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frozentreasure
Nov 13, 2012

~


Remember how everyone and their dog tried to make a mascot platformer for the Playstation in the hopes that they'd be the new rival of Mario and make even half as much money? Well…



Let's Play Croc: Legend of the Gobbos!

Argonaut Software, of Star Fox fame and nothing else, pitched a Yoshi spinoff to Nintendo for the N64 and were rejected. From the looks of the final product, I can't imagine why. Eventually they found another publisher and kept working on the game for the Sega Saturn I mean the much more successful Sony Playstation. In 1997, Croc released on the PS1, as well as the Saturn, PC, and Gameboy (but we don't talk about any of those). The game focuses on obnoxiously hard platforming and collecting little fuzzballs that are definitely 3D and not sprites rotating to face the camera like it's still 1993. Croc himself is kind of adorable and the story is pretty funny, in that very manufactured way, and the music is totally jammin', but don't let it fool you: Croc is definitely a bad game.

Which is obviously why I'm doing a 100% LP of it.

Joining me on the horror funtimes will be Scruffy, and possibly some other people if I can trick them the same way I tricked him (but don't tell them that). Hopefully we'll have a video a week, if not more frequently.

And just in case anyone is, for some reason, concerned about spoilers: There are four main worlds (grass, ice, desert, castle), there are secret levels in every world, you get jigsaw pieces from them and those let you get to the secret island. The manual literally tells you all of this, none of it is spoiling anything. You're free to talk about whatever you want as it relates to Croc 1.

With that out of the way, let's get started!

Part 01: Duck Soup (feat. dscruffy1)
Part 02: Mashed Beetles (feat. dscruffy1)
Part 03: Bucket O' Chum (feat. lateinshowing)
Part 04: Goat Stew (feat. ElTipejoLoco)
Part 05: Fish Tacos (feat. RJWaters2)
Part 06: Cactus Salsa (feat. Zain)
Part 07: Donuts (feat. Apt Funk)
Part 08: Dantini Cocktails (feat. heytallman)
Part 09: Crystal Head Vodka (feat. dscruffy1 & Jenner)

frozentreasure fucked around with this message at Oct 28, 2014 around 13:31

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Vorpal Cat
Mar 19, 2009

Oh god what did I just post?


Oh Croc, I have fond memory of you and I'm not really sure why. I mean I new it wasn't my favorite game and I never actually beat it even though I got to the last world. But when your a kid you don't really understand the concept of a bad game on some fundamental level, you have games you love to play, and games you don't quite like as much.

edit: For those who haven't played this game before one thing that's not immediately in the video is how awkwardly croc controls. This is basically tank controls: the platformer and being an early to mid ps1 game the camera is not your friend.

Vorpal Cat fucked around with this message at Aug 22, 2014 around 15:39

Rodyle
Feb 18, 2011



I never played Croc 1 but I did 100% 2 (which just had an LP abandoned so hard the dude destroyed the disk) on PC. This will be interesting to see I guess.

ElTipejoLoco
Feb 27, 2013

Let me fix your avisynth scripts! It'll only take me a couple horus.


Was Croc designed after Yoshi's Island when it was pitched to Nintendo? It feels like at least the 'disguised' crystals might be following the whole red coin philosophy from that game.

Simply Simon
Nov 6, 2010

I've found reality to
be highly over-rated!


Repeating the story from the other LP of this game: I was like 12 and had discovered the magic of Mario 64 and was seriously hurting for more jumpy action. Friend had this for PC. He confessed that he had no idea how to even play it, let alone do well on it. I tried the first level, all giddy, half an hour later I decided that Croc is loving bullshit and not worth trying to get good at. The controls are just abysmal and 90% of the game's problems (the rest are taken up by awful level design, leaving...whoops).

jawbroken
Aug 13, 2007

messmate king


Grimey Drawer

If you scale your videos to at least 720 lines before uploading then you'll get a better encode. More importantly, I won't have to watch a 360p version because YouTube broke 480p and 1080p when they changed streaming tech.

Fionordequester
Dec 27, 2012

Actually, I respectfully disagree with you there. For as obviously flawed as this game is, there ARE a lot of really good things about it. The presentation and atmosphere, for example, are the most immediate things. No other Yu-Gi-Oh game goes out of the way to really make


Awe man, you guys really think this is a bad game? I mean, yeah, it's camera and controls could've used some work, but, after you get used to them, I find this game incredibly fun! IMO, it's designed in a way that the difficulty starts out slow, but then ramps up gradually, to the point where it becomes very difficult towards the end. But, it's also brilliant in the way it ramps up the difficulty because, again, IMO, aside from the beginning of a level called "Arabian Heights", it never gets to the point where it's just flat out cheap, but is always fair in it's difficulty...

