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Acinonyx
Oct 21, 2005


Jake Armitage posted:

But honestly this show could be a big mishmash of a lot of different 80s tech stories.

The trouble I'm having is that the story just isn't interesting. The tech they are trying to discover wouldn't be revolutionary at that time. What's season 2 going to be, the development of the 286? Early Windows? Blah. This leaves us with the personal drama side, which is also not compelling; a guy who's going to learn to value his wife, a poor man's Dick Whitman (now with scars!), and a punk coder powered by sex.

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TheAngryDrunk
Jan 31, 2003

"I don't know why I know that; I took four years of Spanish."

Usually pilots of shows are kind of weak and then things pick up from there. I experienced the opposite with H&CF. I loved the pilot, but each episode after was worse than the previous one.

I'm not done with it yet though. It has promise.

Jake Armitage
Dec 11, 2004

+69 Pimp

I agree. I kind of reluctantly enjoy it for now, and it wasn't until the second episode that I forgot about my job and started just looking at this like anyone else would, and I enjoyed it more. For me its working more as a vehicle taking me back to the early 80s and some of my weird-at-the-time excitement about computers and technology, even though I was just a really young kid at that time. We got Byte at my house, my dad had that Compaq. I remember what writing code was like in 1985 vs. what its like now. My first computer was a C128, and later my neighbor's dad who worked at IBM brought one by in 1987 or so. So those aspects are pleasant for me.

At least they are introducing some good, modern tv drama now, like the scars, and the man-kiss. Cameron's character is completely ridiculous as a female 80s programming genius, but the character works as boilerplate 80s rebel kid. It's all stupid, sure, but hell I'm curious where its going. I've been comparing this in my head to Pirates of Silicon Valley which was really more about the business than the technology, and I appreciate that they are at least trying to make the technology the center of whatever story they are trying to tell here.

[edit] I should also say one aspect I like about this show is the tension between the sales and business guys and the engineers. Its so true to life. Its always a weird mix of respect and reverence, and disgust and pity. "We know we need you, but don't act like you have any idea what we do or I'll laugh in your face."

Jake Armitage fucked around with this message at 19:30 on Jun 16, 2014

courtney_beth
Jul 23, 2007

I SHALL NOT USE MY
HOOVES AS HANDS


I enjoy the show but realize that if I binged watched the show I would probably like it more.

Just as you start to get a feel for Joe, they add one more layer. His powerplay was brutal and I enjoy him when he's being an rear end in a top hat. :)

unlimited shrimp
Aug 30, 2008



Jake Armitage posted:

At least they are introducing some good, modern tv drama now, like the scars, and the man-kiss. Cameron's character is completely ridiculous as a female 80s programming genius, but the character works as boilerplate 80s rebel kid. It's all stupid, sure, but hell I'm curious where its going. I've been comparing this in my head to Pirates of Silicon Valley which was really more about the business than the technology, and I appreciate that they are at least trying to make the technology the center of whatever story they are trying to tell here.
Cameron was intriguing at first but she's beginning to seem very one-note. How many more "Cameron frantically scribbles & erases" montages are we going to have this season?

Keyser_Soze
May 5, 2009



Pillbug

She's a crappy punk too, just meh all around.

Although I already had an Apple IIe by 1984 running DOS with two sexy 5.25 drives and running Appleworks and doing my reports for HS in it - I'm too dense to understand wtf they are actually building in this show that's supposed to make us all let out a slackjawed "whoa."

strangemusic
Aug 7, 2008

I shield you because I need charge
Is not because I like you or anything!




Keyser S0ze posted:

She's a crappy punk too, just meh all around.

Although I already had an Apple IIe by 1984 running DOS with two sexy 5.25 drives and running Appleworks and doing my reports for HS in it - I'm too dense to understand wtf they are actually building in this show that's supposed to make us all let out a slackjawed "whoa."

It's going to have a handle.

Josh Lyman
May 24, 2009



Gonz posted:

Lee Pace looked like he was tortured in 'Nam, for gently caress's sake.
Holy poo poo, THAT'S who he was in The Hobbit?!

