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Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Is there a way to make your blueprints mark any conflicting objects for deletion when you pop them down?

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Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

necrotic posted:

Hold "Shift" when placing them. Works also when putting down single item placeholders.

This doesn't work for existing buildings/belts/etc... it only marks trees and rocks for removal.

Well that's annoying. It would be nice to drop a 4x4 balancer on top of four belts without having to remove them first. Thanks for the tip though, will help with my rail laying.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

ninjewtsu posted:

what loader mods do people use?i wanted to try to texago TA miners that were talked about earlier, the mod page for them says "recommended to use with loaders," and now that i've typed in "loader" into the mod search there's like 8 different options

https://mods.factorio.com/mod/LoaderRedux are angel's loaders without having to run bobangels.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Yep, to keep belt contents divisible by 8. New numbers will be 15/30/60.

https://www.factorio.com/blog/post/fff-276

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Yeah sorry my bad for the 60 number, I've been realizing epic fuckups in my base designs before I really get to needing a ton of blue belts so I don't have a ton of experience with them.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

i say swears online posted:

ugh this is gonna be stupid

i just started bob's mods for the first time and everything takes wood. am i missing a forest or greenhouse unit or something? i'm not gonna chop down all these trees

You can make all the wood ingredients by either green houses or algae farms eventually.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

0.17 is out. Listed under betas on the steam client.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Oxyclean posted:

Which beta branch should I use? 0.17 or the 0.17.x latest?

0.17.x if you want bug fixes as they're released.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

If you got enough coal and boilers that you need to feed it with a red belt, maybe spring for the yellow inserters and if you have an outage you can just disconnect the power to the main base for a second and manually feed like one boiler to wake them all up.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Tenebrais posted:

You know, I never actually found out - how long is the day/night cycle in the game? It should be easy to calculate how much energy storage I need for solar but nowhere lists it.

https://forums.factorio.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=5594 for some serious sperging about it.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Oxyclean posted:

I suppose solar is more intensive then nuclear in terms of raw, but boy is solar far easier to set up. Automating panels is basic, and accumulators are basic once you have batteries automated. At that point all you need is space. Plus there's basically no upkeep / fuel to worry about.

I'm in the process of trying to figure out how to set up nuclear, so maybe my opinion will change once I get there, but right now needing like 300 red circuits just to get on reactor feels like hell.

One reactor will put out as much electricity as like 1,000 solar panels though (40 MW), and two reactors next to each other put out as much as 4,000 solar panels (160 MW). I'm pretty sure that when you add all the resources together for both systems they aren't as different as you would think.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Oxyclean posted:

I'm going to hazard a guess you probably have too many pumps currently, too. Or at least personally the only places I've used pumps were getting stuff on and off trains, and on very long lengths of pipe. You shouldn't need them at the exit/entrances of refineries. Unless I've been doing something wrong.

Also, fwiw, I think 1 plastic factory can service like 6 red circuits.

Generally you want a pump leaving your storage tanks even if it's a short run to the consumers, otherwise those pipes will only ever be as full as the tank is and it will take longer to fill up the input on the chemical plants or whatever.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Ciaphas posted:

Someone in this thread had either an image or a blueprint I'm trying to find: a quick and dirty intro to oil thing for getting just the 75 (or whatever) blue science for advanced oil processing. Anyone know what I'm talking about? (That's still a thing in 0.17, right?)

It would be different now, since you need solid fuel and plastic instead of just plastic for blue science.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Oil does not need to be that complicated, I think people way overthink it.

Petrol should go to making plastic and acid, and divert to making solid fuel if there's more than 90% in storage.
Heavy oil should go to lubricant and divert to cracking to light oil if there's more than 50% in storage, or solid fuel if you don't have cracking yet.
Light oil should go to solid fuel and divert to cracking to petrol if there's more than 80% in storage, or solid fuel if you don't have cracking yet.

If you use this priority system as long as you are using plastic, acid, or solid fuel you will not have backups, and if you're not using any of those three things then a backup is not a problem.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Collateral Damage posted:

With the 1000spm builds, how many labs are needed to actually consume that much?

like 62 or so if it's fully beaconed, moduled and you've got full research speed tech.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Bombs.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

The Locator posted:

As a diversion from my giant factory (to me anyway) I decided to load up a new game using Bob's Mods to try it out. The early game was interesting and didn't add too terribly much, my belts are slower and I have to use wood for basic circuit boards so I had to find some silica and make some glass for greenhouses.

Where I really hit my first wall though... steel. For steel it looks like I need oxygen for the furnace I have to use, which is ok, except that the thing you make oxygen in plugs up with hydrogen with no obvious way to get rid of it. My assumption is I need to use the gas-vent thing that's listed with the compressor stuff, but that requires a new type of circuit board which requires solder and solder boards, which requires tin, lead, yet another kind of furnace to combine them, all just to make a single item that might, or might not, actually get rid of the hydrogen gas that I don't need.

