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doctrinal war! fight fight
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Apr 16, 2025 12:45
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eschaton posted:if a Linux distribution were to say “we only ship one UI toolkit and all applications we ship use it, we guarantee forward binary compatibility for anything built against our distribution’s SDK which includes that toolkit, and we’re sponsoring work on that toolkit to ensure it gets all the features we need to be competitive” that would have really moved the needle in as late as 2006 eschaton posted:now the most popular Linux distribution in the world, Android, does work that way, but nobody uses it on the desktop just the phone and tablet
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Apr 16, 2025 12:48
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FAT32 SHAMER posted:just do Debian or Fedora 
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Apr 16, 2025 15:34
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infernal machines posted:doctrinal war!
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Apr 16, 2025 15:59
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Thinking about switching to Silverblue but formatting/reinstalling would be a giant pain in the rear end
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Apr 16, 2025 16:03
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eschaton posted:if a Linux distribution were to say “we only ship one UI toolkit and all applications we ship use it, we guarantee forward binary compatibility for anything built against our distribution’s SDK which includes that toolkit, and we’re sponsoring work on that toolkit to ensure it gets all the features we need to be competitive” that would have really moved the needle in as late as 2006 And if a bunch of people in the mid 90s hadn't had the heebie-jeebies about Qt (claiming it's about the licence but half the time it was actually because 'euw C++'), thanks Miguel de Icaza, we could have had that. No need for sponsorship, even, Trolltech were doing perfectly fine as is seeing as they had, y'know, an actual revenue stream from companies making proprietary software. And then of course he hosed off to do .NET stuff then work for actual Microsoft anyway and it turns out C with a million ugly casts and manually-constructed vtbls isn't actually a good language for UI development to the extent that the Gnome people created their own C++ with hookers and blackjack in an attempt to replace it, so, joke's on you 90s free software zealots. feedmegin fucked around with this message at 16:06 on Apr 16, 2025 |
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Apr 16, 2025 16:04
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he did try to make mono the thing for a long time, and he was entirely correct about it. but linux nerds went "eww microsoft" about it until he bought a mac and moved on.
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Apr 16, 2025 16:07
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feedmegin posted:'euw C++' this is a correct and sound opinion to hold, and only becomes more correct the more you learn about it and the more you think about it
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Apr 16, 2025 16:52
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whenever this discussion comes up it makes me wanna give Kotlin’s Multiplatform compose UI a go. it’s really nice to work with in Android development and could be awesome for making desktop UI for native Linux stuff
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Apr 16, 2025 17:01
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infernal machines posted:doctrinal war!
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Apr 16, 2025 17:21
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gnome's so-called "platform" is strange because instead of supporting programs written in one implementation language for a very long time, it instead supports programs written in a wide variety of implementation languages for approximately six months at a time. i guess that's to be expected of something developed by amateurs that are capable of neither consensus nor commitment. microsoft also tried to create a platform that supported multiple implementation languages on an equal basis. their effort was called COM, and despite a valiant and sustained effort on their part it didn't really catch on. GObject is COM but worse.
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Apr 16, 2025 17:37
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pure revisionism to say that com did not catch on on windows.
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Apr 16, 2025 17:40
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though entirely separately: you'll never find anyone who without irony *likes* com. but the commitment was complete, lots of bindings were made, and the bindings are still used a lot all over.
