Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us $3,400 per month for bandwidth bills alone, and since we don't believe in shoving popup ads to our registered users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
«510 »
  • Post
  • Reply
zedprime
Jun 9, 2007


Ciaphas posted:

After concrete tomorrow I need to figure out when best to (and NOT to) use 'bots and how many of each kind I really need or want

Construction bots seem to have a useful limit especially since you only get to use 10 at a time per personal roboport. Logistics... I guess just the more the merrier?? Seems like it'd be really hard on lube and other things over time though
Construction bots plus concrete, or construction bots plus wide scale solar/accumulator blue prints mean you can get your money's worth from a few hundred construction bots in static roboports. Logistics is indeed the more the merrier.

I normally just let robots build forever but keyed off 1x robot frame. 1x assembler 2 making robot frames is one electric engine assembler 2 to itself and will make a robot every 25 seconds. Alternate the use of frames to make what you need at the moment. Over 25 seconds the cost is so close to nothing at all, but the constant production means 10 hours after researching robots you still have 1300 robots. 2x frame assemblers is still barely noticeable, and hey extra robots, but if I do that it's usually to replenish lost construction bots in my pack.

Logistic bots let you make lemonade out of the biggest lemons you may have accidentally designed but they will always be glacial and low throughput compared to belts. If you make them a part of supply chain it should be for uses equally glacial. I usually set them up for making themselves because 25 seconds per frame is years and while the material worth is low, its diverse. Same with combat modules, you can make elegant set ups for the high tech modules, but I like just roboting them because of the diverse array of poo poo that goes into them. Logistic robots also end up the easiest way to make a sorting train station but I'd expect you'll need a lot more than 1k for that.

The real mind blowing use of logistics robots is personal logistic slots. Make them deliver all your basic building materials, ammo, repair packs, or whatever you find yourself using on a normal basis. Use trash slots to recycle old belts to new: they'll come pick up your worthless yellow or red belts and drop them in a requester chest next to the red or blue belt factory. Make them feed your wood (and wood power poles!) into boilers or furnaces. They are at their most useful ferrying things back and forth to you, because after you experience the convenience, picking kit out of a chest doesn't even compare.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Solumin
Jan 11, 2013




Ciaphas posted:

After concrete tomorrow I need to figure out when best to (and NOT to) use 'bots and how many of each kind I really need or want

Construction bots seem to have a useful limit especially since you only get to use 10 at a time per personal roboport. Logistics... I guess just the more the merrier?? Seems like it'd be really hard on lube and other things over time though

Logistics robots are best used to move things small distances, due to having to recharge and being quite slow until you get enough research. Some people recommend not using them for moving bulk goods, like unloading a train station, but other people do just that. Personally, I find bots are great for smoothing out rough spots in factory design: need to get an item across the factory but don't have room for a belt? Give it to the robots!

Unless you have limited resources and making them is putting a strain on the rest of your factory, your can just make as many robots as possible. They won't all be used at the same time, but that's OK. The actual limiting factor is roboports, because you need enough of them to recharge the bots that are active. If your factory requires 100 bots to be active per minute, but you can only charge 50 per minute, eventually they will grind to a halt.

Construction robots are also more useful the more area is covered by your roboports. They'll handle repairs and construction tasks the area covered by the roboports, which is huge. If I'm expending my factory, the construction robots in my factory's network can do most of the work for me, especially early on before I have better armor and multiple personal ports. When you place a roboport, the outer green area is covered by construction robots, while the inner orange area is the logistic network.