Then again, this is coming from a guy who likes 7th Saga, so, take that as you will.

Crosspeice
Aug 9, 2013

Zzzz... sploosh... zzzz... KABOOM... zzz... sploosh...

Pfft, I've only 100% this game at least ten times, once you get past the awkward Tomb Raider controls, the bad camera and the Sonic-esque crystal system, the game is... okay? Mario and Spyro just completely chumped this game in every way though. It's still fun!

The Saurus
Dec 3, 2006

by Smythe


I thought Croc 2 was pretty awesome, actually, but that was quite a while later and I never played the original so I guess there was some improvement inbetween.

Fiendly
May 27, 2010

That's not right!

I'm not entirely sure why you guys are doing this to yourself, but I'm gonna really enjoy it. This first stage actually looked half decent and nearly fun (outside of the bad controls and hitboxes, which are cardinal sins in a platformer), but I know from the other LP that the game gets unforgiving and unforgivable really soon. This B- level is probably the high point of the game.

frozentreasure
Nov 13, 2012

~


Fiendly posted:

I'm not entirely sure why you guys are doing this to yourself

I'm doing it to Scruffy; and when I originally recorded this, there wasn't a Croc LP on the forums, so I figured I'd give them one. And then as soon as I finished recording the game, the other LP started.

dscruffy1
Nov 22, 2007

Look out!


Fun fact: my video stopped playing while we were recording audio. CAN YOU GUESS WHERE?

Ztarlit_Sky
Mar 4, 2014


Nap Ghost

Oh man, Croc.

I played it when I was younger and had somehow convinced myself that it was a good platformer. I think in my infinite patience I even got to the final boss, but not the bonus stages. You have my sympathies.

Doc M
Jan 6, 2011

I enjoy metal because of its dark, creepy, intense aesthetic.



I remember trying this game back in the day and thinking it played like poo poo. It got pretty good reviews and my friends seemed to think it was better than Mario 64, so I figured I must be missing something.

The mid to late 90s were a dark time for all of us.

Geostomp
Oct 22, 2008

Unite: MASH!!
~They've got the bad guys on the run!~

I know he was originally meant to just replace Yoshi, but why is he a Croc if he doesn't even bite or swim? Anything with a tail could replace him without changing anything worthwhile.

MarquiseMindfang
Jan 6, 2013


Geostomp posted:

I know he was originally meant to just replace Yoshi, but why is he a Croc if he doesn't even bite or swim? Anything with a tail could replace him without changing anything worthwhile.

I always thought he was just Blocky Gex.

Also Croc does swim. But that's not a point in his favour because the swimming levels are awful.

Fionordequester
Dec 27, 2012

Actually, I respectfully disagree with you there. For as obviously flawed as this game is, there ARE a lot of really good things about it. The presentation and atmosphere, for example, are the most immediate things. No other Yu-Gi-Oh game goes out of the way to really make


Hmm, watched the first episode now, and there are some things I agree with you on. There are too many instances where if you don't do something right, it punishes you by forcing you to restart. For example, that Sheep mini-game at the end of World 1-3? Yeah, if you don't do that right, you literally have to restart the entire level!! Also, the little things like too little going on in Feeble's Lair, and the boring series of floating platforms in Level S1...

But you know what, I also think there were also some good game design decisions in there as well. Like, the Quick-Turn, or the ability to either smash through a box or float in the air a bit, or the way the Hidden stages are significantly more complicated and larger than the other stages (despite having the same amount of screens).

And in addition, the art design of the game is very well done. Like how the sky goes red for all of the boss levels, and the way all the animations are fairly smooth, and how the colors are bright without hurting your eyes...that kind of thing. Really, the only complaint I have in that area is that the pre-rendered stuff (the sky basically) isn't large enough, meaning that there are times where you're just looking at this huge white or black void, which is somewhat lazy. On the flip side though, when it works, it really works.

Now, don't get me wrong Frozen, I'm not calling you an elitist ignoramous or anything, but...you know, I figure, as a fan of the game, why not point out some of the things the game does well, you know? You guys don't mind, do you?

EDIT: Oh, almost forgot, about that Sheep mini-game? There's actually a MUCH easier way of doing that, which is basically to just position yourself in a way where you can just run across all the switches, do just that, then quick turn, run across them all again, and then just repeat that ad nauseum. Unfortunately, Croc also tends to get closer and closer to falling off as you do that, so you have to occasionally re-position yourself...but other than that? It works really well for me!