Vintersorg
Mar 3, 2004

PRESIDENT OF THE OFFICIAL BRENDAN FRASER FAN CLUB





Josh Lyman posted:

Holy poo poo, THAT'S who he was in The Hobbit?!

Check out The Fall, he's the lead and it's loving gorgeous.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0460791/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iO0LYcCoeJY

Doctor Butts
May 21, 2002



I don't know where this show could go, and I have a lot of doubts. However, holy poo poo they are doing an amazing job of recreating the look of that era.

The mall was just loving perfect.

strangemusic
Aug 7, 2008

I shield you because I need charge
Is not because I like you or anything!




Doctor Butts posted:

The mall was just loving perfect.

I half expected Jason Mewes and Kevin Smith to make a cameo.

ApathyGifted
Aug 30, 2004
Tomorrow?

This thread needs more appreciation for Lee Pace's "I just hosed your man-bitch, what are you going to do about it?" face.

BIG HEADLINE
Jun 13, 2006

Make your launch.... 'cause mine's gonna be suborbital

ApathyGifted posted:

This thread needs more appreciation for Lee Pace's "I just hosed your man-bitch, what are you going to do about it?" face.



"What'd you do?"

"I pumped her partner for more information." :smug:

bryn987
May 30, 2014


Disappointed in this episode. I mean, did anything really happen?

geeves
Sep 16, 2004



Not really. I suspect next week Joe will have a threesome with that old lady and her gay boytoy and get her to invest a large amount of money for smaller percentage.

Sheng-Ji Yang
Mar 5, 2014




Doctor Butts posted:

I don't know where this show could go, and I have a lot of doubts. However, holy poo poo they are doing an amazing job of recreating the look of that era.

The mall was just loving perfect.

definitely reminds me of growing up in early 90s Houston, even if it's a decade earlier.

Josh Lyman
May 24, 2009



Just to make sure I understand the BIOS situation correctly, Gordon figured out the functional spec of the IBM BIOS. In other words, he figured out its inputs/outputs that software interacts with. However, in order to replicate the functionality, they'd still have to use the IBM BIOS, so they hired Cameron to write a Cardiff version of the IBM BIOS, now that Gordon figured out what it has to do. Is that right?

What's the binder about?

TheAngryDrunk
Jan 31, 2003

"I don't know why I know that; I took four years of Spanish."

^^ that's my understanding. The binder is the source code, I believe.

Edit: or some portion of the reverse engineering that they aren't allowed to use.

TheAngryDrunk fucked around with this message at 01:31 on Jun 18, 2014

Sober
Nov 19, 2011

First touch: Life.
Second touch: Dead again. Forever.

Josh Lyman posted:

Just to make sure I understand the BIOS situation correctly, Gordon figured out the functional spec of the IBM BIOS. In other words, he figured out its inputs/outputs that software interacts with. However, in order to replicate the functionality, they'd still have to use the IBM BIOS, so they hired Cameron to write a Cardiff version of the IBM BIOS, now that Gordon figured out what it has to do. Is that right?

What's the binder about?
From what I understood of how Compaq did it, but basically yeah. You have to write a version of the IBM BIOS that would be compatible with all the software that works on an IBM PC, except you can't copy it, and the person writing it has to have never looked at it (because it would 'corrupt' their version of the code, and be liable for them to sue them versus being coincidental). That's the only way to copy an IBM PC, by doing this insane reverse-engineering thing so they can't sue you.

What is a little weird is that no one is actually describing to Cameron what to write specifically. I would've assumed Gordon would have to do it (without talking to her, so via intermediary or something) since he actually transcribed the assembly code. Or it was all offscreen and Cameron is just angsty Sean Young-lookalike because she's trying to do the 2x speed part of the equation but she has goony as gently caress high standards.

geeves
Sep 16, 2004



Josh Lyman posted:

Just to make sure I understand the BIOS situation correctly, Gordon figured out the functional spec of the IBM BIOS. In other words, he figured out its inputs/outputs that software interacts with. However, in order to replicate the functionality, they'd still have to use the IBM BIOS, so they hired Cameron to write a Cardiff version of the IBM BIOS, now that Gordon figured out what it has to do. Is that right?

