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Keromaru5
Dec 28, 2012

Pictured: The Wolf Of Gubbio (probably)

This avatar made possible by a gift from the Religionthread Posters Relief Fund
Not only that, but 2 starts with war orphans barely escaping a massacre, 4 starts with the hero returning from an unprovoked pillaging of an innocent town, and 6 starts with an enslaved young woman slaughtering people on the way to steal an important archaeological find. 1, 3, and 5 were the only ones for a while that started with the heroes as unambiguously heroic.

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Gnoman
Feb 12, 2014

Come, all you fair and tender maids
Who flourish in your pri-ime
Beware, take care, keep your garden fair
Let Gnoman steal your thy-y-me
Le-et Gnoman steal your thyme




I started with a party of veteran adventurers, II with fleeing survivors of a destroyed nation, IV began with you playing as a knight returning from a mission of slaughter and plunder, while VI opened with control of a brainwashed prisoner attacking an innocent town. X-2 was the story of a veteran who somehow survived a kamikaze mission and had to deal with the complications of surviving, and XII started as the tale of a wanna-be rebel who didn't have a clue.

The closest thing the series ever got to the "cliche" accidental hero was III and possibly V (which I don't remember a thing about). I suppose you could make a case for X as well.

NikkolasKing
Apr 3, 2010



All Tidus wanted to do was play blitzball and bang groupies.

Pvt.Scott
Feb 16, 2007

What God wants, God gets, God help us all

NikkolasKing posted:

All Tidus wanted to do was play blitzball and bang groupies.

That seems perfectly in character for a second generation sports superstar with childhood neglect issues, who may or may not be the dying dream of a long dead civilization, or something.

GrimRevenant
Mar 28, 2011

Je Reviendrai.

Hunter Noventa posted:

This was a great sequence in the actual game. Gave me much higher hopes than the game was able to fulfill.

Oh, and here's the video itself if anyone is interested. There may be spoilers in the recommended videos as a warning.
In future, I highly recommend using Polsy to avoid precisely that problem. :eng101:

While I'm at it, Zell's Intro (Polsy), for anyone who wants to see him in action.

Cool Ghost, glad to see you LPing this! Takes care of whatever urge I had growing to play it again. :unsmith:

ApplesandOranges
Jun 22, 2012

Thankee kindly.

Gnoman posted:

I started with a party of veteran adventurers, II with fleeing survivors of a destroyed nation, IV began with you playing as a knight returning from a mission of slaughter and plunder, while VI opened with control of a brainwashed prisoner attacking an innocent town. X-2 was the story of a veteran who somehow survived a kamikaze mission and had to deal with the complications of surviving, and XII started as the tale of a wanna-be rebel who didn't have a clue.

The closest thing the series ever got to the "cliche" accidental hero was III and possibly V (which I don't remember a thing about). I suppose you could make a case for X as well.

I think you mean X-2 started with a concert.

WHAT CAN I DO FOR YOU

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!

ApplesandOranges posted:

I think you mean X-2 started with a concert.

WHAT CAN I DO FOR YOU

...Dammit.

That song is way catchier than it has any right to be.

MarquiseMindfang
Jan 6, 2013

vriska (vriska)

Rabbi Raccoon posted:

...Dammit.

That song is way catchier than it has any right to be.

I always manage to forget about it for a few months and then something inevitably brings it back into my head for aaaaages before it's gone again.

Bregor
May 31, 2013

People are idiots, Leslie.

Obligatum VII posted:

I like Zell, he may have ADHD and be a huge goof, but he's just so earnest and cheerful (without being obnoxiously so).

Your threshold for "obnoxiously so" is a lot higher than mine.

Simply Simon
Nov 6, 2010

📡scanning🛰️ for good game 🎮design🦔🦔🦔
Zell is one of only two good characters in your party because he's a moron like everybody else on the entire planet but not a total loving rear end in a top hat about it. Also, as we're going to see during the course of the LP, he and the other good character are the only persons who actually get things done competently at all.

Attestant
Oct 23, 2012

Don't judge me.
In retrospect, Zell is a loving amazing character compared to most of the cast. Savor these moments with him.

curiousCat
Sep 23, 2012

Does this look like the face of mercy, kupo?

Attestant posted:

In retrospect, Zell is a loving amazing character compared to most of the cast. Savor these moments with him.

I will get back to this post in about five updates.

