|
Just watched the first episode of S5. If Diane and Mr PB were getting divorced, why would he volunteer to take Diane home from the airport? Also, Philbert was right, this is going to be an amazing season.
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 04:52
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 20, 2024 01:32 |
|
|
Speaking of E11 Choking women is bad
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 05:03
|
|
|
Episode 7 Get hosed Diane. That's beyond wrong.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 05:19
|
|
RC Cola posted:Episode 7 Get hosed Diane. That's beyond wrong. Came here to post this. Diane is just not coming off well this season, IMO. Just paused at Episode 10. I think this season is better than the last.
|
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 05:25
|
|
|
RC Cola posted:Episode 7 Get hosed Diane. That's beyond wrong. Pick posted:Oh my GOD, Diane.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 05:28
|
|
|
this is the only show daring enough to make a dilburrito joke. god bless.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 06:06
|
|
Vietnamwees posted:Just watched the first episode of S5. If Diane and Mr PB were getting divorced, why would he volunteer to take Diane home from the airport? You know why.
|
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 06:18
|
|
|
Spoilers in this post refer to the season as a whole.Toalpaz posted:Some thoughts on the show, message and meaning etc. I by and large agree with your take. What Princess Carolyn does to Bojack (inadvertently) is not a million miles away from what Bojack did to Sarah Lynn. The show unsubtly rips on Hollywood’s forgiveness culture and the turnaround from scandal to being a star again, but notably the season ends with the ultimate Hollywood trope of an actor going into rehab following bad PR regarding his or her actions. That’s no accident. Bojack’s struggle with substance abuse has reached a point where his actions are not entirely his own. Bojack is not a good person, of course. He is a product of emotional abuse and will pass the it on to everyone around him, whether he is sober or inebriated, sometimes intentionally but sometimes not. He starts out actually being a better person, continuing to do a solid for Princess Carolyn by being in Philbert and his support in his relationship with Gina. By the end of the season, he physically assaults Gina, but it seems so far out of his character that it really seems explainable only in context of his addiction. I end the season feeling that Bojack is further defined as a tragic figure requiring empathy rather than disdain. I’m going to have to rewatch the whole season, I just don’t know when I’m going to be ready to.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 06:27
|
|
|
Episode 6: Never seen a realer thing about having abusive parents and not knowing what to do with the pain.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 06:28
|
|
|
I feel bad that Gina never gelled with me like Anna or Wanda. I still think Wanda is my favorite one-season character.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 06:29
|
|
|
I was going binge watch this season this last night because I had Friday off, but I had to stop after Episode 6 and take a break. Someone close to me died recently and funeral stuff makes me feel all messed up inside. The episode was amazing though, definitely will and should be the one the submit for their Emmy nomination. Anyway, I just finished watching the second half of the season, here are my thoughts broken down by characters: Diane: Diane is the worst non-Bojack person on this show. What she did in episode seven so hosed up, and the show doesn't seem to quite grasp just how vile what she did was. Last season I wasn't sure where the writers were going to go with her character and after this season, well, I'm still not sure what they're trying to do with her. She's the same person she was in season 1, but worse, and that's really disappointing. Especially after episode 2 made it seem like they were FINALLY going to let her undergo some actual positive growth, but nope after that it was straight back to the same routine from seasons 2-4 (Diane feels miserable -> Diane is helpful, but also does awful things to people and fails to improve as a person -> Diane cries and talks about how sad she is or how much she hates her life and herself -> Diane continues feeling miserable). I have no idea why this show feels so compelled to make their mouthpiece character such an awful person that's never allowed to be happy or succeed in any meaningful way aside from her book being a huge success back in season 1. It's not fun, or even interesting, it's just sort of vaguely unpleasant and it keeps happening over and over again. Princess Caroline: I am deeply concerned for Princess Caroline and her baby. When she said "I think when I have a baby my life will really calm down" I physically recoiled and said "Oh God" out loud and when she joked about naming her kid "Untitled Princess Caroline Project" I heard air raid sirens going off in my head. Using a child to try and fill a hole inside of yourself is one of the worst things a parent can do, and that really seems to be what PC is doing. Like, if she wasn't able to maintain a healthy relationship with her ultra supportive and kind mouse boyfriend or anyone else in her life I don't know why she thinks she'll be able to maintain a healthy Parent/child relationship (one of the mostly notoriously difficult kinds of relationships). I dunno, maybe I'm being to hard on her, but kids don't fix you and Princess Caroline has a lot about herself that needs to be fixed and she seems to think this baby will help her, but babies do not work that way. They can't help you, you need to help them, and you can't genuinely help others until you've learned to take care of yourself and I'm not sure PC has ever actually learned that. It's all just very....concerning Mr. Peanutbutter: I have a friend who's never liked Mr. Peanutbutter, and she says that this season really made her hate him. I totally understand that viewpoint, but personally: I love Mr. Peanutbutter and I loved his story-line this season. I think a lot of it comes down to personal experience, because most of the dumbshit Mr. Peanutbutter did is dumbshit that I've done. I've never cheated on anybody, but I was once a compulsive people pleaser with an aversion to conflict who got involved in a lot of incompatible relationships that I shouldn't have and ruined some other perfectly good relationships because of my own immaturity. Luckily this is stuff I was able to grow out of by my late teens to early twenties, but I could still easily understand where Mr. Peanutbutter was coming from which made the humor from his terrible choices cathartic. Another thing I liked about M.P.B.'s story-line is it was stuff that we haven't seen before. Now that he and Diane aren't married the writers have a chance to explore his character in new ways and scenarios, something they really took advantage of. Also, Paul F. Tompkins continues to be an amazing voice actor and I just love listening to him. Todd: I really liked Todd this season, which felt kind of weird because I haven't really liked him that much since season 2. The humor involving him just all landed for me this time. Also, I know what it feels like to be in love with someone that has a sexual orientation that's incompatible with yours, so the scene where he and Emily talk about how they want to be together romantically but know it won't work really got to me and made me feel some bittersweet emotions. Bojack: You know how in later seasons of the Simpsons Lisa is often treated less like a character and more like a mouthpiece for the writers to give whatever opinion they think is "correct" through? This felt like that, but in reverse. The writers are clearly pretty pissed about Hollywood misogyny and people taking the wrong lessons from their show, and those are indeed valid things to be pissed about. I just wish that had found a way to talk about those things that wasn't so ham handed like they have in the past. I hate seeing things I agree with conveyed poorly. Everything involving Bojack this season was just stuff that was covered better in seasons 1-4, and it some of it was, honestly, kind of boring. Except episode 6, episode 6 knocked it out of the park. Overall: This is the worst season. Don't get wrong, I still liked it and I'm still looking forward to season 6, but the best episodes of this season don't come close to the best episodes of the past seasons (even season one).
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 09:29
|
|
|
I think on the whole my list of favorite seasons is just a reverse chronological order of when they came out, each newer season feels better than the last I will say that nothing beats the s4 episodes that really knocked it out of the park, but the "average" season 5 episode I thought was much more enjoyable. I love pickles and I'm sad that she's getting a raw deal. Diane tells peanut butter that he needs to grow up, and he basically does so immediately, but tragically pickles seems like the one girl who would've worked out for him before he grew up.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 10:04
|
|
|
Space Cadet Omoly posted:Bojack: I think this is right on the money. It was really frustrating. I said in the thread that I thought latching onto #MeToo would be a big mistake for the show, and this is sort of why. It felt like it was so insistent on making real-world points of a specific nature that it forgot who it was telling them with. Ultimately I don't think "kicking Bojack around" especially after last season actually accomplished what they wanted. In fact (*air raid sirens for other shows I talk about*) railroading a character because people are "enjoying them wrong" will always, always gently caress up your story. For a show that spent a lot of time ranting about how "fixing" people is pointless, it is sure trying really hard to "fix" its literal real-world audience.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 10:12
|
|
|
What Diane did in episode 7, it was malicious and angry and a strike at BoJack, and I sure as hell wouldn't give her a pass for it. But she was also trying to show him that he has some amazing faults and needs help. Unfortunately, it just further caused him to resonate with the Philbert character and contributed to his spiral of failing to differentiate fantasy from reality. She bails on season 2 because she recognizes all she did was make things worse by helping to validate BoJack. Feels like some people missed that's what was going on; this wasn't just a stab at someone who insulted her, this was also a hosed-up attempt to help him which only made everything worse.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 10:12
|
|
|
Ironslave posted:What Diane did in episode 7, it was malicious and angry and a strike at BoJack, and I sure as hell wouldn't give her a pass for it. But she was also trying to show him that he has some amazing faults and needs help. Unfortunately, it just further caused him to resonate with the Philbert character and contributed to his spiral of failing to differentiate fantasy from reality. She bails on season 2 because she recognizes all she did was make things worse by helping to validate BoJack. Oh gently caress no, that is not her story to leverage into some weird public torture porn. People aren't pissed because it's mean to Bojack. Think of who else is affected by this and why.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 10:15
|
|
|
ninjewtsu posted:I think on the whole my list of favorite seasons is just a reverse chronological order of when they came out, each newer season feels better than the last I really hope things work out for Pickles, she's a good dog who deserves good things. Mr. Peanutbutter does need to break up with her ASAP though, as cliche as it sounds it's what's best for both of them. Pick posted:Oh gently caress no, that is not her story to leverage into some weird public torture porn. People aren't pissed because it's mean to Bojack. Think of who else is affected by this and why. The worst part about this is season 3 explicitly showed why trying to drag Penny back into Bojack's life in any way is awful. Hell, they even had Sarah Lynn spell out exactly why it's awful (because Penny doesn't deserve to have her life disturbed by Bojack's bullshit and if she wants to keep that incident in her past she deserves too and she's not a tool Bojack can use to get closure or "heal" or "grow") just in case anyone in the audience missed it. So then, to have Diane drag Penny back into Bojack's life by publicly telling Penny's story without Penny's permission is extra super duper gross and the show never properly acknowledges that. That extremely private incident that Penny has been shown to be extremely uncomfortable with is now part of a web series that has been watched by millions. Imagine stumbling upon a show that uses a traumatic memory from your childhood as a plot point without your consent. And you know it's not a coincidence, because the guy who caused that traumatic memory is the star of the loving show. Imagine the shame you would feel at knowing so many people have watched it, and the fear you would feel thinking "What if this somehow gets traced back to me?" God, it was such bad thing to do.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 11:06
|
|
|
Can someone help me out with a bit of recollection? I've watched every season of this show but due to the binging nature of it and the fact that previous seasons came out years ago its hard to keep track of everything. Spoilers up until the end of S5 episode 4: At the end of episode 4 the calculating publicist lady who keeps breaking into Diane's car plays a tape for Diane of Bojack confessing to almost having sex with the teenage fawn. Can someone remind me of where the publicist lady got that tape footage? Who was Bojack even talking to when he confessed to that and how did the publicist lady obtain that audio recording? I vaguely remember that Bojack had a fling with the publicist lady in season 3 so I'm not sure if he confessed it to her directly or whateve.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 11:15
|
|
|
bbf2 posted:Can someone help me out with a bit of recollection? He confessed to her directly during his binge with Sarah Lynn
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 11:17
|
|
|
bbf2 posted:Can someone help me out with a bit of recollection? He had told that Manatee reporter about it while drunk, she recorded him, Anna did something to get the tape, and that's the backstory. GEORGE W BUSHI posted:He confessed to her directly during his binge with Sarah Lynn No, it happened way before that at the beginning of season 3.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 11:22
|
|
|
It's kind of amazing __Ana__ started a relationship with Bojack knowing what she did.
|
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 12:48
|
|
|
bbf2 posted:Can someone help me out with a bit of recollection? BoJack said it when he was failing to have sex with a Manatee Fair reporter during his publicity tour and she still had her tape recorder on. Ana made the tape disappear the morning after.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 13:16
|
|
|
Lurdiak posted:It's kind of amazing __Ana__ started a relationship with Bojack knowing what she did.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 13:23
|
|
Ironslave posted:What Diane did in episode 7, it was malicious and angry and a strike at BoJack, and I sure as hell wouldn't give her a pass for it. But she was also trying to show him that he has some amazing faults and needs help. Unfortunately, it just further caused him to resonate with the Philbert character and contributed to his spiral of failing to differentiate fantasy from reality. She bails on season 2 because she recognizes all she did was make things worse by helping to validate BoJack. I disagree. While later, yes, Diane was trying to get him help (or was she? You could argue she just wanted to hold her self-righteousness over him), at the time she wrote that into the script in a mad, angry frenzy and, tbqh, seemed to take satisfaction from Bojack realizing what had happened. It struck me as an incredibly bitter and morally repugnant way for her to make Bojack squirm. I just finished the season. My thoughts on it are very similar to what Pick, pospysyl, Space Cadet Omoly, and some others have already posted. I absolutely agree with the weird feeling that this season featured a fair bit of the writers feeling like they had to excise the demons from their own fanbase. The Philbert stuff was fun when it was satirising 'prestige TV', but less fun when it felt like it was twisting the arm of me while I was watching it. Sometimes, sure, you can argue that a show needs to make things clear to its core audience -- look at Rick and Morty, for example -- but I don't know anyone who glamorized Bojack and co. Like, probably one of the most shared and well-known clips is Todd ripping into Bojack back in Season 1. I think I preferred it to last season overall, although last season had better episodes. Todd, for example, was way better and, as an asexual guy, it felt accurate and true as opposed to last season where it felt like a weird PSA. I feel like the Todd humor was on point, too, whereas last season it was just a bit off. As I've already said, Diane came off in a very bad way this season and it feels unfair that everyone else is getting put under the spotlight but Diane just gets a mild 'don't be so hard on people, forgive them instead' spiel. PB and PC were fine enough, although they felt like they were treading water for much of the season. I liked Pickles and Gina. Bojack came off as pretty vile in a way that he never has before (see the above) and I feel his strangling of Gina is just... a bit far? I also feel the execution of that with the back-and-forth what-is-real? aspect wasn't executed well, which is unusual for this show because I usually feel it always nails those big moments. Basically, it left me going 'wait, what?' as opposed to 'OH MY GOD'. I kind of hope it closes out on the next season. Milkfred E. Moore fucked around with this message at 13:44 on Sep 15, 2018 |
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 13:25
|
|
|
Milkfred E. Moore posted:I disagree. While later, yes, Diane was trying to get him help (or was she? You could argue she just wanted to hold her self-righteousness over him), at the time she wrote that into the script in a mad, angry frenzy and, tbqh, seemed to take satisfaction from Bojack realizing what had happened. It struck me as an incredibly bitter and morally repugnant way for her to make Bojack squirm. Toplowtech fucked around with this message at 13:36 on Sep 15, 2018 |
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 13:33
|
|
|
Toplowtech posted:2)i don't think any of his wifes grew to become better human beings, in particular Miss Diane-let-s-be-the-other-woman-with-my-ex. a friend of mine worked for jessica biel and justin timberlake when they rented out the super-yacht my friend was working on at the time. he said they were both really nice to the staff and tipped generously
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 13:42
|
|
|
Whorelord posted:a friend of mine worked for jessica biel and justin timberlake when they rented out the super-yacht my friend was working on at the time. he said they were both really nice to the staff and tipped generously
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 13:45
|
|
|
Toplowtech posted:Well, i was talking about their in Bojak universe personas which is probably far worse than their real life selfs. I mean remember last season governorship party in Mister PB's collapsed home. i know, i was joking
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 13:56
|
|
Toplowtech posted:I do agree with your statement, i also think Diane is more likely going to end up as a far more damaged human being than Bojack when she reach his age. She specifically tell Mr PB to grow up because he doesn't and his wifes do and it's why he keeps losing them. But 1)i kinda think his eternal youthful innocence is what make his charm, 2)i don't think any of his wifes grew to become better human beings, in particular Miss Diane-let-s-be-the-other-woman-with-my-ex. The only advantage Diane got over Bojack is that she is a lot younger and still isn't as used by a life in Hollywoo as he is. There's a reason the season's final shot is Diane leaving Hollywoo. I think she realizes that town and her friendship with Bojack and many of the other things that have happened since season 1 have made her a more bitter unhappy person, and she probably doesn't want to wait until she hits utter rock bottom like Bojack to try and make a change.
|
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 14:02
|
|
|
Lurdiak posted:There's a reason the season's final shot is Diane leaving Hollywoo. I think she realizes that town and her friendship with Bojack and many of the other things that have happened since season 1 have made her a more bitter unhappy person, and she probably doesn't want to wait until she hits utter rock bottom like Bojack to try and make a change. I'd argue the opposite. It's part of a larger pattern of behavior. Diane's first instinct seems to be to flee. She fled Boston, she accepted that war reporting job to gtfo, she abandoned that and hid at Bojack's house, she went to Vietnam etc. She never actually tries confront her problems and do the work, or anything past the shallowest level of self reflection. She changes her environment instead of herself.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 14:29
|
|
|
Haha, Netflix is actually offering free churros from Jack in the Box through Postmates.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 15:05
|
|
|
Koalas March posted:I'd argue the opposite. It's part of a larger pattern of behavior. Diane's first instinct seems to be to flee. She fled Boston, she accepted that war reporting job to gtfo, she abandoned that and hid at Bojack's house, she went to Vietnam etc. To be fair, moving out and running away are good options for when you can't address issues too big for you and you don't want to be responsible for mopping up your 'friend' every time hes coming down from a bender. Diane isn't responsible for any of her friend's happiness really, and she hates her life in Hollywoo, recently divorced, why not move out? Her main personal issue is that she lashes out at people when they don't meet her expectations of what is good. Her other main issue is that she is manipulated with that knowledge. Mr PB and Bojack are external stressors that she doesn't need, and confronting and 'fixing' them doesn't fix her own issues. Being in Hollywoo doesn't really do anything for her except force her to revel in celebrity culture through writing.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 15:09
|
|
|
hot take: season 5 is very good
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 15:14
|
|
crazy cloud posted:hot take: season 5 is very good Agreedo.
|
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 15:18
|
|
|
Pick posted:I think this is right on the money. It was really frustrating. I said in the thread that I thought latching onto #MeToo would be a big mistake for the show, and this is sort of why. It felt like it was so insistent on making real-world points of a specific nature that it forgot who it was telling them with. I have a feeling that the show was going to address #MeToo in a completely different way. Based on episode 1, I suspect that they were going to have Flip sexually harass Bojack, or rather escalate his harassment from that episode on. At the end of season 4, Bojack's mostly isolated and he's in a place where he's very hard on himself, which would have made for an interesting story. At some point, though, I think the writing team got the inclination to address anti-hero type shows and the way they normalize bad behavior, and even though Bojack Horseman (the show) did a great job at avoiding some of the pitfalls other anti-hero shows fall into, they wanted to correct the hypothetical bad fans of Bojack the character. They couldn't really show Bojack as a victim, because they wanted to portray Bojack as victimizer. crazy cloud posted:hot take: season 5 is very good It's an average Bojack Horseman season, which, yes, means it's very good. It doesn't have the lows of Season 1, but it doesn't really have the highs of season 1 either.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 15:33
|
|
|
My thoughts on Diane potentially leaving Hollywoo: I think it's a good move on her part. She hates her job, keeps having sex with her ex-husband (who's still in love with her despite currently dating someone else), and her best friend is a toxic emotional drain who constantly brings out the worst in her. A change of environment could help put her in a healthier place. However, as the show has demonstrated time and time again changing where you are doesn't change who you are. It's not enough for Diane to just go somewhere else, she's also got to put the effort into changing as a person. Will she do that? I certainly hope so, because like I posted about before I'm so sick of seeing her repeat the same steps over and over and OVER again. Hell, I kind of hope they just straight up write her off the show, because this isn't a sitcom and she's not Olivia and at this point she's been written in such a way that it seems like leaving forever is the only way she has even a chance at finding happiness so why not just let her be free? Edit: pospysyl posted:I have a feeling that the show was going to address #MeToo in a completely different way. Based on episode 1, I suspect that they were going to have Flip sexually harass Bojack, or rather escalate his harassment from that episode on. At the end of season 4, Bojack's mostly isolated and he's in a place where he's very hard on himself, which would have made for an interesting story. That would have been way more interesting than what they actually ended up doing. Space Cadet Omoly fucked around with this message at 16:01 on Sep 15, 2018 |
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 15:54
|
|
|
I'm disappointed that they fell back on drugs making Bojack lose touch with reality and do horrible things as the season climax for a third time. Also having Hollyhock return solely to set up that he has a drug problem was a waste of the character. But overall, another great season, I loved it.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 15:57
|
|
|
What will this season's thread title be? I nominate The Big Toe Is The Penis Of The Foot
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 15:59
|
|
On #metoo: Raphael Bob-Waksberg has stated in several interviews that the entire season was already written before #Metoo started, and they only rewrote a bit of the Vance Waggoner episode to shift the focus on how quick we are to forgive instead of how easily we let things slide. It does feel like there might've been more planned with Flip before they decided to make the season a meta-critique of Bojack Horseman, but I also think Flip's speech at the end of the first episode was almost like Raphael addressing the character of Bojack, or even Will Arnett. This season went to horrible places, but ultimately it wasn't really about Bojack specifically, it was much more about Hollyoo(d).Space Cadet Omoly posted:My thoughts on Diane potentially leaving Hollywoo: Although I'd be fine with her being missing for a decent chunk of season 6, I would hate for Diane to leave the show entirely. After Bojack, she's the most important character in the show, thematically. She balances Bojack out in several ways but also reflects him in many others. Even when their lives aren't directly interacting, they're always thematically struggling with similar issues. She's also one of my favorite characters on the show (which makes this thread feel like Bizarro Land a lot, especially since the twittersphere also loves Diane for the most part). Plus, Bojack all but said why she won't stay gone in episode 6. Speaking of which... I nominate the thread title to be "You never get a happy ending, because there's always more show"
|
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 16:09
|
|
|
pospysyl posted:It's an average Bojack Horseman season, which, yes, means it's very good. It doesn't have the lows of Season 1, but it doesn't really have the highs of season 1 either. I had no doubt that this season would be good. And it was a really great season of TV. But for some reason I didn’t enjoy it as much as previous seasons of Bojack. I can’t quite put my finger on why. Perhaps it was because the last season ended on a hopeful tone, showing Bojack rebuilding his connections after pretty much losing everything. I was hoping the show would go in a slightly different direction to other seasons, not optimistic as such, but having Bojack move away from the mistakes of his past. It was slightly disappointing that they doubled down on his lovely behaviour and that the season ended with him in rehab. Because where do you go from there? Will next season just be him making amends all over again? I think the seasons that have worked best have had a better balance of dark and light storylines. Some of the humour this season fell a bit flat. Like Yolanda’s family and that whole story was just kind of cringey. If we’re voting on favourite seasons I’d opt for 3 as the highlight so far. It managed to have an issues episode about abortion which was both hilarious and non-preachy, it had the bottle episode with Bojack and PC, the big Todd speech, and Sarah-Lynn’s death, which was a bold move. It even ends on a great scene with Stars by Nina Simone and the wild horses. It’s such a well plotted season.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 16:14
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 20, 2024 01:32 |
|
|
SEX BURRITO posted:Some of the humour this season fell a bit flat. Like Yolanda’s family and that whole story was just kind of cringey.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2018 16:25
|
|