What's the binder about?

See my description from last page. While Gordon reverse engineered he can create high level specs. Those specs thru a Chinese wall are given to Cameron. Cameron writes new code to interpret specs.

pentyne
Nov 7, 2012
turdiak


geeves posted:

See my description from last page. While Gordon reverse engineered he can create high level specs. Those specs thru a Chinese wall are given to Cameron. Cameron writes new code to interpret specs.

They're not showing it, and its not even implied. Cameron is just scrawling magical code on surfaces at random intervals and not generally being useful. There have been quite a few news articles discussing the show that mentioned the complex process of how Compaq got it done, but as far as in the show goes the closest we've got is Joe throwing the binder at Cameron and telling her to copy it, then Cameron gives the binder back to IBM because she's gonna do her own thing. Which makes no sense at all since Gordon would need the binder to create the specs.

I'm glad the other characters are pretty interesting so far, because as the 3rd main cast member Cameron is given nothing to do but be "itinerant drifter & troubled super-genius" all the time. I'm dreading the episode where she reveals her BIOS version and all the tech guys are gobsmacked at how perfect it is before its inevitable loss to the power surge.

Sober posted:

but she has goony as gently caress high standards.

They've sort of dropped it since the second episode where Cameron went on her tirade about not wanting to make a boring beige box and how computers should be this magical device that does everything. I thought that was going to be part of her character but it seems to have translated into "creates revolutionary new BIOS" rather then complaining that the product is a consumer PC.

pentyne fucked around with this message at 06:40 on Jun 18, 2014

wormil
Sep 12, 2002

Hulk will smoke you!

We know more about some of the guys who were fired than we know about Cameron. I'm hoping Cameron is a red herring and Gordon's wife takes over as the female lead because Mackenzie Davis looks lost.

Kung Fu Jesus
Jun 20, 2002

lol jews gonna get fucked.

pentyne posted:

They're not showing it, and its not even implied. Cameron is just scrawling magical code on surfaces at random intervals and not generally being useful. There have been quite a few news articles discussing the show that mentioned the complex process of how Compaq got it done, but as far as in the show goes the closest we've got is Joe throwing the binder at Cameron and telling her to copy it, then Cameron gives the binder back to IBM because she's gonna do her own thing. Which makes no sense at all since Gordon would need the binder to create the specs.

Yeah, this whole reverse engineering thing makes no sense to me as a non-technophile. From the way it appears on the show, Cameron is basically told to create a new BIOS from thin air because she can't use the book and has no other frame of reference. How is that reverse engineering? That seems more like inventing to me. Wouldn't you need the original in order to reverse engineer it? If Gordon figured out the functional specs and was supposed to give that to Cameron as a starting point, that was not made clear at all. Where's that book?

wormil
Sep 12, 2002

Hulk will smoke you!

Kung Fu Jesus posted:

Where's that book?

She obviously memorized it, off camera, like everything else she does that is plot related.

Octy
Apr 1, 2010



I can't be the only one who only watches this show for Lee Pace's deep, sexy voice.

pentyne
Nov 7, 2012
turdiak


Kung Fu Jesus posted:

Yeah, this whole reverse engineering thing makes no sense to me as a non-technophile. From the way it appears on the show, Cameron is basically told to create a new BIOS from thin air because she can't use the book and has no other frame of reference. How is that reverse engineering? That seems more like inventing to me. Wouldn't you need the original in order to reverse engineer it? If Gordon figured out the functional specs and was supposed to give that to Cameron as a starting point, that was not made clear at all. Where's that book?

The whole point of the binder (which, again she gave back to IBM for reasons) was that Cardiff's BIOS has to do exactly the same thing as IBM's BIOS without being a line for line copy of the code. Otherwise all the software designed to run on the IBM BIOS would be useless on a Cardiff PC.