Black Balloon
Dec 28, 2008

The literal grumpiest



Zell is good and cool :colbert:

Bregor
May 31, 2013

People are idiots, Leslie.

Rabbi Raccoon posted:

Zell was one of my first crushes. And is probably the only reason I bothered to finish this game.

Obligatum VII posted:

I like Zell, he may have ADHD and be a huge goof, but he's just so earnest and cheerful (without being obnoxiously so).

Simply Simon posted:

Zell is one of only two good characters in your party

Attestant posted:

In retrospect, Zell is a loving amazing character

Black Balloon posted:

Zell is good and cool :colbert:

Counterpoint:


Maybe the reason Leovinus took down his LP isn't because of the stale, homophobic jokes. He was anti-Zell and the masses apparently disagree.

Kheldarn
Feb 17, 2011



Yeah, Zell was one of my favorite characters from the game.

Gnoman
Feb 12, 2014

Come, all you fair and tender maids
Who flourish in your pri-ime
Beware, take care, keep your garden fair
Let Gnoman steal your thy-y-me
Le-et Gnoman steal your thyme




Zell is the only character in this game I flat out hated. I don't like the fisticuffs fighters in FFs generally (Tifa was an exception primarily because I liked her Limit), and Zell's the sort of personality I simply can't stand in real life.

Of course, my tastes in characters rarely line up with common opinion. We'll be meeting my favorite FF character of all time soon.

Foxhound
Sep 5, 2007

Simply Simon posted:

Zell is one of only two good characters in your party because he's a moron like everybody else on the entire planet but not a total loving rear end in a top hat about it. Also, as we're going to see during the course of the LP, he and the other good character are the only persons who actually get things done competently at all.

I'm really struggling to think of the other competent character, but I think I know who you mean. This cast really is full of morons.

curiousCat
Sep 23, 2012

Does this look like the face of mercy, kupo?

Gnoman posted:

Zell is the only character in this game I flat out hated. I don't like the fisticuffs fighters in FFs generally (Tifa was an exception primarily because I liked her Limit), and Zell's the sort of personality I simply can't stand in real life.

Of course, my tastes in characters rarely line up with common opinion. We'll be meeting my favorite FF character of all time soon.

I think we have the same tastes.

Black Balloon
Dec 28, 2008

The literal grumpiest



I didn't like Zell when I was younger because I was pretty much the same brooding dipshit as Squall, so the rest of the cast making GBS threads on Zell was something I was totally down with. As I got older, I came to appreciate people actually being optimistic and happy and Zell is exactly the kind of dude I more prefer to be around.

notoriousman
Nov 18, 2007

I'M AWARE I'M
AN IDIOT
Zell is basically Sabin, personality et al. But one major faltering point of this game is that there are no ghost trains to be suplexed.

Kheldarn
Feb 17, 2011



notoriousman posted:

Zell is basically Sabin, personality et al. But one major faltering point of this game is that there are no ghost trains to be suplexed.

Every game with a pugilist needs to have a ghost train to suplex. :colbert:

Cool Ghost
Apr 13, 2012

MORE YOU SWEAT、
LESS YOU BLEED。
MORE YOU WEEP、
LESS GAME OVERS。
...OVER
Part Eight: The SeeD Exam, Part 2


Here we are, in Dollet for the SeeD field exam.


While we're here, this music is playing. I think it's a pretty solid track, so you should listen to it if that's your thing.


There are people around in Dollet (mainly other SeeD candidates) but if you talk to them, you lose points on your exam, so this is a 100% no talking run.


Up here is a save point, and a good time to talk about the characters' stats.


The first thing you might notice is that they suck. Characters in this game get jack poo poo for natural stats (for example, Squall's natural Strength at level 100 is 47). This is why junctioning is so important, as the game has hinted to us; SeeDs have good training, but they get most of their combat ability from GFs.

That aside, let's actually look at the characters, starting with Squall. Squall is pretty good at everything, and has one of the best stat spreads in the party. Squall is mainly unremarkable, though he does top the charts for Vitality (this game's name for physical defence) and he's pretty fast. The most interesting thing about Squall's stats is his accuracy/Hit: it is always 255%, so Squall can never miss a physical attack, even if he gets Blinded. This is extremely useful and is actually part of one of the simplest game-breaking strategies you can use. I'll cover that when I get to it.

:eng101: As an aside, some people might tell you that having Squall Blinded disables the gunblade's trigger, but in my experience, it seems to only disable the explosion animation that happens when you pull the trigger they're right.


