Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Edit: nvm

Fiendish Dr. Wu fucked around with this message at 22:08 on Jul 28, 2014

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Dark Helmut posted:

Seems like a fairly chaotic place to work, I would really be looking in the background regardless.

I will say that with what I understand about your background I would be careful about titling myself "Enterprise Architect". So with that said, as long as you are keeping your eyes open, soak up as much experience as you can and hope for the best. Get your boss and whoever else you can on your side. Find discreet ways to let the right people know you're kicking rear end. Play the game!



I also like the way the thread was going, minus the occasional alcohol-fueled dips into E/N territory.

Yeah it really is. It's been very chaotic.

And I agree about the title, I really don't go throwing out around, however it is the title. I was just putting it out there because that's how it hit me. 3 months left on this contract, we'll see how it goes.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


three posted:

You could be a hipster sysadmin.

Like the legendary cobol programmer charging $232/hr

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


CLAM DOWN posted:

Think about it objectively before you think we're just a nice place to flee to

But Vancouver looks like a freaking utopia compared to basically any place in the US.

Different question: what would be a great place to move to within the US wrt IT careers (that's not including NYC or Palo Alto)?

My wife and I have had similar fantasies about Canada / Europe, but she's also been talking about Seattle or Denver

Edit: negative didn't register

Fiendish Dr. Wu fucked around with this message at 16:52 on Aug 1, 2014

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Seattle does seem really cool. The IT part of it is obviously a major factor for obvious reasons, but I guess for us we're mostly looking at cultural fit (of which I'll not get into for risk of a nearly guaranteed major derail / thread closure)

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


There's this one guy who is a few desks down from me who is always on his phone talking loud as gently caress and laughing arrogantly and always mentioning his six Sigma black belt

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


rock2much posted:


Escaped the hell desk and moved into telecom. It's in the same company, and it's work they already had me doing since January. With the change from hourly, where I'd been doing 5hrs OT each week for extra loot, to salary, I think I end up with an extra $30 per check. BUT I get to leave at 5pm and enjoy the beginning of rush hour in NYC. Also like 12 more vacation days. Woo!

Hell yeah!

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


This thread totally dies every weekend when we're not talking about extracurricular activities or having drunken breakdowns.

Fiendish Dr. Wu fucked around with this message at 19:18 on Aug 3, 2014

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Tab8715 posted:

Next question, when they ask about expected salary should I give a number? My first thought is to say something along the lines of "negotiable but my target is X."

Note, this is pre-interview.

CTRL+F page 1 yields 23 results for "salary"

Dilbert As gently caress posted:

I think it's better that way.

I king of like it At least I was more productive with general household stuff this weekend (new thread title is appropriate)

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Dark Helmut posted:

^^^ best custom title ever ^^^ (DAF)


Assuming this is with an end client, I think it depends on your situation. Contrary to the typical hardcore stance of this thread, sometimes you just NEED a job and don't want to risk a good one by going overboard playing salary hardball.

There are a million different variables that go into this and there is no one answer that fits every situation. Knowing nothing else, I might look at what other companies in your market pay for similar roles and start the answer that way. "In looking at the market, I've noticed that this type of position typically pays around x. I don't want a number to stand in the way of a great opportunity, so I'm flexible to an extent, but looking to be compensated fairly."

I'm curious. As a recruiter, does it bother you when people talk this way? Are you ever thinking "yeah okay " as if they're assuming you're just going to try to lowball them and haven't done their research?

I mean, I'm sure you guys know the low and high end of the spectrum, probably even more exact that we can gather from glassdoor or whatever. I would almost feel like the guy who watched one episode of Cosmos and is now going to an astronomy convention telling them all that I know more than they do. Am I just totally wrong here?

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Daylen Drazzi posted:

I might be in the minority, but seeing as how most of my jobs for the last 5 years or so have been contract positions, I honestly think I would prefer some recruiter talk. We all know IT, but for some of us our experience with recruiters is either non-existent or drat little, and we view them with about as much enthusiasm as encountering pond scum in the pool.