Ratzap
Jun 9, 2012

Let no pie go wasted


Soiled Meat

Ciaphas posted:

After concrete tomorrow I need to figure out when best to (and NOT to) use 'bots and how many of each kind I really need or want

Construction bots seem to have a useful limit especially since you only get to use 10 at a time per personal roboport. Logistics... I guess just the more the merrier?? Seems like it'd be really hard on lube and other things over time though

I usually start with 400 construction and 200 logistic then add more if I see the counter on roboports say there's none free. Laying concrete is not done with your personal port, it's done with hundreds of bots. There's a mod (sane concrete) that changes concrete to use iron sticks as rebar rather than ore but you're doing a stock run right? Some people make 10s of thousands of logistic bots but unless you're actually using them (check the roboport counter) why bother. Construction bots can also clear wood/rocks from areas quickly (use the red deconstruction blueprint). If you mod, you can use robocharge, a much smaller footprint charger station which saves spamming ports everywhere.

milward posted:

I decided to get back in the game after a break and to try the modpack that was posted from the MP game and oh god bobs is massive.

I have no idea what I am doing and I have all these new ores and it is wonderful

Tip with bobs, don't try to main bus everything or belt stuff like the resistors. Make small local production units that direct insert or you'll be slowed down by choked belts. Bobs is designed to be a robot heaven late game so be prepared to relocate and rebuild a couple of times as you tech up.

GenericOverusedName
Nov 24, 2009

KUVA TEAM EPIC


I tend to automate production of bots and forget about it until I come back from a bug burning expedition and my game lags to poo poo as the botswarm blocks out the smog-filled sky

milward
Nov 5, 2009


Ratzap posted:

Tip with bobs, don't try to main bus everything or belt stuff like the resistors. Make small local production units that direct insert or you'll be slowed down by choked belts. Bobs is designed to be a robot heaven late game so be prepared to relocate and rebuild a couple of times as you tech up.

Yeah I am going slowly to familiarize myself with the mod (on peaceful) an plan to build very modular

FISHMANPET
Mar 3, 2007

Sweet 'N Sour
Can't
Melt
Steel Beams


I setup my bot factory to feed into a roboport directly. It only feeds bots in if there are less than 100 free bots at a time, so it keeps production under control while also allowing the network to slowly grow as my needs grow.

Ciaphas
Nov 20, 2005

> BEWARE, COWARD



Pillbug

Ratzap posted:

I usually start with 400 construction and 200 logistic then add more if I see the counter on roboports say there's none free. Laying concrete is not done with your personal port, it's done with hundreds of bots. There's a mod (sane concrete) that changes concrete to use iron sticks as rebar rather than ore but you're doing a stock run right? Some people make 10s of thousands of logistic bots but unless you're actually using them (check the roboport counter) why bother. Construction bots can also clear wood/rocks from areas quickly (use the red deconstruction blueprint). If you mod, you can use robocharge, a much smaller footprint charger station which saves spamming ports everywhere.

Not stock enough that I'd mind adding that mod Thanks for letting me know it exists.

Didn't even think of having robits build themselves. That's some gray goo scenario poo poo but since the end goal of the game is to turn the planet gray, that seems okay!

I suppose it's kind of my fault that I'm not seeing the full lazy-man use of construction and logistics bots because I'm running Long Reach, now that I think about it.

FISHMANPET
Mar 3, 2007

Sweet 'N Sour
Can't
Melt
Steel Beams


I usually have 3 personal roboports so I can handle 30 bots at once (multiple roboports also increase your personal range). It works great in the wilderness for dropping new outposts. Also they're useful in your factory for expansion. The key is to have blueprints. It's not a huge deal to shift click a belt on the ground and have a bot place it for you. It is a huge deal to click a blueprint with 80 furnaces and 120 inserters and 180 belts and have the bots place all of them.

mastermind2004
Sep 14, 2007



Is it possible to use the circuit network to determine how many logistic/construction bots are available/idle in a logistics network? It would be pretty neat to be able to activate/deactivate your bot production based on how close to saturated your logistics network was (something like if >80% of bots are in use, keep producing until only 50% or something), that way as you add new logistic draws your factory just keeps providing more bots until you're back to having plenty of slack capacity.

