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charity rereg
Mar 14, 2019

high quality posting

Really loving the changes to recipes in .17, I find it helps fix my ADHD brain "this project is too big you can never finish it how do you even start?" that kicks in right around scaling up blue science.

The improved starter oil setup and giving us something to do with light/heavy oil pre-Advanced Oil is really nice. I had gotten a little burned out on .16 knowing so many QOL changes were coming, glad to see it's almost entirely delivered.

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necrotic
Aug 1, 2005
I owe my brother big time for this!

The recipe changes really helped with the scaling as you progress. Blue was frustrating, as you mentioned, but the scale up in iron for military science was brutal thanks to the turrets. It feels much more like progression and less like hitting huge walls.

Canuckistan
Jan 14, 2004

I'm the greatest thing since World War III.


Soiled Meat

I have to admit that my vanilla non-BP .17 run is at an end. The siren call of mods and BPs called me into the rocks.

First it was a BP for a transport mall and lane balancers, because why do that to yourself. Then I installed a mod to force biters into friendly mode because I got really sick of random biter attacks even when there was nothing I could see in the cloud. They always seemed to happen when I was a few minutes away at some god-forsaken uranium ore patch trying to get poo poo going. Side note - i grossly overestimated how much sulfuric acid you need to mine uranium. Four tanks and two tanker cars is a little too much acid.

Paper Tiger
Jun 17, 2007
but my teeth are atomic

Canuckistan posted:

I have to admit that my vanilla non-BP .17 run is at an end. The siren call of mods and BPs called me into the rocks.

First it was a BP for a transport mall and lane balancers, because why do that to yourself. Then I installed a mod to force biters into friendly mode because I got really sick of random biter attacks even when there was nothing I could see in the cloud. They always seemed to happen when I was a few minutes away at some god-forsaken uranium ore patch trying to get poo poo going. Side note - i grossly overestimated how much sulfuric acid you need to mine uranium. Four tanks and two tanker cars is a little too much acid.

I don't know if this is a new option, but for my current run I just disabled pollution. To balance it out I turned on biter expansion, which is disabled by default for rail worlds. Because I'm a baby I limited biter expansion distance to three chunks so that I could always see a new biter base on radar before the next expansion reached my stuff, but my next run I might crank the expansion distance and frequency up to feel like more of my base is at risk.

It's actually pretty great, I don't find myself obsessing over where my cloud is, but still have to pay attention to where biters are. I rationalize it as biters aren't smart enough to know where pollution is coming from, but they will randomly migrate into a wall of turrets once in a while.

Mithaldu
Sep 25, 2007

Let's cuddle!


Canuckistan posted:

I have to admit that my vanilla non-BP .17 run is at an end. The siren call of mods and BPs called me into the rocks.

First it was a BP for a transport mall and lane balancers, because why do that to yourself. Then I installed a mod to force biters into friendly mode because I got really sick of random biter attacks even when there was nothing I could see in the cloud. They always seemed to happen when I was a few minutes away at some god-forsaken uranium ore patch trying to get poo poo going. Side note - i grossly overestimated how much sulfuric acid you need to mine uranium. Four tanks and two tanker cars is a little too much acid.

It's important to know that biters choose a source of pollution to kill and then will leg it over the entire map to get there, only stopping to attack anything if it attacks them, or is seriously impeding their pathing. You're supposed to either live with biters occasionally throwing sand into your gears, or by creating a solid outer perimeter for your base/s.

Jamsque
May 31, 2009


I have made another overly long rambling factory tour video, check it out

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajONYJaxVXI

Ciaphas
Nov 20, 2005

> BEWARE, COWARD



Pillbug

Communist Bear posted:

You guys are daft, I can't quite understand why anyone gets enjoyment from this.

*5 minutes later*

Man making red research in my inventory is slow. I wonder if I could automate this.

*30 minutes later*

So wait a minute...if I put these things here, I can program them to construct things for me, which then goes toward building red research...huh...

*Another 30 minutes*

Green needs what now? That means I need to build...like...several things to do that!

*Hours later*



This is so poo poo, but i'm so happy!

it begins

Mazz
Dec 12, 2012

Orion, this is Sperglord Actual.
Come on home.


Grimey Drawer

I really gotta give this game another shot, I have so much need to be neat and organized that I never get farther than like green science before I canít handle it , gotta just get past that, learn all the poo poo and then organize later, because I know this would be my jam once I clear that hurdle.

