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Annakie
Apr 20, 2005

"It's pretty bad, isn't it? I know it's pretty bad. Ever since I can remember..."
Stop using spoiler tags for stuff that's already aired. ;)

That was a fun episode. I was pretty meh on Kitty at first but she's starting to really grow on me. Sherlock saving Bell's life was a nice touch, too. Also loved Joan laying down the law about being Kitty's "mom". Though no Clyde, unless I missed him, so, that takes a whole letter grade off the episode. :colbert:

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SpiderHyphenMan
Apr 1, 2010

by Fluffdaddy
I like this show and how it's not up its own rear end in a top hat like that other show about Sherlock Holmes.

Pick
Jul 19, 2009
Nap Ghost

Annakie posted:

Sherlock saving Bell's life was a nice touch, too.

I like how it wasn't immediate. It was like "Oh, huh." (Seconds pass.) *BOOM*

I also love how they've established that one of Sherlock's strengths is knowing how to get information, not just having all of it already in his brain. Good research practices.

Anyway, relevant @Elementarystaff tweets:

quote:

The motive of the villain is based on real cases. I won’t spoil it, but this is a real way to make a ton of money with math.

Again, the WPA mural thing is based on real events. I’ve seen Diego Rivera’s mural at the Presidential Palace in Mexico City. It’s amazing.

The @NSA_PAO has used math games and puzzle hunts as a recruitment tool in the past.

I ate one of my dog’s treats for research. It wasn’t very good. I don’t know why he loves them so much.

The Space Monkey poster was made by our art department. I have a copy on my office wall. I love it.

Pick fucked around with this message at 06:39 on Nov 14, 2014

BIG CITY LAWYER
Sep 15, 2004

I believe it was the great American painter Bob Ross who said, "The key to a swollen vagina is... courage."
I feel dumb asking this, but who was the knife thrower/football guy? I got that his first name was Phillip, is he a real player? :negative:

pyromance
Sep 25, 2006
Phil Simms, former QB and current NFL commentator.

Blind Pineapple
Oct 27, 2010

For The Perfect Fruit 'n' Kaman

1 part gin
1 part pomegranate syrup
Fill with pineapple juice
Serve over crushed ice

College Slice
Really liked this episode. It just had all the little things that make the show great. The anti-tropes like the delayed blast and Phil Simms' cameo being a totally weird non sequitir, Miller's great facial expression after Harlan's butthurt rant, Sherlock trolling an intimidated person ("Watson seems sufficiently sexed").

I also really like Kitty, but I can't shake the feeling that she's working for Moriarty. Just speculation, but why else would some cute girl with no background show up during a weak moment for Sherlock and quickly assimilate into a position to easily keep tabs on Holmes and Watson? Also, Sherlock's "I need an understudy" attitude sounds like something Moriarty would exploit, and Kitty almost appears to be going out of her way to make herself look less smart than Holmes and Watson (but just smart enough to justify Sherlock keeping her around).

Tiggum
Oct 24, 2007

Your life and your quest end here.


SpiderHyphenMan posted:

I love how this show makes me feel stupid for not seeing the solution instead of infuriated over it coming out of loving nowhere like a lesser show would.

I felt that The Five Orange Pipz failed in that. The first thing I thought of when they said the beads metabolised to GHB was that they would probably be really valuable, because that is something that people want to buy. But none of the characters seemed to consider that, so I kind of forgot about it, and then it turns out it is relevant at the end.

Pick
Jul 19, 2009
Nap Ghost

Blind Pineapple posted:

I also really like Kitty, but I can't shake the feeling that she's working for Moriarty. Just speculation, but why else would some cute girl with no background show up during a weak moment for Sherlock and quickly assimilate into a position to easily keep tabs on Holmes and Watson? Also, Sherlock's "I need an understudy" attitude sounds like something Moriarty would exploit, and Kitty almost appears to be going out of her way to make herself look less smart than Holmes and Watson (but just smart enough to justify Sherlock keeping her around).