Fionordequester fucked around with this message at Aug 23, 2014 around 23:34

Simply Simon
Nov 6, 2010

I've found reality to
be highly over-rated!


Dude you're talking to goons. You can get run out of the forums for liking something. Beware.

dscruffy1
Nov 22, 2007

Look out!


Hey! We got us a thing liker over here! Someone grab the oil!

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012


Simply Simon posted:

Dude you're talking to goons. You can get run out of the forums for liking something. Beware.

The really funny thing is when people like a thing for a while, and then someone says it sucks, and then everyone scrambles to hate it most, and claim they hated it all along.

It's amazing.

Blood Sally
Jan 9, 2007


Jim's now a
Trick-or-Treating Cave Salamander!



dscruffy1 posted:

Hey! We got us a thing liker over here! Someone grab the oil!

Hey, I heard there was a thing liker in this thread. I came as fast as I could, sorry I'm late.

Oh, a Croc LP. Oh.

Fionordequester
Dec 27, 2012

Actually, I respectfully disagree with you there. For as obviously flawed as this game is, there ARE a lot of really good things about it. The presentation and atmosphere, for example, are the most immediate things. No other Yu-Gi-Oh game goes out of the way to really make


chiasaur11 posted:

The really funny thing is when people like a thing for a while, and then someone says it sucks, and then everyone scrambles to hate it most, and claim they hated it all along.

It's amazing.

And THAT...would be called Hindsight Bias, also known as the knew-it-all-along effect, is the inclination, after an event has occurred, to see the event as having been predictable, despite there having been little or no objective basis for predicting it, prior to its occurrence. Kind of like saying "yep, that married couple? I could tell they were doomed from the start", even if that wasn't what they originally thought...

Crosspeice
Aug 9, 2013

Zzzz... sploosh... zzzz... KABOOM... zzz... sploosh...

Man this game is such a piece of poo poo and I really enjoy playing it and none of you bitches can stop me. I might even play it RIGHT NOW.

(Also never knew there was a secret area in the first level, I thought I'd found them all by not looking very hard)

Simply Simon
Nov 6, 2010

I've found reality to
be highly over-rated!




Why isn't this sick filth banned yet?

frozentreasure
Nov 13, 2012

~


Fionordequester posted:

I mean, yeah, it's camera and controls could've used some work, but, after you get used to them, I find this game incredibly fun!

I shouldn't have to get used to something to enjoy it.

Fionordequester posted:

But you know what, I also think there were also some good game design decisions in there as well. Like, the Quick-Turn

The quick-turn is only there and is only necessary because Croc can't turn on a dime to begin with.

quote:

Now, don't get me wrong Frozen, I'm not calling you an elitist ignoramous or anything

Seems odd that you'd say that you're not doing that when that thought didn't even cross my mind reading your posts.

quote:

but...

So, you are doing exactly that.

Anyway.

Part 02: Mashed Beetles

EDIT: No, Fionordequester, you're not a bad person or in trouble for liking this game. You're just in the minority, and also on SA.

frozentreasure fucked around with this message at Aug 27, 2014 around 00:15

Prythian
Aug 6, 2012

sweet dreams


So, the almighty Google says that a Dantini is cocktail of gin, vermouth, and tonic water.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.


Dinosaur Gum

Early 3D games will usually always suffer in comparison to modern stuff.

I'm trying to imagine how this might have been a Yoshi game. Maybe one where Yoshi doesn't eat stuff to get ammo to free-aim?

Fionordequester
Dec 27, 2012

Actually, I respectfully disagree with you there. For as obviously flawed as this game is, there ARE a lot of really good things about it. The presentation and atmosphere, for example, are the most immediate things. No other Yu-Gi-Oh game goes out of the way to really make


frozentreasure posted:

EDIT: No, Fionordequester, you're not a bad person or in trouble for liking this game. You're just in the minority, and also on SA.

Wonderful! Well then...anyways, I will say that this section of the game wasn't so good, at least not in terms of level design. I mean, we got that Tumbling Dantini who literally shows up for just that one screen...and then never makes an appearance ever again (not even in Croc 2), the end of S2 is basically just a rehash of the end of S1, and the levels were much shorter here than in the last video...

In fact...they almost seem kind of rushed. I mean heck, look at Level 1-6! That one doesn't even have any enemies in it!

