UKMT July - The Nigel Farage Barrage Garage - The Something Awful Forums

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Car Stranger: Feb 16, 2005

Apologies for my lazy conjecture, and thanks for the figures!

# ? Jul 31, 2014 14:18

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# ? May 14, 2024 17:03

Metrication: Dec 12, 2010; Raskin had one problem: Jobs regarded him as an insufferable theorist or, to use Jobs's own more precise terminology, "a shithead who sucks".

Car Stranger posted:

If London has the ability to pay for it itself, it's probably because London has developed said ability thanks in part to large amounts of tax revenue historically being funneled into it from elsewhere in the country, isn't it?

So it's not okay for London to take money from central government but then it's also not okay for London to fund stuff on its own? I don't understand the logic of this, they are two opposite positions.

As I pointed out before, the �550bn spent on housing can probably be totally recouped, as councils can borrow (assuming the rules are changed to allow them to) and build and then sell at either a small profit or at cost, then rent some out and make a profit over the lifetime of the property. That's assuming that this is all public sector housing (which it won't be). The �450bn on transport is more complicated but many of the projects involving rail infrastructure will definitely pay for themselves over time, given the immense growth of people taking public transport. It's really not as if this money is going in some black hole where it will never return, it is long term investment that will pay off either on a balance sheet or by the money generated from intensified economic activity, tax receipts etc.

# ? Jul 31, 2014 14:20

Serotonin: Jul 14, 2001; The history of all hitherto existing society is the history of *blank*

Shoot London into the sun.

# ? Jul 31, 2014 14:27

Rude Dude With Tude: Apr 19, 2007; Your President approves this text.

But I don't want to live in a world of tits, puns and sport :cripes:

# ? Jul 31, 2014 14:43

ReV VAdAUL: Oct 3, 2004; I'm WILD about
WILDMAN

In some good news for the government Prison policy is working as intended:

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/jul/31/official-figures-violence-prisons-england-wales

quote:

A rising tide of violence inside prisons across England and Wales has been revealed by official figures showing serious assaults soaring by 30%, three murders in the past 12 months and a 69% rise in suicides to the highest level for nine years.

According to Ministry of Justice figures, the number of self-inflicted deaths in prisons rose by 36 to 88 in the 12 months to the end of March � the highest level since 2005.

Prison governors have repeatedly warned that jails have been struggling to cope with a record population of more than 85,000 in increasingly crowded conditions while implementing budget cuts of up to 24% over the past three years.

With the cut in funding less money is being squandered on trying to treat sex offenders or rehabilitate other prisoners into productive members of society. Good on Grayling!

# ? Jul 31, 2014 14:50

Rude Dude With Tude: Apr 19, 2007; Your President approves this text.

The BBC article too shows how well the system is working!

quote:

The performance of the three prisons in England and Wales that opened under the coalition government is "of concern", according to the Ministry of Justice.

Its annual ratings show Oakwood in the West Midlands and Thameside and Isis, both in south London, have been graded in the third category out of four. They are among 28 jails - out of 126 - rated as "of concern" to officials. Justice Secretary Chris Grayling said prisons "are still running safe and decent regimes".

Oakwood and Thameside both opened in spring 2012 and are privately operated. Isis, a publicly-run jail for adults and young offenders in south London, opened in July 2010.

The Prison System�. Beating Crime, Beating Criminals.

# ? Jul 31, 2014 15:07

Wolfsbane: Jul 29, 2009; What time is it, Eccles?

Metrication posted:

So it's not okay for London to take money from central government but then it's also not okay for London to fund stuff on its own? I don't understand the logic of this, they are two opposite positions.

As I pointed out before, the �550bn spent on housing can probably be totally recouped, as councils can borrow (assuming the rules are changed to allow them to) and build and then sell at either a small profit or at cost, then rent some out and make a profit over the lifetime of the property. That's assuming that this is all public sector housing (which it won't be). The �450bn on transport is more complicated but many of the projects involving rail infrastructure will definitely pay for themselves over time, given the immense growth of people taking public transport. It's really not as if this money is going in some black hole where it will never return, it is long term investment that will pay off either on a balance sheet or by the money generated from intensified economic activity, tax receipts etc.

That's all true wherever you spend the money though. The question is still "why London rather than anywhere else"?

# ? Jul 31, 2014 17:10

Rush Limbo: Sep 5, 2005; its with a full house

Can't make a Brit-Cit without breaking a couple of counties

# ? Jul 31, 2014 18:41

notaspy: Mar 22, 2009

Zero, is that number for the space program adjusted for inflation?