The Locator
Sep 12, 2004

Out here, everything hurts.




Hair Elf

So I am learning that biters don't act like I thought they did. I thought that they only attacked if they were in my pollution cloud, so I came up with a solution. I built a giant wall completely outside of my pollution cloud all the way around my base and cleared all the biters from inside as well as within radar range of the wall.

Two things happened while I was slowly adding defenses to the wall. First some new colonies appeared *inside* the wall .. wtf? Second, the wall was attacked and breached (as that side was undefended) in multiple locations and then new biter nests were established, still outside the pollution.

So I will continue to complete the defense installations around the wall, but I don't know how to prevent the biters from just appearing I inside of the wall in some of the large unused areas of the interior.

I'm slowly building complete radar coverage, will that prevent the appearance of biter nests?

Evilreaver
Feb 26, 2007

GEORGE IS GETTIN' AUGMENTED!

Dinosaur Gum

The Locator posted:

So I am learning that biters don't act like I thought they did. I thought that they only attacked if they were in my pollution cloud, so I came up with a solution. I built a giant wall completely outside of my pollution cloud all the way around my base and cleared all the biters from inside as well as within radar range of the wall.

Two things happened while I was slowly adding defenses to the wall. First some new colonies appeared *inside* the wall .. wtf? Second, the wall was attacked and breached (as that side was undefended) in multiple locations and then new biter nests were established, still outside the pollution.

So I will continue to complete the defense installations around the wall, but I don't know how to prevent the biters from just appearing I inside of the wall in some of the large unused areas of the interior.

I'm slowly building complete radar coverage, will that prevent the appearance of biter nests?

Biters have to manually walk to a site to set a nest up. If you fully sterilize an area and wall it off, they will not be able to build a nest there. You missed a bug somewhere.

Additionally, their 'nesting' parties look very similar to attacks, in that they will come up to your walls and chew through them-- and those will come from outside your pollution cloud.

GenericOverusedName
Nov 24, 2009

KUVA TEAM EPIC


Biters will expand over time and try to settle down in open territories. If a colonizing group runs into an obstacle (such as your wall) they'll chew through it to get to their destination.

Sydin
Oct 29, 2011

Another rainy day commute



Pillbug

Nests that are within a pollution cloud will generate "attack waves" of biters, who once they reach a certain size will beeline for the nearest source of pollution and attempt to destroy it. Nests outside of pollution won't spawn these waves, but they do still spawn biters, and every once in a while within a certain time range they'll send out "expansion parties" of a handful of biters, who will go a certain distance and then establish a new nest. Expansion parties will attack turrets or pollution generating structures if they come across them, but will generally leave static structures such as walls/power poles/etc alone unless their movement is blocked by them for a long period of time.

So my guess is while the nests outside the wall weren't creating attack waves, they were sending out expansion parties that were bumping up against your wall, were unable to find a way around towards the area they wanted to expand, and so attacked the wall to continue on. As for the bases popping up behind your wall, AFAIK bases don't just "spawn" in the fog, an actual expansion has to take place via biters. So either there was a gap in your wall that expansion parties managed to slip through in some areas, or they took out a section of your wall and before you could repair it they moved on to establish a colony.

e. Oh, biters also aggresively attack radars for some reason, they're essentially treated as turrets or pollution generating structures for the purposes of biter AI. So if you had radars on the edges of the walls, any expansion parties that go near the walls will attack them to get to the radar.

Sydin fucked around with this message at Mar 19, 2019 around 17:00

The Locator
Sep 12, 2004

Out here, everything hurts.




Hair Elf

Okay, so I need to defend myself against the expansion party's and make sure the interior is completely clean and I should be good for a while.

The biters are starting to spawn big green bugs that are noticably tougher than anything else. Is the evolution infinite, and getting overrun eventually inevitable when they get too tough for my weapons to kill in a reasonable amount of time?

Canuckistan
Jan 14, 2004

I'm the greatest thing since World War III.


Soiled Meat

This makes sense. I didn't bother with defenses as I just tanked the poo poo out of the bugs and never really had a problem until recently, but I'll BUILD THE WALL soon and turn biters back on.

Are Dragon's Teeth still worthwhile in .17? I seem to recall that they're really good in .16.

