Crusader Kings 2: Succession under the Laws of the Persians and Medes

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Let's Play! > Crusader Kings 2: Succession under the Laws of the Persians and Medes

lurksion: Mar 21, 2013

Ah, a succession game. This should be good. I'll add myself to the back of the list (##Add me to the list). Never played one of the smaller religions since I dislike how there's never anyone good to marry from outside your realm due to religion differences.

Also, are we Altaic (aka do we have the horse archer special tactic?). If not, Horse Archer retinues are actually fairly average IIRC (in terms of power per retinue point).

lurksion fucked around with this message at 03:10 on Apr 8, 2014

# ¿ Apr 8, 2014 02:32

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# ¿ Apr 28, 2024 18:22

lurksion: Mar 21, 2013

Amnistar posted:

...I may have forgotten to turn that mod off when I started the game...

Well its not like they're likely to make it over to the east. Also turning it off any time before they arrive works if we don't want to see them.

# ¿ Apr 13, 2014 17:04

lurksion: Mar 21, 2013

Ouch. That sucks. Looking at the composition, their army outclassed us slightly. Converting to retinue points, 16813 worth of units vs 16161, with considerably more heavy infantry and considerably less light infantry (which honestly should be worth less than 1 point - they get almost NO tactic bonuses).

We had basically no melee presence compared to them - if we couldn't win in skirmish, we wouldn't win, and our flank composition as shown was not suited to forcing a smashing victory in skirmish either (not enough archers or horse archers, too many light infantry).

Incoming :spergin:

!

Something that may have helped considerably though - keep the retinues in one flank. Diluting them across all our flanks is suboptimal - mixing with other units will drastically decrease their effectiveness. I think it often makes sense to run a smaller pure-retinue flank (as long as it isn't too small). So in this case, I think a 3850/3850/2300 actually might have done better - likely more damage on average than a 3333 mixture due to restricting the available tactics pool.

I'm actually sperging out on a giant retinue composition guide (primarily because I keep seeing Light Cavalry being poo poo on, which is IMO completely wrong). Here's my analysis of a pure Horse Archer retinue:

Skirmish Phase:

code:

41%     Harass                  3.87/4.48
41%     Swarm                   9.44/4.48
18%     Harass Swarm            9.06/4.48
        Average Unit (SD)       7.09/4.48 (2.68/0.00)
Special Retreat and Ambush      14.10/4.48

Melee Phase:

code:

50%     Retreat and Ambush      NA
50%     Raid                    9.53/3.52
        Average Unit (SD)       9.53/3.52 (0.00/0.00)

While there's no frame of reference for this, I'll just say that their Skirmish on average is pretty good (even without R&A) and melee crap. Mixing in units will expand the possible tactic selection pool, basically making everyone in the flank worse, and you're almost never going to roll Retreat and Ambush.

For the 3333 mixed (the flank composition as shown) vs 2300 pure example, that means:
3333 Mixed Flank - 1.71 average attack^* x 3333 = 5700 total damage
2300 Pure HA Flank - 7.09 average attack x 2300 = 16300 total damage, worst case (Harass tactic) 8900 damage
_{* Basically the flank is so diluted that all the tactics basically give so little overall bonus that they all cancel out (also my spreadsheet isn't large enough to fully calculate all the combinations)}

That's a huge difference and could have meant skirmish victory on one flank, followed up rolling up the others. And if we had managed to roll R&A... :supaburn:

lurksion fucked around with this message at 01:34 on Apr 24, 2014

# ¿ Apr 24, 2014 01:31

lurksion: Mar 21, 2013

To be fair, we also did outnumber them this time.
So we'll need to have another test.

Though a immediate flank victory is always great to see.

# ¿ Apr 26, 2014 05:11

lurksion: Mar 21, 2013

Looking like a good recovery.

And as for future events:
Mounted and Organizer? No one's getting away :rms:

. Especially since the leader bonus is multiplicative on top of evreything else (so take my theorycrafting post and multiply up). Too bad his martial is only 8.

That is insane if we don't get unlucky and hit on the head.

# ¿ Apr 28, 2014 02:02

lurksion: Mar 21, 2013

TheMcD posted:

To me, there's pretty much nothing worse in CK2 than that "even worse, they divulged my name". It's the moment where I know that there's roughly a 30~40% chance my ruler will definitely kick the bucket, regardless of what I do from here.

The solution is to immediately stab the liege (and his heirs) until you aren't discovered. Stabbing more really does solve (almost) everything.
:black101:

# ¿ Apr 30, 2014 13:38

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# ¿ Apr 28, 2024 18:22

lurksion: Mar 21, 2013

ulmont posted:

Yeah, the wiki claims -30 for oldest child, -10 for other children, -5 for other dynasty, and +20 for other vassals.
http://www.ckiiwiki.com/Elective

Which is a perfectly acceptable trade-off IMO for having your pick of heirs.

# ¿ May 22, 2014 02:21

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