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tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Good evening fellow crumblings.

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tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



I'm a fan of smooth peanut butter or jam on bread

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



I'm in the same boat as PMom, day 1 kills a lot of the time are basically random without someone accidentally loving up and posting their role pm or something. Difficult to build a case prior to that.

Poison Mushroom posted:

Hm. Let's try this, then.

Discussion topic: If you were scum, how would you answer this question?

Personally, I just wouldn't. It'd be easier to pretend I thought it was stupid and ignore than to comment and maybe accidentally let something slip.

I really don't know how anyone would answer this question, scum or not.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Mr. Maltose posted:

I knew the lack of sarcastic quotations around "Jokephase is over" would come back to bite me in the bagel.

Heated or unheated?

This is important

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Kitiara posted:

While tithin seems to only post to not appear MIA without really adding anything at all. I'm also kind of eh on poisoned mushroom, but we'll see.

:ironicat:

It's funny though, in every game I've signed up to, I'm usually one of the first to be tagged as "suspicious" for no reason at all that I can see.

Sorry I haven't done a massive effort post cataloguing everyone I find suspicious on day 1 when no one's said anything at all of note.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



I think it's clearly a joke vote given the reason given

I think you're taking a joke vote too seriously by reading too deeply into a joke vote

I completely tuned out Goodness' post because they're pointing out unintentional puns, and therefore white noise.

Surprised that 100years hasn't unvoted, but it's early yet.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Christ, short day. Didn't realise we only had an hour left.

Not really sure I'm comfortable backing any lynch at the minute, there's really not much to go on.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Lampsacus posted:

We could lynch the least active.

More likely to hit town than scum with that.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



No extension - as lovely as it is, no lynch is the better play imo, in case of mislynch robbing is us two townies.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Fine, i'll put in the vote but I'm not happy about it.

##vote Maltose

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



First up, thanks for basically the first serious post of the day.

100YrsofAttitude posted:

First serious post he makes is a defensive, "ugh I'm ALWAYS suspicious guys." It seems like a weak defense especially when he was under absolutely no pressure, just kitiara's gut. Kitiara does bring up how he's just content-posting rather than making any strong claims. A game he keeps up.

For perspective I've not played any serious games in 6 months, and this week I've played three games where I turned out to be town, but have been flagged as suspicious / scum on Day 1 for no real reason. It's weird to me and I can't figure out what it is about the way I post that gets me flagged super high on the scumdar straight from the firing line.

quote:

What most gets me his he's the one to first advocate the no-lynch. Lynching is our ONLY tool to win this game. If we don't lynch we don't get scum. Mis-lynching is the terrible risk but we really can't afford not to lynch and for me no-lynch advocating is scummy through and through. What's worse is his final vote on Maltose.

Disagree - Mislynching on Day 1 (assuming Scum chooses to kill on N1), in a game with 9 players makes the game dramatically easier for scum to win by cutting us down to 2/3 of our starting roster. A mislynch is essentially going to make the game a lot easier for the kill.

quote:

Distancing himself already from his vote in case it goes sour (in which case Maltose is proved town and tithin get's credit for having the right assumption).

His play is just so defensive because, I think, he's got something to hide.

I distanced myself from my vote because I didn't like doing it, and I've stated why both in this post and in previous ones.

The only reason I went with it is due to Maltose's push to try and get at least some sort of lynch (using the same logic you yourself applied above, that any lynch is better than no lynch).

My plays are defensive because I frequently find myself under attack in the last few games I've played, so that's possibly carried forward. Sorry.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Poison Mushroom posted:

This is a good case, I think. I mean, every game I've been with tithin in, he's been like that, unfortunately, but that doesn't mean they aren't good reasons.

The overdefensive "ugh, someone always thinks I'm scummy" reminds me of what I used to say when I was new to Mafia. But he's been in over a dozen games, now, counting this one, so that doesn't really fly any more.

Would vote tithin.

Pmush you've been in every one of those games I'm referring to - you know what I'm talking about :smith:

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



100YrsofAttitude posted:

As for tithin I feel for you. In light of your recent spate of town games where you get called out I think that at least explains that comment. I still don't agree with you on the mis-lynching but there you go. Make a case, I'm by no means 100% sold on my vote on you as of yet because frankly I find everyone but poison mushroom to be still somewhat scummy. Goodness is... ok. I'm not sure what to think about goodness? What your takes on them?

It's mainly a difference of opinion, to my mind with small games, a mislynch on day 1 is the difference between winning and losing, and being frank, this is a small game. We gently caress up at the start, we don't have much, if any, breathing room.

