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BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

mystes posted:

oh-my-zsh is the worst name and that's saying a lot

haven't you ever heard the common turn of phrase "oh my zeesh?"

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BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

carry on then posted:

remember to flatten and reinstall your body regularly. store your brain on a separate partition so you don't have to make a backup every time.

I didn't know this when I set myself up so now I'm a walking pile of kludges and hacks that regularly needs to boot into recovery mode

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

I like using it, its timers and services are very good

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

speaking of tab completion, modern bash (though I don't know how modern since I stopped paying attention to linux for more than a decade until last year) has some magical tab completion that is aware of switches and arguments of various commands and can autocomplete those

for instance, I have a file text indexer, recoll, running on my document repository as a service, and I have a systemd unit file for it called recoll.service placed in /etc/systemd/system. If I want to stop it, I can type systemctl stop rec<tab> and it autocompletes the filename, even if I'm not currently in /etc/systemd/system where the unit file is located - it's aware of where the unit files are and that this is the argument where I'd be entering a unit file filename

again I don't know how new and impressive that is but I thought it was pretty cool when I found it

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Rufus Ping posted:

Unsurprisingly it's all rigged up using horrific shell scripts https://www.gnu.org/software/bash/manual/html_node/Programmable-Completion.html

Poopernickel posted:

It's actually not part of bash. Tab completion scripts are almost always packaged separately and aren't part of Bash at all. Bash knows how to execute an entry script function in response to a tab, and that's it. The rest is all external.

There's a standard bash-completion package on most distros. Systemd's completion scripts are managed separately. They're an optional component when building systemd from source.

:oh:

well, terrible or not under the hood, I still enjoy it

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

carry on then posted:

my hobby server doesn't do that, because i do not let the accursed gui packages foul its serverly grace

I use recoll on my server, which indexes the text in documents and lets you search for phrases. It has a GUI and a command line version. There are actually separate packages for both versions and a "recoll" package that installs both packages. I didn't know this at first and installed the "recoll" package on my command line only server.

The web of GUI dependencies that the GUI version has is so huge and tangled that it somehow went and installed wpasupplicant and the avahi daemon on my server that had no need for either of those things. I guess you wouldn't notice normally because the Debian desktop comes with both of those in the standard package list but it was annoying realizing how much cruft ended up on my server

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

you don't need consistency when you can pipe them through a dozen different plaintext processing programs to extract what you need

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

is beyond grep like beyond meat?

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

Sapozhnik posted:

while we're at it let's add an ioctl that performs transparent audio and video compression and decompression, oh and maintains a seek index as well obviously

I don't know what the rest means but did anyone ever try to make thing a thing???

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

xfce is very needs-suiting to me

it's light, looks good enough, does everything I expect, doesn't try to do anything fancy, puts stuff in the places I expect to find it, and its default utilities don't all start with the same letter so I can remember them more easily

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

I really like argp in glibc

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

BlankSystemDaemon posted:

Is there a new API for webcams?

Because they've been WDM/Video4Linux(2) for as long as I can remember.

I get that your gimmick is that you like to share man pages but I don't think Video4Linux is a system call

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

pseudorandom name posted:

nah, its HID

HID is arbitrarily complex, too complex for a PC BIOS in 1996 to parse, so they defined three minor device classes -- generic devices that could be anything and require a full report descriptor parser to understand, and Boot Protocol Keyboards & Boot Protocol Mice

Boot Protocol devices don't even have HID Report descriptors, they implicitly use descriptors defined in the spec, and the keyboard descriptor defines 8 byte packets -- 6 one bye key codes, 8 one bit modifiers, and a padding byte.

for a long while it was impossible to get N-key rollover in USB HID so the gamers stayed with their PS2 keyboards, but eventually keyboard manufacturers started designing their own keyboard controllers which are generic HID devices that define reports large enough for every key on the keyboard simultaneously

except now you have the problem that your keyboard is using custom HID reports that your PC BIOS from 1996 can't understand, so there's generally something stupid involved in starting up as a Boot Protocol Keyboard and then switching to the N-key mode after the OS starts

edit: oh, and they way that it is supposed to work is that the keyboard comes up in normal full-featured mode and then the BIOS has to manually send a Set_Protocol request to switch it into Boot Protocol mode, except nobody implemented non-Boot Protocol keyboards for a while and as you can imagine all BIOSes are poo poo

whoosh

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

I'm a dirty Windows user so I use Consolas in my Putty windows when I SSH into my Linux machines

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

I like XFCE because it doesn't try to do any bullshit

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

haha I've had to use gnu fortran to compile some scientific bullshit but cobol is an an even worse level of loving why

