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Ubiquitous_
Nov 20, 2013

by Reene


It was the very end of "Drip, Drip", Season 1 Episode 5.

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Teriyaki Hairpiece
Dec 29, 2006

Ask me about my dream Frasier episode where Frasier and Bulldog oil their heads and then rub them together. It's definitely not a fetish of mine, I swear!

It was specifically to show Teddy that if someone comes up behind you, chokes you out, then does stuff to you while you're passed out, you don't have a lot of say in the matter. I'm not sure if Teddy really got the point.

CalvinandHobbes
Aug 4, 2004



cheerfullydrab posted:

It was specifically to show Teddy that if someone comes up behind you, chokes you out, then does stuff to you while you're passed out, you don't have a lot of say in the matter. I'm not sure if Teddy really got the point.

Yeah, Daniel said aobut the event that "It doesn't do any good to fight back" and Teddy was talking about how a real man would have fought it off and Daniel probably enjoyed it, the direct quote is "did you fight back or did you relax and enjoy it". Daniel made an attempt to tell Ted that there that it wasn't that simple and there were things he didn't know. Daniel then showed him the things he didn't know.

I'm hoping if Teddy sr. confronts Daniel then Daniel and cogently make this clear although I really doubt it.

precision
May 7, 2006

hug your posting pals


It's getting increasingly hard to convince people I'm not the guy reviewing this for the AVClub. His review of the latest episode said exactly what I did, that there are many scenes (especially Ted-Tawney) that are essentially filmed and written exactly as if they were in a soap opera (if soap operas were, you know, good). It's an interesting route for the show to take, and while I'd say there have been some bits of this season that felt awkward and less than perfect, the core of the show is still phenomenal and I've got pretty high hopes for season 3. Season 2 feels like a very long, deliberate set-up season, and there's no way they wrap anything up next week.

Also, why was Jared spying on Bobby Dean? What the heck is his deal? Are they seriously implying that he's curious about what killing someone would be like, and if not, what was the point of that scene where Daniel tells him "it's OK to be curious" or whatever?

Ubiquitous_
Nov 20, 2013

by Reene


That was likely more "it's okay to be curious about the truth of what happened", because he's the one constantly left out of the loop as far as big events with Daniel are concerned. This is why he had Hanna's tape for Daniel earlier in the season.

As for the "soap opera" critique, I thought that was one of the laziest criticisms I have ever seen leveled at the show, and that AVClub review was bullshit for it.

Ed Zeddmore
Dec 12, 2011

:h:love will turn you around:h:


http://insidetv.ew.com/2014/08/18/rectify-renewed-season-3/

Entertainment Weekly posted:

Sundance has renewed the quiet and contemplative small town drama series another round. The critically acclaimed series follows a man (Aden Young) released from prison after spending nearly two decades on death row. It’s not yet clear how many episodes have been ordered — the first season was six episodes; the second season was 10 — though we’re hearing the order may come in on the short side.

Rectify is Sundance’s first wholly owned original series. The show is modestly rated, averaging 287,000 viewers.

I liked the shorter first season better than this one (everybody else has their moments but I really preferred the tighter focus on Daniel), so going back to six episodes or what have you sounds good to me.

blue squares
Sep 28, 2007


I also preferred season 1. I really liked the philosophical feel to it, and feel like this season it has just become yet another TV show, although still very good, but lost what made it really stand out in season 1.

savinhill
Mar 28, 2010


Ubiquitous_ posted:

That was likely more "it's okay to be curious about the truth of what happened", because he's the one constantly left out of the loop as far as big events with Daniel are concerned. This is why he had Hanna's tape for Daniel earlier in the season.



Yeah, pretty much this, Daniel was also saying how he knew he was using his headphones right before that. As for him spying on Bobby Dean, I just saw that as him wanting to see what the family on the other side of the murder was like.

Ubiquitous_
Nov 20, 2013

by Reene


blue squares posted:

I also preferred season 1. I really liked the philosophical feel to it, and feel like this season it has just become yet another TV show, although still very good, but lost what made it really stand out in season 1.

That's kind of a harsh criticism. There's still plenty of philosophy and existentialism to Season 2, but it's spaced out a bit more evenly instead of minutes where Daniel is just laying out in the grass or what have you.