I think goodness's first official vote was weak, and I think the reason given was weak. I'm also not entirely sure it wasn't a joke, but the fact that there was no later unvote is suspicious because to vote for someone on such weak grounds (:ironicat:) is pretty scummy.

Unfortunately there's not a lot of other content there that I can read as being scummy or not.

:justpost:

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Poison Mushroom posted:

This is better.

How do you feel about Lamp? And, on another point, how do you feel about me, and 100's statement of me as probably-town?

Lamp is difficult for me to read, if I look at it from a "probably scum" perspective, he's flagging relatively high on there for me due to the flip flop vote first on 100, and then later for no vote.

The vote could be fake, the reason given could be a joke, but at the same time it could also not - but it's certainly curious that he flipped so quickly from "lynch" to "no lynch", once people started getting behind the functionally random day 1 lynch on <name forgotten cos I'm distracted>.

I'm not convinced he's scum, but yeah, he's certainly worth watching.

As for you pmush, I'm getting a town vibe from - I haven't done a full read of you (yet), but I haven't noticed anything overtly scummy.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Wrong name - sorry.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



I'm re-reading goodness at the minute and I'm getting kind of a scummy vibe - but at the same time I'm not sure I'm not just projecting (scum hunting will do that for you) - is goodness a newer player also? Is this how they typically post?

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



goodness posted:

The first couple days and last couple days I am typically pretty cynical about the game, just because of the way some people think they are clairvoyant gods.

The problem here is that the first couple of days, and the last couple of days in this particular game are going to run together.

There's not going to be a comfortable middle imo - so you're kind of shooting yourself in the foot.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Poison Mushroom posted:

It's pretty much the definition of WIFOM.

Sorry, WIFOM?

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



At least it's not nearly so quiet as the Australia game where the mod's threatened to modkill / close the game because no one's loving talking.

Thanks for the explanation on WIFOM

100YrsofAttitude posted:

A harder question to ask is why was sos killed?

He targeted goodness and maltose each. He also mentions mushroom in this post:


Sos was also a proponent of lynching Maltose and against the no-lynch. Useless to say in retrospect, but I think anyone would've been hard pressed to put him down as scum on D1 and I think it was that earnestness of his as town that led him to being lynched. Normally it's risky for scum to go after a player they think personally threatens them, since it can be easily connected. Does that mean we get to pay less attention to these guys?

I can't get much out of the night kill of last night, there's probably not much there, but I don't think we should forget that it happened.

It's difficult to say the logic, but it would be a good way of diverting attention to Maltose, which honestly makes me a bit averse to voting for him on that ground.

That being said it's almost literally all we've got to go on.

Might try to do a formal read - how much time do we have left?

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Lampsacus posted:

Oh god is it seriously ambiguous that my first d1 vote for 100 because "of his name" wasn't a joke? That's really unfortunate.

Yeah, it is a little ambiguous - to me at least. I was asked to read you and as I said, purely from where I was sitting, if I were to look at it in the scummiest light possible, it is a tell.

quote:

Just because I want to say my last piece on the matter: I wish people would stop saying I was disrupting Day 1 srs talk with my joke vote. It was literally like half a dozen posts from the last joke vote and there really wasn't any proper content from what I can read. Only "hey guys we should get serious now" Which I disagreed with because I always like to do at least one joke vote and wanted to get mine in before that.

There was no intention of mine to push the town away from serious talking. That would be a blatant and poor scum tactic and I like to think in an alternative universe where scum-Lamp is playing this game he wouldn't be so dumb to try do that.

Happy with this reason.

quote:

I just read but can't find another post like this against goodness which basically reads "if you are spending all your time being overly defensive and not prodding other players that is pretty scummy"

And I think that's just sloppy. Newbies, and some vets, have a tendency to spend all their posts just defending themselves from being scum. It's an easy trap to fall into to. But what really helps t find s is.. questions and offensive posts! Not emotional pleads that "I'm townie guys wait till I flip!!"

I'm hella guilty of it myself. And I definitely don't see it as a reason to label somebody scummy like Poison Mushroom etc might.

I agree with this (/bitter).

quote:

This is a very terrible fake reason not to be participating dude. No offense.
And if you are town, your absence isn't helping much. With only a couple hours to deadline and two votes already on you - ##vote goodness

I'm just going to make my vote for goodness now, my earlier ~big post~ combined with the subsequent explanation post don't tally as a good enough reason for me.

##vote goodness

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



re-reading that last quote block is confusing even to me

To clarify, I had thought I'd done a read and post on goodness but hadn't - I just did the read.