Evilreaver
Feb 26, 2007

GEORGE IS GETTIN' AUGMENTED!

Dinosaur Gum

mastermind2004 posted:

Is it possible to use the circuit network to determine how many logistic/construction bots are available/idle in a logistics network? It would be pretty neat to be able to activate/deactivate your bot production based on how close to saturated your logistics network was (something like if >80% of bots are in use, keep producing until only 50% or something), that way as you add new logistic draws your factory just keeps providing more bots until you're back to having plenty of slack capacity.

I have my logi bots inserted into one port, and my const bots in a different one. I don't send 'overflow' anywhere, so as soon as a port is full, production stops. Similarly, whenever demand is high enough to summon bots from those ports, production resumes.

It's not perfect or foolproof but it does the job.

Talky
Mar 26, 2010


mastermind2004 posted:

Is it possible to use the circuit network to determine how many logistic/construction bots are available/idle in a logistics network? It would be pretty neat to be able to activate/deactivate your bot production based on how close to saturated your logistics network was (something like if >80% of bots are in use, keep producing until only 50% or something), that way as you add new logistic draws your factory just keeps providing more bots until you're back to having plenty of slack capacity.

Yes! If you hook a roboport up to a circuit network, it automatically outputs 4 different signals. - 1) the total number of logistics bots in the network, 2) the number of idle /available logistics bots, and 3), 4) the same for construction bots. I think they're set to output them in W, X, Y, and Z, but it has the labels in game there are is. I usually just have my bot production run when "available < some number", but with combinators you could do percentages or something fancier no problem.

Talky fucked around with this message at Sep 2, 2016 around 15:54

zedprime
Jun 9, 2007


Talky posted:

Yes! If you hook a roboport up to a circuit network, it automatically outputs 4 different signals. - 1) the total number of logistics bots in the network, 2) the number of idle /available logistics bots, and 3), 4) the same for construction bots. I think they're set to output them in W, X, Y, and Z, but it has the labels in game there are is. I usually just have my bot production run when "available < some number", but with combinators you could do percentages or something fancier no problem.
I completely forgot they added this, this changes everything

Its not by default though, you need to change the radio button on the roboport's window after hooking up the wire.

CanOfMDAmp
Nov 15, 2006

Now remember kids, no running, no diving, and no salt on my margaritas.

Ciaphas posted:

After concrete tomorrow I need to figure out when best to (and NOT to) use 'bots and how many of each kind I really need or want

Construction bots seem to have a useful limit especially since you only get to use 10 at a time per personal roboport. Logistics... I guess just the more the merrier?? Seems like it'd be really hard on lube and other things over time though

Construction bots work in the green area (much larger) of the roboports, so plan accordingly. You can carry additional personal roboports in your armor to have more bots working and charging at once. I personally have 3.

In terms of how many bots to have, just make enough that you don't feel like everything slows to a crawl when you really tax the system, like when you come back from an excursion and need to empty all of your trash and pick up your logistics requests, or when a train shows up that needs to be emptied. You will likely have a lot of bots sitting around not doing much, but who cares because your goal is to pave the earth and blot out the sun with your robo-army.

Ciaphas
Nov 20, 2005

> BEWARE, COWARD



Pillbug

FISHMANPET posted:

I usually have 3 personal roboports so I can handle 30 bots at once (multiple roboports also increase your personal range). It works great in the wilderness for dropping new outposts. Also they're useful in your factory for expansion. The key is to have blueprints. It's not a huge deal to shift click a belt on the ground and have a bot place it for you. It is a huge deal to click a blueprint with 80 furnaces and 120 inserters and 180 belts and have the bots place all of them.

Yeah I just built a new factorissimo power plant with blueprints and I'm kind of at half mast here

Solumin
Jan 11, 2013




Ciaphas posted:

Yeah I just built a new factorissimo power plant with blueprints and I'm kind of at half mast here

In my most recent games, I rush modular armor + construction robots just so I can start using blueprints as soon as possible. There's nothing quite like plunking down a complete oil refinery blueprint and knowing you don't have to worry about anything.