Canuckistan fucked around with this message at Mar 19, 2019 around 17:07

M_Gargantua
Oct 16, 2006

STOMPIN' ON INTO THE POWER LINES

Exciting Lemon

The Locator posted:

Okay, so I need to defend myself against the expansion party's and make sure the interior is completely clean and I should be good for a while.

The biters are starting to spawn big green bugs that are noticably tougher than anything else. Is the evolution infinite, and getting overrun eventually inevitable when they get too tough for my weapons to kill in a reasonable amount of time?

The green ones are the biggest they'll ever get. And once you get toward the end of the tech tree your weapons will be so overpowered that even they will get easy.

For defense flamethrower turrets are pretty much the strongest, but they have a fixed direction and minimum range. Feed them with light oil, and they're very ammo efficient compared to gun turrets. A good strategy with them is to chain them together one underground pipe length apart and put them behind either a laser or gun turret. You don't need much to prevent even attack waves.

Sydin
Oct 29, 2011

Another rainy day commute



Pillbug

Greens are the biggest they get and are significantly tougher than everything else before it, yeah. I think even at max evolution factor you only ever get about 25% greens vs everything else.

Gun turrets kinda run out of ability to punch green biters reliably late game, unless you have all the damage and shooting speed upgrades, along with uranium ammo. Lasers and Flamethrowers are both viable against them, but they both have drawbacks: lasers take a lot of power at scale and power lines at the far reaches of your defense perimeter, flamethrowers need pipe infrastructure, a steady stream of oil, and can be difficult to place properly because of their cone of effectiveness. I prefer to start with flamethrowers, then supplement them with lasers once I have nuclear up and running.

The Locator
Sep 12, 2004

Out here, everything hurts.




Hair Elf

M_Gargantua posted:

The green ones are the biggest they'll ever get. And once you get toward the end of the tech tree your weapons will be so overpowered that even they will get easy.

For defense flamethrower turrets are pretty much the strongest, but they have a fixed direction and minimum range. Feed them with light oil, and they're very ammo efficient compared to gun turrets. A good strategy with them is to chain them together one underground pipe length apart and put them behind either a laser or gun turret. You don't need much to prevent even attack waves.

Thanks, if those are as bad as they get then I'll have no problem unless the numbers get into zombie horde levels. My perimeter is all laser turrets and they are upgraded as high as possible without space tech.

I could handle them fine with my power armor, I just noticed that the were substantially tougher than any prior bugs.

Evilreaver
Feb 26, 2007

GEORGE IS GETTIN' AUGMENTED!

Dinosaur Gum

Again, gun turrets out-dps lasers handily tech-for-tech with AP rounds, and utterly demolish laser DPS with uranium rounds

seravid
Apr 21, 2010

Let me tell you of the world I used to know


Evilreaver posted:

Anyone have any good nuke plants that are in the 12-24 reactor range that aren't tile-based? Or failing that, are at least good looking when tiled? All the ones I find are just boring lines of things.

Currently running 5 6-reactor plants and climbing.

If you don't mind water mods, the one on the left is a 26-reactor: link (too large to inline)

Oxyclean
Sep 23, 2007



speaking of nuclear blueprints: one I used was bigger then the screen space I could see it on - I couldn't even get it on screen with map view, zooming out far enough resulted in losing the radar view. Do people run a mod to manage these sorts of blueprints? (I was able to place it, but I nearly overlapped a bunch of stuff way off screen that I didn't want to.)

The Locator
Sep 12, 2004

Out here, everything hurts.




Hair Elf

Evilreaver posted:

Again, gun turrets out-dps lasers handily tech-for-tech with AP rounds, and utterly demolish laser DPS with uranium rounds

Running the ammunition supply belt to my huge perimeter wall would take a huge amount of time and resources, and while setting up the lasers is still a chore, it seemed easier.

Power for the lasers is significant, but the baseline load is manageable, and I've got over 1Gj of accumulaters to handle any spike loads from combat that might exceed my power generation capacity.

Sydin
Oct 29, 2011

Another rainy day commute



Pillbug

Evilreaver posted:

Again, gun turrets out-dps lasers handily tech-for-tech with AP rounds, and utterly demolish laser DPS with uranium rounds

Huh. In my current game my AP turrets got completely overwhelmed by behemoth biters, while lasers are holding just fine, with similar tech. I'm in process of converting my AP belt to a uranium belt belt, will see how that works.

