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Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Sakura is my favourite by default because she doesn't lecture you endlessly about pointless bullshit.

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Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



I thought the idea is that you already saw the outcome in UBW.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Wasn't Kotomine powered up by the grail during HF or something? He may have just been weaker in Fate.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



I liked Shinji for the first two routes (or at least I appreciated him as a good unlikable character). He was such an unmitigated failure that his actions made sense as either him lashing out or trying to prove that he was useful. I was still hoping Shirou would accept his team-up on the last route because I thought that could be interesting.

That doesn't really work in light of his HF actions, though, it was sortof disappointing to realize he was just bad. Maybe it would have worked better if Shirou was confronted with it early on as a challenge to his worldview that everyone can be saved.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Well obviously it would end up with them fighting when Shirou realizes, but at the time Shinji offers the team-up they're friends (for some reason) so it wouldn't be too strange.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Well we know it's difficult but not impossible for a servant to go against a command seal. It depends on the magical power of the user and the independence of the servant (Gilgamesh seems to be basically immune). So maybe Archer (with his independent action skill) can easily ignore them while Caster can't. And Saber can ignore Shirou's if she really wants to because Shirou isn't that magical.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



I think Saber knew Kotomine was killed? At least, I remember her being really shocked in Fate when he shows up (I'm not sure how Shirou learnt that he was meant to have died otherwise). If so it's a sortof weak plotline because it relies on neither Rin nor Shirou ever mentioning his name to her.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Kiritsugu probably just cut Saber off as soon as her role was fulfilled because he hated her.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



BlitzBlast posted:

Meanwhile Sakura loses both of the pillars of her life and spends the rest of her (arguably brief) life suffering.

You're such a great sister Rin. :thumbsup:
Hey, at least she still has her brother!

...:smith:

Man even the HF bad end is much better for Sakura (and perhaps the world in general) than the UBW and Fate ones.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



HF implied he was planning to wait until the next war to get involved, so presumably he'd just wait around and keep training Sakura until then? I don't think anything in Fate or UBW would stop another war from happening.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



That sounds cool, I kindof hope it gets animated as a UBW epilogue or something.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



I have heard a legend that King Arthur is merely asleep and will awaken when England needs him. That could have served as the basis for the non-aging or the fact that Saber is still alive.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Plus you see Gilgamesh in an early scene with Sakura, so it's not like they could hide his presence completely from people who've seen Fate/Zero.

Although I think that scene might have been optional or something.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



That seems like another reason to skip Fate - its twists are largely things that an F/Z viewer would already know (eighth servant, Kiritsugu wasn't as great as Shirou thought he was, Kotomine is evil, Saber is Arturia, Saber served under Kiritsugu previously, Illya will die as part of the grail summoning etc).

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Actually that reminds me of a question I've had for a while: why does Gilgamesh not care about Saber at all in UBW? He was really obsessed with her in Fate.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Soylentbits posted:

My Celtic literature teacher pronounced it that way too and he assuredly did not know about fate/ stay.
Yeah I'm pretty sure it's the correct pronunciation, doesn't stop it being funny.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Cake Attack posted:

sakura isn't a matou, and he means the new generation of matous aren't mages anymore.

Shinji would be the weakest master because unlike Shirou he has literally no mana, but Sakura is the real master and that's foreshadowing that

i think
Or maybe she's just alluding to the fact that Shirou is the only master stupid enough to prevent his servant from protecting him :v:

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Pierson posted:

The Tsubame Gaeshi ruled hard and perfectly conveyed the 'what the gently caress was that'-feeling you think it'd make. The pre-death image Saber saw/felt makes me think of Gae Bolg more though since that's a causality-breaking weapon and the TG just bends physics/time.
I think that was just meant to be Saber's combat instincts kicking in and telling her that Assassin's next move would kill her.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Compendium posted:

"Fate/Zero is darker and edgier therefore superior because Kiritsugu is a goddamn adult who would cap all these motherfuckers in the head," is what I usually glean from people who think F/Z is the best.
I don't see this attitude very much, it mostly seems like a strawman built by FSN enthusiasts. Kiritsugu's moral system is wrong and the series makes that abundantly clear. Indeed that's one of the major reasons I like FZ (and to some degree FSN); plenty of other action series pretty much advocate behaviour like his and it was refreshing to see his ideals taken down.

The actual problem I had when I read FSN is that it had loads of long pointless boring scenes, and when I watched FZ I was glad to see most of the cool things I liked about FSN without as many of those scenes.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



What a Master and Servant choose to do behind closed doors is none of your business.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



They'll probably switch to a sad OP for the second half of the UBW anime like they did with FZ.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



I like how Rider has like 6 Noble Phantasms and none of them prevent her from dying like a chump three times

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Her narrative roles are mainly to have good fights and provide another perspective on Sakura and I think she does both of those things fine :shrug:

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Is the church in TM really bad? Maybe they're over-aggressive, but vampire killing seems important and Kotomine isn't acting in their interests.

Or is there a twist where they're behind everything in Tsukihime, I never finished it

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Also if christianity's primary purpose were to slay vampires I can imagine that it would develop differently.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



People are mostly complaining that the anime so far has been boring, Zero is just the easiest comparison to make because it's set in the same universe.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



I guess the fact she's an elf would be surprising to a new viewer??

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Saber likely didn't expect any real resistance from a human, so her first attack was probably intended to either quickly kill Kuzuki or force him to surrender - that could make it easier to counter than her regular attacks. After that point Kuzuki injures her while she's still off-balance, so she never really has a chance to properly engage him in combat in the way Shirou did.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Effectronica posted:

So in other words, the three houses are guaranteed a position so long as they have someone who fits the criteria, but anyone who fits those criteria can join the war by summoning a Servant.
Shirou started getting a crest before he summoned a servant though, I always assumed from Ilya's threat that she had some hand in it.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



I think the joke is that 90% of FSN readers would've made that guess at some point. I certainly did.

Incidentally I also guessed Archer was Jesus at some point, which made his monologues about hurting himself while projecting and saving people really funny

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



It was in the Deen adaptation so it'll probably be here too.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



I liked Saber's epilogue in Fate (true). Otherwise yeah a lot if the route was boring and it didn't make up for it with a great second half like the other routes did.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



It's not really about Fate but yeah it exists.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Yeah you can only pass the family magic to one child (remember Tohsaka magic works through heirlooms so you can't divide it up without weakening it) and I guess having a second highly jealous child could screw things up. Heck, imagine Shinji only he has enough latent magical ability to be a real threat.

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



I wonder what would have happened if Kariya had just been a bit more specific

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Kiritsugu is bad and all but at the same time I don't think his mindset is particularly absurd or even uncommon. Plenty of people really do not give a poo poo about the means as long as the bad guy gets got. Jack Bauer

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Seems like a bad idea to me, I mean there were meltdowns every time a character made an off-colour joke in Dangan Ronpa. Also it's in English so you can just get the game if you want to read it.

Irony Be My Shield fucked around with this message at 12:43 on Apr 22, 2015

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Also Kiritsugu's path led to everyone he ever cared about dying

Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



UBW good is really dumb though.

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Irony Be My Shield
Jul 29, 2012

PRETTY SURE THAT ONE'S SARCASM, BOSS



Nate RFB posted:

HF True feels earned, Shirou has to go to hell and back to get there and even then Illya still has to sacrifice herself in one of the most memorable scenes in the whole story. Whereas UBW Good comes out of nowhere and isn't really thematically rewarding.
Yeah. After you see Saber make peace with herself and return to her own timeframe to die it seems super cliche and bad to see her just stick around with these two random kids from the future instead

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