I love Season 1, but I don't think Season 2 has really pulled the show that far from its premise. I can understand where you're coming from, though. But I think this season has been more of a way for the writers to figure out and teach us what kind of show Rectify wants to be. It's still very much unlike most TV.

I'm all for a shorter Season 3, though. I would say my main criticism of Season 2 is the middle section being kind of meandering and slow(er than usual for this show).

Ubiquitous_ fucked around with this message at 05:56 on Aug 19, 2014

hcreight
Mar 19, 2007

My name is Oliver Queen...


God drat that finale. This show should be getting Emmy consideration for the "admission" scene alone. A shame only like 6 people watch it.

Kelfeftaf
Sep 9, 2011


Yes, the season finale was loving incredible, especially the plea deal scene and the montage at the end. Jesus Christ, people, watch this show.

Ubiquitous_
Nov 20, 2013

by Reene


That finale absolutely destroyed me. Can't wait for Season 3 next year.

Lycus
Aug 5, 2008

Half the posters in this forum have been made up. This website is a goddamn ghost town.


If the plea deal gets rejected on account of the Teddy assault, do they have to throw out the new "confession" or can that be used at the trial?

blue squares
Sep 28, 2007


Lycus posted:

If the plea deal gets rejected on account of the Teddy assault, do they have to throw out the new "confession" or can that be used at the trial?

It's sealed, off limits

Red Red Blue
Feb 11, 2007





I didn't enjoy parts of this season as much as I did the first, but this finale more than made up for it

Why can't it be next year already?

precision
May 7, 2006

hug your posting pals


Red Red Blue posted:

I didn't enjoy parts of this season as much as I did the first, but this finale more than made up for it

Yeah pretty much this here. That finale was just goosebump-inducing from start to finish.

Crazy limb theory time here, but Jared sees a whole row of scarves in Hanna's room. I know from experience that girls who like being choked also usually own a lot of things to cover their necks up. So Hanna's death may have been completely accidental, no matter who did it? That's the only reason I can think of for showing that rack of scarves, or in fact, for the "Jared is a creepy home invader" scene at all.

The flashback to young Amantha and Daniel in jail was also really ace.

life is killing me
Oct 28, 2007



Ugh I knew all along there wouldn't be a resolution this season, and that was a bittersweet realization.

I felt bad for Daniel in the finale. It seems like he's given up, but I can see why. In a way he was released from prison, right into another prison, to wax a little philosophical. In the debrief scene (which was easily the most intense scene in this season by far, in my opinion), Aden Young does a very good job portraying a dude who knows he didn't kill Hannah, but just wants it all to be over, and is conflicted about what he should say in order for that to happen. I almost thought he was going to say he didn't kill her so it would go to trial and I was kind of hoping for it. The senator is basically the best antagonist I've seen in a show recently, just for whatever reason determined to see Daniel scapegoated for the murder (I would really love to see why he is so dead-set on putting Daniel away, either he really believes Daniel did it or he's protecting the guys who really did it for some reason). Basically I could just tell Daniel wanted to say that he didn't do it, but is wary of a trial because he's sick and tired of the entire town and of the senator and maybe if he can get away from the town he can just move on with his life.

Anyway, the DA(?) getting that phone call will be a good reveal the next season, and the second the scene began with the boy swinging over the river I was sort of reminded of Stand By Me and knew they'd find the body of the dude who shot himself at the end of last season. Also pretty anxious to find out what Teddy was talking about when he walked in to talk to the sheriff.

gently caress, this is a good show.

Riled Shareef
Dec 19, 2013


Teddy was asking the Sheriff if it was too late to testify about the COFFEE INCIDENT. That's what that was about I'm almost certain. I guess he decided to go through with it since he's hit rock bottom. Family be damned so long as he can rid himself of Daniel.

Riled Shareef fucked around with this message at 08:20 on Aug 24, 2014

CalvinandHobbes
Aug 4, 2004



life is killing me posted:

Ugh I knew all along there wouldn't be a resolution this season, and that was a bittersweet realization.