I really feel like this show doesn't want to fridge her, and with her backstory it would be unusually sinister for a show that ultimately is pulling for kindness. But that means they have to do something with her, they can't keep relying on "funny circumstances are allowing Holmes and Watson to work together this time!"

johntfs
Jun 7, 2013

by Cowcaster
Soiled Meat

Pick posted:

I really feel like this show doesn't want to fridge her, and with her backstory it would be unusually sinister for a show that ultimately is pulling for kindness. But that means they have to do something with her, they can't keep relying on "funny circumstances are allowing Holmes and Watson to work together this time!"

Holmes and Watson didn't work together this time, at least not on the main case. I do wonder if Joan was in the meeting with Kitty just to support her or if Joan is also a survivor of a sexual assault. I don't this (the latter) is true but I almost hope it is just to have Sherlock wreak some horrible revenge on the perpetrator.

johntfs fucked around with this message at 02:22 on Nov 15, 2014

Pick
Jul 19, 2009
Nap Ghost
The staff Twitter said she was there to support Kitty, which doesn't put it out but means that's not the reason she was there.

hollylolly
Jun 5, 2009

Do you like superheroes? Check out my CYOA Mutants: Uprising

How about weird historical fiction? Try Vampires of the Caribbean

Pretty sure Joan was only there to support Kitty. E:fb ^^^

I enjoyed this episode, except Sherlock shutting down his math guy (you asked me for help with social situations!) was pretty painful. I mean, that's what they were going for, so it was good...but it made me cringe for the guy. I'm glad Sherlock brought him back in at the end. Also it was funny that the police takedown actually took place an hour previous to the explanation because of an avoided phone call.

Clyde's terrarium made an appearance - the show is such a tease!

Pick
Jul 19, 2009
Nap Ghost
Yeah, it's clear that Sherlock is a little different than when he left, even. He has seemed a little harsher without Joan.

I liked the scene with math guy breaking down because it was a clear example of how Sherlock's endgame-oriented attitude hurts other people. Though math guy is sort of a "sadsack" character, he's clearly in the right. After all, why can't he ask Sherlock for advice, that's literally what he's been doing for Sherlock regarding mathematics.

hollylolly
Jun 5, 2009

Do you like superheroes? Check out my CYOA Mutants: Uprising

How about weird historical fiction? Try Vampires of the Caribbean

Exactly.

Although the complete absurdity of someone thinking Sherlock was a font of advice for socializing was pretty funny.

Scorchy
Jul 15, 2006

Smug Statement: Elementary, my dear meatbag.
There was heavy stuff going on with Kitty's scenes and with the math guy, but in between that I must have bursted out laughing 4 or 5 times at various points. Just the whole thing with Watson being horrified at the thought of Sherlock and her being the parents to Kitty, oh man.

e: Also Sherlock continuing to wake Watson up in the worst ways despite not living together any more.

"...Hello?"
"You've had sex."

Scorchy fucked around with this message at 21:26 on Nov 14, 2014

Jedit
Dec 10, 2011

Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

Scorchy posted:

There was heavy stuff going on with Kitty's scenes and with the math guy, but in between that I must have bursted out laughing 4 or 5 times at various points. Just the whole thing with Watson being horrified at the thought of Sherlock and her being the parents to Kitty, oh man.

e: Also Sherlock continuing to wake Watson up in the worst ways despite not living together any more.

"...Hello?"
"You've had sex."

It's Holmes's curse: he can never stop analysing.

Pick
Jul 19, 2009
Nap Ghost
The thing I find difficult is trying to reconcile what we know of Kitty and Holmes' observation that she shouldn't approve of a murderer who gets off the hook because of incorrectly ascribed motivations. To me, this kind of implies her situation involved three people. Why three?

It wouldn't make sense if the referenced murderer were Kitty (she would approve of being let off then).
It wouldn't make sense if there were only Kitty and her abductor, because he didn't kill her (obviously).

It could be that her abductor killed someone in such a way that he got away with murder and what he did to her. Then there's three people, including the guy he killed.
It could be that a murderer killed her abductor, and then claimed it was for Kitty's sake when Kitty knows that is not true. (Maybe one criminal kills another and then claims he did it to save her, having previously known and not cared about Kitty's condition.)