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Apr 16, 2025 17:45
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Late to distro-chat, but want to rant about something that happened on Ubuntu which is what we use on our dev machines: 1. I save most of my downloaded work-files in /tmp, because a) rarely do I need them more than once, b) quite a few of them contain sensitive info and c) I know that /tmp is guaranteed to be wiped on shutdown. 1a. Tangentially I also wrote a thing that converts .msg files to a tmpdir with .html+attachments and auto-opens them in a browser. So opening stuff from /tmp in a browser is a thing I'd like to do regularly. 2. Of course since this is Ubuntu, Firefox runs in a Snap thingy. 3. The Snap thingy comes with sandboxing. That's good. 4. It turns out that by default Firefox does not get read-access to /tmp thanks to that sandboxing, only to $HOME. Meaning I can't open .html files which are contained in /tmp. Breaking my workflow. That's bad. 5. But no worry, there's a text file for configuring the sandboxing, so you can just add an entry for /tmp there with sudo nano. That's good. 6. Except lol of course it also turns out that Snap Sandboxing fucks this up, as it creates some kind of private /tmp for each Snap seperately at like /run/user/1000/whatever, and as a consequence there's is no sane way to access the system /tmp from Snaps. That's baaad. 7. The easiest workaround for this according to people on stack-overflow is to mkdir $HOME/tmp, mount /tmp into it via an fstab entry, navigate to $HOME/tmp in your file explorer and open the html from there. That's bad. Afaict after a few years on this distro, that's the kind of stuff that's just a normal part of The Ubuntu Experience. (speaking of Snap, apparently the way it creates executables is by symlinking, e.g. /snap/bin/chromium is a symlink to /usr/bin/snap, and /snap/bin is on the $PATH. Meaning any app/script/whatever that looks for a chromium on $PATH, gets the absolute path obtained thusly and also happens to resolve symlinks will in fact just call /usr/bin/snap with the args that were supposed to be passed to chromium. With bad results.) Ocean of Milk fucked around with this message at 18:48 on Apr 16, 2025 |
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Apr 16, 2025 18:46
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e: you can remove firefox snap and download firefox deb and install that lmao i do have one memory of com one of the part time jobs i had in 2005 or 2006 was janitoring pcs of some investment firm and they used competing investment software suites, and the installers would nuke com and odbc bindings for each other, and 95% of my job there was to fight with mmc until it was possible to run both on their desktops lmao Truga fucked around with this message at 18:49 on Apr 16, 2025 |
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Apr 16, 2025 18:47
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Of course Canonical decided to make their own lovely version of flatpak instead of adopting flatpaks for some reason. Of course they are lovely compared to flatpak as well.
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Apr 16, 2025 18:57
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I don't think that's specific to Ubuntu, /tmp is not really a well-liked part of the standard UNIX filesystem layout because it kind of acts like a dumping ground that every security principal running on the system has at least some access to and that's not great from a security standpoint. Flatpak has a similar sandboxing thing going on. If you really insist on specifically using /tmp and nothing else will do then yes bind-mounting it into your home directory is probably the least worst thing you can do.
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Apr 16, 2025 19:00
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repeatedly owning myself in a biannual attempt to move away from windows because i refuse to write down or memorize the correct boot process
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Apr 16, 2025 20:11
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Ocean of Milk posted:6. Except lol of course it also turns out that Snap Sandboxing fucks this up, as it creates some kind of private /tmp for each Snap seperately at like /run/user/1000/whatever, and as a consequence there's is no sane way to access the system /tmp from Snaps. That's baaad.
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Apr 16, 2025 21:43
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Stux posted:the reality of running arch vs the expectation of it being hard to use and for experts has been hella confusing for me so far. going to assume it was worse a while ago or something I ran arch linux for 7 years before 2016 and the only major problem I had was "not reading the newsletter to run some command that they need you to run on upgrade". Yes one time I did cause a kernel panic by doing that, but that was only once and it was mostly my fault for not upgrading regularly lmfao. Outside of that it was smooth as butter and I didn't have any major problems.