I want to know how to find a good recruiter, what questions to ask, which questions are okay to answer, and pretty much anything else I would need to know in order to get the most out of dealing with a recruiter. Primarily, I want to know when I'm dealing with some bullshit artist who's feeding me a line and when I'm dealing with a real professional who knows their poo poo.

I agree with this entirely.

I like my current recruiter, and feel comfortable with him and the agency. However, from what I've gathered, the agency is sort of on the lower end of the spectrum and also takes one of the largest cuts. It's generally referred to as the entrance level agency for the area. With this in mind, I feel like I have a good relationship with them and feel like they are working for my best interests, but I'm probably just a huge sucker.

One part of this discussion that I would personally like to focus on its renegotiating contracts. As I've mentioned before, I love my current job and want to stay, but unfortunately it's in the air as to whether my boss is going to be able to hire us on perm. There may be an offer for extension, with which my boss already said would come with an increase in pay (no specific amount yet.)

Now, my position had also inherited a major role. The guy whose role I inherited was easily making double what I'm making (his 10+ years experience vs my 4).

Using general numbers here:
If: I'm currently 20/hr, contracted with no bennies
And: I was originally told that after the 6 months is up they want to hire me at 50k with complete bennies
And: I inherited the role of a guy who I can safely assume was making close to 6 figures
Then: how much should I reasonably expect for a contract extension?

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


NippleFloss posted:

How do you know this? I've seen people get in trouble negotiating before because they assume that the people around them are making more than they are based on hearsay or water-cooler talk.

You're right, it's an assumption I'm making based on his 12+ years experience and qualifications / position at this company. I guess that's what I'm asking for input on - how to go about this because I'm definitely not trying to get into any trouble when it comes down to it.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Dark Helmut posted:

Everyone cuts their own deal in life, in work, and other stuff that's E/N thread-worthy. In this situation, you don't have 12 years of experience, even though you have this guy's job/title. So it stands to reason that even if you do the job as well as he did, in most companies you aren't just automatically going to step into his pay grade.

You justify your salary not only with skill and experience, but with loyalty/longevity of service to the company as well. So, with that said, I would take the same approach I recommended earlier. Find out what desktop architects make in your area, as opposed to focusing on what this guy was making. Have all your bullet points ready to go - what you do well, how you have stepped in and owned the role, and anything else that is in your favor, and set up a conversation. If you are at $50K and the average desktop arch is getting paid $80K, then I'd be happy somewhere in the middle there.

Annnnd I just realized you are on contract, which throws another wrinkle into the mix. If your recruiter is any good and has the latitude to do so, they have already started another conversation with the client since you are holding a much more senior role now. It's unlikely they are going to be able to pay you more unless the client pays them more. I had a project manager take on a more senior program manager role here and even though he deserved it, I was unable to pay him any more. But given the drastic title change for you (architect I believe?), I can't imagine the client would/could refuse a conversation about that.

Thanks for this. Yes, architect is correct. I had a meeting last week with my agency, during which time I explained the new role (with no mention of the other guys salary), and I know they have yet to talk with my boss.

I'm really not too worried as it sounds like I'm in a good position (however I'm still updating my resume just in case).

I've also heard it said that benefits can amount to around 30% of your salary. Is that a fair estimate?

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Dark Helmut posted:

I think you would make yourself nuts trying to quantify/generalize it like that. Instead, I would just look at the big ones - vacation, health care cost, stock options, and maybe the 401K match if they have it. My company chips in like $2400/yr for my HSA, so I would include that for example.

Yeah that makes sense. I guess I have the same feeling as skipdogg where he said

skipdogg posted:

I much rather work a 70K a year job where I get 3 or 4 weeks of vacation and have a really nice low deductible PPO than make 80K a year with 1 week vacation and lovely insurance.

Anyways, I'm just trying to get a general idea and make sure I'm going about it the right way. Thanks for the input.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Aunt Beth posted:

Turns out we had a critical ICMP outage on one of our servers the other day. Boy were my customers happy when I plugged their PC back in.