Instead we're getting "Cameron develops everything independently, scrawls on whiteboards, mirrors, while listening to 80s music". And somehow the product will be exactly what they need but better then IBM's BIOS. It's not a good sign that 3 episodes in the show is contradicting itself with the reverse-engineering aspect and constantly forgetting that Cameron and Gordon are legally barred from being in the same room or speaking to each other.

Octy posted:

I can't be the only one who only watches this show for Lee Pace's deep, sexy voice.

Right now his "I'm Patrick Batemen meets Gordon Gecko" is the only thing keeping this show from being just another mediocre summer offering.

Josh Lyman
May 24, 2009



Wait, this was shot in Atlanta? To think I could have been stalking Lee Pace this whole time!

The project was a spec script and the showrunner wrote a few episodes of Southland. That explains why the show seems to be halting stalling a bit.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Josh Lyman posted:

That explains why the show seems to be halting stalling a bit. catching fire.

Ftfy.

I want this show to succeed, and I want to like it, but it's just not doing it for me. I can't see it being renewed for s2. I think it could be great, but it's just failing.

Hopefully it'll pick up.

IRQ
Sep 9, 2001

SUCK A DICK, DUMBSHITS!



Kung Fu Jesus posted:

Yeah, this whole reverse engineering thing makes no sense to me as a non-technophile. From the way it appears on the show,

Well it doesn't make sense on the show. What actually happened was Gordon? the nerd, had to describe the code to Cameron through an intermediary (without just transcribing it verbatim) because it has to be independently written to be legal to use. Purple monkey dishwasher style coding, if you will. The reverse engineering has already taken place, now they're trying to skirt the law and make it useable.

This doesn't seem to happen on the show though, as Cameron seems to just pull things out of her rear end that she needs to frantically scrawl on whatever is at hand which is related to computers because reasons.

mobby_6kl
Aug 9, 2009



mobby_6kl posted:

Didn't watch this yet, but as a huge nerd, I find the premise very intriguing and the setting of 80s Texas should be refreshing as well. Some early reviews seem to say that it's good, but does try a bit too hard to ape some other workplace period drama. Still, I'm planning on checking it ounce once I have some time.

Welp, it's a shame that the show's going down the shitter just three episodes in. I haven't started watching yet due to lack of time, but if the feedback and reviews continues in this manner, I probably never will. Given the timeframe, location and subject matter, maybe Mike Judge should've been making this show in parallel with Silicon Valley.

unlimited shrimp
Aug 30, 2008



First episode of Mad Men gave us Don, Peggy, Joan, Pete, Roger, and Betty, all of whom would be major characters. By the third or fourth episode we had spent time with pretty much everyone else who would be a major character in some way. Kinsey, Sal, Sally, Trudy, Bert, etc. By the third episode we were already being slapped in the face with 1960s anachronisms and it added to the charm of the show.

The only characters of consequence in this show so far are Joe, Cameron, Gordon and his wife, and and the sales guy. They do a good job making it look like the 1980s but they don't really comment on the era. Everything's moving super fast plot-wise and it seems like they'd rather show Frantic Cameron montages than dramatize her work.

I dunno, I'll stick with it's like they're trying to make a new Mad Men without ever having watched Mad Men and without a proper budget.

unlimited shrimp fucked around with this message at 15:49 on Jun 19, 2014

passionate dongs
May 22, 2001

Snitchin' is Bitchin'

unlimited shrimp posted:

Everything's moving super fast plot-wise and it seems like they'd rather show Frantic Cameron montages than dramatize her work.
This is particularly disappointing to me. I struggle to compare it to Mad Men because that's entirely out of this show's league, but Mad Men knew how to make things I would have no understanding (or care) about and turn them into best moments on TV. Will he/won't he sign a contract, pitches about pantyhose and slide projectors, those were all great moments because we knew exactly what was at stake.

It feels like whoever is writing the computer stuff and whoever is writing the cunning business stuff don't quite understand each other on this show.

passionate dongs fucked around with this message at 00:39 on Jun 20, 2014

strangemusic
Aug 7, 2008

I shield you because I need charge
Is not because I like you or anything!




drat that last episode was not great. Others have noted this but Cameron did nothing this week but hurriedly scribble, groan and chuck things off her desk.