# ? Jul 31, 2014 18:59

twoot: Oct 29, 2012

Drunk passenger attacked plane crew with false leg

quote:

A FLIGHT to Edinburgh had to be diverted to London after a drunk passenger attacked cabin crew with her prosthetic leg.

The woman, who was a passenger on Thomson flight 297 from Enfindha, Tunisia to Edinburgh, had demanded �cigarettes and a parachute�, and became violent and abusive when staff asked her to quieten down.

Shocked eyewitness John Smith said that the woman slapped a young girl sitting next to her before taking off her false leg and swinging it at the stunned cabin crew.

The woman was eventually restrained and put in handcuffs while the pilot made an emergency landing at Gatwick Airport.

She was escorted from the aircraft by police, as relieved fellow passengers broke into a rousing rendition of the Hokey Cokey.

The drama unfolded at around 10pm on the Edinburgh-bound flight on Wednesday evening.

Mr Smith added: �We were coming back from Tunisia when this lady kicked off. She was off her face on drink.

�She was shouting �I want cigarettes� and that she wanted a parachute to jump off the plane.

�She slapped a young girl and then assaulted the cabin crew with her prosthetic leg.

�They took it off her, but she started kicking them with her good leg.

�It sounds funny, but it was not a laughing matter at the time. It was serious. She was totally drunk. It was pretty shocking.�

Other passengers claimed the woman had been involved in a dispute at the resort in Tunisia, with the argument escalating on the bus to the airport.

At Gatwick, police officers took statements from travellers after escorting the woman off the plane.

Mr Smith continued: �When police came on board to escort her off the plane, people started singing the Hokey Cokey.

# ? Jul 31, 2014 19:11

DesperateDan: Dec 10, 2005; Where's my cow?

Is that my cow?

No it isn't, but it still tramples my bloody lavender.

Zero Gravitas posted:

With this amount of money, we could do the same but with a fleet of 55 shuttles going to space.

How many of the :ussr:

BURAN

would that buy though, eh?

# ? Jul 31, 2014 19:13

SybilVimes: Oct 29, 2011

twoot posted:

Way to poo poo on everyone else by 'emergency' landing at gatwick instead of waiting the 20 minutes extra to get to Edinburgh. They had her in cuffs, just carry on instead of this 'must drop everything!!!' security theatre bullshit.

# ? Jul 31, 2014 19:14

baka kaba: Jul 19, 2003; PLEASE ASK ME, THE SELF-PROFESSED NO #1 PAUL CATTERMOLE FAN IN THE SOMETHING AWFUL S-CLUB 7 MEGATHREAD, TO NAME A SINGLE SONG BY HIS EXCELLENT NU-METAL SIDE PROJECT, SKUA, AND IF I CAN'T PLEASE TELL ME TO
EAT SHIT

SybilVimes posted:

Way to poo poo on everyone else by 'emergency' landing at gatwick instead of waiting the 20 minutes extra to get to Edinburgh. They had her in cuffs, just carry on instead of this 'must drop everything!!!' security theatre bullshit.

People were dying for a bit of banter innit, but they needed some police to hide behind

# ? Jul 31, 2014 19:18

goddamnedtwisto: Dec 31, 2004; If you ask me about the mole people in the London Underground, I WILL be forced to kill you; Fun Shoe

SybilVimes posted:

Way to poo poo on everyone else by 'emergency' landing at gatwick instead of waiting the 20 minutes extra to get to Edinburgh. They had her in cuffs, just carry on instead of this 'must drop everything!!!' security theatre bullshit.

20 minutes from Gatwick to Edinburgh? Not even Concorde could have managed that.

(Policy is always to get on the ground as soon as is practical if a passenger kicks off, even if they're restrained, because ultimately you've no idea what might be wrong with them. Accidental overdose/drug interactions, diabetic shock, even some forms of stroke can all cause people to become violent, and of course being restrained is itself medically dangerous. Is it really worth risking someone's life just to prevent a slight inconvenience to the other passengers?).

# ? Jul 31, 2014 19:22

thehustler: Apr 17, 2004; I am very curious about this little crescendo

DesperateDan posted:

How many of the BURAN would that buy though, eh?