Speaking of ICMP outages

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


HatfulOfHollow posted:

Please tell me that's a real thing. I want to believe that somewhere out there someone accidentally cut some CAT6 and "fixed" it by tying the severed ends together.

My boss got tired of this one guy always playing the jokester and unplugging usb cables all over the office. He asked to borrow my knife to get even.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


SamDabbers posted:

Well, no job's worth shaving my magnificent neckbeard, but I suppose I could shower and wear something with fewer food stains to make a good first impression.

Although my beard may not be as magnificent or cover as much of my neck as yours, this is how I feel.

SaltLick posted:

I work in a jail and wear the same lovely khakis and polo every day because jail smells like bad easy mac and despair. I went to the interview in a suit. Wear a suit this is easy stuff.

Working in It 3.0: smells like bad easy mac and despair

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Wore khaki's (Dockers Alpha slim), ocbd, blazer, tie, nicest shoes I own to the interview that got me my current job. Will wear my new suit to the next one.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


psydude posted:

Totally up and moving to Middle Earth once I finish my master's.

You have my sword!

And we shall be the fellowship of the nerds.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


dogstile posted:

Can't you just draft a random dude who has a small workload to give you a hand for the day?

Get a guy off the helpdesk "Hey man, I know you've been wanting to do some ~real server work~..."

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Civic

More back seat legroom than my friends ctsv.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


tomapot posted:

I'm hitting that mid-life crisis car age. I have a used Volvo that I bartered with a friend who has a towing company. As much as I want a new(ish) sports car I just can't justify a car payment when I telecommute and only drive around town like 4 times a week.

I plan to drive my civic until I give it to my kid for his first car. Between now and then, If I need a mid life crisis car I'll still drive the civic for daily commute and take the Ariel Atom out on the weekend.

Unless Tesla builds up an infrastructure of power charging units out here by 2017, then I want a model 3

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Sometimes I feel a little crazy and drive my wife's Town and Country to work. The ladies love it (they can't get enough of the stow n go seats and integrated dvd/video display). They see me rollin by and the panties just drop.

Also, I drive it to interviews to show how much of a dependable guy I really am. (not really but it's not a bad idea)

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Tab8715 posted:

I've been eyeing most entry-level German Cars and maybe the Acura ILX. I'm surprised so many high-end luxury cars have terrible crash test ratings, especially small-front overlap.

Really if I got anything else right now besides my civic it would be a 2.0 tdi.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


No matter how great my mileage is in the civic I still have to fill up often because of the commute (60+- round trip) and 10 gallon tank

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


I enjoy my commute. It gives my time to listen to my music, audio books, and podcasts in peace (kids make that near impossible at home)

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


jaegerx posted:

To continue my on topic talk.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/15918...1&robot_redir=1

This is built for sales engineers but works for techs too. I find drawing out the ideas and plans I have in front of the guys with the money gets me the most results.

The other week we were at lunch with a bunch of enterprise architects while we explained the new framework with crayons on the tablecloth.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Swink posted:

Guys who listen to podcasts as they drive- any recommendations? Sysadmin focus?

I've tried many but I always come back to the TWiT network podcasts. This Week in Tech, This Week in Enterprise Tech, and Security Now are my IT related favorites.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


I checked out a few of those but I think the reason I keep coming back to TWiT is for the production value. If I remember correctly, Packet Pushers was one dude with a thick accent breathing into the mix and not even trying to speak clearly.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


skipdogg posted:

I can't do tech podcasts while I drive.... I use my car time to relax, last thing I want to think about is tech stuff. My go to podcasts for my long commutes (up to 3 hours a day in the car 2 or 3 times a week)

Nerdist
Rich Eisen Podcast (If you love the NFL)

Well really then, Star Talk Radio and Nerdist.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


psydude posted:

Get a degree just for the sake of being able to write. Because god damned, there are so many people in IT who cannot write.