Seifer is a stronger, faster Squall with a little less Vitality and a little more Spirit (magic defence). Like Squall, he uses a gunblade in battle, and like Squall, he has a 255% hit rate. Because of the way he swings his gunblade, it's a little harder to hit the trigger with Seifer, but it's not a huge difference.


Zell has higher Strength than Squall, but is worse at everything else. In fact, past level 40, he's not even stronger than Squall. He can also miss in fights, which makes him worse than Squall or Seifer. Zell is also the first party member we've had who hasn't been a highly-talented child prodigy, so it makes sense that he's a bit worse. Not that any of it matters when you get your junctions in a line, but hey, it's interesting to look at.


Oh, and I make sure to do junctions here. Zell gets Queso, Squall gets Mufasa, and Seifer gets IcyNips.


I also move Quistis's Water spells over to Seifer so he has something to junction (I had a lot of fish fins, so Squall and Quistis both had 100 Waters. I never made any for Zell, but it doesn't matter at this point).

Oh, and if you're wondering where Quistis is on stats, she's basically on par with Zell. A little slower and weaker, but with higher Spirit. I think if you add the stat values up, Quistis has 3 points more than Zell at level 100.


Running through this archway, we get our first battle in Dollet when two Galbadian soldiers run out to meet us.


Hi.

Fun fact: these basic G-Soldiers beat out Squall in Strength and Magic at any level. As I alluded to earlier, SeeDs without GFs are just regular people, and these guys are probably more experienced and fully grown than teenagers. I think this is really neat gameplay/story integration, and it's a shame that nobody but the biggest Final Fantasy VIII nerds are going to see it.


Also, I'm sorry about the black boxes behind the ATB gauges. It's an emulator error, and I can't figure out how to fix it. They don't even appear everywhere - they weren't in the Fire Cavern, for example.


G-Soldiers are useful for drawing Cure if you need some, I guess.


Other than that, they cast Fire spells. This is the same type of para-magic that SeeD uses. We need to use the GF to use magic, but I think that anybody can use para-magic if they're just properly trained in it; the GF is a shortcut and boosts the efficacy of the stuff, but isn't a necessary component.


G-Soldiers are really just cannon fodder.


They drop Potions, which is a fact.


Oh, GF levels. I don't know if I've gone over this, but GFs can level up just like characters. It increases their HP and the amount of damage they do in battle. Some GF abilities are locked behind level gates. Like your party members, GFs level up at fixed intervals - every 500 EXP. It's not really something you should worry too much about - if you have to grind levels for your GFs, you're relying on them too much.


Dollet seems like a very European kind of town to me. I kind of like it, but I feel like they could have done more to make it feel like it was being occupied/was a warzone. There's nothing going on on the streets that would ever make you think there's any fighting going on.


Seifer doesn't follow your party during this sequence, by the way. He'll run to some point on the screen, then stop and wait for Squall and Zell to catch up. It's neat because he's still the squad leader, even though Squall is the player character.



As we run under this bridge, two more G-Soldiers jump down to give us something to do.


You're always struck first in this fight (or maybe I just have the weirdest luck).


Cannon Fodder #2: They still look like kids!

A little commentary on how hosed up it is that SeeDs can be as young as 15, perhaps?

Cannon Fodder #1: Elite forces from Garden?

Nevermind, he's probably just never seen SeeDs before and is surprised that they're not adults.



At this point, I decided to have Squall and Zell off themselves.



This is because of force of habit. It's very useful to have those two KO'd for a while here, and Seifer can handle G-Soldiers by himself no sweat.


It also makes it easier to use Seifer's limit break. See, instead of being used when a gauge is filled after taking damage, like in FFVII, IX, and IX, or when the character's HP is low, like in FFVI, the ability to use limit breaks in Final Fantasy VIII is determined by something called "crisis level". Crisis Level is determined by how much HP the character has left, how many party members are down, if the character has any negative statuses on them, and a random element. For Seifer, the "remaining HP" modifier is smaller than other characters, so he can use his limit break far more often than other characters, especially when the other two party members are KO'd.


:eng101: Seifer's limit break involves casing a fire spell on enemies, which implies that what he did to Squall in the intro was a limit break. Squall's response was also a limit break.



No Mercy is a doofy-looking move where Seifer spins his gunblade around and then sends pinwheels of gunblade energy at all enemies.