Azhais
Feb 5, 2007


Cybernetic Crumb

Solumin posted:

In my most recent games, I rush modular armor + construction robots just so I can start using blueprints as soon as possible. There's nothing quite like plunking down a complete oil refinery blueprint and knowing you don't have to worry about anything.

Yeah, there's nothing quite like walking into a factorissimo with 96 electric smelters and watching those little guys go

Solumin
Jan 11, 2013




Nice use of underground belts

Are you using the Bottleneck mod? (The little glowing lights on the furnaces.)

Azhais
Feb 5, 2007


Cybernetic Crumb

Solumin posted:

Nice use of underground belts

Are you using the Bottleneck mod? (The little glowing lights on the furnaces.)

Yeah, my science isn't running at the moment (need to go liberate more biter nests to finish up the last 2600 purple research ) so all the copper is backed up hence everything is yellow

Ciaphas
Nov 20, 2005

> BEWARE, COWARD



Pillbug

Azhais posted:

Yeah, there's nothing quite like walking into a factorissimo with 96 electric smelters and watching those little guys go



Stealing this layout to fix my loving iron throughput problem

Ignoranus
Jun 3, 2006

HAPPY MORNING

I've seen it mentioned that underground belts are an effective way to fully-pack a belt but it's not clear to me how that's supposed to work (or even why). Can anyone shed some light on that?

Zetsubou-san
Jan 28, 2015

Cruel Bifaunidas demanded that you [stand], I require only that you [kneel]


milward posted:

I decided to get back in the game after a break and to try the modpack that was posted from the MP game and oh god bobs is massive.

I have no idea what I am doing and I have all these new ores and it is wonderful

have this screenshot of my last bobs+RSO+SCT game

RiotGearEpsilon
Jun 26, 2005
SHAVE ME FROM MY SHELF

Azhais posted:

Yeah, there's nothing quite like walking into a factorissimo with 96 electric smelters and watching those little guys go



Oh my god. *furiously writing this down*

Al!
Apr 2, 2010





Am i doing something wrong with my crude oil extraction? I feel like i am constantly running out, do the pumpjacks just cause the wells to run dry so fast that i should always be looking for new places to extract?

Solumin
Jan 11, 2013




Al! posted:

Am i doing something wrong with my crude oil extraction? I feel like i am constantly running out, do the pumpjacks just cause the wells to run dry so fast that i should always be looking for new places to extract?

If you're running with the default richness, yes, you'll run out pretty quickly. You need to look for new places and put speed modules in the old ones.

zedprime
Jun 9, 2007


Any oil above 0.1/cycle is just bonus. You quickly start budgeting that each pumpjack just gives you that 0.1 over whatever your latest and greatest speed modules can speed it up to because it just disapears.

Make sure you have crude storage. Pumpjacks keep depleting their source every tick whether you have room for it in your system or not.

Ratzap
Jun 9, 2012

Let no pie go wasted


Soiled Meat

Ciaphas posted:

Stealing this layout to fix my loving iron throughput problem


RiotGearEpsilon posted:

Oh my god. *furiously writing this down*

Calm down there, it's clearly inferior since it has no beacons and no modules.

Today being Friday we have a FFF here: https://www.factorio.com/blog/post/fff-154

Which is all about the MP challenge they are starting since 0.14.3 is now out. It's up now, get in before it's crowded. Plus a peek at the 0.15 hi res work.

And 0.14.3 released:

quote:

Fri Sep 02, 2016 8:00 pm

Minor features
When selecting anything that uses item/signal filters the filter is automatically set to the item in the cursor if any.
When save of scenario is loaded in multiplayer, it's scenario is saved in user scenarios.
Added /time command to print the current map age.
Added option to host multiplayer game with scenario (it only had new game/load game there).