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

nudgenudgetilt posted:

had another tell me alpine was just ubuntu with less installed by default, and you can just apt-get your way from alpine to ubuntu

I thought most distros had less installed though :dadjoke:

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

but lol at "it has a different init system, different libc, and different coreutils and a package repo with completely different contents but yeah you can totally just alpine into ubuntu"

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

there has to be a better way to distribute a program, even a pre-configured one, than running a whole rear end new OS within your already perfectly fine OS

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

I wouldn't expect busybox or gnu coreutils or anything else like that to contain a package maanger

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

hobbesmaster posted:

im going to build a yocto distro optimized for ramdisks with busybox, musl libc and openrc. maybe I’ll roll my own package manager for fun though.

original idea do not steal

make the world's worst package manager with a shell script using busybox sh and only busybox commands

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

hrngh, colonel, I'm trying to sneak around and the complete silence of the broken audio in my OS isn't alerting the guards

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

I say this every time but no one has an answer, what is wrong with appimage

an appimage extracts the program and its dependencies into a fake root directory structure in a subdirectory of /tmp, runs the program, and then deletes the files when it closes

seems a lot less brute force than also having to include an init system and full userland

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

BlankSystemDaemon posted:

what advantage is there to it, over implementing support for fat binaries?

it's a lighter-weight thing for the typical use case of those other programs, i.e. distributing a program with its requirements included without having to integrate anything into your normal filesystem

lighter-weight as in that appimages are fully standalone executables with no requirements of their own to run and don't include half of an OS inside them

edit: I guess I have no skin in the game (I don't think I'm really in the target market for stuff like Docker, at least for the usecase where you actually want things heavily compartmentalized) but every time I've downloaded something as an appimage it worked flawlessly and I don't understand why that isn't more common versus these heavy containerized things when all you want to do is distribute a normal program or demo

BattleMaster fucked around with this message at 13:59 on Apr 20, 2023

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

also don't fat binaries solve a different problem, running the same executable on different platforms and CPU architectures, with no implication that the dependencies are included

BattleMaster fucked around with this message at 14:38 on Apr 20, 2023

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

There are obviously applications where you want that kind of isolation like maybe stuff connected to the internet, but for normal desktop or utility programs that don't have people trying to slam exploits into them over the internet I feel like normal permissions are probably sufficient

like if I ran a native program right now the only thing it has access to is my home directory, and if I don't even trust it that much I can sudo it as a user with even fewer privileges and even less access

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

on computers I care about I actually have run untrusted stuff as users with nothing in their home directories (usually stuff compiled from source rather than executables though) and on computers I don't care about I've also run stuff from actual vendors that I don't think are trying to rip me off as my own user, with nothing of consequence in my home directory not even browser credentials or anything

(for instance inexplicably closed source software for my logic analyzer distributed as an appimage, like they make their money on the hardware I'm not sure why they don't open source the software which is available for free anyway)

edit: on computers I care about I always run stuff as minimal-credentialled users if it doesn't come from my distro repositories, most recently I've compiled and run yamagi quake 2 and I run my quake 2 servers as their own user:



I don't think there's anything malicious in there but you never know what could happen

and I only even compile and test stuff on a different computer that actually really has nothing I care about on it

I think those above cases are a little different than random executable e-mailed to me or found in some weird anonymous place which I wouldn't run at all on any computer imo

edit 2: and lol at "sudo dance" like if you're already typing in the name of something to run it is it really that much harder to be like "sudo -u junkuser" on top of that

BattleMaster fucked around with this message at 17:01 on Apr 20, 2023

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

polyester concept posted:

*record scratch*

I love linux but tbh that was too strong a descriptor for it

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

and if you still need those things you can run older kernels, like I'm kind of wondering how much you even lose out on not having bleeding edge kernels when you're running on ancient hardware anyway

edit: speaking of linux and ancient software, I was able a couple weeks ago to get a few different versions of quake 3 test from 1999 running on a modern 64 bit Debian machine. I just had to install the 32 bit versions of glibc, x11, and opengl libraries it used.

of course the sound didn't work because of course it didn't (specifically it was looking for the old OSS /dev/dsp device which still didn't work for whatever reason even after I modprobed a module that emulates it) but it's pretty cool that linux can still run something so crusty and ancient. but if they needed to drop support for something there I don't think I'd begrudge them

BattleMaster fucked around with this message at 21:04 on Apr 21, 2023

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

sb hermit posted:

quake 3 had an actual steel retail box and worked great on my voodoo 3 so it's probably that

I think quake 2 uses DLLs so I don't think a linux port was available for quite awhile. Heck, I'm not sure if it's available now.