It makes short work of G-Soldiers, but I wish the devs had given Seifer a less silly limit break.


Phoenix Downs are pretty common in this game, being available at any store. I like games that don't restrict revival items really heavily.


On the next screen, Seifer is waiting for us.

: The Central Square is up ahead.

Dollet is not very big, so we're almost to our objective already. This exam is piss easy.



: Come out'n show your faces! Don't leave me hangin' now!


Zell is right. Seifer is the kind of glory hound that gets people killed.


Oh well, orders is orders.


Hey, looks like you found the Galbadians. Good work, man.


This fight goes exactly as you expect.


Yeah, somehow I don't think that five guys was the entire occupying force. Call me crazy.


Seifer is doing a heroic pose here that I like.


We're technically supposed to be looking for Galbadians, but talking to a dog is more fun.


The dog likes Seifer better though. :(


I spy with my little eye a Galbadian who I'm about to beat up.


Cool jump, guy.


Too bad about your guts.


I was right about the occupying force. It was six guys.


Like I said, this exam's gonna be piss easy. All we have to do is stand around until someone tells us to go home.

: Standby... How boring...

I have a feeling that Seifer was put on a job like this on purpose.


At this point we're just waiting.


Eventually, Seifer will go to the fountain, but he can't get there if Squall is in the way.


He doesn't give a poo poo if Zell is there, though.

...Holy poo poo, Zell is a ghost. :tinfoil:


You can hear explosions in the distance.


I included this one because I think it's funny how Seifer has both his own and Zell's hands on his hips.



During this whole bit, the dog follows Seifer around and whines at him.


Now the dog slinks off, scared of the yelling sword man.

: What are you waiting for!? Come show me what you got!


Well, he tried, at least.


Wow, the moon is huge tonight.


At this point, we just have to wait.


I could talk to Zell, but I actually remembered to wait this time.


This came up before I remembered that Zell has a line here.


I have a feeling like Seifer is about to do something stupid.


Suddenly, the dog runs over and starts howling at something.


A Galbadian scout comes by, but his efforts are foiled by the extreme hiding abilities of SeeD.


Then he runs off towards the mountains.


Some other G-Soldiers follow him. Seifer, who was spoiling for a fight a minute ago, and who is supposed to be keeping the area clear of Galbadians, does nothing.


Thank you, Detective Leonhart.


The store, Zell. They forgot to get milk.


You can just see what he's talking about on the peak on the left. It's some kind of tower.


I like Seifer's "pointing with gunblade" pose.

: But that's against orders!
: Weren't you just saying how bored you were?

No, because I forgot to talk to him.

: Squall!


Squall sort of walks away from Seifer and Zell here. He knows that Zell is right, but he also knows that his job here is to follow Seifer's orders. He doesn't like it, and he wants to get away from having to make a call.

: ...Captain's decision?


Seifer puts his hand on Squall's shoulder here, but Squall pushes it away.


Unlike earlier, Squall stands and looks Seifer right in the eye here.

: Thanks to you, I feel like I can take on anyone. Even if they do fight dirty, like you.
: You'll thank me when the time comes.



: I thought you guys didn't get along? You're like, all buddy-buddy now. Listen. This ain't no ordinary battle. It's an exam, an important one. I'm tellin' ya, we have to stick to orders.

Zell is absolutely correct here. He's not an idiot.



Unfortunately, Zell also has a button that Seifer knows exactly how to press.



: Seifer, if we're gonna go, let's hurry.

Squall is smart enough to know that Seifer is going to go no matter what he and Zell say. At least if they go with him, he's less likely to be killed.

: The enemy is headed for the facility. We, Squad B, are to secure the summit. Move out!
: Alright.
: Tch... Fine.


And off we go to do something stupid.


It didn't come through in this shot, but on the emulator, this bridge absolutely freaks the gently caress out.


There's a wounded Dollet soldier here, but we still aren't allowed to talk to anybody.


Once we reach Seifer, another wounded Dollet soldier crawls out from behind some rocks.

Dollet Soldier: Ahhh! W-W-Who are you!?
: Don't worry. We're SeeD candidates. We've been dispatched by Garden.
: So what's going on up there?
Dollet Soldier: The Galbadian Soldiers have entered the Communication Tower. On top of that...that place has always been a nesting ground for monsters. If you guys are goin' up, be caref...


Uh-oh.


Squall tries to grab him, but ends up with a fistful of fight instead.