I must admit I don't understand at all what motivated Joe to start making out with Venture Capitalist (Allison Janney, yay!!)'s right hand man.

The Gordon plot was decent this week though. It started on a strong (if slightly goofy) note with his firing binge, and I like the Kill Room vibe - I didn't love the idea that he was just going to steal his wife's idea and effectively railroad her, but you got the sense that he's a guy doing what amounts to his best in an unwinnable situation.

strangemusic fucked around with this message at 14:49 on Jun 20, 2014

Baronash
Feb 29, 2012

So what do you want to be called?


strangemusic posted:

drat that last episode was not great. Others have noted this but Cameron did nothing this week but hurriedly scribble, groan and chuck things off her desk.

I must admit I don't understand at all what motivated Joe to start making out with Venture Capitalist (Allison Janney, yay!!)'s right hand man.

The Gordon plot was decent this week though. It started on a strong (if slightly goofy) note with his firing binge, and I like the Kill Room vibe - I didn't love the idea that he was just going to steal his wife's idea and effectively railroad her, but you got the sense that he's a guy doing what amounts to his best in an unwinnable situation.

That wasn't Allison Janney.

JEEVES420
Feb 16, 2005

The world is a mess... and I just need to rule it

Josh Lyman posted:

Just to make sure I understand the BIOS situation correctly, Gordon figured out the functional spec of the IBM BIOS. In other words, he figured out its inputs/outputs that software interacts with. However, in order to replicate the functionality, they'd still have to use the IBM BIOS, so they hired Cameron to write a Cardiff version of the IBM BIOS, now that Gordon figured out what it has to do. Is that right?

What's the binder about?

One person figures out the code and what function it does. He then writes down what it does without the how it does it. This gets handed to the second person who now knows what it needs to do then writes how to do it. This is how reverse engineering works.

The binder is the code (how it does it) that Gordon figured out. He should be writing each line of what it does and giving it to Cameron who is suppose to then figure out how to make it do that. This keeps things legal because Cameron never saw IBMs code.

strangemusic
Aug 7, 2008

I shield you because I need charge
Is not because I like you or anything!




JohnSherman posted:

That wasn't Allison Janney.

gently caress. Jean Smart. My facial recognition is busted.

Shitenshi
Mar 12, 2013


passionate dongs posted:

This is particularly disappointing to me. I struggle to compare it to Mad Men because that's entirely out of this show's league, but Mad Men knew how to make things I would have no understanding (or care) about and turn them into best moments on TV. Will he/won't he sign a contract, pitches about pantyhose and slide projectors, those were all great moments because we knew exactly what was at stake.

It feels like whoever is writing the computer stuff and whoever is writing the cunning business stuff don't quite understand each other on this show.
That, and this show's people are as dull as sandpaper. A bunch of boring superprogrammers that we're told are geniuses but don't come off that way, and one smug rear end in a top hat in a suit whose whole job so far is being a smug rear end in a top hat in a suit, and in any other show someone would have hit him with a baseball bat, but the plot is so heavy-handed we all know that he's going to come out on top even if he's caught dropping a deuce in public for no reason.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

I dunno, watching him drop a deuce in public would at least be interesting.

IRQ
Sep 9, 2001

SUCK A DICK, DUMBSHITS!



Pope Guilty posted:

I dunno, watching him drop a deuce in public would at least be interesting.

No but he totally gay made out with that guy in the last episode that's totally oh no wait that's not really interesting at all in 2014 unless you're 80 years old and live in Indiana.

I'm giving this show one more episode to not suck, and that's only mostly because there's poo poo all else on.

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Sucrose
Dec 9, 2009


Fiendish Dr. Wu posted:

Ftfy.

I want this show to succeed, and I want to like it, but it's just not doing it for me. I can't see it being renewed for s2. I think it could be great, but it's just failing.

Hopefully it'll pick up.

Ratings are......not good. IMO, AMC is going to toss both their new scripted shows (this and Turn), and try again next year.

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