Changes
server-settings.json are automatically used if they are in the write path and not specified on the command line.
Fonts specified in a locale configuration now have to specify the mod name in their paths. For example, the default font is now specified as "default=__core__/fonts/TitilliumWeb-Regular.ttf".

Bugfixes
Fixed desync related to selection of trains. (31935)
Fixed slowdown in recipe tooltips with large amounts of recipes. (31863)
Fixed show_gui not working with game.take_screenshot.
Fixed accidentally turned on graphics safe mode for all Steam users, which set graphics settings to low values. (31958)
Fixed that the game eated all the CPU in headless mode when no player was there. This also fixed that the memory used grew few bytes per tick when being a server.
Fixed console commands not working when entered directly on Windows headless server. (31918)
Fixed that the server would ignore specified username when given a login token. (31945)
Fixed that it wasn't possible for mods to use custom fonts. (31916)
Fixed crash when removing mods that had items on transport belts that were connected to the circuit network. (31984)
Fixed that right clicking in the craftign menu to craft 5 items wouldn't de-focus the search widget. (31063)
Fixed that joining paused game resulted in a black screen that was there until someone else unpaused it. (31763)
Fixed that map2scenario errors when loading an edited save file that contained assembling machines connected to inserters. (31706)
Fixed that the exit message was wrong when the person just dropped. (saying he couldn't keep up)
Fixed that after reconnecting to server using the small save/quit/reconnect window didn't close the window. (32010)
Potential desync fix related to locomotives being selected in the same tick they are mined by someone else.
Potential fix of crash after a desync.

Scripting
Moved LuaControlBehavior::disabled to LuaGenericOnOffControlBehavior::disabled and fixed it to work correctly. (31232)
Fixed crash after confirming other settings as a server in multiplayer game. (31612)

Solumin
Jan 11, 2013




Ratzap posted:

Calm down there, it's clearly inferior since it has no beacons and no modules.

Today being Friday we have a FFF here: https://www.factorio.com/blog/post/fff-154

Which is all about the MP challenge they are starting since 0.14.3 is now out. It's up now, get in before it's crowded. Plus a peek at the 0.15 hi res work.

And 0.14.3 released:

FF 154 posted:

Big part of the pain when writing automated test in C++ is to have to guess the positions of entities correctly when building a setup to test, especially if they interact (rails, inserter, belts, etc). This is why Michal made an internal mod to generate the C++ code that generates entities based on setup in the game. We can just selected it like this:

Holy poo poo that's really cool.

Hi-res graphics look real good too.

Ratzap
Jun 9, 2012

Let no pie go wasted


Soiled Meat

Yeah, the Factorio team test toolkit is amazing. It really instills confidence in the product (unlike some recent untested poo poo releases *cough* NMS *cough*).

I got onto the challenge server and played a few rounds. It's fun but very hectic (team beat the clock produce stuff before they do thing) and I'm too old for that sort of crap. There's a spectator mode too which is entertaining. I was going to post a screenshot showing Kovarex chopping trees but alas my client crashed with an odd error. Off to post a bugrep (assuming there isn't one already).

Nullkigan
Jul 3, 2009


Whatr's the point of the super-short underground belts vs surface ones in that super-smelter?

Ciaphas
Nov 20, 2005

> BEWARE, COWARD



Pillbug

problem I never expected to have: i have like five cars and i can't goddamn find any of them

RiotGearEpsilon
Jun 26, 2005
SHAVE ME FROM MY SHELF

Nullkigan posted:

Whatr's the point of the super-short underground belts vs surface ones in that super-smelter?

The ore-to-be-smelted is pulled off the blue belt; the metal-that-has-been-smelted is pushed on to the red belt. Using red and blue undergrounds lets you interleave in a helix like that. If you just had the one belt you wouldn't be able to mix like that.