I felt bad for Daniel in the finale. It seems like he's given up, but I can see why. In a way he was released from prison, right into another prison, to wax a little philosophical. In the debrief scene (which was easily the most intense scene in this season by far, in my opinion), Aden Young does a very good job portraying a dude who knows he didn't kill Hannah, but just wants it all to be over, and is conflicted about what he should say in order for that to happen. I almost thought he was going to say he didn't kill her so it would go to trial and I was kind of hoping for it. The senator is basically the best antagonist I've seen in a show recently, just for whatever reason determined to see Daniel scapegoated for the murder (I would really love to see why he is so dead-set on putting Daniel away, either he really believes Daniel did it or he's protecting the guys who really did it for some reason). Basically I could just tell Daniel wanted to say that he didn't do it, but is wary of a trial because he's sick and tired of the entire town and of the senator and maybe if he can get away from the town he can just move on with his life.

Anyway, the DA(?) getting that phone call will be a good reveal the next season, and the second the scene began with the boy swinging over the river I was sort of reminded of Stand By Me and knew they'd find the body of the dude who shot himself at the end of last season. Also pretty anxious to find out what Teddy was talking about when he walked in to talk to the sheriff.

gently caress, this is a good show.


The senator built his political career on being the prosecutor who put a monster like Daniel way. He's currently running for national office and knows that having the conviction overturned would destroy his chance of winning the race. He's protecting his political career with this. That's why he insisted on the debrief and was so insistant that Daniel confess guilt and that he wasn't coerced into it.

Lycus
Aug 5, 2008

Half the posters in this forum have been made up. This website is a goddamn ghost town.


Riled Shareef posted:

Teddy was asking the Sheriff if it was too late to testify about the COFFEE INCIDENT. That's what that was about I'm almost certain. I guess he decided to go through with it since he's hit rock bottom. Family be damned so long as he can rid himself of Daniel.

And I think that's probably why there will be a trial next season. The prosecution will use the Coffee Incident as leverage to put rape and jailtime back on the table, Daniel will probably say "no", and we get a trial.

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004




Grimey Drawer

The speed this show moves at the trial will probably be in season 4 or 5.

life is killing me
Oct 28, 2007



And Daniel will be living in Delaware or some poo poo, or gently caress, maybe Florida, Daytona Beach with the lay-deez

precision
May 7, 2006

hug your posting pals


Oh, and I think it was meant to be heavily implied that Daniel is planning on killing himself once he leaves Georgia, hence the conversation with Jared: "Will I ever see you again?" "Probably not. Wait a while to tell mother."

If there weren't a third season on the way, this would have been one bleak rear end ending.

life is killing me
Oct 28, 2007



precision posted:

Oh, and I think it was meant to be heavily implied that Daniel is planning on killing himself once he leaves Georgia, hence the conversation with Jared: "Will I ever see you again?" "Probably not. Wait a while to tell mother."

If there weren't a third season on the way, this would have been one bleak rear end ending.

I really hope that's not where they go with the show, but you're right, it does seem like he might be planning on it--saying Jared won't ever see him again would seem weird otherwise since the family could obviously go visit him wherever he went. Though Amantha had already written him off if he said in the debrief that he killed Hannah, or that if he wanted to see her he was going to have to reach out to her.

I didn't understand her whole reaction to the plea deal and the possibility of Daniel admitting guilt in the murder. I mean, it seems like she's only seeing it from her point of view and is scarcely considering Daniel's, his being that as long as he stays in town the witch hunt will never end because of the senator and he will always be seen as guilty, and he just wants it all to end so he can either be at peace or kill himself.

Riled Shareef
Dec 19, 2013


precision posted:

Oh, and I think it was meant to be heavily implied that Daniel is planning on killing himself once he leaves Georgia, hence the conversation with Jared: "Will I ever see you again?" "Probably not. Wait a while to tell mother."

If there weren't a third season on the way, this would have been one bleak rear end ending.

Jesus, I didn't think that at all but now I totally see what you're saying. But I do like to think that his coma-conversation with Kerwin at the very least has convinced him to give life a shot. He just has to get this Hanna business out of the way first.

How long do you guys think the show can go on at this quality? Breaks my heart to say it but I'm not sure that Rectify is a show meant to go on for MAYBE more than... 5 seasons? That might even be pushing it.

Riled Shareef fucked around with this message at 21:32 on Aug 24, 2014

Wallet
Jun 19, 2006



life is killing me posted:

I really hope that's not where they go with the show, but you're right, it does seem like he might be planning on it--saying Jared won't ever see him again would seem weird otherwise since the family could obviously go visit him wherever he went. Though Amantha had already written him off if he said in the debrief that he killed Hannah, or that if he wanted to see her he was going to have to reach out to her.

