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Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
I put a few hours into Hard last night. Hard is hard. This isn't my first space rodeo and I'm barely able to make ends meet. It doesn't seem like you can even make some of the part tests cost-effective without chaining multiple contracts together and even then it's mostly a wash. Even turning on quicksave and revert, it's just too grindy for me. I'll probably reset it to medium.


The fact you need to / can upgrade is super non-obvious. I finally figured out you had to right-click on the buildings, but I feel like the game really needs to focus some overlay UI for places like the space center overview. Even just a side window that lists all the buildings and an upgrade button beside it would make it obvious you need to / can click on that tiny building to open a window, and the tiny building next to it is another piece of the center. I feel like I'm back in King's quest trying to pixel hunt a key.

Obviously, I'm also of the "show DV" opinion, even if it's just during construction. With the tonnage limit of the initial launchpad, I really need to know what the minimum amount of gear is I need to make it into orbit and back.

The final thing I noticed in my few hours is how difficult it is to right click on the command pod to take a crew report while trying to keep the rocket from spinning out of control because you took along Jeb (no SAS). This is pretty silly, there really should be a button with a dropdown of available commands on the various pieces of the rocket in the corner where the contracts and other info is.

Bhodi fucked around with this message at 21:42 on Dec 16, 2014

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Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
OK yeah I just clicked "OK" past the wall of text that took up half the screen, thinking "I've played this before.". My mistake! Maybe a ? is needed to bring up the stuff again?

(I still think there should be a short list of the avail buildings as a UI piece on that screen)

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
Giving a mission to rescue a kerbal in orbit before having the ability to actually TARGET him for intercept is just mean.

There really needs to be some gates on these missions. Two stars my rear end. I don't even know if it's possible to rendezvous without targeting. I know it's not possible for ME.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
They could come in as kerbal contractors; they don't work for the KSP itself, but are contracted as support for potentially.. energetic launches.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
Isn't one benefit of steamworks integration the ability to scrape your friends list for names?

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
So this game hit the big 1.0! I loaded it up again and there are still TONS of things that need the edges polished off. I am disappoint.

I'm laughing that there's STILL no way to see DV and terminal velocity which are two very critical things if you want to hit orbit. There's basically NO information on what TWR and duration your first stage should be to get it out of the soup. Mechjeb continues to be mandatory.

You can get out of the cockpit of a plane but can't get back in until you're halfway up the science tree and unlock ladders. There's no distance or graphic indicator for landing spots for science, making 'landing and taking measurements' stuff a real challenge.

There are still weird bugs like hitting save on a rocket, asking if you want to overwrite, saying yes, and having the mouse click on whatever's underneath the dialog box, breaking apart your rocket. There's still that weird 3+1 icon listing on the stages for engines.

the "engineer" suggestions are all broken, telling me my command pod is on backwards, it's not really very useful at all. You'd think this would be a good place to say "Hey, you might want to use more engines! This thing won't even get off the pad!"

When you're messing with maneuver nodes to intersect another ship, you keep having to mouse over and checking the minimum distance, then adjusting the node, then mousing back... This isn't knew, I remember watching illectro have to do it basically this time last year

All this usability stuff has been noted before and I'm surprised we're at 1.0 without it being addressed.

Bhodi fucked around with this message at 21:27 on May 2, 2015

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
Yeah, uh, where are sub-assemblies?

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
is there a button in kerbal engineer or mechjeb that shows max electricity generation versus consumption with ion/drill/converter, and how many seconds of battery I have to run it? If not, what's the best mod for it?

I'm tired of trying to do maths to figure out the appropriate amount of battery and solar I need to launch, seems crazy a running total isn't shown somewhere. I almost want to just add it to mechjeb and submit a patch

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
Hey nice, perfect, thanks!

Also, whoever made ckan deserves all the money and to be hired by squad.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug

Sanctum posted:

No more expensive rescue fuel missions to Jool for me. Got my moon-miner there so all future Jool disasters will never have to worry about fuel for the return trip. :toot:



What's inside the central stack of that thing? I've been needing to make a miner but can't seem to get the proportions right.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
and what, a poodle? Where's all the power? Are there fuel cells jammed in there somewhere? four radioisotope won't do the job...

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
So I installed the alcubierre drive mod and when I activate it the warp bubble just collapses instantly, both on the ground and in space. Am I missing something important? It appears to be fully charged on launch. I am on a sub-orbital trajectory, I just wanted to try it out. It's just a lander can with 10k battery and a bunch of xenon canisters. Version 0.2.1 standalone installed through ckan.