Unfortunately there's not a lot there to read, and I suspect it's mainly scum lurking. Combined with the subsequent cynicism explanation and promise to do a big effort post from him that didn't occur, I'm happy to vote goodness, as I'm pretty confident he's scum at this stage.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



If his rebuttal is sufficiently strong enough, I'll be happy to unvote, but promises to post content and then failing to follow through is a big scummy move a lot of the time, especially when it helps to avoid them getting lynched.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Pinterest Mom posted:

and since I basically just outed myself anyway, I jailed Pmush night one.

Why?

How do you know there's no tracker?

Am I missing something there?

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Haha. Ok, I got that Pmom claimed Jailer, but didn't realise those were mutually exclusive roles.

I also doubt very much pmom would claim jailer where a town flip on goodness will get himself killed.

Someone hammer this scum.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Pinterest Mom posted:

and since I basically just outed myself anyway, I jailed Pmush night one.

Question before the night ends: why the jail on Pmush?

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



That's some damned fine comedy.

I'm also totally fine with being jailed.

goodness posted:

I like how he is quick to call me a liar, but then claims similar to me. At least I know he is scum now. Or just a vanilla town that really wants me to be bad haha.

Man I wish I had time to play tonight.

Sorry dude, that's weak as gently caress.

If you flip town, we know he's lying, and we vote him as scum.

It's a standoff, and frankly I'm more inclined to believe pmom.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



goodness posted:

I tracked Tithin last night and got a sucess

Oh my, and what did I do last night? :allears:

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



I'm gonna straight up say I'm VT, I have 0 powers whatso-loving-ever.

So if he's saying he tracked me, and got a success, and that I did something, he's talking out his arse.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Reread yesterday - I was jailed

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



I'm at work for another 9 hours but I want to start looking at Kitiara - the last message they posted about people not voting being suspicious stuck out to me as the wording implies they were also confirmed town and I don't think they've been confirmed.

If someone could put a case together I'd be appreciative - failing that I'll do one tonight.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



I'm not claiming I was jailed.

Pmom said in the thread at the prompting of others that he was going to jail me.

There is only two scum in the game.

If I were scum, pmom jailing me would have overridden my kill command.

Pmom was killed, therefore I cannot have been the killer and am confirmed town.

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Poison Mushroom posted:

Oh, I see. Okay.

But what if Pmom decided otherwise? Not lied, but came up with another idea, maybe thought they knew who was going to get NKed?

I doubt they would have - my posting puts me high on the scumdar, I was being jailed as a test.

The smartest thing scum could have done last night is no kill to "confirm" me as scum.

Instead they cleared me - thanks Mr Skeltal

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



i had intended to do a proper read on Kitiara tonight, but I'm honestly tired as balls so I'm going to take a break for the rest of the night. Also, her post sort of alleviates some of my concerns. How much of it is true, I don't know as I've not confirmed any of it, but if true I'll be happy to clear her mentally from my scumlist.

Kitiara posted:

The case on Kitiara, as far as I can see, is that SHE said we should look at those who voted late for goodness or didn't vote for goodness at all. Since goodness is the only confirmed scum, and she didn't think scum would be so daft as to vote for themselves.

Sorry, I suck at telling gender on the internet. Just ask P Mom after the game - I've called him female based on his name about 10 times in our last few games :greenangel:

Nothing intentional - sorry!

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Hey all,

Civ BE has eaten up my ENTIRE evening.

This being said I'm thinking that the read on PMush is pretty damned solid.

The thing that stuck out to me more than anything else was something only really touched on in 100s read - which is how confused PMush was after the Jailing action.

It stuck out to me because this is the fourth or fifth game in a row that I've been in a game with Pmush and it's pretty out of character for her - especially considering how experienced she is at the game. Hell, she's been giving me advice post game for several of them.

That was at least backed up by how quickly she moved the goalposts to Kitiara (given I had mentioned I had found her previous statement suspicious) when Lamp stated that he was getting frustrated with answering the question on how the jailing cleared me.

This, combined with 100s effort post means I'm pretty confident that PMush is scum.

##vote Poison Mushroom

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Yes! And they fixed spying so it's not shite!

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



:redhammer:

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



:ghost: MOTHERFUCKER :ghost:

tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Poison Mushroom posted:

:ghost: Laugh bitterly. :ghost:

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tithin
Nov 14, 2003

[Grandmaster Tactician]



Welp, now I feel dumb. You were way down on my list, lamp.

I'm assuming nk = survivor of some sort

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