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KOGAHAZAN!!
Apr 29, 2013

a miserable failure as a person

an incredible success as a magical murder spider



I have only two things to say:

1) Please, less Doctor calling Clara a christmas cake. Thank you.
2) I think that was basically a straight retread of Dalek. Only better, somehow.

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FiftySeven
Jan 1, 2006


I WON THE BETTING POOL ON TESSAS THIRD STUPID VOTE AND ALL I GOT WAS THIS HALF-ASSED TITLE ok im just adding words to see how much space it can really take up dont forget to delete this


Slippery Tilde

That was a seriously good episode. What an improvement over last week! Clara was much better but she still annoys me slightly. Hopefully next week will be more of the same.

Plavski
Feb 1, 2006

I could be a revolutionary


So Missy is harvesting the souls of all of those who the Doctor has coerced into killing themselves. It's going to be another season about The Soul of the Doctor (tm).

"I don't kill people, I just get other people to do it for me!"

"Think of the people you have let die, Doctor. You're a monster!"

"Oh no, I'm a monster! And yet not."

DoctorWhat
Nov 18, 2011

Someone call the Chancellery Guard. Commander Maxil's out of uniform. AGAIN.

The best part of the episode:

When the Doctor is trying to change Rusty, he TOUCHES TWO STRANDS TOGETHER.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?


DoctorWhat posted:

The best part of the episode:

When the Doctor is trying to change Rusty, he TOUCHES TWO STRANDS TOGETHER.

Yeah, loved that.

Plenty of neat allusions to the classic series, and also straight up references such as how his first trip to Skaro was part of what set him on the course to become the person he is today (at that point the name "the Doctor" was pretty much just a misunderstanding on Ian and Barbara's part).

It's a good thing Journey kissed her uncle goodbye instead of saying,"SEEYA LATER SHITLORD!" since she had to come skulking back about 30 seconds later

Also I dig Mr. Pink, though they had to rush his introduction a bit.

ConanThe3rd
Mar 27, 2009


So, given what was shown, I'm sure that "Missy" is The Rani or at the very least someone with a Tardis with a working camelion circuit.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?


ConanThe3rd posted:

So, given what was shown, I'm sure that "Missy" is The Rani.

I still say she's The Nightmare Child, based on absolutely nothing beyond the fact that I'm utterly convinced this is the case for no reason I can even understand myself.

ConanThe3rd
Mar 27, 2009


Jerusalem posted:

I still say she's The Nightmare Child, based on absolutely nothing beyond the fact that I'm utterly convinced this is the case for no reason I can even understand myself.

Honestly it's the whole "scooping someone up when they were supposed to die" gag.

Solaris Knight
Apr 26, 2010

ASK ME ABOUT POWER RANGERS MYSTIC FORCE


Autonomous Monster posted:

She doesn't scream "season arc" to you?

She does, of course she does, but I didn't expect her to be in the next episode after her first appearance.

Diabolik900
Mar 28, 2007



Fun Shoe

ConanThe3rd posted:

So, given what was shown, I'm sure that "Missy" is The Rani or at the very least someone with a Tardis with a working camelion circuit.

I don't know that she's necessarily The Rani, but it seems plausible that she's a Time Lord. There's a definite similarity between the way she's grabbed people who seem to be dead and the way The Doctor did it at the beginning of this episode.

Star Platinum
May 5, 2010


Is it too early to call Capaldi my favorite Doctor? The mind meld scene was absolutely brilliant and he nailed it. I'm usually a bit wary when it comes to exploring the "dark side" of any given character because it's so easy to go over the top, but it was remarkably well done in this episode.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?


ewe2 posted:

It's like they let an adult write the script for a change.

Phil Ford is 2 for 2 when it comes to co-writing. He wrote Waters of Mars with RTD and now this with Moffat. By himself he wrote.... the Doctor Who Adventure Games

DoctorWhat
Nov 18, 2011

Someone call the Chancellery Guard. Commander Maxil's out of uniform. AGAIN.

ConanThe3rd posted:

Honestly it's the whole "scooping someone up when they were supposed to die" gag.

Which is interesting, because that's how the Doctor saved... Gun Girl (forgot the name already).

Missy/TARDIS theories gaining strength. Actually, the TARDIS was also really prominently in one of the shots immediately following Missy's appearance.

Muppetjedi
Mar 17, 2010


I do like the idea that he went for coffee at the end of the previous episode... then got distracted and has been carrying these 2 cups of coffee throughout a load of future big finish stories.

Rohan Kishibe
Oct 29, 2011

Frankly, I don't like you
and I never have.


I'm just impressed that the Doctor actually managed to drop Clara off back where he said he would.

Gyro Zeppeli
Jul 18, 2012

sure hope no-one throws me off a bridge


Muppetjedi posted:

I do like the idea that he went for coffee at the end of the previous episode... then got distracted and has been carrying these 2 cups of coffee throughout a load of future big finish stories.

Just the Doctor emerging from the TARDIS carrying coffee, turning around and just getting back into the TARDIS, a la Grandpa Simpson.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?


Muppetjedi posted:

I do like the idea that he went for coffee at the end of the previous episode... then got distracted and has been carrying these 2 cups of coffee throughout a load of future big finish stories.

Given the direct continuity between Time of the Doctor and Deep Breath, I wonder if her confused family got a call from her several hours after she and her naked boyfriend ran out the door on Christmas Day, saying,"Help I'm in Glasgow!"?

Thunderfinger
Jan 15, 2011



So that was brilliant.

It's actually like what someone else said here, where this is a retread of Series 1 episode "Dalek", except better. I wasn't so sure about the new costume before, but now seeing it in action I have to say I think it's really cool, especially because I think that's more or less how I would have dressed myself if I was doing this, and it's nice to see the Doctor being completely stone cold for a moment there. Also for once I'm interested in seeing how Clara's subplot develops.

In summary: it might be a bit early yet, but I think the new series is getting it's legs after a shaky start.

Burkion
May 10, 2012

Changeman! And Not A Moment Too Soon!


My complaint with this episode?

It centers entirely around the Doctor.

First and foremost-the gently caress good is a single good Dalek going to do? What can a single good Dalek DO to change the universe?

It's not like you're going to be able to rig up this mind meld bullshit on the entire species after all, so what really are you going to gain?

Also, Doctor, seriously. Stop being A) Surprised at the idea of a GOOD DALEK and B) SURPRISED AT WHAT A GOOD DALEK DECIDES TO DO.

Jesus Christ, let's take a short list of all of the Daleks with morality! This isn't even me trying to reach for examples either-

The Human Daleks from the classic series

The Dalek from Dalek

Dalek Sec

Dalek Caan

DALEK OSWIN

You know what all of those guys did?

TRY TO WIPE OUT THE DALEK SPECIES OR CHANGE IT ON A FUNDAMENTAL LEVEL. (And then kill themselves)

Stop acting like the idea of a good Dalek is so novel and new! Stop it!

Also please do something about the Daleks who are quite clearly kicking the asses of everyone and killing untold numbers of people if you could. I mean, it's your fault the new empire exists, mind trying to DO something about it? Beyond farting around inside of a Dalek case and then getting surprised when the Dalek realizes that, holy poo poo, my people are insane I need to kill them all.

DoctorWhat
Nov 18, 2011

Someone call the Chancellery Guard. Commander Maxil's out of uniform. AGAIN.

Not as good as Jubilee but I think it might be better than Dalek.

Of course, Into the Dalek is at least as different (thematically, narratively, and philosophically) from Dalek as Dalek is from Jubilee, so it's a pretty pointless comparison really.

But people are persisting in comparing them anyway, so I might as well compare them PROPERLY before someone does it all wrong and probably hurts themselves.

thepokey
Jul 20, 2004

Let me start off with a basket of chips. Then move on to the pollo asado taco.

I'm loving Capaldi so far. Matt Smith used to click his fingers to open the TARDIS door. Capaldi just kicks the door open.

Although there are times when he just puts on Malcolm Tucker's bollocking face, like when the solider lady told him he was done talking and he just gave her this look without saying a word, loving brilliant.

Solaris Knight
Apr 26, 2010

ASK ME ABOUT POWER RANGERS MYSTIC FORCE


DoctorWhat posted:

Not as good as Jubilee but I think it might be better than Dalek.

Of course, Into the Dalek is at least as different (thematically, narratively, and philosophically) from Dalek as Dalek is from Jubilee, so it's a pretty pointless comparison really.

But people are persisting in comparing them anyway, so I might as well compare them PROPERLY before someone does it all wrong and probably hurts themselves.

Jubilee's also considered an extremely high bar to surpass, so Into The Dalek coming even close enough to compare is a huge achievement.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?


Burkion posted:

First and foremost-the gently caress good is a single good Dalek going to do? What can a single good Dalek DO to change the universe?

What can any single person do to change the universe? The Doctor isn't concerned with the functional application of a good Dalek, he's concerned with proving to himself that the Daleks don't have to be an absolute. This is far more about himself than the Daleks, he NEEDS to know that there is some hope they can be changed for the better, that being evil isn't an absolute or that there can ever be no hope. Every single time he lets himself fall into cynicism over the Daleks is a victory to THEIR way of thinking, and every time he claws back and holds out hope (ala the 4th Doctor in Genesis) it is a victory for HIS way of thinking - the notion that there is hope, that nobody is beyond salvation.

Yes, in the end the Dalek took the wrong message from their merging of the minds and simply changed it chosen target of hatred, but the Doctor once again rejected the idea that it isn't possible for the Daleks to eventually be saved/changed. He accepts now that there is a possibility, no matter how remote.

Yes "good" Daleks have popped up throughout the years and usually (the human Daleks in Evil are the biggest exception I think) been murdered by their own kind or otherwise died. But the fact that they do keep turning up in spite of all this is what gives the Doctor hope against the crushing wave that is the Daleks' supposed intractability. Like "Rusty" said - life prevails.

Plavski
Feb 1, 2006

I could be a revolutionary


Star Platinum posted:

Is it too early to call Capaldi my favorite Doctor?

So far he has leaped up the charts in my book and is fast creeping up on McGann and Davison. He's just so magnetic.

DoctorWhat
Nov 18, 2011

Someone call the Chancellery Guard. Commander Maxil's out of uniform. AGAIN.

Solaris Knight posted:

Jubilee's also considered an extremely high bar to surpass, so Into The Dalek coming even close enough to compare is a huge achievement.

Let me clarify:

Into the Dalek really doesn't come close to Jubilee in terms of overall superbitude. But really, almost nothing does. It's not even a huge qualitative improvement over Dalek, really.

Dalek has about 15 factors going into it that make it more-or-less irreplacable. It's the only story since The Daleks that could make any claim to being critical to understanding the Daleks. It's certianly the only possible story that could have reintroduced them to the revival.

But I think I'll enjoy rewatching Into the Dalek more.

Linear Zoetrope
Nov 28, 2011

A hero must cook

I do like that The Doctor basically trusted Clara to do what he would do in the Dalek's memory hub. I can't remember many times when the Doctor outright trusted a companion to make something clever up to save the day.

Plavski
Feb 1, 2006

I could be a revolutionary


This was way better than Dalek just because it was filled with real actors and a companion who wasn't just a big faced blank slate. I watched Dalek again recently and found the only good things to be the Doctor and the Dalek's interactions. All the other cast were decidedly weak.

Harlock
Jan 15, 2006

Tap "A" to drink!!!



The episode totally felt like an RTD era episode and for that I liked it.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?


Harlock posted:

The episode totally felt like an RTD era episode and for that I liked it.

There was a lot of Rusty in it!

HauntedRobot
Jun 22, 2002

an excellent mod
a simple map to my heart
now give me tilt shift

Great episode but one nitpick, what happened to the liquidised human goop they were covered in between that scene and the next one? They were suddenly bone dry and cleaned up, unless I missed the explanation when my cat got spooked and jumped off the back of the sofa directly onto my nuts.

Linear Zoetrope
Nov 28, 2011

A hero must cook

HauntedRobot posted:

Great episode but one nitpick, what happened to the liquidised human goop they were covered in between that scene and the next one? They were suddenly bone dry and cleaned up, unless I missed the explanation when my cat got spooked and jumped off the back of the sofa directly onto my nuts.

The tube they crawled out of was really hot, I think the implication was that the long crawl through that tube dried them off. (Never mind that their clothes and hair wouldn't dry that neatly, but ~TV~)

DoctorWhat
Nov 18, 2011

Someone call the Chancellery Guard. Commander Maxil's out of uniform. AGAIN.

Jsor posted:

The tube they crawled out of was really hot, I think the implication was that the long crawl through that tube dried them off. (Never mind that their clothes and hair wouldn't dry that neatly, but ~TV~)

Yeah, it was a cheat, but it was a cheat that worked. There was a point to it, you know - you want the scene with the goop but don't want the characters goopy for the rest. Good a resolution as any.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

Ask me about my calm and reasonable opinions on cycling!

I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


That was actually pretty good, good show chaps and ladies

Attestant
Oct 23, 2012

Don't judge me.



Prison Warden posted:

I'm just impressed that the Doctor actually managed to drop Clara off back where he said he would.

Considering the clothes change confusion caused this time, I'd say he does it in the most inconvenient way possible on purpose.

Wheat Loaf
Feb 13, 2012

by FactsAreUseless


I enjoyed it, it was fun. Would watch it again.

LividLiquid
Apr 13, 2002

BITCOIN BATMAN

I love Peter Capaldi.

Plavski
Feb 1, 2006

I could be a revolutionary


HauntedRobot posted:

Great episode but one nitpick, what happened to the liquidised human goop they were covered in between that scene and the next one? They were suddenly bone dry and cleaned up, unless I missed the explanation when my cat got spooked and jumped off the back of the sofa directly onto my nuts.

How did they get deminaturised from inside the Dalek?

Who gives a gently caress, it would've been boring to explain anyway.

Kin
Nov 4, 2003

Sometimes, in a city this dirty, you need a real hero.


Star Platinum posted:

Is it too early to call Capaldi my favorite Doctor?

I'm giving the show a shot because of Capaldi and i think it's much better. Unlike the previous ones, he comes across as a wise and aged person that fits the classic "image" of Doctor Who (not to mention a guy that's been kicking around the universe for hundreds of years) instead of Smith and Tennant who seemed a lot more childish, campy and wiffy waffy, waving their magic wand around to fix everything.

In fact, if Capaldi-Doctor chucks the screwdriver next, then the show will get even better.

Oh and keep things in space and on other planets or dealing with more sci-fi things. The dalek episode was pretty enjoyable because it didn't have the Doctor dealing with a version of the past/present/future UK for the umpteenth time. He's a dude who can travel the infinite reaches of time and space, it's really shite to have him dealing with Robin Hood for example

Kin fucked around with this message at Aug 30, 2014 around 21:17

DoctorWhat
Nov 18, 2011

Someone call the Chancellery Guard. Commander Maxil's out of uniform. AGAIN.

Plavski posted:

How did they get deminaturised from inside the Dalek?

Who gives a gently caress, it would've been boring to explain anyway.

I liked that too, actually! It's the best use of Moffat's habit of "cutting out the 'obvious' bits" there's been thus far, in that it only cuts out the boring and obvious bits that would have ruined the pacing even if they didn't have a fixed timeslot.

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MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

Ask me about my calm and reasonable opinions on cycling!

I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


Kin posted:

Oh and keep things in space and on other planets or dealing with more sci-fi things. The dalek episode was pretty enjoyable because it didn't have the Doctor dealing with a version of the past/present/future UK for the umpteenth time. He's a dude who can travel the infinite reaches of time and space, it's really shite to have him dealing with Robin Hood for example

Yeah, take that Verity Lambert what's with all this Aztec poo poo

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