Bhodi fucked around with this message at 21:44 on Jun 7, 2015

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug

Otacon posted:

There's minimum "safe" distances your orbit must be from certain bodies. It varies by planet and depending on which size Alcubierre drive you use.
Someone midway in the thread said it's 900k for kerbin.

This makes me really sad. Roverdude, you have to tell us stuff like this in the info, it doesn't say this anywhere in the thread, readme, or in-game. :smith:

If I submit a pull request, would you accept it?

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
Those cable ladders and metal electrical conduit are a standard size so it makes it pretty easy to get perspective. Those yellow cables are twisted pair ethernet of one sort or another. Could be anywhere from cat-5 to 6, no way to know. The orange tube is almost certainly fibre conduit and yeah the silver cardboard is normal bulk shielding. Nothing off except maybe strain on some of those cables and of course the horror show below the cable ladder.

Bhodi fucked around with this message at 14:58 on Sep 27, 2015

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
getting back into this after being away for years, still saddened at the continued complete opaqueness of some of the mechanisms. But mechjeb as always fixes most issues so now I have two questions:

Is there any way or mod to show the minimum m/s of a craft in low atmos with a deployed chute on it? The diameter of a deployed chute is completely worthless. I need to know that i'll be lithobraking on the way down and need to add more chutes.

Same but for re-entry? They added deadly re-entry by default or something so now I need to know if I can slow down without exploding or if I need to attach a heat shield? I came back from a mun flyby and it took 3 breaking passes @ 40km before I was able to slow down enough to not explode. That was an eye-openeer.

Also, weirdly, sub-orbital flight seems almost completely deadly now; shallow angles seem completely mandatory.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
Stage recovery was a perfect solution to my parachute woes, thanks.

Kind of a disappointed that there's no easy place to put the larger heat shields; because the rockomax decoupler is so heavy, it's hardly even worth it mass-wise to make a separate stage and stick the heat shield in front of your fuel tanks and engine. I guess I could just direct connect and expect the engine and fuel tank to blow apart on the way down, maybe I'll try that.

I notice the mass of parts is still all out of wack, which is kind of disappointing. 4 ton command pod? 2 person lander can that's four times as heavy as the 1 person? LOL. I'll be using Lander cans / hitchhiker storage / crew cabins until the end of time, I guess! Though at some point, I think the nuclear engine got lighter? That's a nice change.

Still no 'persistent thrust' mods except for one I found that does ion engines; I remember that being the one most annoying thing when I used to play, anything large & interplanetary was like, start your burn, bump to 4x and go do something else for 20 minutes

Bhodi fucked around with this message at 15:18 on Apr 15, 2017

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug

zedprime posted:

You can throw a command pod from the mun to a relatively deep kerbin approach and basically walk away and make dinner and if you don't hit a mountain and set up the parachute pressure right it will just land itself.
It's much harder to design a rocket that can shove a bunch of extra tons into orbit and beyond than throw a few more chutes on what's coming back. The heat tolerances are the same between the 2 and 1 person can; there's just zero reason to ever use the 2 man one. That command pod mk 2 is also bad just no reason to use it IMO versus the other options, that extra heat tolerance alone isn't going to save you from a interplanetary journey w/o a heat shield and from the mun it honestly isn't needed.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
Is there any rule of thumb for calculating dv required to slow down when doing a higher angle transfer to save time? I guessed it was going to be the same as the extra dv I spent to get there versus lowest dv but it turns out I'm wayyyyy off and all my probes I sent on higher-than-optimal intercepts are going to zoom by hopelessly fast. I'm coming in on eve's SOI at ~10km/sec which is just impossible to deal with.

I have like 5 probes and a duna station in transit, all destined to be lost because orbital mechanics are hard and I was impatient.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug

shovelbum posted:

Well at least those two bodies have atmospheres!
And me with no heat shields! I dipped my toe 5k into the eve atmosphere and promptly exploded.

I wonder if aerobraking is simulated correctly when you can easily disintegrate with 0.25m/sec drag. It seems to me like temperature should be a factor of how much it's slowing you down but that doesn't seem to be the case.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug

zedprime posted:

I think you are looking for transfer porkchop plots. By way of example of the prepoulated Duna case at https://alexmoon.github.io/ksp/


The algorithm says most efficient transfer is 236 days in the future, and it takes 1692 m/s to do it in 258 days. You say no that's silly, its still pretty efficient to only take 150 something days. The website lets you click in the heatmap where you'd rather be and you can see a different flight plan, like if you go 279 days in the future, you can spend 2451 m/s to do it in 153 days.