Gravy Jones
Sep 13, 2003

I am not on your side


The Locator posted:

Running the ammunition supply belt to my huge perimeter wall would take a huge amount of time and resources, and while setting up the lasers is still a chore, it seemed easier.

Power for the lasers is significant, but the baseline load is manageable, and I've got over 1Gj of accumulaters to handle any spike loads from combat that might exceed my power generation capacity.

The time and resources are probably similar. Lasers cost a hell of a lot more than a Gun Turret, a yellow inserter and a few yellow belts.... but the ongoing cost of ap ammo will add up over time. Either works though. I think longer term the more important (and more resource intesive) component is roboports. Once either turrrets are maxed out and especially if you throw flamethowers and/or artillery into the mix, you can pretty much ignore bugs if everything is in repair range, unless you're expanding.

necrotic
Aug 1, 2005
I owe my brother big time for this!

Sydin posted:


e. Oh, biters also aggresively attack radars for some reason, they're essentially treated as turrets or pollution generating structures for the purposes of biter AI. So if you had radars on the edges of the walls, any expansion parties that go near the walls will attack them to get to the radar.

Radars are a military structure. Any military structure will attract biters to attack if they path nearby.

LonsomeSon
Nov 22, 2009

A fishperson in an intimidating hat!


The Locator posted:

Running the ammunition supply belt to my huge perimeter wall would take a huge amount of time and resources, and while setting up the lasers is still a chore, it seemed easier.

Power for the lasers is significant, but the baseline load is manageable, and I've got over 1Gj of accumulaters to handle any spike loads from combat that might exceed my power generation capacity.

Yeah the tradeoff for lasers is supposed to be leverage the relative simplicity of power infrastructure in exchange for jack-of-all-trades-master-of-none-type limitations on dps and needing to build a deep power buffer to handle the huge power draw spikes from laser outposts going loud.

Personally, given the number of batteries required for both the turrets themselves and their accumulator buffers, not to mention the steel for the lasers, I find conveyor-belt delivery of red magazines to the primary perimeter is less time- and resource- consuming. Particularly as you can just route DU ammo mags into the same feed and know that once the AP ammo is used up the perimeter will start throwing the good poo poo without needing me to touch the system at all.

But I also run a mod which starts me with 30 construction bots and the personal roboports to use them, so long straight runs of belt are less of a pain in the rear end for me than for real Factorio players.

The Locator
Sep 12, 2004

Out here, everything hurts.




Hair Elf

Gravy Jones posted:

The time and resources are probably similar. Lasers cost a hell of a lot more than a Gun Turret, a yellow inserter and a few yellow belts.... but the ongoing cost of ap ammo will add up over time. Either works though. I think longer term the more important (and more resource intesive) component is roboports. Once either turrrets are maxed out and especially if you throw flamethowers and/or artillery into the mix, you can pretty much ignore bugs if everything is in repair range, unless you're expanding.

Robots are an aspect of the game that I haven't even touched yet. Just so many things to do and not enough resources or time.

I have a crapton of laser turrets as I set up a single assembler making them a long time ago, and didn't set a limit on the steel chest. I've probably got over 2000 of them now.

Evilreaver
Feb 26, 2007

GEORGE IS GETTIN' AUGMENTED!

Dinosaur Gum

I set a line of lasers in pairs around a line of substations behind a double thick wall, with a trio of gun turrets between each pair, fed by a local roboport network.

Expensive? Yeah. But indestructible and self repairing. Once you have a train set to deliver ammo and repair packs whenever they run out, out course. Then you can also set an artillery train to visit periodically.

Lasers do a good job of killing anything except Behemoth biters, and guns chew those up quick, so they pair nicely.

Ratzap
Jun 9, 2012

Let no pie go wasted


Soiled Meat

Ciaphas posted:

This is where I get to and stop playing (and where I'm at now, in fact--drat you, Division 2) because I don't really know where to start on Base Two (electric boogaloo). For some reason if I'm starting on a blank patch of land my brain goes similarly blank

You know you can make labels on the map right? I start by labelling areas with icons so you get a rough idea of layout zoomed out in the map. So a rail icon and 'ore in', a furnace with 'smelt' and so on. You need water so make sure some is close-ish. Don't be scared of running 100 or so underground pipe runs if you need to though. Once you have a rough plan laid out, start building. Labs need to be FAR away from the bus because the chunks making purple and yellow are pretty big. Leave space and do it backwards - lay down the assemblers making the packs first, then feed them with ingredient makers.
Just do a bit at a time and you'll be fine.