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Apr 18, 2025 11:23
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infernal machines posted:i don't usually go for cutting-edge releases. corel linux has served me fine and frankly i don't see a reason to upgrade
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Apr 18, 2025 11:31
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it’s surprising to me that all you folks are allowing linux of any variety into your homes
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Apr 18, 2025 12:19
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my homie dhall posted:it’s surprising to me that all you folks are allowing linux of any variety into your homes my boomer parents use linux with little to no problem (i get called far less than with windows and its usually "oh this website is just weird as hell" not "no i have no idea why ur usb drive isnt working") my main machine now is a steam deck and its Fine, most powerful gpu in the house lmao, but outside that ive been distrohopping for like a decade. i think its only in the last 5 - 8 years that valve's funding of upstream development has really catapulted into being really nice to use compared to windows and mac
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Apr 18, 2025 12:58
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yeah my dad's been using lunix on a laptop for a long rear end time and the only time i had to tinker with it was when i had to find a driver for his win2k era flatbed scanner because it no longer works in win10+ lol
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Apr 18, 2025 16:35
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my homie dhall posted:it’s surprising to me that all you folks are allowing linux of any variety into your homes you are likely surrounded by little linux turdlets that you don't even realize are there
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Apr 18, 2025 16:37
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I just set up a spare raspberry pi as a home assistant server and it’s very good and needs suiting. I bought a cheap €20 zigbee 3.0 usb stick for it and everything just works.
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Apr 18, 2025 18:34
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my homie dhall posted:it’s surprising to me that all you folks are allowing linux of any variety into your homes the only other option was staying on ltsc iot win10 until 2032 and then setting my comptuer on fire the second its eol bcos im not installing win11
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Apr 18, 2025 19:41
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Stux posted:the only other option was staying on ltsc iot win10 until 2032 and then setting my comptuer on fire the second its eol bcos im not installing win11 Don’t worry, Win12 will be out by then and it will have SO MANY USEFULL AI FEATURES! Such as….
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Apr 18, 2025 19:53
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Stux posted:the only other option was staying on ltsc iot win10 until 2032 and then setting my comptuer on fire the second its eol bcos im not installing win11 lmao nevermind i missed the 11
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Apr 19, 2025 01:35
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FlapYoJacks posted:I just set up a spare raspberry pi as a home assistant server and it’s very good and needs suiting. I bought a cheap €20 zigbee 3.0 usb stick for it and everything just works. what does this mean?
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Apr 19, 2025 01:45
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Last Chance posted:what does this mean? FlapYoJacks posted:I just set up a spare raspberry pi as a home assistant server and it’s very good and needs suiting. I bought a cheap €20 zigbee 3.0 usb stick for it and everything just works.
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Apr 19, 2025 01:48
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oh so like a Linux smart home? hopefully that works
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Apr 19, 2025 01:54
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Last Chance posted:oh so like a Linux smart home? hopefully that works At the very least it'll be quiet
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Apr 19, 2025 03:11
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Buck Turgidson posted:At the very least it'll be quiet
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Apr 19, 2025 09:30
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i have been meaning to check out home assistant, most of the stuff in my house is in apple home and i have very few complaints or things i notice that are missing features though im not interested in almost any automation, just remote control turns out the one automation i did want is not supported (or possible?) in apple home: having an automation run a certain delay after the event that triggers it, like specifically “turn bathroom exhaust fan off one hour after it turns on”, had to set up a dummy switch in homebridge and do two automations to make that work from everything ive seen, home assistant is really well done and it can control homekit-native devices, then you can bridge the whole setup back into apple home last i checked connecting a new matter over thread device directly to home assistant wasnt that trivial though
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Apr 20, 2025 13:42
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i hear almost exclusively positive things about home assistant and the overall ecosystem at this point. and not the usual stockholm syndrome positive things even.
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Apr 20, 2025 13:56
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home assistant is v good and the community is very active and helpful
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Apr 20, 2025 14:06
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IDEK what I'd be doing with that poo poo. "close the blinds after the sun hits a certain level" ok but i could just do that with my arms and get the exercise. "turn the heating to x" ok but the dial is right there and I don't care that much about the temperature of the room, if its cold thats cooling and refreshing. if its hot, well, lol, we dont have aircon anyway
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Apr 20, 2025 14:06
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yeah it’s excellent. I have zero complaints about it.
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Apr 20, 2025 14:07
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anything even remotely non-trivial is easier to sort out by hand rather than faffing with configs and also would require a level of integration that i have neither the will nor the means for
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Apr 20, 2025 14:08
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