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pookerbug posted:It comes down to the frustration that the show isn't fitting people's preconceptions of what they feel it should be and as a result they are unable to enjoy the show for what it is. I don't argue that it's flawed, but so far it's been good enough to keep me interested and I'm willing to give it the benefit of the doubt - for now. Agents of SHIELD had many problems including not having good episodes until the end of the season, this show is much more enjoyable early on. I do think you are right about this show having a problem being a substitute for AMCs other shows and people wanting it to be a different show.
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Jun 30, 2014 18:56
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There's so many 80's touches about this show which continue to amaze me. Maybe I have low standards, or maybe no one has really tried to recreate the era as far as fashion and design goes. I mean, just the fact that they have all of these drat period correct cars is loving amazing considering that era was like the nadir of automobiles that no one reminisces about. Cameron trying on 20 blouses all with different varations of satiny/cap sleve/big rear end bow tie was hilarious. Doctor Butts fucked around with this message at 21:34 on Jun 30, 2014 |
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Jun 30, 2014 21:32
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That's the thing - most 80s references in media are either like Joe or Cameron. It's less common to see folks like Gordon and Donna (though The Americans doesn't do too bad of a job there, either).
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Jun 30, 2014 22:11
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The costuming for Joe is really quite clever though. I've noticed they have been very deliberate in choosing his wardrobe from the subset of 80s fashion that has come back around in 2014. His knit tie, for example -- big in the 80s and just now making a return. It works really well to ground him in the present (or their future) without making him look like some sort of time traveler.
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Jun 30, 2014 23:00
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Jake Armitage posted:That last episode was definitely a step up, mostly because it had a minimum number of This episode also clearly defined why Joe is essential to the company in business terms. He's great at selling the concept to the electronic retailers in poetic terms, and he knows world-wide business culture like no one else in Texas. Just the look on his face when Gordon said he made reservations at a sushi restaurant was perfect, like it was a Business 101 mistake that thankfully he could fix. His apology was also carefully tailored to appease the Japanese, and if Gordon hadn't begged his father to fix it they might have given Joe a second chance.
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Jul 1, 2014 00:36
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technical moments. But I feel like these characters are so thin that every episode is basically just a couple scenes reiterating the same thing about them over and over again.
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I'm about half way through 1x4 and I can't tell if MacKenzie Davis is a bad actress or if the writing for her is just atrocious. Donna is just miles stronger than Cameron and it's really amazing that Kerry Bishe is billed behind Davis
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Jul 1, 2014 01:56
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Really enjoyed this last episode.
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Jul 1, 2014 02:28
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I give it about two more episodes before Donna is playing her boss's Texas Instrument.
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Jul 1, 2014 02:29
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Damiya posted:I'm about half way through 1x4 and I can't tell if MacKenzie Davis is a bad actress or if the writing for her is just atrocious. She becomes notably better in episode 5, given actual plot besides "be angry 80s rocker chick" and actually displays human competency and foresight in usurping her manager and forming a connection with some members of the coding team.
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Jul 1, 2014 02:46
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Bachelor Numpad posted:I give it about two more episodes before Donna is playing her boss's Texas Instrument. If there were ever a moment for  this would be that moment.
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Jul 1, 2014 02:47
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Bachelor Numpad posted:I give it about two more episodes before Donna is playing her boss's Texas Instrument. Given how lovely Gordon treats her, I wouldn't blame her.
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Jul 1, 2014 03:13
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Having just finished the most recent episode, I have renewed faith in all this. No canned metaphors, yay! American-Japanese relations straight out of "It's Not All Raw Fish" - weirdly, anachronistically great! Actual character depth and no "I googled Punk music" montage for Cameron! You're swingin' for the fences, show.
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Jul 1, 2014 03:35
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pookerbug posted:It comes down to the frustration that the show isn't fitting people's preconceptions of what they feel it should be and as a result they are unable to enjoy the show for what it is. I don't argue that it's flawed, but so far it's been good enough to keep me interested and I'm willing to give it the benefit of the doubt - for now. What's also playing into it is that we know AMC is capable of better, we can see where the writers are cribbing from superior shows like Mad Men, and they just haven't been able to pull it off. We know they can do Serious Drama because of Mad Men and Breaking Bad, and that they can do Exciting Pop Serial Drama because of Walking Dead. How do they keep missing the mark with all these other shows? It's like they have HBO concepts and network TV everything else. Ubiquitous_ posted:Given how lovely Gordon treats her, I wouldn't blame her. 
unlimited shrimp fucked around with this message at 03:54 on Jul 1, 2014 |
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Jul 1, 2014 03:51
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Bachelor Numpad posted:I give it about two more episodes before Donna is playing her boss's Texas Instrument. Pointed direction in the phone call scene where both characters' wedding rings were plainly visible in their phone hands.
