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Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


Best viewed on Orgasma Plasma
Lipstick Apathy

I remember Notorious b.s.d. 's rant about ubuntu, it was unusable because everything was in universe and universe was best effort support
now universe is supported for 10 years, so its Notorious b.s.d. approved

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burning swine
May 26, 2004



so do you have to pay the recurring fee to get updates to stuff in universe

also lmao at the "tell everyone to gently caress off for 20 years, then charge to reach parity with the free offerings" business plan

burning swine
May 26, 2004



naturally i have bsd's post saved because it's good poo poo

quote:

Notorious b.s.d. posted:
The problem with Ubuntu isn't a matter of taste. It's not that I don't like Unity, or I have bad feelings about Shuttleworth, or that the logo doesn't agree with me. It's much more fundamental: The Ubuntu model for development is broken.

Ubuntu periodically forks Debian's "Unstable" tree (Debian's rolling release). Canonical, inc. works from that snapshot for six months, and then publishes a Ubuntu release.

Inside that Ubuntu release, there is a core of Canonical-supported packages. Canonical accepts bug reports for these packages. These packages receive updates for the supported lifetime of the release. Ubuntu's "core" is supported much the way that Debian or CentOS is.

The problem is that this core is only a fraction of the packages on the system. Ubuntu 14.04, the latest "long term support" release, contains 44378 packages. Only 8751 of them are in the supported part. The rest of the packages go into a separate repository, "Universe."

The packages in Universe, the missing 35 thousand packages, are six months old on release day. They've gone six months without updates or security patches. By the end of the release cycle, they're five and a half years out of date.

--

Shadowhawk will doubtlessly point out that a legion of unpaid, untrained, unorganized volunteers can "maintain" packages in universe. But it's completely optional. Any given package might be untouched (bad), get backported security updates (good), be updated religiously from upstream (really bad), or replaced with something completely different from debian (really, really bad).

There's no release management process. There are no guarantees about what you find in Universe. It's totally up to the kindness of individual strangers.

Universe and Launchpad.net are sources of "works on my machine" issues and security holes. And that is all I have to say about that.

--

Of course, all this peril can be avoided if you don't enable the "Universe" repositories. If you restrict yourself to the core and update repos, you should have no problems. In that case, Ubuntu could be just fine.

Now let's try to use it.

I'd like to build a ruby application.
Whoops. There's no bundler. That was part of Universe.

Python?
Oops. No pypi and no virtualenv. Those are also stuck in Universe.

Java?
Sorry. Maven was also part of Universe.

Perl?
Nope, no mod_perl2.

PHP?
Actually, PHP works fine with only core. All the necessary bits are supported. I can say without any trace of sarcasm that Ubuntu is 100% totally suitable to hosting PHP applications.

my homie dhall
Dec 9, 2010

honey, oh please, it's just a machine
nbsd come back

Nomnom Cookie
Aug 30, 2009



he’s in posting heaven now, judging gods shoes

jesus WEP
Oct 17, 2004


my homie dhall posted:

nbsd come back
veto

Cybernetic Vermin
Apr 18, 2005

i liked nbsd, but there's really no need for him to come back now since burning swine has already made the post. couple of years down the line maybe.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016

https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/byobspacebuds.gif
https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/trustfists.png
https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/pigballswebsitegang.gif
https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/errorinvalidgangtag.png

my homie dhall posted:

nbsd come back

Kazinsal
Dec 13, 2011


my homie dhall posted:

nbsd come back

hard pass given his last ban was for defending lowtax's wifebeating habit by saying "well we don't know, she could have earned it by being a walking dumpster fire"

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016

https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/byobspacebuds.gif
https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/trustfists.png
https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/pigballswebsitegang.gif
https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/errorinvalidgangtag.png

Kazinsal posted:

hard pass given his last ban was for defending lowtax's wifebeating habit by saying "well we don't know, she could have earned it by being a walking dumpster fire"

you make a good point.

I rescind my petition

hifi
Jul 25, 2012

ubuntu pro, aka fedora

Sapozhnik
Jan 2, 2005

Nap Ghost

hifi posted:

ubuntu pro, aka fedora

Best Bi Geek Squid
Mar 25, 2016
https://github.com/ggandor/leap.nvim

this is the future vim users want and its disgusting

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016

https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/byobspacebuds.gif
https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/trustfists.png
https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/pigballswebsitegang.gif
https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/errorinvalidgangtag.png

Best Bi Geek Squid posted:

https://github.com/ggandor/leap.nvim

this is the future vim users want and its disgusting


incorrect

the future vim users want has already been here for decades and they just want nobody to deprecate it

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016

https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/byobspacebuds.gif
https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/trustfists.png
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people who want to "improve" vim with autoindent and autocomment and etc can die in a fire because it's so hard to disable

I will admit that syntax highlighting has been somewhat useful but otherwise vim has been fine for decades already

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016

https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/byobspacebuds.gif
https://fi.somethingawful.com/images/gangtags/trustfists.png
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the last thing any veteran programmer wants is literally anything to attempt to be "clairvoyant" because gently caress that poo poo, just have the simplest logic and don't move my cursor unless I explicitly tell you to

Nomnom Cookie
Aug 30, 2009



hackernews is leaking

BlankSystemDaemon
Mar 13, 2009
nvi :colbert:

Cybernetic Vermin
Apr 18, 2005

Best Bi Geek Squid posted:

https://github.com/ggandor/leap.nvim

this is the future vim users want and its disgusting

tbh atom/vscode jumpy just seems the ideal navigation to me these days

Baxate
Feb 1, 2011

Cybernetic Vermin posted:

tbh atom/vscode jumpy just seems the ideal navigation to me these days



thats nothing more than vim easymotion

Captain Foo
May 11, 2004

we vibin'
we slidin'
we breathin'
we dyin'
who needs they vimussy exited

cum jabbar
Feb 19, 2008

Grimey Drawer
just use a mouse ffs

eschaton
Mar 7, 2007

Don't you just hate when you wind up in a store with people who are in a socioeconomic class that is pretty obviously about two levels lower than your own?

sb hermit posted:

the future vim users want has already been here for decades and they just want nobody to deprecate it

vi has been deprecated since everyone replaced their cheapass ADM-3A terminals with terminals having actual arrow keys

dioxazine
Oct 14, 2004

cum jabbar posted:

just use a mouse ffs

qsvui
Aug 23, 2003
some crazy thing

cum jabbar posted:

just use a mouse ffs

did you just tell me to go gently caress myself

eschaton
Mar 7, 2007

Don't you just hate when you wind up in a store with people who are in a socioeconomic class that is pretty obviously about two levels lower than your own?
no that was me when I said vi is deprecated

I wonder what it’d take to get the next UNIX spec to no longer include it

FlapYoJacks
Feb 12, 2009

VI, VIM and EMacs are all bad.

BlankSystemDaemon
Mar 13, 2009

FlapYoJacks posted:

VI, VIM and EMacs are all bad.
clearly the only editor is ed, it's right in the name

BobHoward
Feb 13, 2012

The only thing white people deserve is a bullet to their empty skull

eschaton posted:

no that was me when I said vi is deprecated

I wonder what it’d take to get the next UNIX spec to no longer include it

i wonder what it would take for there to be a next UNIX spec

pseudorandom name
May 6, 2007

more than one Unix

cowboy beepboop
Feb 24, 2001


can you host exchange on linux yet

NihilCredo
Jun 6, 2011

iram omni possibili modo preme:
plus una illa te diffamabit, quam multæ virtutes commendabunt

cum jabbar posted:

just use a mouse ffs

i have a touchscreen so I move the cursor by projecting my tongue like a chameleon

Cybernetic Vermin
Apr 18, 2005

cowboy beepboop posted:

can you host exchange on linux yet

why would you host exchange? it is included in your o365 subscription

Kazinsal
Dec 13, 2011


Cybernetic Vermin posted:

why would you host exchange? it is included in your o365 subscription

:hmmyes:

Captain Foo
May 11, 2004

we vibin'
we slidin'
we breathin'
we dyin'

Cybernetic Vermin posted:

why would you host exchange? it is included in your o365 subscription

Truga
May 4, 2014
Lipstick Apathy

hifi posted:

ubuntu pro, aka fedora

isn't fedora only supported for like 6 months?

Cybernetic Vermin posted:

why would you host exchange? it is included in your o365 subscription

o365 is insanely expensive. i moved to o365 at work recently and the cost is like 600% of self-hosting, and that's including the hours i did on the old exchange servers. i poo poo on microsoft a lot, but self-hosted exchange is p. much bulletproof, and you can more easily have a proper spam filter running in front of it. we moved to o365 because the big email providers now regularly just black hole email that is not from a big email provider lol

Buck Turgidson
Feb 6, 2011

FlapYoJacks posted:

VI, VIM and EMacs are all bad.

*cracking knuckles* looks like we got ourselves a kakoune user over here

Cybernetic Vermin
Apr 18, 2005

Truga posted:

o365 is insanely expensive. i moved to o365 at work recently and the cost is like 600% of self-hosting, and that's including the hours i did on the old exchange servers. i poo poo on microsoft a lot, but self-hosted exchange is p. much bulletproof, and you can more easily have a proper spam filter running in front of it. we moved to o365 because the big email providers now regularly just black hole email that is not from a big email provider lol

eeeh, the e1 $10/seat/month remains a really good deal to my mind. even if i had several employee with all the skills to run an exchange server i would struggle to motivate making that an in-house risk.

i still expect microsoft to ramp that up one of these days.

Private Speech
Mar 30, 2011

I HAVE EVEN MORE WORTHLESS BEANIE BABIES IN MY COLLECTION THAN I HAVE WORTHLESS POSTS IN THE BEANIE BABY THREAD YET I STILL HAVE THE TEMERITY TO CRITICIZE OTHERS' COLLECTIONS

IF YOU SEE ME TALKING ABOUT BEANIE BABIES, PLEASE TELL ME TO

EAT. SHIT.


Cybernetic Vermin posted:

eeeh, the e1 $10/seat/month remains a really good deal to my mind. even if i had several employee with all the skills to run an exchange server i would struggle to motivate making that an in-house risk.

i still expect microsoft to ramp that up one of these days.

I reckon they're pretty happy with it:

quote:

Ms. Foley says that Microsoft disclosed the Microsoft 365 revenues during a private Ready session with employees and partners. At $20 billion, Microsoft 365 contributed almost 14 percent of Microsoft’s $143 billion in total revenues from FY2020, which ended on June 30.

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Sapozhnik
Jan 2, 2005

Nap Ghost
yeah they're making enough money on it. just the right amount of money, not too little and not too much. making too much money on this product or service would be immoral, they would never do something like that.

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