for push to talk to work. supposedly gonna be available in 1.4 release but who knows when the hell that is. discord push to talk flat out doesn't work, i worked around this by setting a plasma hotkey to run a script that toggles my mic on/off lol

lastly, none of F13-F24 keys work, lmfao. they show up correctly in libinput debug-events, but do not get passed through to desktop/apps for some reason, and show up in xev as 0 byte events. i use them as an easy "this key is definitely not already hotkeyed to poo poo in bad apps that don't allow remapping" to easily do non-conflicting desktop hotkeys, so it's very much a dealbreaker for now


i restored back my plain debian 11 and i'm staying on X for now, but it's good to see some progress is being made at least, though i don't yet see any reason to switch on a non-laptop

BlankSystemDaemon
Mar 13, 2009

System Access Node
Not Found:ins:




SYSV Fanfic posted:

And the cloud was just called "time sharing".
a time shared butt

NihilCredo
Jun 6, 2011

iram omni possibili modo preme:
plus una illa te diffamabit, quam multæ virtutes commendabunt



tfw you have a list of codes in a text file and you want to find all files that contain any of them, so you do:

Bash code:
cat barcodes.txt | tr '\n' '|' | head -c -1 | xargs -i grep -Elr '{}' .
and you feel all greybeardy and wizardy then realized you could have just done

Bash code:
grep -lr -f barcodes.txt .

DoomTrainPhD
Feb 12, 2009



This morning, despite their promises, IT shut off the NetExtender VPN. My entire team now canít use docker for development and many of them were denied their request for the new Cisco VPN because theyíre contractors. What a mess lol.

BlankSystemDaemon
Mar 13, 2009

System Access Node
Not Found:ins:




NihilCredo posted:

tfw you have a list of codes in a text file and you want to find all files that contain any of them, so you do:

Bash code:
cat barcodes.txt | tr '\n' '|' | head -c -1 | xargs -i grep -Elr '{}' .
and you feel all greybeardy and wizardy then realized you could have just done

Bash code:
grep -lr -f barcodes.txt .
it's kind of a GNUism because GNU grep evolved a bunch of options that replicate other functionality, but it doesn't mean they have to be used - i still would've done the first way, simply because it's easier to think in terms of pipelines and small utilities for me
same thing happened to GNU ls - and both of them ended up being ported to BSD grep and BSD ls because they were so commonly used that people kept asking about them

later on, these options also started being added to speed things up - for example `find <expr> -exec grep <expr2> {} +` being used as a weird incantation of magic characters, instead of piping to xargs because it used to be faster than using piping, instead of you know making pipes faster
same weird optimization philosophy also got applied to GNU yes, so that it's incredibly fast, for no easily ascertainable reason

long options are also a GNUism and i seem to recall that they were originally supposed to be used only for scripting - the idea being that it's easier to read the script if you know what's being done, but then what's the point of manual pagesGNU info?

BlankSystemDaemon fucked around with this message at 18:23 on Dec 2, 2021

mawarannahr
May 21, 2019



BlankSystemDaemon posted:

it's kind of a GNUism because GNU grep evolved a bunch of options that replicate other functionality, but it doesn't mean they have to be used - i still would've done the first way, simply because it's easier to think in terms of pipelines and small utilities for me
same thing happened to GNU ls - and both of them ended up being ported to BSD grep and BSD ls because they were so commonly used that people kept asking about them

later on, these options also started being added to speed things up - for example `find <expr> -exec grep <expr2> {} +` being used as a weird incantation of magic characters, instead of piping to xargs because it used to be faster than using piping, instead of you know making pipes faster
same weird optimization philosophy also got applied to GNU yes, so that it's incredibly fast, for no easily ascertainable reason

long options are also a GNUism and i seem to recall that they were originally supposed to be used only for scripting - the idea being that it's easier to read the script if you know what's being done, but then what's the point of manual pagesGNU info?