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Jul 1, 2014 03:53
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Pretty good episode. Cameron is actually showing signs of being a character rather than a cliche. And I like Yo Yo. Hope he sticks around.
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Jul 1, 2014 05:19
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unlimited shrimp posted:What's also playing into it is that we know AMC is capable of better, we can see where the writers are cribbing from superior shows like Mad Men, and they just haven't been able to pull it off. We know they can do Serious Drama because of Mad Men and Breaking Bad, and that they can do Exciting Pop Serial Drama because of Walking Dead. How do they keep missing the mark with all these other shows? "Mom, they're not pumping out the exact same show again and again! Unfair!"  isk posted:That's the thing - most 80s references in media are either like Joe or Cameron. It's less common to see folks like Gordon and Donna (though The Americans doesn't do too bad of a job there, either). Also the car, it's still popular today and it hits the "douche-bag salesperson" mark spot on. Also I drive one, so... 
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Jul 1, 2014 18:21
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Last episode definitely picked things up better. I wish it had me 80s music though.
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Jul 1, 2014 19:03
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I keep wanting Gordon to do better because the show sort of makes him an underdog. So, I get mad at the show when he does dumb things like get drunk and badmouth people. Even though he's the underdog to everyone with power, he's a gigantic douchebag. The more I remember that, the less 'problem' I have with his antics. Factor Mystic posted:Pointed direction in the phone call scene where both characters' wedding rings were plainly visible in their phone hands. The infidelity plot was set in stone the second she and her boss were talking about growing up together.
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Jul 1, 2014 19:10
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Measly Twerp posted:"Mom, they're not pumping out the exact same show again and again! Unfair!" You are certainly free to find it enjoyable, but saying that this show is a departure from the stylistic norm for AMC is hilariously off the mark.
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Jul 1, 2014 19:23
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JohnSherman posted:This is literally the same kind of character driven drama series that AMC has been putting out for the better part of a decade now. It wants to be the shows that people in this thread are comparing it too, but the writers are apparently unaware that you need to actually write compelling characters. I don't find the characters uncomplaining, but then I'm ok with being patient and seeing how things develop, so far it sounds like a lot of whining over "It's not Breaking Bad 2" as if it's reasonable to expect the same quality of every show.
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Jul 1, 2014 20:12
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I'm catching up right now and I just got to Cameron's little tantrum where she is like "when you're in the flow you don't think about backing up mannnnn!". Good god I hate this character.
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Jul 1, 2014 23:01
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ApexAftermath posted:I'm catching up right now and I just got to Cameron's little tantrum where she is like "when you're in the flow you don't think about backing up mannnnn!". Good god I hate this character.
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Jul 2, 2014 07:21
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Measly Twerp posted:I don't find the characters uncomplaining, but then I'm ok with being patient and seeing how things develop, so far it sounds like a lot of whining over "It's not Breaking Bad 2" as if it's reasonable to expect the same quality of every show. Not counting Luck (which was cancelled for other reasons), the last time an HBO drama failed to get a second season was John from Cincinatti 7 years ago. Even a show like Enlightened, cancelled after the second season due to low viewership, was still critically acclaimed. So clearly HBO "gets it" and is able to reliably put out high-quality content regardless of the plot or concept. AMC seems to have a high level understanding of what's required to make great TV but it's a complete crapshoot when it comes to execution.
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Jul 2, 2014 16:15
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unlimited shrimp posted:Nobody is expecting a first season show to magically be the next Mad Men or Breaking Bad. What I do expect is for AMC to, at this point, have a better understanding of why those shows were great. They shouldn't be considered flukes. It wasn't magic. See also: Low Winter Sun
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Jul 2, 2014 16:20
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Toilet Terror posted:See also: Low Winter Sun Low Winter Sun started surprisingly strong (watching Mark Strong and Lennie James murder a fellow cop and cover it up is a big opener), but then it meandered into terribleness between the Prostitute with a Golden Heart that Strong's character kept trying to find, and the Last White Gang in Detroit as the other main plotline.
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Jul 2, 2014 16:47
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I must have been half sleeping for some important scene telling me all about this, but who is the douchy Steve Jobs/Aston Kutcher look-alike who's always being mean to his secretary? He doesn't seem connected to the rest of the story as far as I can tell  edit: OH it's the wife's boss. I totally didn't connect that it was her when she was at work instead of slaving away in a kitchen 
My PIN is 4826 fucked around with this message at 20:30 on Jul 2, 2014 |
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Jul 2, 2014 19:45
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One of the best scenes in the series thus far was the 'boss' calling everyone in to tell him how to get out of the cave.