Thoughts?

Byers2142
May 5, 2011

Imagine I said something deep here...

Pick posted:

Thoughts?

I took it to mean that someone was caught for the crimes against her, but it wasn't the right guy. That the true criminal got away while someone else paid for the crime, and that her abductor is still out there.

The Lord Bude
May 23, 2007

ASK ME ABOUT MY SHITTY, BOUGIE INTERIOR DECORATING ADVICE
So, it's been more than 24 hours now, why is the thread title not 'watson seems well sexed' yet?

Blind Pineapple
Oct 27, 2010

For The Perfect Fruit 'n' Kaman

1 part gin
1 part pomegranate syrup
Fill with pineapple juice
Serve over crushed ice

College Slice
Just re-watched the pilot on a wild hair, and one thing I wish they had continued referencing throughout the series is Watson being a die-hard Mets fan.

SpiderHyphenMan
Apr 1, 2010

by Fluffdaddy

Blind Pineapple posted:

Just re-watched the pilot on a wild hair, and one thing I wish they had continued referencing throughout the series is Watson being a die-hard Mets fan.
The less that reminds me about the scene where Sherlock is able to predict exactly what happens in the game, the better.
gently caress that scene, it makes no sense.

hollylolly
Jun 5, 2009

Do you like superheroes? Check out my CYOA Mutants: Uprising

How about weird historical fiction? Try Vampires of the Caribbean

:siren: S3 E4 Bella :siren:

When a groundbreaking artificial intelligence software program is stolen, Sherlock agrees to take on the case, but enlists Joan's assistance in solving it when he becomes more interested in disproving the computer's abilities than finding the thief. Joan confronts Sherlock about his motives after she learns he has been in direct contact with her boyfriend without her knowledge.

bubblelubble
Feb 26, 2013

scribbled out the truth,
paying in naivety.
Clyde first thing. Great episode already.

LordNad
Nov 18, 2002

HEY BAD GUYS, THIS IS THE VICE PRESIDENT, PLEASE DON'T KILL HIM!
I like how the ending really drives home Sherlock's humanity. I'll bet the struggle will continue to drive him mad and we'll see the professor again.

Pick
Jul 19, 2009
Nap Ghost
I was actually expecting it would be the other researcher, but as a PR stunt to get more attention or credibility for the project. This was actually pretty interesting.

Slamhound
Mar 27, 2010
They missed a perfect opportunity for a Michael Emerson cameo.

johntfs
Jun 7, 2013

by Cowcaster
Soiled Meat
"Just ride it out. If he starts hitting things, use the fire extinguisher on him."

Kitty's existence as a character is validated just because it allowed for that scene.

hollylolly
Jun 5, 2009

Do you like superheroes? Check out my CYOA Mutants: Uprising

How about weird historical fiction? Try Vampires of the Caribbean

bubblelubble posted:

Clyde first thing. Great episode already.

I love that Sherlock and Joan share custody of him. :3:

The episode didn't end with everything wrapped up neatly, which is pretty unusual. I thought the mystery and who actually did it was really interesting.

johntfs
Jun 7, 2013

by Cowcaster
Soiled Meat
I kept thinking it would circle back to Melinda, Borstein's partner/assistant, who killed him to eliminate the profit-sharing and plant the idea that the AI was advanced enough to willfully commit murder (and thus be a true AI which would be worth a lot of money). I'll bet that Holmes kept a copy of the Bella program.

Also, kudos to Elementary for bringing in Raffles.

I will say that I longed for a Michael Emerson/Harold Finch cameo, but I understand why they didn't do it. As perceptive as Sherlock is, he'd certainly be aware of and active in the situations involving PoI's plotlines and I really don't want to see Elementary Person of Interest.

Blind Pineapple
Oct 27, 2010

For The Perfect Fruit 'n' Kaman

1 part gin
1 part pomegranate syrup
Fill with pineapple juice
Serve over crushed ice

College Slice

hollylolly posted:

The episode didn't end with everything wrapped up neatly, which is pretty unusual. I thought the mystery and who actually did it was really interesting.