This mod set is really interesting, but drat it needs some tool-tip help so I can figure out what something does without going through a dozen steps of manufacturing just to make the item so I can actually see if it does what I think it does. Even FNEI doesn't help in this case, because it tells me what I need to use to make something, not what I need to use to get rid of something.

There are water purifiers to get rid of just about any extra liquid and flare stacks to get rid of just about any extra gas. Part of the challenge with Bobs is trying to use all your byproducts because everything is eventually useful somewhere, but plop one of those things down until you figure that part out.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

The Locator posted:

I didn't realize it when I responded to you on the previous page, but it was a Tuplex video that brought this mod to my attention and made me decide to try it on my new game.

Are you sure? Do you frequently drive your car into trees?

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

KirbyKhan posted:

I do and that poster is confusing Tuplex with Nilaus.

Tuplex drives a car into a tree every time he drives a car, my dude.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Loren1350 posted:

It's my take on adding tiberium. The mod is eventually intended to add not-tiberium ("biterium") and not-vespene ("phosphene") gas.



That is entirely too many products.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

LonsomeSon posted:

Dehumanize yourself and face to the belt spaghetti!

Do you guys like the filter inserter output approach or do you prefer to unload on single belts into filtered splitters?

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

M_Gargantua posted:

Loaders have filters built in

loaders be cheating.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

SubNat posted:

That really reminds me that I wish you could just easily slap down multiple stations alongside eachother and have them act as platforms for the same station, ala OpenTTD's multi-track stations.
With the trains pathing into the first open track on it, instead of needing to assign them to different stations.

Though it wouldn't be super useful or necessary, but it would be neat.

IIRC If you name more than one station the same thing your train will go to whichever one is open when you include that on your schedule.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

super fart shooter posted:

If you're running your factory on a hybrid coal steam/solar power setup (I'm playing IR so nuclear is still far away) what's a good way to make the accumulators drain first at night, before the steam engines up their performance? I tried to do this once by circuiting up the inserters to an accumulator and making them only go active when it gets low, but from what I remember, this didn't actually work that well for some reason

You need an SR latch circuit. Turn on the off-shore pumps when the accumulator hits 20%, turn them off when the accumulators hit 80% or something. Otherwise it will keep turning them on and off if the accumulators are able to charge off the excess steam power.

edit: woah there's like a whole page of this, fb.

Dietrich fucked around with this message at 22:01 on Oct 31, 2019

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Chakan posted:

It's Factorio Friday Facts.

This one's about changing the color of stuff and preparing for 1.0

These guys are awesome. How many devs would be mod-friendly enough to include a script to update the colors of custom art in mods when they re-do their own colors?

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Dr. Stab posted:

I mean that in response to the idea that it's the same number of heat exchangers and turbines to build a non-adjacency boosted reactor setup. If you're looking at the material cost of your nuclear setup, surely the cost of a reactor should factor in.

One time costs average out to zero in the long run. If you're doing a speed run or something, sure.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Galvanik posted:

What is the use of "encoding train positions"?

It can tell you which cars are engines and which cars are not. You can use this data to enable fuel inserters for the engines and avoid putting fuel in cargo wagons, and therefore have universal depot stops which will fuel any train in your network.

Galvanik posted:

And, is it somehow possible to set up a fluid provider and requester at the same station? Like, chlorinated waste water comes in, hydrochloric acid goes out, and only use one station for both.

Absolutely. A stop can be both a provider and a requester. You would need to wire your pumps to some combinators to only activate the HCL pumps when the train station output is outputting a request for HCL, and a second circuit to activate the CLWW pumps when the train content output says the train contains CLWW.

A few things I've discovered about LTN -
1) Always make sure that your request size + your request level is less than your total storage capacity - you don't want your trains sitting there waiting while cargo is slowly trickled out - and if it takes longer than 120 seconds to unload your train the train will just gently caress-off and leave and you'll end up sending cargo to the wrong station the next time that train takes a job. Also make sure you have enough inserters to completely off-load the train in less than 120 seconds, this can be an issue before you've researched all the stack size upgrades.
2) Always wire up your providers to only insert the amount requested. This helps avoid the situation in 1, and also permits you to request less than a full train load for things like low-demand intermediate products with massive stack sizes (blue/red circuits, I'm looking at you)
3) Your train -> chest inserters should just go full tilt, but your chest -> belt inserters should be wired to only insert if the chest they are working with contains equal to or greater than the average chest contents for the station. (Unless you can do some belt balancing output configuration so that the chests are drained equally). Otherwise you'll end up with one chest with 4k material and a bunch of empty chests and a single stack inserter struggling to keep the factory running all by itself.

Dietrich fucked around with this message at 17:13 on Jan 29, 2020

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Mithaldu posted:

always clean your trains in the depot

Nah, wire your poo poo to only send what's requested and never request more than you can take, it won't be a problem.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Tesla was right posted:

Until you start having brownouts. Then your inserters slow down and fail to empty your trains.