-f is posix, op

mystes
May 31, 2006



BlankSystemDaemon posted:

it's kind of a GNUism because GNU grep evolved a bunch of options that replicate other functionality, but it doesn't mean they have to be used - i still would've done the first way, simply because it's easier to think in terms of pipelines and small utilities for me
same thing happened to GNU ls - and both of them ended up being ported to BSD grep and BSD ls because they were so commonly used that people kept asking about them

later on, these options also started being added to speed things up - for example `find <expr> -exec grep <expr2> {} +` being used as a weird incantation of magic characters, instead of piping to xargs because it used to be faster than using piping, instead of you know making pipes faster
same weird optimization philosophy also got applied to GNU yes, so that it's incredibly fast, for no easily ascertainable reason

long options are also a GNUism and i seem to recall that they were originally supposed to be used only for scripting - the idea being that it's easier to read the script if you know what's being done, but then what's the point of manual pagesGNU info?
The bsd thread is over there in the basement somewhere

BlankSystemDaemon
Mar 13, 2009

System Access Node
Not Found:ins:




mawarannahr posted:

-f is posix, op
small utilities and pipelines aren't a posix thing, it's a unix principle
-r doesn't exist and i'm pretty sure the behaviour of -l is subtly different

Gentle Autist
Jun 4, 2003



Nomnom Cookie posted:

real alternatives offered by real yospos posters:
* simply do not have more than 3 EC2 instances
* docker swarm
* bake an AMI for each app and run everything in ASGs
* have a single mission critical server that is never allowed to have even a minute of downtime, even for a kernel update

what about ecs precious

Gentle Autist
Jun 4, 2003



NihilCredo posted:

like, I'm still lol'ing at that post

saying that putting an app in docker is making it more complex to operate because it's an extra dependency is like saying that putting your groceries in a bag makes them harder to take home because you bought an extra item

this is a great analogy :tipshat:

Gentle Autist
Jun 4, 2003



Progressive JPEG posted:

is this the modern equivalent of people complaining about how many kilobytes of disk an executable uses?

no, thatís people complaining about javascript while spending 12 hours a day using apps built in it

Nomnom Cookie
Aug 30, 2009





Gentle Autist posted:

what about ecs precious

right? but no one has ever said to me "don't use eks, ecs is fine" in yospos, or anything similar. there are very good alternatives to kubernetes and yet the people who are loudest about it sucking only ever suggest utterly terrible things instead

psiox
Oct 15, 2001

Babylon 5 Street Team

ecs is absolutely fine

unless you want to spend vc money on the jobs program that is Kubernetes

Gentle Autist
Jun 4, 2003



Nomnom Cookie posted:

right? but no one has ever said to me "don't use eks, ecs is fine" in yospos, or anything similar. there are very good alternatives to kubernetes and yet the people who are loudest about it sucking only ever suggest utterly terrible things instead

i work for aws and tell people this but I would would I

Iím also reluctant to run down Kubernetes too much to customers because I donít want to appear like rear end in a top hat vendor guy shilling my own companies products but I do try to qualify why they are considering k8s if asked. itís hard to push back against that tide

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hifi
Jul 25, 2012



BlankSystemDaemon posted:

it's kind of a GNUism because GNU grep evolved a bunch of options that replicate other functionality, but it doesn't mean they have to be used - i still would've done the first way, simply because it's easier to think in terms of pipelines and small utilities for me
same thing happened to GNU ls - and both of them ended up being ported to BSD grep and BSD ls because they were so commonly used that people kept asking about them

later on, these options also started being added to speed things up - for example `find <expr> -exec grep <expr2> {} +` being used as a weird incantation of magic characters, instead of piping to xargs because it used to be faster than using piping, instead of you know making pipes faster
same weird optimization philosophy also got applied to GNU yes, so that it's incredibly fast, for no easily ascertainable reason

long options are also a GNUism and i seem to recall that they were originally supposed to be used only for scripting - the idea being that it's easier to read the script if you know what's being done, but then what's the point of manual pagesGNU info?

thats all good stuff

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