I doubt that he's planning to off himself. His conversation with Ted Sr. was, I think, making the point that a significant portion of his motivation for accepting the deal is not just that he wants out from under it, but that he wants the rest of his family to be able to move on. Similarly, he tells Amantha, in the scene where they're talking in prison, that she should go back to college, which has no particular purpose except to show us just how long she's been putting her life on hold.

It was a major plot thread this season that Daniel's freedom was far more damaging to his family than his incarceration. It felt, to me, that a lot of Daniel's resignation wasn't him deciding on suicide, or even confession, but rather him accepting that as long as he's around he'll be hurting his family as much as prison hurt him. The plea deal forces him to move somewhere else, where no one knows him, and I assume that he's either going to cut himself off from his family or he expects them to cut him off after they find out what he did to Teddy.

Wallet fucked around with this message at 01:02 on Aug 25, 2014

precision
May 7, 2006

hug your posting pals


Wallet posted:

It was a major plot thread this season that Daniel's freedom was far more damaging to his family than his incarceration. It felt, to me, that a lot of Daniel's resignation wasn't him deciding on suicide, or even confession, but rather him accepting that as long as he's around he'll be hurting his family as much as prison hurt him. The plea deal forces him to move somewhere else, where no one knows him, and I assume that he's either going to cut himself off from his family or he expects them to cut him off after they find out what he did to Teddy.

I mean, I can see that reading but Daniel doesn't seem like someone who would do that to his mother - his sister, father-in-law, Tawney, Jared, maybe, but to be so drastic as to be in a situation where his mother can't even call or visit doesn't quite fit his character for me. I really got the impression he was going to kill himself, though probably in a way that makes it ambiguous whether he just disappeared or what. Because in the end of the season, that's all he wanted to do - disappear. This world is not his home anymore.

Now, let's have some forward progress on a happy Daniel next season, or at least one who isn't so self-defeatingly whiny.

Some random stuff I don't think I posted about before:

- Was the waitress/prostitute (the one the Senator and Daniel have now both had sex with) actually at Lezlie's house and I didn't recognize her? I seriously thought I had missed an episode when he woke up in her bed. Going into next season, I really want to know what her deal is. She was nice to Amantha and obviously cares for Daniel (seems to be about the same age too). As far as I know she also never gave any opinion on Daniel being guilty or not. I had her pegged as a much more important character than she has been so far, based on her season 1 relationship with the Senator.

- Why no scene between Bobby Dean and Daniel after Daniel essentially let him get away with attempted murder? I mean, yes, they're saving it for season 3, and maybe it goes in the pile of evidence suggesting that season 3 was tacitly greenlit the entire time season 2 was being written, but still...

- Charlie the Chaplain was fantastic, just like we got a little more Kerwin this season, I hope we get a little more Charlie next time.

Lycus
Aug 5, 2008

Half the posters in this forum have been made up. This website is a goddamn ghost town.


precision posted:

- Was the waitress/prostitute (the one the Senator and Daniel have now both had sex with) actually at Lezlie's house and I didn't recognize her? I seriously thought I had missed an episode when he woke up in her bed. Going into next season, I really want to know what her deal is. She was nice to Amantha and obviously cares for Daniel (seems to be about the same age too). As far as I know she also never gave any opinion on Daniel being guilty or not. I had her pegged as a much more important character than she has been so far, based on her season 1 relationship with the Senator.

She was at the party, but I don't remember if we actually saw her in the episode. She mentioned Lezlie and his parties to Daniel that morning.

I think she was on the Senator's "side" at the start, but now thinks he's probably innocent.

Lycus fucked around with this message at 01:46 on Aug 25, 2014

life is killing me
Oct 28, 2007



Yeah I mean, if you think a convicted murderer who just got released from death row isn't innocent, you probably wouldn't have sex with him, for money or not.

Anyway, I did notice the whole thread this season was about how Daniel's release affected his family, and I think that was a good way to go. Every time Daniel did some weird poo poo like shoot a gun or get high on coke or mushrooms at Lezlie's party, I sweated a little because I kept thinking that if he was smarter then he'd remember he wasn't technically exonerated and that any of that poo poo could come back to haunt him. Every time he went out and didn't come back that night it scared the poo poo out of his mother.