Big snake.


We're just going to hop over to an alternate timeline where Squall and Zell aren't unconscious so Seifer can explain something.

: Listen up! The finishing blow determines the EXP. Save it for me!

In this game, whatever character lands the last hit of the battle (even if they're a GF) gets an EXP boost. It's not generally that big a deal, but if you're trying to do a low-level game, you have to pay attention to it so people don't end up gaining a level you don't want.


Anacondaur (the snake) is a lot tougher than the G-Soldiers, but I put those Tornado spells I've been carrying around on Seifer's Strength.


It's not that tough. This is also a pretty good example of how you can break the game with Junctions - that's a lot of damage.



: That sucks.
: More fun for us. Come on....


Seifer seems like the kind of hero a lot of RPG players would want.


On this screen, I stopped to just fight enemies for half an hour. Not for grinding reasons, mind, but because one of the things you're marked on during the exam is how many enemies you defeat. To get top marks, you have to kill 75. There are about 10 fixed enemies during the whole exam, so 75 is a huge number - it's more enemies than I've fought all game up to this point. So, in the interests of my grade, I did nothing but run in circles fighting enemies.


Highlights include the guy in red at the back, an Elite Soldier. He's a G-Soldier+1. They can use Cure on themselves and they hit a little harder, but they're still not a real threat.


There's also this guy, Geezard. Geezard is one of the weakest monsters in the game.


Its only remarkable feature is that it drops Screws, which are used in getting new weapons.


After I kill a bunch of lovely enemies, I follow Seifer.


Let's all have fun by lying on the ground.

Galbadian Soldier A: The generator is up and running!
Galbadian Soldier #2: No problem with the boosters!
: ...the hell they doing?
Charlie the Galbadian Soldier: Cable disconnection confirmed! Beginning exchange process!
Galbadian Soldier A: Roger.


After that little exchange, the Galbadians all head back inside.



: This must be your first real battle. You scared?
: ...I don't know. I try not to think about it.

This is Squall's stress response. He just tries to avoid thinking. It's, uh, not a great one.



: The way I look at it, as long as you make it out of a battle alive, you're one step closing to fulfilling your dream.
: What!? Your dream?
: You have one too, don't you?

This is another one of those exchanges that shows Seifer respects Squall - if he didn't, he wouldn't bother asking if Squall is afraid or about his dream. In fact, even just asserting that Squall has a dream shows that, because that would make him like Seifer, and Seifer fuckin' loves Seifer.


Squall looks away from Seifer again - he's hiding something.


I have a feeling like he's not gonna go for that, Zell.

: Mind your own business.

I should be a fortuneteller.


Zell is punching the air next to Seifer here.


Seifer just drops this line and runs off toward the comm tower.


Like a drat piano.


Oh poo poo, we're gonna get it now.


So, instead of following the path, this girl climbed the cliff to find us.



She's not so good at finishing that action, though, and completely biffs it.


She ain't bothered.


Last I checked.

Bad at Standing: Wait a minute... You're the guy who showed me around, right!? Thanks! I don't get so lost anymore.

See? Having manners pays off.

Bad at Standing: Oh yeah, I haven't told you my name yet. I'm...a messenger. Name's Selphie, from Squad A.
Selphie: The squad captain's Seifer, right? Where is he?



Well, see ya, Seifer.

Selphie: (sigh) This sure is tough...


up!

Seeing the cliff, Selphie is compelled to use it as a shortcut. It is her raison d'être.


We'll be taking the long way for now.


Oh, and at this point, Squall and Zell are back on their feet. Seifer is gone, and he ain't comin' back. This is another reason why it's good to keep Squall and Zell unconscious for the exam; if Seifer gains all the levels, it doesn't influence the party's level once he leaves. If you're really dedicated, you can grind Seifer to stupidly high levels to get some good drops from Anacondaur, or level your GFs to 100 without real consequences.


FFVIII Fact: you're forced to walk on this screen.


The moon is kind of nice, even if it is going to crash into the Earth soon.


:eng101: You can jump off the cliff like Selphie did, but it's points off.

: ...Much quicker? Pu-lease... You wouldn't normally jump off a cliff, OK!?


The funnier answer here is the second one, but it also involves some extremely bad manners.

: ...Yeah, I guess so. You wouldn't normally jump that.
Selphie: Hmm...I don't know... Well, anyway.