Oh god why did you do that! :siren:

# ? Jul 31, 2014 19:45

Fluo: May 25, 2007

notaspy posted:

Zero, is that number for the space program adjusted for inflation?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CbIZU8cQWXc
:911:

# ? Jul 31, 2014 19:59

DesperateDan: Dec 10, 2005; Where's my cow?

Is that my cow?

No it isn't, but it still tramples my bloody lavender.

thehustler posted:

Oh god why did you do that!

For glory of union of soviet socialist republics is why

# ? Jul 31, 2014 20:06

Pissflaps: Oct 20, 2002; by VideoGames

DesperateDan posted:

For glory of union of soviet socialist republics is why

Really naughty copy this. Did it ever even get into space?

# ? Jul 31, 2014 20:08

HortonNash: Oct 10, 2012

Pissflaps posted:

Really naughty copy this. Did it ever even get into space?

One flight, unmanned, then hangered until it literally rusted away and the hanger roof fell on it, crushing it, I believe.

# ? Jul 31, 2014 20:12

Gyro Zeppeli: Jul 19, 2012; sure hope no-one throws me off a bridge

I always love discussion of London public transport, because it's so in-depth. Glasgow, on the other hand, clearly designed the Subway on a Friday afternoon. "gently caress it, a big circle. Done."

# ? Jul 31, 2014 20:51

Plasmafountain: Jun 17, 2008

notaspy posted:

Zero, is that number for the space program adjusted for inflation?

Adjusted for inflation, the accurate figure is for 30 years design, build and operation of 52.96 shuttles.

EDIT:

DesperateDan posted:

How many of the BURAN would that buy though, eh?

I havent been able to find a decent source for the cost of the :ussr:

BURAN

program.

Plasmafountain fucked around with this message at 21:04 on Jul 31, 2014

# ? Jul 31, 2014 20:52

Xachariah: Jul 26, 2004

Shuttles just have to fly once, infrastructure has to be maintained.

EDIT: AS far as the moon landing is concerned anyway.

Xachariah fucked around with this message at 21:14 on Jul 31, 2014

# ? Jul 31, 2014 21:11

Rush Limbo: Sep 5, 2005; its with a full house

Hijo Del Helmsley posted:

I always love discussion of London public transport, because it's so in-depth. Glasgow, on the other hand, clearly designed the Subway on a Friday afternoon. "gently caress it, a big circle. Done."

On the subject of terribly designed transport systems I'm always amused by that legend that the Trans-Siberian railway has a huge curve in it because the designer demanded it be exactly as he say and he had his fingers over the ruler while drawing it.

# ? Jul 31, 2014 21:13

Plasmafountain: Jun 17, 2008

Xachariah posted:

Shuttles just have to fly once, infrastructure has to be maintained.

EDIT: AS far as the moon landing is concerned anyway.

The space shuttle didnt go to the moon :jebstare:

And that cost is for the cost of the entire program. research and dev, construction, launches, recovery, operations, everything.

# ? Jul 31, 2014 21:22

thehustler: Apr 17, 2004; I am very curious about this little crescendo

Xachariah posted:

Shuttles just have to fly once, infrastructure has to be maintained.

EDIT: AS far as the moon landing is concerned anyway.

Erm no they are reusable

# ? Jul 31, 2014 21:23

Microplastics: Jul 6, 2007; It's what's for dinner.

Xachariah posted:

Shuttles just have to fly once, infrastructure has to be maintained.

EDIT: AS far as the moon landing is concerned anyway.

The wrongest post :psyduck:

# ? Jul 31, 2014 21:29

Xachariah: Jul 26, 2004

Yeah but for the space program and all that expense they only had to go to the moon once, and the R&D is applicable to future projects too.

It's not really an apples to apples comparison of a large scale public infrastructure project which has to be routinely repaired due to extensive daily use.

# ? Jul 31, 2014 21:29

Fluo: May 25, 2007

Xachariah posted:

Yeah but for the space program and all that expense they only had to go to the moon once, and the R&D is applicable to future projects too.

It's not really an apples to apples comparison of a large scale public infrastructure project which has to be routinely repaired due to extensive daily use.

What the hell are you smoking? So many things wrong with this post. It's late so I'll for now just point out they've landed on the moon more than once.

# ? Jul 31, 2014 21:33

tooterfish: Jul 13, 2013

Fluo posted:

What the hell are you smoking? So many things wrong with this post. It's late so I'll for now just point out they've landed on the moon more than once.

Just weighing in to say, they actually did it so many times people got loving bored of watching.

# ? Jul 31, 2014 21:37