Daigerus
Nov 5, 2009


I just noticed that the boxing canvas has Flibby's face painted over it, and that there's an audience watching that ooh's and ahh's during said match. Either Baron conjured up the ring for Flibby as well, or Croc takes so long in terms of in-game time that Flibby just constructs said ring to match his ego in his free time - why else would it be absurdly big even for the newly transformed ladybug?

Great LP so far - love how you're showing off secrets and even throwing in game design alongside the entertaining commentary. You'd think Croc would be a better swimmer, but I guess it's kind of hard to make swimming good in general when it comes to video games.

NoEyedSquareGuy
Mar 16, 2009

Just because Liquor's dead, doesn't mean you can just roll this bitch all over town with "The Freedoms."


The best part of this LP is watching you do awkward things like jump backwards into gems so you can preemptively avoid the camera getting stuck on the wall. I played this on the first generation of Playstation controllers when they didn't have joysticks yet, and don't think I ever got past the second world on account of all the finnicky jumps and horrible ice physics. You really have to play it to understand how bad the controls are in this game, the video makes it look deceptively functional.

Fionordequester
Dec 27, 2012

Actually, I respectfully disagree with you there. For as obviously flawed as this game is, there ARE a lot of really good things about it. The presentation and atmosphere, for example, are the most immediate things. No other Yu-Gi-Oh game goes out of the way to really make


Daigerus posted:

I just noticed that the boxing canvas has Flibby's face painted over it, and that there's an audience watching that ooh's and ahh's during said match. Either Baron conjured up the ring for Flibby as well, or Croc takes so long in terms of in-game time that Flibby just constructs said ring to match his ego in his free time - why else would it be absurdly big even for the newly transformed ladybug?

Since I found this line of thought amusing, I actually looked at the world map/stage select screen for this world...and I found that, if you hover over any level besides Level 1-1, that boxing ring is still there, even BEFORE you ever get to Feeble!

So basically, the whole thing is either one big coincidence, or Dante's got an insane amount of free time on his hands...Huh.

Fionordequester fucked around with this message at Aug 28, 2014 around 04:15

frozentreasure
Nov 13, 2012

~


Glazius posted:

Early 3D games will usually always suffer in comparison to modern stuff.

This suffers in comparison to other games at the time, though; Mario 64 and Crash 1 controlled astoundingly for first outings.

NoEyedSquareGuy posted:

The best part of this LP is watching you do awkward things like jump backwards into gems so you can preemptively avoid the camera getting stuck on the wall.

It's more because Croc doesn't turn on a dime and it's way easier to jump to hit a single gem 90% of the time. The camera is an issue for the gems behind me, of course, since quick-turning would make the camera immediately try to swing behind me, screw up the controls and probably make me miss it.

Apt Funk
Nov 2, 2012


Oh man, this game. Lots of bad memories with this one. I actually cringed a bit when I saw that water section, knowing how bad they get. I still 100%'ed the game for whatever reason, but yeah, not fun. Shame I never really appreciated the music when I was younger, though. It's actually pretty sweet.

frozentreasure
Nov 13, 2012

~


The worst part about Croc isn't how the controls and the camera are hosed, that the enemies pose no challenge, that the coloured gem are pointless, that the collision detection is awful, or that the game is difficult in the laziest way possible throughout the second half of the game, it's that it has some pretty cool design concepts that it doesn't do enough with.

Nah, I'm kidding, it's totally the hosed controls and camera.

Part 03: Bucket O' Chum (feat. lateinshowing)

Crosspeice
Aug 9, 2013

Zzzz... sploosh... zzzz... KABOOM... zzz... sploosh...

Croc's sidestep is very similar to Spyro's roll from his first game, absolutely pointless and doing anything else is better instead. Also, why does everyone find Tree Tops that hard? I don't get it.

Also, gently caress that pot minigame, but there is a way around it via a glitch. I won't say what it is if you're gonna talk about in the future, since it lets you skip all the pots, because I'm rubbish at those and haven't completed a single one (well, maybe once and was surprised I could do it and annoyed it took so long), yet have 100% the game.

Fionordequester
Dec 27, 2012

Actually, I respectfully disagree with you there. For as obviously flawed as this game is, there ARE a lot of really good things about it. The presentation and atmosphere, for example, are the most immediate things. No other Yu-Gi-Oh game goes out of the way to really make


Hmm...yeah, some of the stuff that was in that video, like the pot mini-game and the lack of music loop...yeah, can't defend that. Although, to be fair, at least from what I've seen of the PC version, the music actually DOES come back on eventually. You just have to sit through a minute or so of awkward silence, which is still pretty bad...but, you know, it's something.