Selphie: Has everyone equipped a GF? You haven't forgotten... Have you...?

The game is pretty good about reminding you to set your junctions in these early areas. And I'm not sure, but I think that second bit might be a joke.


At this point, Selphie joins our party so we're back at full strength. :toot: She also has all of Seifer's magic, so the Tornado spells he was using go back to Squall.


I make sure to give her a GF.


Well, it's not the Burger King.

: Sure is big...



Looks like Seifer found the Galbadians.



: HEEEY!


Seifer doesn't like it when girls try to talk to him.



Gee, I wonder.



Next time: did Seifer go up?

Cool Ghost fucked around with this message at 06:53 on Mar 23, 2015

curiousCat
Sep 23, 2012

Does this look like the face of mercy, kupo?
Selphie :allears:

Fister Roboto
Feb 21, 2008

With a moon that big and close, the planet they're on must have some insane tides. I'm talking like mile high waves.

e: unless the planet and the moon are mutually tidally locked, which is entirely possible with such a large moon.

Fister Roboto fucked around with this message at 09:29 on Dec 9, 2014

CmdrKing
Oct 14, 2012

Maybe if I called it 'Interpretive Stabbing'...
Selphie has learned only one thing in life, but learned it well: the shortest distance between two points is a straight line. Ergo, she has determined to be tough enough to plow through all obstacles to travel that straight line.

On the whole the party would probably accomplish all their goals more easily and faster if their first response to any problem was "do whatever Selphie says".

Gnoman
Feb 12, 2014

Come, all you fair and tender maids
Who flourish in your pri-ime
Beware, take care, keep your garden fair
Let Gnoman steal your thy-y-me
Le-et Gnoman steal your thyme




Ah, Selphie. Best character in the series.

Vil
Sep 10, 2011

On the subject of accuracy and evasion from early in the last post, it's worth noting that almost every enemy in the game has absolute garbage for evasion. On top of that, limits just ignore the accuracy/evasion calculation and always hit, as do a number of other things.

Accuracy matters if you're not Squall and you're blinded (in which case it's a quarter of what it would be otherwise), or when fighting one very specific random enemy type popular for AP farming later in the game. The rest of the time, you will basically never ever notice it. (Every now and then Zell might whiff a hit, but it's a once in a blue moon sorta thing.)

And the best part is that neither of those two situations is really remedied by paying much attention to your Hit stat. (Well, it's a valid solution to the second one, but there are smarter options like a single bullet of Shotgun Ammo.) It really is colossally useless and if you're playing along at home, you should never junction any remotely important spell there.

NikkolasKing
Apr 3, 2010



Cool Ghost posted:

: More fun for us. Come on....


Seifer seems like the kind of hero a lot of RPG players would want.

drat right he is.


Also this post has been answered now:

Kajeesus posted:

I don't know if this is mentioned anywhere, but do Squall and Seifer actually harbor any hostile feelings towards each other? Everyone assumes Squall is mad about Seifer cheating during their sparring match, and Seifer does occasionally put Squall down, but they obviously decided to spar together, and notice that Squall complained about Zell, and both Zell and Quistis were unhappy with Seifer, but Squall never said (or thought!) he had any issues being on Seifer's team.

Seifer and Squall have a complicated relationship built around mutual respect it seems. They are complete opposites in most ways but they're true rivals in that they don't really seem to dislike one another at all. So they clash the way two dissimilar people would but there's no enmity there.

Honestly, I would say Seifer and Squall's dichotomy is one of the few well-done aspects when it comes to the game's writing.

ApplesandOranges
Jun 22, 2012

Thankee kindly.
Here's the second option to Zell's remark about not jumping off the cliff:

Squall: "...I don't know about that. Perhaps anyone but the Chicken-wuss can make it."

Zell: "WHAT DID YOU SAYYYYY!!!?"

Selphie: "...Hm? Since you're so angry, I guess you're the Chicken-wuss."

Zell: "What the...!!! WHY IS EVERYONE...? I am not a CHICKEN!!!"

Selphie: "Well... If you don't like CHICKEN, how 'bout...a PIG! Oh, but you look more like a CHICKEN, anyway."

Zell: "Chicken, pig, whatever... Call me what you want!!! I don't care anymore!!!"

Squall: "Don't take it so personally, Zell."

Zell: "Tch..."

The funny thing is that Squall isn't even the best in terms of base stats: a future party member easily beats his Str by near 20 points. A few temporary party members also usually have impressive stats compared to the permanent ones.

Well, impressive as far as baseline stats go.

Fister Roboto
Feb 21, 2008

ApplesandOranges posted:

The funny thing is that Squall isn't even the best in terms of base stats: a future party member easily beats his Str by near 20 points. A few temporary party members also usually have impressive stats compared to the permanent ones.

Well, impressive as far as baseline stats go.

Yeah he doesn't need good stats when all his attacks never miss and do 1.5x normal damage if you don't suck at timing.

anilEhilated
Feb 17, 2014

But I say fuck the rain.

Grimey Drawer

Foxhound posted:

I'm really struggling to think of the other competent character, but I think I know who you mean. This cast really is full of morons.

If he's thinking along the same lines I am, it's Irvine, aka the other character the game calls out on being an idiot as opposed to pretending it's heroic or whatever. He and Zell are my favorite characters out of this cast too.

Valiantman
Jun 25, 2011

Ways to circumvent the Compact #6: Find a dreaming god and affect his dreams so that they become reality. Hey, it's not like it's you who's affecting the world. Blame the other guy for irresponsibly falling asleep.
That's some impressive amount of arbitrary reasons for reducing points. Asking a wounded person how he's doing? NO Jumping down a small cliff? NO Chatting with your squad members? NONONO

Iretep
Nov 10, 2009

Valiantman posted:

That's some impressive amount of arbitrary reasons for reducing points. Asking a wounded person how he's doing? NO Jumping down a small cliff? NO Chatting with your squad members? NONONO

They aren't medics so theres no real point talking to the wounded. While multitasking is nice and all isn't really effective when you have a mission to do still. Though the cliff and no talking to squad members is pretty bullshit.

Cool Ghost
Apr 13, 2012

MORE YOU SWEAT、
LESS YOU BLEED。
MORE YOU WEEP、
LESS GAME OVERS。
...OVER
Not only does jumping the cliff give you points off, it's one of the worst things you can do, giving you 5 deductions (talking to people gives you 1).

Psion
Dec 13, 2002

eVeN I KnOw wHaT CoRnEr gAs iS
SeeD has designed a test specifically to hate on Selphie. That's cold.

NikkolasKing
Apr 3, 2010



Simply Simon posted:

Zell is one of only two good characters in your party because he's a moron like everybody else on the entire planet but not a total loving rear end in a top hat about it. Also, as we're going to see during the course of the LP, he and the other good character are the only persons who actually get things done competently at all.

Squall not being an rear end in a top hat is a new interpretation.

Also I'd say Seifer is about as competent as one can expect. Admittedly he has very little in the way of competition in this game.

inverts
Jul 6, 2014
I started reading this LP today and I'm so glad. It's been 10 years since I played this game, so I remember nothing about it except that I love Zell and Selphie. And I definitely never knew all the things being discussed here about levels. This has been really great to read so far, both the LP and everyone's commentary. I've got FF8 on Steam now so I might play along with the LP.

CmdrKing
Oct 14, 2012

Maybe if I called it 'Interpretive Stabbing'...

Valiantman posted:

That's some impressive amount of arbitrary reasons for reducing points. Asking a wounded person how he's doing? NO Jumping down a small cliff? NO Chatting with your squad members? NONONO

That's basically the point I think. They want to create this deliberate contrast between what SeeD actually is (magically enhanced teenage mercenaries) and how Balamb Garden is actually organized (anime high school). They'll practically alternate between one and the other- Cid gives a team coach pep talk, Quistis gives a serious mission briefing. Seifer gives Zell the lamest insulting name he can think of, actually talking to Seifer or Zell costs you points. There's definitely a conscious effort to hit the player with some dissonance over the whole thing, although in the end, as the plot takes shape, I really don't think they succeed at all.

rickiep00h
Aug 16, 2010

BATDANCE


CmdrKing posted:

Seifer gives Zell the lamest insulting name he can think of

I always thought that "Chicken-wuss" was a bad localization or intentional censoring of "Chickenshit" as it still implies frightened and weak and "Chickenshit" is a little more Seifer's character than something that sounds absolutely ridiculous.

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CmdrKing
Oct 14, 2012

Maybe if I called it 'Interpretive Stabbing'...
I agree a little profanity would feel more in character to Seifer, but he's still fundamentally just calling him a chicken. Zell's enough of a doofus to let that get to him but not exactly A material from Seifer here.

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