And as far as the coffee grounds, I mean, I wouldn't think the family would have cut him off for that. Even Ted Sr. admitted that Ted Jr. was sort of an rear end in a top hat. Not saying that it excuses what Daniel did to him, but for goodness sake, he should have kept his mouth shut about Daniel especially that soon after his release. The whole way through I kept thinking how much a big baby Ted Jr. was being about literally everything, especially when he said that Daniel had taken everything from him. I felt for him in that scene where he said that, but honestly he brought everything on himself, including the coffee grounds in his rear end. In the end I think that if Daniel would have apologized to Teddy for it they'd have cut Daniel a little slack, because good loving gosh, Daniel had been in prison for 20 years waiting to goddamn die and then got released into a town that mostly thought he killed Hannah. Then here comes Teddy to stir the pot and start talking poo poo and be a dick to Daniel for really no good reason, and Daniel had enough and retaliated in the only way he felt would be effective after 20 years of feeling powerless in prison.

blue squares
Sep 28, 2007


Or, this guy who you believe is a rapist and a murderer is out and showing an interest in your wife. Your wife who is distant. You feel like you're losing control.

Yeah, Teddy is a dick, but this show is good enough that we have to think of it from his perspective, too. He was scared about Daniel's effect on Tawny and handling that in the only way (being an rear end in a top hat) that he knows how to feel like he has control in a situation.

life is killing me
Oct 28, 2007



blue squares posted:

Or, this guy who you believe is a rapist and a murderer is out and showing an interest in your wife. Your wife who is distant. You feel like you're losing control.

Yeah, Teddy is a dick, but this show is good enough that we have to think of it from his perspective, too. He was scared about Daniel's effect on Tawny and handling that in the only way (being an rear end in a top hat) that he knows how to feel like he has control in a situation.

Yeah and I can understand it but he was being a dick right out of the gate too.

And also, yeah I guess Tawney wasn't really denying it either. That probably made it worse. But now he might help Daniel go back to jail just because his wife hasn't denied that she wants to be with Daneil, even if she doesn't actually want to be with Daniel. But I think the vibe given in the show is that she is drawn to him for some reason and she's not quick at all to disavow Teddy of his suspicions on that matter.

e: I guess she was sort of denying it at first, IDR.

Lycus
Aug 5, 2008

Half the posters in this forum have been made up. This website is a goddamn ghost town.


Of course, if Teddy had only told Daniel to stay away from Tawney, the Coffee Incident wouldn't have happened at all.

precision
May 7, 2006

hug your posting pals


Right, Daniel clearly understands why Teddy would want him to stay away from Tawney, and even believes that he's a bad person for desiring Tawney in the first place. He's caught in the dilemma of having feelings for someone, and believing those feelings are reciprocated and good (for him and her both), but also feeling the moral crisis of knowing that Teddy loves her and that if Daniel hadn't shown up, she would still love him.

Of course it's more complicated now that Tawney flat-out admitted that she might not have been happy with Teddy even before Daniel showed up.

Ubiquitous_
Nov 20, 2013

by Reene


I don't think Teddy deserved the coffee grounds assault at all. No one does. But it's kind of a result of two opposite forces colliding -- a broken man who has spent decades being tortured emotionally and physically by inmates and his own past, and a man used to being the center of attention in the family losing grip on all of it. It was a recipe for disaster.

life is killing me
Oct 28, 2007



Ubiquitous_ posted:

I don't think Teddy deserved the coffee grounds assault at all. No one does. But it's kind of a result of two opposite forces colliding -- a broken man who has spent decades being tortured emotionally and physically by inmates and his own past, and a man used to being the center of attention in the family losing grip on all of it. It was a recipe for disaster.

Yeah all I'm saying it, Teddy should have taken Daniel's previous experiences and hardships into account before deciding he was going to be a complete dick.

But no, I agree with you, Teddy didn't deserve that "punishment." I think Daniel could have gotten his point across with a punch. I always wanted Daniel to just get this cathartic bitch session out with everyone. He always seemed, in both seasons, to be maddeningly stoic about his situation and Teddy and the senator and all that. He only breaks the stoicism a little bit in the debrief when speaking directly to the senator. So it was, again, maddening that he never just lost it even once and did a "normal" thing by just punching Teddy in the face. Not that it's really normal to do that and there's usually no need to punch anyone in the face for anything in the real world, but I wanted him to just make a point.