I assumed it was going to be a multi-parter since the ending did seem to come out of nowhere. There was no real closure on the murder or Sherlock vs. AI. The show doesn't usually leave loose ends like that. Either way, good episode this week. That scene with the creepy doll and the seizure-inducing background was unsettling.

Lotus Aura
Aug 16, 2009

KNEEL BEFORE THE WICKED KING!
Immediate 5-second close up of Clyde, revelation of joint custody for him, great start to the episode...

The thief never appeared on-screen in person and the murderers weren't on-screen until the last few minutes. Not even as a photo or painting like that one guy was. Kinda bizarre even for this show.

SpiderHyphenMan
Apr 1, 2010

by Fluffdaddy

Dragonatrix posted:

Immediate 5-second close up of Clyde, revelation of joint custody for him, great start to the episode...

The thief never appeared on-screen in person and the murderers weren't on-screen until the last few minutes. Not even as a photo or painting like that one guy was. Kinda bizarre even for this show.
Well, it's a two-parter. And it's going to be about Sherlock's humanity, not about whodunnit.

Pick
Jul 19, 2009
Nap Ghost
Weird it didn't have a "to be continued" or something despite it being something that needs to be followed up on. Wouldn't be shocked if the prof is the S3 major antagonist though. They've been good about shaking it up.

Stabbey_the_Clown
Sep 21, 2002

Are... are you quite sure you really want to say that?
Taco Defender
A two-parter? Why? Honestly, this doesn't seem like it needed to be a two-parter. I thought the ending was pretty good. It was okay that the real culprit got away with it, it was enough that he was identified, even if nothing could be proven.

bubblelubble
Feb 26, 2013

scribbled out the truth,
paying in naivety.
It'd be a nice change of pace if it wasn't a two-parter, but I highly doubt it. The ending was too... err, not-an-ending, but in a technical sense. I was almost expecting a "To be continued..." to be scrawled across the screen.

johntfs
Jun 7, 2013

by Cowcaster
Soiled Meat
There's no indication that this is a two-parter or even that we'd see the professor again in the future.

If you'll think back to the fourth episode of season 2, it had a similar ending when the parricidal ex-pen pal of Holmes chooses to confess to a crime she didn't commit to spare the sexually abused kid the trial and ugliness she went through.

hollylolly
Jun 5, 2009

Do you like superheroes? Check out my CYOA Mutants: Uprising

How about weird historical fiction? Try Vampires of the Caribbean

The preview for the next episode indicates that it is a whole new mystery and unconnected to this week's episode. Something to do with weightlifters.

Space Hamlet
Aug 24, 2009

not listening
not listening
Yeah I think this one's just going for a sort of partially-resolved ending. The murder's been solved, after all - there's just a few unanswerable questions left dangling.

Hypocrisy
Oct 4, 2006
Lord of Sarcasm

That opening scene with Clive made my day.

I'm pretty surprised that the episode ended with such a clear loss for Holmes. It reminded me a bit of the "Balloon Man" episode, though that one gave Holmes the win in the end.

johntfs
Jun 7, 2013

by Cowcaster
Soiled Meat
I don't see it as a clear loss, but it was very much a partial one. The professor is unlikely to be able to recruit another student devoted enough to go to jail for him and even if he did, he knows he's on Holmes' radar now and will be unlikely to pull off another murder without being caught and having his work interrupted by jail time.

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Scorchy
Jul 15, 2006

Smug Statement: Elementary, my dear meatbag.
I don't think it needs a second part, it's already a good ending if you accept that the AI themes were the main thoroughline and the murder mystery was secondary.

The end scene he comes back around to talking to the computer, but instead of questioning the computer's humanity, now he's questioning his own humanity on whether to turn the guy in. His Turing test ending inconclusively is mirrored in the episode ending inconclusively. It took a minute to digest it afterwards, but I thought it was very interesting.

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