I don't know for a fact what the linux Quake 2 situation was back in the day, but the source release had linux versions of the platform-specific code and could be compiled with no modification.

the game dll source that was released before the full source release had no windows-specific dependencies so mods could also be compiled for linux - I was digging up some old mods and found that they had game .so files included for linux. although, I'm not sure if there was a linux game client or just a linux dedicated server which those would use (the dlls/sos are only needed for single player or dedicated servers, so their presence doesn't imply the existence of a linux client)

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

nudgenudgetilt posted:

i'll take rpms over debs any day just due to the policies surrounding configuration and service startup


debian policy is that package installation should provide a usable config out of the box and start the service at install time if the package provides one

rpm policy is way less heavy on the install scripting and just puts files on disk without starting and configuring services

for the vast majority of users dnf is just a yum drop-in replacement

I like Debian but sometimes its dependencies are really odd and you end up getting a bunch of services set up that you don't necessarily need. For instance, the GUI version of Recoll, a document indexing and searching tool, has such a bizarre tangle of dependencies that if you install it from a minimal system it ends up installing avahi and wpa_supplicant.

Why. Why does some fairly basic GUI poo poo need absolutely any networking stuff. I don't know how, whether there's actually something that actually thinks it needs those things in the big stack of x11 libraries or whether it gets very generous with suggests.

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

RMS's accomplishments are way in the past and right now he's some kind of weird hermit who has his e-mails printed out for him and hand-delivered to him so I don't know why anyone would pretend he has something useful to say about computers now, on top of him being a real piece of poo poo

like I get he did some good work and created a useful organization but it would be way better for everyone if he had nothing to do with it anymore

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

I was repeating something I saw here and it's wrong so I apologize. He has some weird habits according to his own website like having a system wget websites and e-mail them to him though. https://stallman.org/stallman-computing.html

My intent was that Stallman specifically is out of touch with how people use computers, not old people in general or anything, and that Stallman specifically doesn't bring anything to the table anymore in spite of his past contributions, because he just doesn't do the same kind of work anymore

Normally I guess sure let him have a symbolic or advisory position, but like, he's a loathsome person so maybe just let him fade into history

edit: also I am a scientist, scientists statistically do their best work at 60+, but that's dependent on keeping on top of the field. Stallman... hasn't kept on top of the field. I don't think he's wrong about everything like the web being a privacy disaster but I don't think he's exactly current in the political and legal matters of computers

edit 2: also him not being up to date isn't even my objection, it's that you can't even argue that he bring something to the table that outshines how terrible he is. He is terrible and not terribly useful so why

BattleMaster fucked around with this message at 23:16 on Sep 20, 2023

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

yeah I don't actually think it's possible for someone to do something so great that it's worth overlooking the kinds of thing RMS did, it's just that people will try to make that argument and they can't even do that for him

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

it should be linux with gnu because I don't see why userland should get top billing over the kernel

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

pseudorandom name posted:

light mode is necessary as an accessibility option for people with astigmatism

this is news to me, I have astigmatism so bad that it's like my eyes are pointing in two completely different directions without my glasses on, and I favor dark mode because I don't like to be rear end-blasted by brightness

like I support light mode as an option but I don't know if it helps my bad eyes specifically

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000


a good way to avoid confusion is if the feature subset in question had a different name, maybe a lower number, like hdmi 2.0, to indicate that it has a smaller feature set than hdmi 2.1

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

BlankSystemDaemon posted:

Well, systemd did reinvent the HIVE from first principles, so it's less of a joke than at first blush.

you keep saying that but I've seen no evidence that systemd doesn't store its configuration as text files in /etc like everything else in linux/unix/miscellaneous unix-likes

edit "systemd registry hive" only comes up with windows 2000 stuff from 20 years ago because apparently windows 2000 had something called systemd

BattleMaster fucked around with this message at 21:44 on Oct 12, 2023

BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

every time I have configured systemd it is by editing or placing files in /etc

but whatever, the directory doesn't matter, the fact is that "systemd uses registry hives" is something BSD keeps saying as an attempt at a burn and is [citation needed]

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BattleMaster
Aug 14, 2000

but like nearly every config file I've seen borrows that syntax, there aren't very many ways to format configuration files (edit: without doing sicker poo poo like json or xml that is)

oh no you can't use equal signs, microsoft uses those!!!

BattleMaster fucked around with this message at 22:08 on Oct 12, 2023

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