Last Chance
Dec 31, 2004



I love this show so much. I just rewatched the first episode and Daniel drinks Teddy's beer when he's at home for the first time. Poor Teddy, Daniel just keeps taking more poo poo away from him as time goes on.

mr. mephistopheles
Dec 2, 2009



Just finished season 2 and holy poo poo. This is hand's down my favorite TV show I've ever seen.

Also I don't know if Teddy getting assaulted is a matter of "deserved" but that was for sure the only way he was going to understand how easily all of his power and control could be taken away from him. Plus, you know, I'm not sure a person can get much scummier than mocking someone for getting raped, regardless of them behaving inappropriately toward your wife. The only reason I think anyone doesn't view Teddy as a complete piece of poo poo after that scene is because it's such a prevalent attitude in our society and Teddy didn't really say anything I'm sure we couldn't all imagine someone we know saying. But when you look beyond how commonplace "men can't be raped" is as a cultural mindset all you're left with is him taunting a victim of an extremely severe crime from a position of what he felt was invulnerability based on him thinking Daniel was too weak to fight back, which is pure psychopathy.

I hope Aden Young gets more attention for this season. That last scene alone where, as someone mentioned, it was so clear he wanted to deny everything because he knew it was the truth but he wanted the situation to be over more so he said what he thought they wanted to hear was so perfectly done.

mr. mephistopheles fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Sep 14, 2014

savinhill
Mar 28, 2010


life is killing me posted:

Yeah all I'm saying it, Teddy should have taken Daniel's previous experiences and hardships into account before deciding he was going to be a complete dick.

But no, I agree with you, Teddy didn't deserve that "punishment." I think Daniel could have gotten his point across with a punch. I always wanted Daniel to just get this cathartic bitch session out with everyone. He always seemed, in both seasons, to be maddeningly stoic about his situation and Teddy and the senator and all that. He only breaks the stoicism a little bit in the debrief when speaking directly to the senator. So it was, again, maddening that he never just lost it even once and did a "normal" thing by just punching Teddy in the face. Not that it's really normal to do that and there's usually no need to punch anyone in the face for anything in the real world, but I wanted him to just make a point.

And it would have been nice if Daniel said something like "Teddy just kept digging at me about prison rape, even after I told him my first years in prison were a living hell of repeated rape, abuse and degradation" to one of the people who he discussed the whole coffee grounds incident with instead of letting them just think he lost control of his repressed sex assault urges once again.

precision
May 7, 2006

hug your posting pals


savinhill posted:

And it would have been nice if Daniel said something like "Teddy just kept digging at me about prison rape, even after I told him my first years in prison were a living hell of repeated rape, abuse and degradation" to one of the people who he discussed the whole coffee grounds incident with instead of letting them just think he lost control of his repressed sex assault urges once again.

Nitpick: he was only raped that one time (repeatedly), that we know of.

But yes, a running theme of the show is that Daniel might not get nearly as much of a bad rap if he just told the whole story a bit more often. See also: "Trey took me to see Georgie but Georgie was mysteriously missing, this information might have some relevance to you, Sheriff."

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mr. mephistopheles
Dec 2, 2009



A major part of this season was Daniel having the conscious realization that he thinks he's a bad person, which heavily influences how he tells his side of the story. He tells the Teddy story in a way that makes his actions seem completely uncalled for because he personally thinks they were and he feels he reacted the way he did because he's a bad person and not because he was goaded into it by someone else's purposeful action. Like I think all of Daniel's actions need to be viewed through the lens that he doesn't really believe he's innocent. He knows he's innocent of the crime he was convicted of, but he doesn't believe he is an innocent person and so he doesn't really feel like he deserves to be treated as someone who is good. That seems to be the reason he feels so drawn to Tawny. Not because she thinks he's good because she believes he's innocent like his family does, but because she thinks he's good regardless of anything he may have done that makes him think he is not a good person. Tawny believes in him in a way that nobody else does, especially not Daniel himself. She is his only hope that he might ever be saved from being the person he believes himself to be.

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