And what Late said about the bonus stages, I totally agree with. They were pretty lazily designed, at least in this world. There was clearly no thought put into either increasing the difficulty from level to level, or making them more complex as you go on, or any of that. Just "random stuff thrown together", as he said.

I guess the only thing I have to really argue about is the whole "Trident Dantini on a box" thing. Personally I thought that was kind of interesting, so I actually kind of liked that whole level design concept. But...

Anyways, yeah, nothing much to say there, although, I will say, it's going to be interesting seeing what you have to say about the Desert World, because that is actually where I really start to enjoy this game, mainly because I feel like that world and the Castle world is where the game designers start to really mix it up with the level design. Because the levels have so much more going on in those stages, and are generally a lot longer and more complex and all that.

So that's something that I'm going to be looking forward to. Just because it's interesting to see whether or not what I like about that world is exactly what you hate about it, you know? In any case, good job on the LP so far! It's been really entertaining!

Fionordequester fucked around with this message at Sep 3, 2014 around 07:17

Lateinshowing
Oct 10, 2012


Well, it's more that for dumb 10-12 year old me, that poo poo was impossible. Not to mention I didn't quite understand collecting EVERYTHING until later on. When I play it now, it's super easy and I do look back thinking why was I so dumb.

Captain Fargle
Feb 16, 2011



Ahh! Croc 1. I have some interesting trivia about this game!

Croc wasn't just released on Playstation and PC. It was also released on the Sega Saturn. The Saturn was a really loving weird piece of hardware in terms of it's internal architecture and notoriously difficult to program for. With Croc this lead to extremely large graphical glitches in the Saturn version if the game loaded when the system booted. ie: If you had the disc in when you switched on your Saturn. If you wanted to play the game in such a way that Croc's model actually had a head, you had to boot your Saturn without a disc inserted so that it would take you to the system's main menu screen. Once you were on the system menu you could insert the disc, launch the game from there and it would play perfectly normally. Since this was the 90's and patching this stuff just wasn't an option you instead got a little flyer inside your game box informing you of how to load it properly.

I imagine this is a big part of why a Saturn version of Croc 2 somehow failed to materialise.

Fionordequester
Dec 27, 2012

Actually, I respectfully disagree with you there. For as obviously flawed as this game is, there ARE a lot of really good things about it. The presentation and atmosphere, for example, are the most immediate things. No other Yu-Gi-Oh game goes out of the way to really make


And in addition, there's THIS whole page of trivia!

http://croc.5u.com/facts.htm

Most interesting facts off the top of my head...

1)"Croc's arch-nemesis, Baron Dante, was originally called "Denver"! The name was changed when the Lead Designer, who is also a movie fan, joined the Croc team (to quote; "Denver? That sounds rubbish!"). 'Dante' was picked as a name as homage to the movie director, Joe Dante. The 'Baron' part was added "Because it sounds mean"."

2) "Listening to how Croc sounds, and then to how Baron Dante sounds, it might seem hard to believe, but all of the character voices in both Croc 1 and Croc 2 were done by one guy. According to the Croc team, the actor behind Croc, his friends, and his enemies is able to pitch his voice both very high and very low, resulting in only one voice talent being needed for every character in both games."

3) "The background story in the instruction manual for Croc: Legend of the Gobbos was written by one of the writers responsible for scripts in the popular show The Simpsons. The series' Lead Designer was apparently never particularly happy with this version of the story - it can be guessed that this is because the story in the manual does not really fit with the style of the game itself. The manual-story was purely humourous, whereas the style of the game is quite whimsical. This did not happen with the story in the manual for Croc 2 - that story stayed true to the game's style, and was obviously written by somebody else."

4) "Due to technical limitations, the individual 'rooms' in Croc: Legend of the Gobbos really aren't too big in size, even though they appear to be. To acheive this effect, the team behind the game came up with a clever idea - since they couldn't make the levels any bigger than they already had, they made Croc himself smaller, thus making the areas seem more cavernous. This is easily observed if you compare the PlayStation and PC versions of the game to the Saturn one - Croc wasn't shrunk down in the Saturn port, so everything seems a lot more enclosed. "

5) "The PC version of Croc: Legend of the Gobbos contains a mention under the Special Thanks section of the credits that the other versions do not have - it says, "Croc widows and orphans", and was the idea of the game's lead tester, because everyone on the game's team had spent so much time working on it, rather than being with their families."

Fionordequester fucked around with this message at Sep 7, 2014 around 04:42

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Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.


Dinosaur Gum

Man, it says something when it's world 2 and the end boss is just phoning it in.

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