Communist Bear posted:

This is so poo poo, but i'm so happy!

Press your left Alt and it will show what structures are making on them (you seem to have it off in your screenshot). It makes it so much easier to 'read' your factory.

super fart shooter
Feb 11, 2003

-quacka fat-


Laser turrets will always lose to regular turrets in DPS, and are definitely not "optimal" in terms of resource efficiency, but the convenience makes it more than a worthwhile trade. It's so easy to slap down a huge battery of lasers, and it's equally easy to pick it up again. And once you have nuclear power, the "ammo" for lasers is basically free. I use pure laser defenses all the time for temporary perimeter defenses, or mining expansions

The Locator posted:

Robots are an aspect of the game that I haven't even touched yet. Just so many things to do and not enough resources or time.

I have a crapton of laser turrets as I set up a single assembler making them a long time ago, and didn't set a limit on the steel chest. I've probably got over 2000 of them now.

I did this too on my first Factorio run, I was already so overwhelmed, I didn't want to have to learn another complicated thing. But for a pretty minimal investment, bots will save you sooooooo much time and effort, and eliminate a lot of the more tedious tasks that you're probably having to do right now

Olesh
Aug 4, 2008

Why did the circus close?

A long, chilling list of animal rights violations.

College Slice

Laser Turrets:
- Range 24, Base 20 (laser) damage, 3 shots/sec. - 60 DPS
Gun turrets:
- Range 18, Base 5 (Physical) damage, 10 shots/sec (standard rounds) - 50 DPS
- Range 18, Base 8 (Physical) damage, 10 shots/sec (piercing rounds) - 80 DPS
- Range 18, Base 24 (Physical) damage, 10 shots/sec (uranium rounds) - 240 DPS


On paper, this looks great. The problem with gun turrets is that Biters (but not Spitters) get Physical resistance - Medium and Big biters resist 8/10% physical, while Behemoths resist 12/10%. If you've got high evolution such that you're seeing lots of upgraded Biters, it's entirely possible that gun turrets alone don't do the job until you've put enough upgrades into them .

Since you can get your upgrades to level to 4 with just red, green, and military science and turrets get an extra damage boost from research, this should only really be a problem if you've let pollution and evolution get completely out of hand while just not doing your defensive research, but depending on how much you're kept on the defensive and how slow you're teching up, you might need to switch to laser turrets for defense almost entirely until gun turrets are viable again (via more upgrades, or uranium ammo).

K8.0
Feb 26, 2004

Her Majesty's 56th Regiment of Foot

I say I love this game and recommend it to people, but I can't bring myself to play it. Every time I reach about blue science/oil, I just have zero interest in playing anymore. I think it's the scale - it just starts feeling like pointless drudgery where absolutely nothing interesting happens. Everything that might interest me is gated behind hours of doing the same poo poo over and over. I want so badly to keep enjoying it, but it's just not fun. I really envy you guys who have been able to get years of enjoyment out of it, because the part I did like was great.

It's funny, because while everyone else wants mods that make the game bigger and longer, I kinda feel like I might enjoy it more if there was a mod that really compressed everything down.

BrainMeats
Aug 20, 2000

We have evolved beyond the need for posting.


Soiled Meat

My base keeps grinding to a halt because I've got some sort of problem with crude oil deliveries. These trains will run dozens of successful loops before they just decide they've had enough. There's some sort of disagreement between the train and the pumps whether it's in position or not.

(full train, empty refineries and pumps not connected)

It's the same super basic schedule I run on all my trains but it only affects the oil tankers. I tried ripping up the station, tracks and even replacing the train. I could restart it manually and it will run however many more deliveries before locking up again so this feels like some kind of bug I'm seeing.

Ratzap
Jun 9, 2012

Let no pie go wasted


Soiled Meat

BrainMeats posted:

My base keeps grinding to a halt because I've got some sort of problem with crude oil deliveries. These trains will run dozens of successful loops before they just decide they've had enough. There's some sort of disagreement between the train and the pumps whether it's in position or not.

I always put the pumps in the middle section to avoid that sort of thing, never at the extreme edge positions of the wagon. Have you tried moving them and see if the problem fixes itself?

BrainMeats
Aug 20, 2000

We have evolved beyond the need for posting.