Hell yeah.

One vendor engineer we had a meeting with apparently quote a book on the subject. He wrote me an email the next day with so many typos and grammatical errors it was ridiculous. He seriously mis-used "your".

Apparently his book is pretty terrible too. But hey, he wrote a book

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Erwin posted:

If there's anyone who could help you wrap your head around something, it's a neurosurgeon

Okay this made me laugh.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


NippleFloss posted:

... a 30 year old who wants to get into IT should also work towards a 4-year degree because he will already be behind many of his peers on the job ladder and the lack of a degree will hold him back even more.

Oh look, a conversation about me!

I'm 31 now, was 30 when I officially broke into IT. I've got just over 3 semesters left in my B.S. in IT Management.

When I decided I wanted to get into IT, I chose another path and enlisted in the Navy. My original contract was for a CTN rating, then it changed to IT, then I got screwed into the choice between aviation and subs (I enlisted during the peak of The Great Recession of 2009 when everybody and their uncle enlisted). I chose aviation then when I arrived at my command I volunteered for every little bit of IT work I could do. During this time I also completed most of my degree because I knew I would need it when I got out.

Vet status and a secret security clearance helped me get my first gig and pure luck got me my current one. I managed to get into the architecture team for a fortune 500 company - I'm one of the 2 lower level guys where everybody else on my team has masters and typically over 15 years of experience. The other lower level guy I work directly with is working on his Masters.

I mentioned I got my current gig from pure luck and I'm telling the truth. I am not getting on a high horse just to brag, but I can provide a unique perspective. I am severely under-qualified compared to my peers, so I am doing everything in my power to do the job to the best of my ability and prove my worth (which is working out well for me - I'm not here to gently caress around). The "degree" conversation comes up often because of the college prestige dick-measuring that goes on, and when it comes up around me I usually sort of change the subject to my experience in the military - and since non of them were enlisted (most are immigrants anyways) it usually provides interesting conversation.

I said all that to provide a little background so I can say this: if you want to be in a top level team then get your loving degree. If you're happy floating around in the mid-level position then fine, we need people like you too. After all, if everybody applied themselves and got their degrees then my office wouldn't have people to empty my trash can, brew our coffee, and clean our bathrooms.

edit: so - can it be done without a degree? Yes. But why do it the hard way?

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


So here's a different spin on the whole degree / certification thing: With the advent of free MOOC's like on Coursera, how valuable do you think certified specializations are, or will be?

Considering the weight given to "soft skills", you would get much of the same, and many of these free classes are taught by top level education centers like MIT or Berkeley. Should these be given consideration? Do you think they will be looked at negatively because of the free nature?

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Swink posted:

For the record I am one week into the Coursera course "Web Application Architectures". So far I am not super impressed but it is early days.

I'm actually taking that one too (alongside my actual BS coursework). I've gotten my wife to sign up as well, who really doesn't know about tech stuff at all. It's been fun so far from that aspect.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


No black people here, but plenty of minorities. We use lots of Oracle. You get one guess.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


contract extended with 50% raise!

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


MC Fruit Stripe posted:

IT chat: we're all hideously out of shape, some of you are downright ugly, and all of us need to exercise more. Who's with me on a vague, non-committal promise to do something about it?

Hell yeah. Just had my first day (back) at the gym yesterday, and I can barely move my arms today. IT is great because you can be sore as gently caress and be able to spend your time recovering in a chair.

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


Just have my first high level webex presentation about the current and future state of server operating systems in our production environment to about 40 architects.

I think I need a beer now...

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Fiendish Dr. Wu
Nov 11, 2010

You done fucked up now!


quote:

For the sake of argument, let's say your initial offer is $70000. If you get a 5% raise after one year, and another 5% raise after another year, you're looking at $77175. If you negotiate just $5000 more to start and get the same percentage increases, your first raise puts you at $78750. You're making more after one year than you would be after two under the initial offer.

So what you're saying is that 5% of a big number is more than 5% of a little number.
math is hard

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply