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Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Nate RFB posted:

Found this while digging for that pic too; contains spoilers for pretty much everything, and may be kind of out of date at this point (no Mahoyo), but if you ever felt your life was incomplete without a character chart for the Nasuverse then I have you covered:
Man, that thing really is out of date. It doesn't even have Fate/Zero on it. Someone should probably update it. And put all the Shikis right next to each other.

Wili posted:

Speaking of which, the second season had a pretty cool fight lasting its three last episodes (08, 09 and 10). So you may want to check them out if you liked first season's fights and/or want to watch Bazzet kick everyone's butts.
No, goddamnit, you are not gonna convince me to watch more of that poo poo.

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Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Pierson posted:

I do like how the Grail was never actually used even before it was corrupted. The first and second they gently caress it up and then the third time they really, really gently caress it up.
I also like how this makes complete sense. The original plan is convoluted and requires the unwilling help of other powerful agents. I can understand that getting the necessary vast quantities of energy in the right place doing the right thing is probably super hard, but that doesn't change the fact that the resulting mechanism is unstable as hell. They were setting themselves up for multiple failures before success.

And then the Einzberns had to be sore losers and dump a tanker full of evil into the prize pool without telling anyone.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Sylphid posted:

Always seemed kinda counterproductive of the Einzberns to send in the sacrificial lamb to be the Master of Berserker, even if she was really the only one capable of controlling him. Even if she made it to the very end, with only one Servant left, there's so way she'd order Berserker to kill himself, and like with Irisviel, the more the Grail gets filled, the worse she's off. I do like how it's a consistent theme with the Einzberns that they'll do ANYTHING to get to the Grail, including all of their antics during the Third War, splitting the duty of fall girl and Master during the Fourth War, then going to the trouble of summoning Hercules and leaving nothing to chance by sending in their own Master in the Fifth War.
I've always felt like it's not that they wanted the Root more than the other two families, but that they were more desperate. From my memory, their family line just naturally sucked at combat, so they had to find increasingly creative ways to even have a chance of winning. It does end up being the same, though. Despite all the crazy poo poo everyone else pulls, they take the craziest risks that we're told about in the setting.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Rand Brittain posted:

I feel like Waver's thing is more like "we should stop organizing magical society around these weird incestuous families and start working on social structures that help people increase their magic power in other ways."
That sounds suspiciously like it won't get to the Root of Origin by using an incredibly dangerous plan that will probably kill everyone around you. Rejected.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Rodyle posted:

Waver's whole storyline is that he actually had an inflated opinion of himself and got in over his head. Remember how an ordinary old man broke his hypnotism?
Waver's whole story is that he's the one remotely normal or sane person who managed to get himself involved with this crazy war and all of its batshit masters.

Seriously, for the most part everyone in either Holy Grail is extremely mentally hosed up, either from the stress of having their parents die at an early age and having to take over their ridiculous legacy, being tortured all their lives, having an extreme case of survivor's guilt, being turned into some kind of magic super weapon chalice and raised to kill their own father who betrayed The Family, being raised to become a sociopath, being brought up as if they're completely useless to the family and completely overshadowed by their adopted sister, killing their father after he raised the dead and destroyed his entire village before becoming a hitman, being a serial killer, undergoing horrific training to try to save the daughter of the woman you love (who shacked up with another man), being the guy who sold his daughter to being tortured, oh and then there's the guy who's literally just loving evil.

In the middle of all this, we have Waver Velvet, a kid who got embarrassed in front of an entire classroom and wanted to prove how he awesome he was to spite his teacher. He's the definition of the "normal person who got in way, way, way over his head," and that's easily why he's everyone's favorite character.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Silver2195 posted:

Where do you get the idea that Fate Shirou becomes Archer?
Some source material, Nasu gave the percentage chances of Shirou becoming Archer after each route, and Fate had the highest percent chance at like 20%. Heaven's Feel was at like 0% because Heaven's Feel.

Although I guess it isn't Shirou explicitly becoming Archer since the Archer in the narrative is supposed to come out of an Ilya route (right?) so the Shirou would just become an Archer like person. Unless the Servant Archer is basically just a combination of multiple timelines of Archer-like Shirous--

Yeah, I'm done here. Point is, Word of God says Fate Shirou most likely to be Archer.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

BlitzBlast posted:

Don't call me a hero, I just ruined this kitten's life.
That is honestly my favorite part of F/HA.

Well that and "because I AM A HERO OF JUSTICE!"

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

I feel like HA does a great job of underlining how Sakura is the most divisive character, the entire community can only take opposing extreme opinions out of any scene she's in.

Really though I'm one of those guys who actually likes Sakura in the VN, and I absolutely love how she's handled in HA. Mostly because HA has many moments where it drops the pretense that Sakura is in any way sane and perfectly acknowledges how terrifying and possessive she is.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

I always assumed he took the same approach with the Christian Church as he did with servants. Do a fair amount of research on the subject, and just keep it in mind as ideas.

Mind I don't remember much about what was said about the Church when talking with Caren. I mean she's an okay character when she's being wistful and casually bossing around some hyper badasses, but her background is aggressively terrible.

Twiddy fucked around with this message at 07:24 on Dec 6, 2014

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Kyte posted:

E: I remember somebody explaining it that the core difference is that in japan the focus is in punishing those who have committed evil, whereas a superhero typically works to prevent evil from being committed in first place. The former takes losses and collateral damage as a given, while the latter takes it as a failure.
Yeah that's fantastic that that's how the meanings work in Japanese. In English though, we help get that idea across by saying superhero.

I mean you tell me superhero, and sure I think of the guy who beats the supervillain, but I also think of Superman flying around and fixing dams and poo poo.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Rodyle posted:

Then they'll complain that there was no purpose to Kirei and all that buildup was for nothing.
I'm pretty sure that if Heaven's Feel is multiple movies people will complain about the lack of build up all the way until the very end.

I think one of the things that I actually like about Nasu's writing is that its ridiculous repetition actually seems to simulate how a brain tends to function (or in my experience it isn't jumping around and making leaps at every opportunity), so a lot of times the way a character reacts is eerily similar to my reaction. "Wait, why is he still alive? You know what, whatever I guess he's alive."

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Honestly the more I'm reading the other thread, the more that I'm concerned of Ufotables ability to sell the major fight scene in UBW (or I guess more specifically, if it will sell). The fight has a long way to go in a very short amount of time, beginning with finalizing Archer's identity, firmly establishing his ideals and gripes with Shirou, having a conflict, and then setting up a resolution that sounds like a simple platitude but has meaning and resonance with Archer, that you're supposed to get over that one fight. If people aren't quite seeing Shirou's side, thoughts, and motivations by now, I can see people finding Archer's attacks inaccurate and the entire thing coming across as a blur.

I'm really looking forward to episode whatever guys. Hoping it doesn't disappoint like the first run of Fate/Zero's episode 11.


EDIT: Yeah I'm hoping they get to the bullshit fisticuffs next episode rather than merely setting it up.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

HellCopter posted:

If half as much effort is put into it as was put into the Berserker fight, it'll be the next best thing to UBW itself.

Here's a thought I had: How many masters/servants have there been with actual wishes for the Holy Grail? Everyone (Archer, Rin, Shirou, Rider, Sakura, Caster) thinks they're cool by saying "I'm in it to win it" or "I just want it for the sake of having the grail" or "Whatevs lol" but as far as I know, the only people who came into this thing with a plan were Kiritsugu and Tokiomi.
... You know, that actually is really funny. Considering how the wish part is meant as bait to get 4 suckers to join the war, it's amazing that so few of the non-main families have a wish. I mean taking Kiritsugu as the rep for the Einzberns, the only person who probably had a wish in mind was caster's former master.

Twiddy fucked around with this message at 02:34 on Dec 9, 2014

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

AlternateNu posted:

Iskandar, Saber, Kiritsugu, Tokiomi, Kayneth, and Gilles de Rais were the only ones who came into the war with a specific wish. I think it is one of the best indicators of how the kids in the fifth war were just pawns when you realize how apathetic they are to the original purpose of the war.
Well, they were meant to be used as pawns, but ultimately their apathy is what allows them to eventually stop the ritual in the first place. "No wait, you guys summoned the devil? What? No, that's not 'acceptable losses,' what the poo poo?"

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Personally I'm counting down to the days when it clicks for someone and they realize who Archer is, and I get a very polite response in the thread apologizing for not seeing how Archer is an appropriate authority figure to criticize Shirou's ideals. Then I can respond with "no problem" and we can drink tea like the intellectual gentlemen we are.

Seriously, I've known the reveal so long that I can't remember at what point it should be stupidly obvious that they aren't just drawing parallels.

Compendium posted:

It could always be complaining about how the action isn't meaningful and there isn't the strategy like there is in F/Z. (Seriously what the gently caress was up with that one :argh: )
I hope someone goes oh snap at a person actually fighting a servant.

The only thing I'm annoyed about is that they didn't have Saber do much of anything. Which makes sense what with the surprise blow directly where the spine comes from the neck. At least they had the little flail at the end that Kuzuki perfectly countered.

Twiddy fucked around with this message at 19:35 on Dec 13, 2014

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

BlitzBlast posted:

He was trained in the Snake his entire life so he could be used to kill a guy. He got his position as a teacher just to have the perfect cover. But when he went over to the target to scope things out he ended up just killing the guy then and there and was at a total loss at what to do next. He was supposed to kill himself too, but didn't really feel like it and decided to just ditch.
To be a bit more specific, he found it to be a massive letdown and a waste. He was totally fine with offing himself as a one off trained assassin for this super difficult job, being the ultimate tool to get the impossible done, but the guy just died. Kuzuki's like, "literally anybody could have killed that guy, what was the point?"

And then yeah he goes and becomes a teacher.

The moral of the story is that F/HA is really cool and if you ever desire a short story related to a F/SN character again it's probably in there.

Raenir Salazar posted:

Sure, but how come they cut Kuzuki who I presume still managed to "block" or deflect them the same way he did Excalibur.
Yeah don't know. I mean trivially, Shirou landed blows against Kuzuki's hands that Saber couldn't, but I don't remember there being an explanation. Maybe he wasn't as cautious or the stone skin spell started wearing off. I mean it's quite literally impossible that Shirou has more technique than Saber or that Kanshou and Bakuya are stronger than Excalibur, considering how stupidly powerful Saber is.

I think the only reasonable explanation might be that hand to hand styles aren't effective against dual wielding. Against a single weapon you can use one hand to deflect the attack and the other to either assist deflecting or attack, and you can also set up your entire body for the deflection. Against two swords you can't effectively maneuver out of the way or set up a parry that completely misses the edge of the sword (or the brunt of the attack), so you have to take a few blows.


Okay yeah this makes sense to me. When you're going hand to hand against a weapon usually your options are to avoid the weapon entirely, catch a completely harmless part of the weapon with great precision, or aim for the opponent themselves (generally when talking about dealing with a weapon you go for the wrists). The short is that you can't effectively block without taking some damage, you want a weapon of your own to block. Against dual wielding, there's too many attacks/weapons/points of attack that you can't get around all of it without blocking.

Twiddy fucked around with this message at 01:18 on Dec 14, 2014

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Compendium posted:

What I'm saying is that the guy goes down like a true hero. :irelandflagsingletear:
I mean of course he does. Cu Chulainn's legend is that he tied himself to a rock while he was dying so that he could die on his feet, and his enemies didn't even believe it until a raven landed on him. A big part of his legend is going down like a goddamn badass, it would be terrible if that wasn't reflected at all in Fate.

Seriously though Lancer and Fake Assassin are great characters that just get the shortest end of the stick no matter what route they're in.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Shyrka posted:

The hanafuda minigame in Hollow Ataraxia is oddly compelling, too. Pity it never got any reference in Carnival Phantasm.
This is true, but it also has some hilariously bad game design decisions. Like about half the things they added to the game are textbook lessons on what to do in a game (Caster's 1/3rd of the time I lose I actually win what the christ).

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Endorph posted:

To be fair, that might be part of the gag. It was pretty clearly being played for laughs, rather than a legit attempt at making an awesome Hanafuda simulator.
I mean I can understand it being part of the gag, but they're still bad decisions. I think what I mean by that comes across better with more examples...

Bazett's Fragarach ability is terrible game design. Why? Because it's exactly the same as "opponent's can't use noble phantasms" except it promises a fun bonus that can't get delivered on (except for the AI playing like an idiot, and it kind of ruins the experience when the AI has to be purposely thick to make a mechanic work). It's awesome in a way because it perfectly translates what Fragarach does into the game, but it just doesn't work out as made.

I guess at least half of the bad decisions are also because the AI can't handle some of the abilities. Playing as Ilya's maids is basically easy mode because the AI frequently puts itself into unwinnable scenarios because it doesn't even try to play around the ability.


Ultimately the game's still fun and I still completed every route, but as I said you can point out many of the mechanics as textbook examples of what not to do.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

jellycat posted:

I wonder what happens to Saber after Heaven's Feel. Does she just move on to the next search for a Holy Grail?
Isn't she kind of dead in both endings?

Otherwise, I imagine she just chills at Hotel Emiya like everyone else, neglecting to get a job like the deadbeat she is.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Silver2195 posted:

It's confusing because Rule Breaker (fittingly?) breaks all the normal rules about how Command Spells work. For example, normally you keep your Command Spells after your Servant dies, and if you make a contract with a new Servant you have to use already-existing Command Spells. However, when Medea uses Rule Breaker on Saber, she gets three new Command Spells out of nowhere. I believe it's also stated somewhere that Kuzuki has things that are sort of like Command Spells but are different somehow.
Yeah, she can somehow mock up fake command spells and she uses them rather liberally. Might be related to her item crafting ability? Who knows.

Angry Grimace posted:

I remember a bunch of people hoping that the ufotable adaptation would be Heaven's Feel, but so far, I don't think I've seen many people figure out the big twist in UBW without spoilers. But you'd have to be denser than the bone of Shirou's sword to not figure out the Heaven's Feel twist (the Shadow is Sakura!). Tellingly, Shirou could not figure this out for 2/3 of the loving route.
From my memory of the route, Shirou points out that he very purposely ignored a lot of things about Sakura's situation, both before and after the Holy Grail War begins. It's less how dumb he is and more that he acts purposely thick about Sakura's life.

Nate RFB posted:

I think Illya's entire body is covered in Command Spells so she might have more than 3? You can "store" unused Command Spells, as we saw with Kirei in Zero, though I have no idea how the Einzberns might be able to do so.
From my memory of Fate/Zero, the moderators just have a stack of extra command spells on them. It's why Kirei's father could promise extra ones to whoever killed Caster. From that alone, there doesn't seem to be a strong limit.

Twiddy fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Dec 29, 2014

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

BlitzBlast posted:

"Shouldn't you just kill him?"

"Nah, this is totally going to work out."

"Well okay, you're the boss."
Hey man, not pissing off the crazy rear end in a top hat worm lich is totally the smart move here. Look at what he does to his adopted grand daughter, and then tell me you want to contradict him.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Soylentbits posted:

UBW is a cooking anime.
The proper Fate adaptation we've been waiting for.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Pretty sure she's referring to the "WebM for retards" part.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

It really doesn't matter if KnK exists in a separate timeline because if Shiki ever needs to interact with anyone from the main timeline, she can just kill the barrier between those timelines. Or kill the differences between the two timelines.

My favorite fan comics are the ones where Ryougi Shiki interacts with the other Type-Moon cast members.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

TheLovablePlutonis posted:

Where is the loving Apocrypha translation/ anime version so i can see more of achilles, astolfo and shakespeare
Don't worry, it's probably coming sometime after this new season of Prism Ilya (apparently we're getting another one of those).

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Man, I wish I could read Japanese at all (no what do you mean I should just go and learn it?). Oh well google translate will have to do for now, I guess.

Seems like Saber's still asleep, the lazy poo poo.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

I think my favorite comparison that people try to make between Fate/Zero and Fate/Stay Night is that Fate/Zero is about adults and Fate/Stay Night is about children, because it completely ignores that basically all the adults in Fate/Zero act like children.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Redmark posted:

To be fair those are mostly the Zero-only folks who had to die. Kiritsugu/Kotomine/Gilgamesh are the really important ones (though I guess you could say they act like children, if you know some really hosed-up children), and they get a lot more screen time and dialogue than in stay/night.
You're acting like the definition of a sociopath isn't practically having the moral compass of a child, because children don't comprehend ethics. That's why children can be hosed up as well as little angels, depending on moral guidance, since they literally can't work it out on their own.

A shorter way to put it is...

Kyte posted:

It is not inaccurate to say all three lack emotional maturity.

In any case, the MOST adult characters are probably Tokiomi and Kayneth (which I'm 100% sure are not who people think about when they give the "Fate/Zero is about adults" line) because they're mostly motivated by duty and family honor, which are a bit more adult concerns than say, a devotion to childish ethics. That doesn't necessarily say much when one sells his daughter to another dude and then has that whole bullshit thing with Kariya and the other taunts a teenage student.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Irony Be My Shield posted:

Kiritsugu is bad and all but at the same time I don't think his mindset is particularly absurd or even uncommon. Plenty of people really do not give a poo poo about the means as long as the bad guy gets got. Jack Bauer
I think the most telling post in the Fate/Zero thread was someone posting an article/paper that people who super seriously subscribe to utilitarianism are very unhappy people. Even if it's not uncommon, that doesn't stop it from being childish or toxic.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Einander posted:

Nah. He did Contract with the World eventually to get the power to use his Marble, but there wasn't any wish on the Grail. (This is a good thing, because I'm pretty sure no one wants to see how it'd interpret "save everyone.")
I mean the grail's kind of simple minded, which is part of the reason that Carnival Phantasm Grail-kun's sketches are pretty great. I'm positive it would just interpret "save everyone" old testament style and save all those lost sinful human souls from their own materialistic evil.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Rodyle posted:

Also even without Angra I don't think the Grail can do something where the person making the wish doesn't have a clear idea in mind. So Tokiomi can easily say "open a door to the root" and it'll do that, but Kiritsugu couldn't just ask it to "save the world" because what does that even mean.
Yeah that's kind of the weird thing when it comes to the grail, and more or less comes about because of good ol' half-truths being thrown about in the Nasuverse works.

Basically, it seems like some people who have only seen Fate/Zero have a slight misconception on how the Holy Grail works (which of course is not incorrect) because the explanation has to do with how the grail functions when it isn't literally dripping in evil. The holy grail is basically a mass of energy, and if you can't give proper form to the idea or the energy it can't really do anything. As stated above, "save the world" doesn't mean anything, it doesn't direct the Holy Grail to do anything. That's the understanding that comes out of Fate/Zero.

Of course, as is known after Heaven's Feel or if you read between the lines in earlier routes, the current Holy Grail is actively malicious and destructive, and will purposefully interpret any wish in the most destructive manner possible. The energy is literally possessed by the devil, it doesn't know how to do anything but destroy.


So unfortunately for idealists like Kiritsugu, there's two layers of bullshit preventing the Holy Grail from doing gently caress all to achieve their dream.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Her magic is literally entirely based on precious gems, hell yeah she cares about money.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Redmark posted:

gently caress the card minigame in hollow/ataraxia is stupid and infuriating and I can't stop playing it
If by stupid and infuriating you mean broken and kind of easy (unless we're just bitching about how terrible Shinji and that one ability Caster has are, yeah).

Once you figure out the AI does not play around what abilities you have at all you've broken it.


EDIT: ^^

Speaking of, haha oh man their ability in the FHA Hanafuda is broken as poo poo. The only reason I can tolerate playing against its broken rear end is because it trivializes everything when you get to use it.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Redmark posted:

Not sure what you mean by AI not playing around abilities. You just get the one NP that moves a card you need to the top of the deck, right? You still have to hope that you have a card in the same month to actually take it with. Going by your post I'm sure I'm missing something obvious about the game.

And by infuriating I mean that sometimes you can't do anything about losses, especially if the opponent has first pick. Not to mention that sometimes you literally win or lose 6 points before the round even starts...
Oh so the only part you're on is having the character who essentially just gives you the pieces of a royal flush and that's it.

Eventually you only more characters/teams and they each have an ability and route in the game.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Well I expected nothing about gratuitous action and back story, and that was... incredible.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Silver2195 posted:

One thing I haven't seen anyone mention about the most recent episode: The scene with Angra Mainyu taking the form of Irisviel strikes me as an attempt to reconcile the line in the VN about Kiritsugu leaving his daughter and wife behind in the castle with Zero. It also helps explain why Ilya is so angry at Kiritsugu, instead of blaming Acht for everything.
I mean, from my memory about that wasn't it known that Acht just straight up lied to Ilya about why her father didn't come back and that bred the resentment? And then after all that finding out he just had a new family probably didn't help. Don't remember where I got that from though.

Mind, this works a bit better and makes it more clear, but I don't remember it feeling like a plot hole at all (at least, not the "why is Ilya pissed" part. Obviously the whole leaving wife thing was a plot hole).

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

Raenir Salazar posted:

e: I did a cursory google search, is there not yet a LP somewhere by someone for Hollow Ataraxia? I don't really have the time to play the game when not at work. :ohdear:
The F/SN LP took a long time, was in a slightly different LP community, and took forever to even get accepted into the LP Archives. Unfortunately, don't hold your breath.

That said, nothing stopping you from playing the game yourself. Hell, the game's even nice enough to sequester off the sex scenes. Well, except what I presume has to be the worst one. Why.

Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

TheLovablePlutonis posted:

Well he's technically not a rapist because he didn't do that but it sounds better than muwdewew.
He makes more than enough off-color jokes that I think wascally wapist is appropriate.

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Twiddy
May 17, 2008

To the man who loves art for its own sake, it is frequently in its least important and lowliest manifestations that the keenest pleasure is to be derived.

LORD OF BUTT posted:

Especially since they kinda have to go with the good ending for HF and not the normal ending, because the latter skips one of the best fights.
It doesn't, actually. You can still get the best fight and then have Sakura go "it's spring" for years on end.

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