Azhais
Feb 5, 2007


Cybernetic Crumb

RiotGearEpsilon posted:

The ore-to-be-smelted is pulled off the blue belt; the metal-that-has-been-smelted is pushed on to the red belt. Using red and blue undergrounds lets you interleave in a helix like that. If you just had the one belt you wouldn't be able to mix like that.

This is true, needed for the density. In general tho inserting onto an underground belt lets you fill it more completely. Normally inserters on a belt look for a spot to drop the item, then drop it there. But especially on express belt sometimes the gaps fly through too fast for the item to get placed (which is why every so often on your saturated belts there's a lonely gap). On the underground belts it cheats and just inserts whenever the number of items is lower than the max throughput without needing an actual physical spot to place it

Al!
Apr 2, 2010





What do people use for power generation mate game? Massive banks of solar panels and massive banks of capacitors?

Ciaphas
Nov 20, 2005

> BEWARE, COWARD



Pillbug

Oh dear I just finished the last research and looked up how much goes into one rocket and rocket pad and satellite









um




Solumin
Jan 11, 2013




Al! posted:

What do people use for power generation mate game? Massive banks of solar panels and massive banks of capacitors?

Yup. Construction robots make it trivial though. Make a nice 21 : 25 or 20 : 24 blueprint, get the materials, slap 'em down. You'll have 1 GJ of Accumulator capacity before you know it.

Ambaire
Sep 3, 2009



Oven Wrangler

zedprime posted:

Any oil above 0.1/cycle is just bonus. You quickly start budgeting that each pumpjack just gives you that 0.1 over whatever your latest and greatest speed modules can speed it up to because it just disapears.

Make sure you have crude storage. Pumpjacks keep depleting their source every tick whether you have room for it in your system or not.

Wait, what? Is that true? Because if so, then I suppose I should start wiring the pumpjacks to a power switch that only turns on if the crude oil tanks are less than x% full.

Azhais
Feb 5, 2007


Cybernetic Crumb

Al! posted:

What do people use for power generation mate game? Massive banks of solar panels and massive banks of capacitors?

I've got like 7500 solar panels with accumulators in a 20:24 ratio.

My blueprint includes roboports so I just ran out to a huge field, slapped down a gigantic grid of blueprints and the first roboport with some bots, then set up a train stop there and just constantly have trains running from base full of ports, panels, accumulators, and substations and the field just grows and grows and grows without me needing to go back

Ciaphas
Nov 20, 2005

> BEWARE, COWARD



Pillbug

Al! posted:

What do people use for power generation mate game? Massive banks of solar panels and massive banks of capacitors?

Two of these monstrosities gives me 80MW of power, though I think I'm gonna need a third before I end the game

Credit to Arumba for the design



zedprime
Jun 9, 2007


Al! posted:

What do people use for power generation mate game? Massive banks of solar panels and massive banks of capacitors?
Solar and accumulators are the best deal, you pay off the battery's equivalent in solid fuel in an hour. You can and should set up blueprints to help you just pave the world in solar panels.

Unless you have biter settings cranked way up or are going for the no solar achievement or just generally dislike how solar fields look, in which case you can make a call on resource availability whether it make more sense to use coal or solid fuel.

Ambaire posted:

Wait, what? Is that true? Because if so, then I suppose I should start wiring the pumpjacks to a power switch that only turns on if the crude oil tanks are less than x% full.
Per cycle. They will continue to cycle with a pump sitting in front of them off. You will want to wire pumpjack power poles to an electric switch if you want a pull set up. Durrr thats what you said, but yeah, if you want a pull set up you'll want to switch them off. Or just build a bigger crude tank, tanks are cheap.

zedprime fucked around with this message at Sep 2, 2016 around 21:41

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Solumin
Jan 11, 2013




Can anyone explain infinite resources and RSO to me? I don't need them yet, but infinite resources would be really helpful later (way later) in the game. Are they enabled by default? Do I need a mod?

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply
«510 »