I've got to say I've never had that problem, but I'm so worried about brownouts that I have like a 40% power overhead at all times.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Mithaldu posted:

Alright, send me your blueprint of a provider station for sending out assorted outpost materials. Thanks in advance. :)


Also, trashing at depot is also useful if you have a station that produces item XYZ, but also various assorted things you don't want there. I just have a yellow box that throws these things into whatever train is fetching material, know it won't be a bother at the filtered receiver station, and clean it out at the depot.

I have a dedicated construction train I can send to my mall cell and have it filled with outpost building material. I wouldn't want to use LTN for something like that, sounds crazy to me.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Mithaldu posted:

It works 99% fine for me and having the depot clean trash means i can also be fast and sloppy elsewhere. Kind of necessary too for what i'm doing as i need to build *many* outposts, and need to keep the outposts stocked with material destroyed in attacks + ammunition.

Do you put your depot for your construction train network next to the supplies so a bot network can cycle things back to the provider?

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

GotLag posted:

I'm unhappy with the name of my fluid recipe flipping mod, Mirror Mirror on the Oil. That was a dumb placeholder name and it's just not growing on me at all.

But what the gently caress else could I call it?

Mirror Universe?
Flipper?
Untitled Fluid Mod?

Oilio.

or OiliO

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

diremonk posted:

Finally launched a rocket in Krastorio, thought I was going to go crazy with all the different building blocks for everything. I can't imagine trying Angels/Bobs anytime soon. I don't think I'll go back to vanilla, like having the warehouses and loaders too much to give them up. Now just got to get my launch speed up to once per minute.

Had a question about LTN though. I'm using the blueprint from earlier in the thread for the stations and it's been working great once I understood how it worked and what wires do what. I'm thinking about changing from the standard two cargo wagons to three for bulk items like ore and one for smaller refined items that I don't necessarily need as much of like space research. Is it just a matter of changing the LTN stops to have a max train length? What about if I want one drop off location to only request one car of something like red circuits, but have another be able to request three cars?

There are a few ways to go about it, but what you probably want is separate networks for ore versus intermediate and final goods. Standardize on 4 car trains for the ore network and 2 car trains for the other one.

Also set your provider stations to only fulfil the request, not to work until the car is filled.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2ELmXwi3EE

spiderton in action

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Rescue Toaster posted:

Until you've worked with a language that has arbitrary, user-defined, different-per-array indexed arrays, you haven't lived.

My complaints with lua are mainly around the aforementioned indexes, iterating their weird tables, that sort of thing. Trying to find good examples of how to do things with the factorio API is rough too. Plus trying to debug code written against an API that only exists when running in their context is awful too. For the horrors of embedding python, could you imagine hitting a user-defined interrupt, pausing the entire game, and dropping into a REPL to try and figure out what's going on?

I'll admit that C# is probably a curse and a blessing with ONI, as that's probably why the game chugs so hard sometimes. I can't picture factorio working in C#/.NET.

.net core is pretty fast. Still edged out by native code obviously but we're talking about 5-10% difference these days rather than 200%, although native will probably still have a smaller memory footprint.

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Would it be possible to write a mod that would color a train to match the cargo that is currently in it, provided that it is all the same thing?

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Freaksaus posted:

It's already been made actually. I've been using it for quite a while and it works pretty well.

https://mods.factorio.com/mod/Automatic_Train_Painter

There's also https://mods.factorio.com/mod/automatic-station-painter for the train stops.

Awesome!

Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

LordAdakos posted:

So with these changes, how should we be building stations in a vanilla playthrough?

Do we still need stackers or just enough room for 2 trains to fit in line?

If the naming for ore pickups is all 'ORE' and we have 3 pickup stops, can we assign 6 trains to ORE and watch as they automagically get assigned 2 each??

I don't know enough about trains to understand the implications of the changes.

Only build enough room for the max number of trains you set the train stop to schedule. Name all your pickups the same and all your drop-offs the same. Assign enough trains to the route to get the throughput you need, but never more than the number that all the routes can schedule.

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Dietrich
Sep 11, 2001

Xerophyte posted:

In case anyone cares why RGB(0, 0, 255) isn't possible to paint or print: the brief explanation is that what you consider "blue" light is actually light comprised a bunch of different wavelengths that happen to tickle the "blue" cone cells in your eye. Your "red", "green" and "blue" cone cells -- assuming they all work for you -- each has their own spectrum of wavelengths that they detect and, crucially, those spectrums overlap. Most of the photons that activate a "red" cone would also activate a "green" cone.

The rest of your post is good advice for getting natural looking colors but this is not why at all!

The difference is additive (emitting colored light) versus subtractive (using pigment to absorb wavelengths) coloring. You can't print #0000FF because your printer doesn't actually contain blue ink. It contains Cyan. It also doesn't contain Red (Magenta is used) or Green (it has Yellow!). Not to mention that we really don't have any actual pigments which absorb everything but 445nm EM radiation, and the substrate you put it on or the medium you mix it in has its own absorption profile which would impact the visible color.

The entire visible color spectrum is always your brain interpreting the signals from 2 or 3 of your cones, if there was no ability for your brain to see #0000FF, that would be the case for both on the screen and in real life.

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Dietrich fucked around with this message at 21:28 on Nov 12, 2020

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