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Jul 2, 2014 23:40
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BIG HEADLINE posted:One of the best scenes in the series thus far was the 'boss' calling everyone in to tell him how to get out of the cave. The show seems to be at its best when it's not concerned about the plot, which is the its greatest weakness just because it relies so heavily on Joe and Cameron being terrible. Cameron's pretty enjoyable when she's chumming with her coworkers and not being the 'tortured punk genius'.
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Jul 3, 2014 00:06
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God drat Cameron is a lovely character. I really liked her in the pilot, but Jesus. It's like they hired a writer just for her and that person is dead set on tanking the show, maybe as some sort of revenge on AMC for cancelling Rubicon. Or maybe this is one of those weird challenges, like "Let's get lovely ratings and tank the characters for 6 episodes and then try to dig back out of that hole."
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Jul 3, 2014 07:18
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Cameron is supposed to be a brilliant prodigy/rebel genius but instead of Mozart in Amadeus we've been given 1980s training montages. e: \/ I think she's just underdeveloped. The character had a lot of potential in the pilot that they have done next to nothing with in the subsequent episodes. unlimited shrimp fucked around with this message at 16:37 on Jul 3, 2014 |
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Jul 3, 2014 16:08
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I don't really think she's a bad character as much as the character is a kind of a bad person. That doesn't mean the character is poorly written. It's obvious Cameron is a brat desperately in need of parents, or some other order-imposing authority. She's the epitome of Programmer Hubris and being right about the mythical man month or being able to write a bios from scratch only enable her. I agree that a brat being bratty is less interesting than a brat not allowed to be bratty. I was somewhat disappointed that Agile Manager Guy got fired, because him sticking around to impose rules would've been interesting for Cameron's character.
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Jul 3, 2014 16:13
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Factor Mystic posted:I don't really think she's a bad character as much as the character is a kind of a bad person. That doesn't mean the character is poorly written. It's obvious Cameron is a brat desperately in need of parents, or some other order-imposing authority. She's the epitome of Programmer Hubris and being right about the mythical man month or being able to write a bios from scratch only enable her. Unless they completely walk it back in the next few episodes, it seemed like having that manager dictate to her pushed her to connect with the other coders and become more mature about her role in the company. Joe nailed it when he broke down why she wasn't fit for management but if she really did get over her ego and now wants to direct the coding team herself in a semi-professional manner then her potential as a character will be much better then when she was the "badass outsider" who doesn't listen to anyone.
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Jul 3, 2014 17:40
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pentyne posted:Unless they completely walk it back in the next few episodes, it seemed like having that manager dictate to her pushed her to connect with the other coders and become more mature about her role in the company. Now she'll be the proverbial Luke Skywalker leading the ragtag team of coders. Which is unassailably better than her previous characterization, for sure.
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Jul 3, 2014 19:23
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strangemusic posted:Now she'll be the proverbial Luke Skywalker leading the ragtag team of coders. Which is unassailably better than her previous characterization, for sure. "Hey, you guys wanna go trash a hotel room and scratch letters into our arms?"
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Jul 3, 2014 21:40
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Can't wait for Cameron's faceplate to accidentally pop off, Westworld-style.
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Jul 4, 2014 01:22
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Anyone have some recommendations for music like Trentmoller's intro? I know of Kavinsky but that's about it.
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Jul 4, 2014 01:33
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Meatwave posted:Anyone have some recommendations for music like Trentmoller's intro? I know of Kavinsky but that's about it. The intro is Trentmoller? Haven't heard that name since his famous essential mix way back when
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Jul 4, 2014 01:40
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bryn987 posted:The intro is Trentmoller? Haven't heard that name since his famous essential mix way back when Well drat, I knew there was a reason I liked the intro music so much. Long version for kicks: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liHjofQBAeM Also for things along that line I would suggest Sepalcure, Plaid, Harmonic 313, Jean-Michel Jarre, Machinedrum. strangemusic fucked around with this message at 04:29 on Jul 4, 2014 |
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Jul 4, 2014 03:55
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I just hope they let Cameron wear a bra because the actress is too obviously uncomfortable without one.
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Jul 4, 2014 06:39
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Meatwave posted:Anyone have some recommendations for music like Trentmoller's intro? I know of Kavinsky but that's about it. Lazerhawk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1NAhlVRaZ4 Com Truise https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mY9J87SV6dA Mitch Murder https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzV-5zeZlhs Flashworx https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcOiJnWniWg RCMP https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8AbQYBHJdM
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Jul 4, 2014 16:30
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