If you're winging it, well, maybe Mechjeb's maneuver plotter can give you a heads up?
That's exactly what I did but once you intersect you're screwed. I'm using the mechjeb maneuver planner but that dv cost is only for intersect and not what it costs to slow enough to orbit. With a faster transfer you intersect at a much sharper angle and it takes way, way more dv to actually achieve a capture velocity and the amount of fuel (optimal capture dv plus the difference between optimal exit dv and chosen exit dv) I take isn't enough. Not even close, since I was closing on eve at 10k.

It was a really nasty wakeup call and those transfer numbers are useless unless they also note the estimated amount I need to slow down as well. It was so demoralizing that I pretty much stopped playing KSP tbh because I had like 10 different things en-route before I discovered the wonderful news.

Bhodi fucked around with this message at 00:29 on May 22, 2017

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
Mechjob is still mandatory for me for Time Until Impact, Auto-rear end (pro/ret/norm/radian to target or orbit, plus the really critical UP button), and advanced maneuver planner plots. Plus a nice info-window though I could get that with engineer. Ascent and entry is wonky as hell in anything that has an atmosphere, autodocking is beyond wasteful I don't even bother anymore.

I do use 'fine tune intercept' a lot though, my default lazy intercept is to launch slightly behind, burn into an eliptical orbit with the periapsis at the orbit and apo about 30km higher and then fast forward an orbit or two until I have a near intercept, mash the button, mash execute.

I also generally lazy dock by swapping between ships and having them face towards each other's target docking port with auto-rear end.

uXs posted:

Man I loving hate it when docking just. won't. work. Spent like an hour stroking one docking port with another. They do attract each other but then just as quickly bump and repel. JUST CONNECT YOU FUCKERS, GODDAMMIT.

And no, I'm not doing anything wrong. They're lined up perfectly in all directions and also rotated correctly.

edit: it's probably a bug. I think I had it before and reloading fixed it. I'll try it later.
You used to be able to nest docking port Senior / Standard / Junior to make a universal one but I launched a station and found I couldn't dock in the standard or senior ports. I thought you make the lips even but maybe I messed it up or it doesn't work anymore. You can tell its not working because they don't really grab for each other hard like they're supposed to.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
I am kind of surprised there is no "retcon" type mod where you stick a box on the side to be able to pull out stuff like that, only instead of having to pack it on the ground you can instead get 1-5 pulls of any item because you "thought ahead". Or maybe frame it as various cables and electronics you can cobble together. Call it the junk drawer. I get frustrated as hell when I spend 15 mins orbiting and docking a craft only to realize I left X at home.

I have reverted so many craft.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
Is there any mod that does a tonage sanity pass over all the stock parts? Things like the mk2 pod and rockomax 6way connector are absurdly heavy. Impact resistance is mostly a non-issue so a lander can + hitchhiker is simply going to be better than anything else 99% of the time and that kinda sucks.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
The best mod for me was that one that increases the physics fast-forward rate. Finally, I can do ion engines and 0.1TWR nerva burns in a normal amount of time.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
Yeah, last time I ran with a dozen mods and I wasn't really able to have more than 15 or so colonists and a handful of pets without it slowing down to unplayability. I keep hoping for improvements on that front.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
this.. is amazing.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug

FBS posted:

What the gently caress is wrong with my airplanes?

I'm playing Career for the first time ever, and every plane I build at the first aero tier yaws back and forth across the runway til it blows up without ever getting airborne. What am I doing wrong?
also possibilities:

you're placing a single front wheel with mirror and it's silently placing two wheels on top of each other
the rear wheels are not vertical as they should be, or are too close together

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
So the frame rate is better, but like... no tweaks to part weight or the ridiculously narrow margin of flight testing parts?

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
Found a uh... bug? that gave me 4000 science and like 12 million on the recovery of my second launch. Not sure why.

I confirm I got the DLC for free though!

e: sorting by cross-section size is broken, all the 1.5 parts are also listed 1.0.

Hooo boy. another bug. On the first mission, I realized I didn't put a chute on, so I selected "Revert to Spawn" or whatever, then "recover vessel". It took me to the KSP campus overview, but everything was listed as locked. So I hit escape, and revert again, and I just get the loading screen forever. Had to F4.

Bhodi fucked around with this message at 22:31 on Mar 13, 2018

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
Seriously who cares about click-through EULAs these days. I'm really fumed up about the bugs though. I shouldn't run into two obvious bugs, one of which is a show-stopper, within my first 15 minutes of playing.

e: this was post patch, too

Bhodi fucked around with this message at 18:55 on Mar 14, 2018

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
hey look, ANOTHER BUG. IN THE FIRST MISSION I TRIED. I'm landed but the mission trigger... didn't.



Maybe I'm too far? You'd think they would put a mission trigger in for that. A previous one I splashed down farther away and it triggered so I'm all ???

Bhodi fucked around with this message at 16:47 on Mar 18, 2018

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
Pitching the top of your ssto spaceplane around to hit the docking port because you put it behind the cockpit instead of center of mass

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
On the cool channel posted upthread, I was watching a video and on the 2.9 ton rocket to gilly and back they said "Using Keplers 3rd law, Hilbella can predict exactly how low periapsis needs to be to get another encounter with Eve 4 orbits later"

you can WHAT now? Is there a video of cool orbital mechanics tricks like that, because my navigating experience consists of tidbits like "when thrusting any orbit you want to get to must intersect your current orbit at your position" and "movement is cheaper when your AP is higher" and "let mechjeb figure out how and when to get to another planet".

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug

TheresaJayne posted:

I am completely useless can't even get a ship into orbit with enough deltav to go anywhere except back down to kerbin

Vanilla - no mods at all
It's because the game doesn't give you enough informational feedback. Install kerbal engineer or mechjeb or any mod that will tell you DV while you build your rocket. Then get a DV chart from GIS and go nuts.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
Did anyone try that the kerbal martian remake mission? I got like, a little of the way through but it seems completely obtuse as to what you're supposed to do. I haven't seen the movie so maybe that'd help?

I really like the idea of long, multi-stage missions but they seem so damned brittle; you have to do things in the exact correct order.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
I do kinda wish there was an empire progression mod that had gated convenience stuff. Like, after you build your first space station is unlocks the ability to auto refuel in kerbin orbit. When you mine ore and colonize mun and minmus that unlocks the ability to refuel within kerbin soi. Bringing back samples from duna unlocks space launch platforms. I want to build motherships and multistage leviathans but i hate the pointless tedium of launching empty tanks and endless module docking. Yeah i could just cheat myself all that but that's not the same. I just want a middle ground that makes a jool soi exploration mission feasible without a multi hour launch and prep process.

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
I tried a few of those auto replay mods but i never could get them in a usable state. With one you had to record and do the mission flawlessly including docking and back to earth and it had to be on one docking collar on one station but there was some restrictions like your could never move the station or save/load during the capture and i never found it all that useful for large mission planning because most of the launches are oneoffs that get assembled, not docking at some shared refueling station. You also had to transfer fuel manually, it didn't work with crew, etc.

I just want abstraction at some later level when I'm planning complex missions and have "mastered" basic small/medium craft launch to orbit.

Afiak mechjeb auto launch into space has been broken for the longest time, since the last atmo update way back. Even then, it doesn't work for marginal rockets and walking away and coming back isn't great either...

Bhodi fucked around with this message at 15:48 on Oct 19, 2018

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
I think i keep missing GC, every time i come back it's post patch and it hasn't been updated. Should give that a try

Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
the learning curve starts going ??? when you start to get a little more advanced. Things I'd watch a video on:

How to achieve an efficient, direct orbital rendezvous without doing the burn-to-target, cancel-velocity shuffle 4x
when to launch to intercept an orbiting target
when to burn to a higher orbit to intercept an orbiting target (something to do with phase angles?)
what's the best time to do plane changes during intercept (burning out to minmus, changing plane at the descending node doesn't seem as efficient as doing it before)
calculating/planning gravity assist or grand tour courses
how much ablative material, parachute do you need to bring per m/s for different planets
more fins? a guide to top-heavy rockets
what each engine is best used for
ship construction techniques for ships with multiple docking ports and twinned stacks, fitting stuff inside fairings, "mothership" type exploration vessels

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Bhodi
Dec 9, 2007

Oh, it's just a cat.
Pillbug
If I had to come up with a napkin math system, I'd have the 'system time' delay described in multiplayer, with the option that everyone synced to current time can toggle the fast forward amount that they are comfortable with and then have the system move forward at the slowest toggle. If you are the only one synced, you need at least X (1? 2?) others to agree fast forward for it to start. You must be synced to move into a sphere of influence of another player.

Even this is hacky; I'd want to experiment with quick mockups of different systems to see which is the most fun.

Bhodi fucked around with this message at 15:13 on Aug 20, 2019

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