Soiled Meat

Ratzap posted:

I always put the pumps in the middle section to avoid that sort of thing, never at the extreme edge positions of the wagon. Have you tried moving them and see if the problem fixes itself?

I'll try it out and see how it goes. I put an inactivity timer on them for now that seems to reboot them when they get stuck. It's the part where it works some of the time but not others is what is wrong about it all.

charity rereg
Mar 14, 2019

high quality posting

Olesh posted:

Laser Turrets:
- Range 24, Base 20 (laser) damage, 3 shots/sec. - 60 DPS
Gun turrets:
- Range 18, Base 5 (Physical) damage, 10 shots/sec (standard rounds) - 50 DPS
- Range 18, Base 8 (Physical) damage, 10 shots/sec (piercing rounds) - 80 DPS
- Range 18, Base 24 (Physical) damage, 10 shots/sec (uranium rounds) - 240 DPS


On paper, this looks great. The problem with gun turrets is that Biters (but not Spitters) get Physical resistance - Medium and Big biters resist 8/10% physical, while Behemoths resist 12/10%. If you've got high evolution such that you're seeing lots of upgraded Biters, it's entirely possible that gun turrets alone don't do the job until you've put enough upgrades into them .

Since you can get your upgrades to level to 4 with just red, green, and military science and turrets get an extra damage boost from research, this should only really be a problem if you've let pollution and evolution get completely out of hand while just not doing your defensive research, but depending on how much you're kept on the defensive and how slow you're teching up, you might need to switch to laser turrets for defense almost entirely until gun turrets are viable again (via more upgrades, or uranium ammo).

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...jk6J1W_sn6K_g4/ Some redditor did all of the research and math for people who enjoy spreadsheets (hopefully all of us)

Evilreaver
Feb 26, 2007

GEORGE IS GETTIN' AUGMENTED!

Dinosaur Gum

charity rereg posted:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...jk6J1W_sn6K_g4/ Some redditor did all of the research and math for people who enjoy spreadsheets (hopefully all of us)

I also did the math earlier in the thread (though not as comprehensively), even including armor values gun turrets always win dps/time-to-kill races tech-for-tech unless you're using yellow ammo

Olesh
Aug 4, 2008

Why did the circus close?

A long, chilling list of animal rights violations.

College Slice

Evilreaver posted:

I also did the math earlier in the thread (though not as comprehensively), even including armor values gun turrets always win dps/time-to-kill races tech-for-tech unless you're using yellow ammo

The spreadsheet is a little off for 0.17 - medium biters are up to 8/10% - but it does a good job illustrating that gun turrets are king for DPS. Laser turrets remain the weapon of spot convenience - you don't need to supply them with ammo, only power, so they're easier to throw in outposts or other far flung areas.

Personally, I wish flamethrower turrets had more of a niche... they do a lot of damage, but their limits mean they can't realistically operate on their own and they're typically overkill in vanilla.

The Locator
Sep 12, 2004

Out here, everything hurts.




Hair Elf

I have finished the perimeter wall and defense, cleansed my area of bugs, established pretty much full radar coverage, and got the 2nd iron mine up and running (again).



My stupid oil fields keep running out of power, so I need to tap a bunch more coal and start cracking it for fuel for my power plants I guess, and then start figuring out nuclear so I can stop dealing with fueling all those steam engines. I have put out a bunch of solar just 'because', have one assembler just making panels which I deploy periodically. It's that large grid on the left under the "Stone 1.2" label.

I have all the remaining tech that I can complete without space science in the queue, so need to decide what to do next.

Regardless of the next actual 'target', before I can really do any major new thing I need to shore up the resource supplies (including power) in order to be able to feed anything else.

Probably going to start dabbling in robots for construction after I get the resource supply freshened up.

Edit: The laser turret wall defense has already killed a few of the green bugs without taking any wall damage, so it seems to be fairly solid for now until I start seeing major attacks due to the pollution cloud creep.

Mithaldu
Sep 25, 2007

Let's cuddle!


This was a problem raised a long time ago already, so maybe they did something for it: Did the devs ever add anything to keep bots from crossing hostile terrain with weird logistics network shapes?

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GotLag
Jul 17, 2005

食べちゃダメだよ


As far as I'm aware the answer is still "keep your bot networks convex"

I'm not sure why it's not in the OP, but the official* Discord is good for quick answers to questions like these: https://discord.gg/URvxS7

* According to Discord it's not official because it's run by the community, but it's full of devs, so

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