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Cricket
Blackface in crowd
References to Lord of the Rings
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Seams
Feb 3, 2005


Smorgasbord posted:

Cricinfo had made some more 'improvements' to their interface - this time we lose the nice clean player stats on their profile in favour of a much busier and annoying jumble of garbage.

Yeah it sucks.

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webmeister
Jan 31, 2007

The answer is, mate, because I want to do you slowly. There has to be a bit of sport in this for all of us. In the psychological battle stakes, we are stripped down and ready to go. I want to see those ashen-faced performances; I want more of them. I want to be encouraged. I want to see you squirm.

Ratios and Tendency posted:

Think about how bad 10 and 11s are compared to real batsmen, and they're elite level sportsmen with access to the best coaching and facilities and have been training for decades in the actual sport.

Sure, but the vast majority of the coaching and facilities for that #11 is going into their bowling and fielding, not their batting.

Like I'm not suggesting Jack Leach or Nathan Lyon would make it as batsmen if they just worked on their cover drive, but they aren't there to bat and likely only put a token amount of practice in. I'm sure there's exceptions (I seem to remember Glenn McGrath took his batting super seriously and spent more time with the bat than the ball), but they're gunna be the exception and not the rule.

tanglewood1420
Oct 28, 2010

The importance of this mission cannot be overemphasized


The bowlers absolutely don't put in only token practice, it's not the 80s anymore. In modern international cricket the tailenders spend almost as much time in the nets as the top order.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

A bracing glass of carrot juice!


There's a lot of crossover in sports that rely on having a big engine rather than hand eye coordination, like rowing/cycling, but that's more obvious.

therattle
Jul 24, 2007

I'm a family man - I run a family business. This is my son and my partner, H.W.


Soiled Meat

The Proteas are no longer the official SA team. Much bad administration involved:

https://www.dailymaverick.co.za/art...z8zmRMiHk51QE0s

Seams
Feb 3, 2005


lollin at jadeja basically single-handedly beating kohli and his team.

Dead Goon
Dec 13, 2002


Do batsmen spend as much time with the bowling coaches as bowlers spend with batting coaches?

BWV
Feb 24, 2005



Seams posted:

lollin at jadeja basically single-handedly beating kohli and his team.

ir was great to hear the commentators unable to hold back laughter just at how dominant he's been. Even just now trying to get yet another run out from the other side of the field. It also looked like he could hardly breath during his last over of batting. What a guy

goatface
Dec 5, 2007

I had a video of that when I was about 6.

I remember it being shit.




Grimey Drawer

therattle posted:

The Proteas are no longer the official SA team. Much bad administration involved:

https://www.dailymaverick.co.za/art...z8zmRMiHk51QE0s

lol

At least this/last years T20 WC is looking increasingly unlikely. They might reform the administration by 2022 in Australia.

Feels Villeneuve
Oct 7, 2007

Kanye West - Touch the Sky


Smorgasbord posted:

Cricinfo had made some more 'improvements' to their interface - this time we lose the nice clean player stats on their profile in favour of a much busier and annoying jumble of garbage.

wondering if Cricbuzz are better or if they're still pretending that the Pakistan Super League doesn't exist

BrigadierSensible
Feb 16, 2012

I've got a pocket full of cheese, and a garden full of trees.

Dead Goon posted:

Do batsmen spend as much time with the bowling coaches as bowlers spend with batting coaches?

Don't know if they get "coached" as much, but most batsmen are required to roll their arms over in the nets at training.

It was why/how a lot of batsmen who went to England to play county cricket back in the day came back as pseudo all rounders able to bowl a few overs to change ends or maybe be a partnership breaker. Because all the bowling they had done in the nets had improved their skills.

webmeister
Jan 31, 2007

The answer is, mate, because I want to do you slowly. There has to be a bit of sport in this for all of us. In the psychological battle stakes, we are stripped down and ready to go. I want to see those ashen-faced performances; I want more of them. I want to be encouraged. I want to see you squirm.

therattle posted:

The Proteas are no longer the official SA team. Much bad administration involved:

https://www.dailymaverick.co.za/art...z8zmRMiHk51QE0s

It's honestly kind of amazing how regardless of country or discipline, sports administration is always just a colossal shambles full of idiots, failsons, and nepotism golems

garycoleisgod
Sep 27, 2004
Boo

therattle posted:

The Proteas are no longer the official SA team. Much bad administration involved:

https://www.dailymaverick.co.za/art...z8zmRMiHk51QE0s

This makes Australia's abandonment of the tour to SA earlier this year make a bit more sense, especially the talk of the SA board not getting back to them in regards to Covid protocols.

Don't get me wrong, CA are still fuckbois and they would never have abandoned an England or India trip, no matter how unprofessional the conduct. 'Cause the money aspect.

But yeah, things come into focus now.

Burn Down Canberra
Oct 27, 2005

GAME PLANS? We don't need no stinking game plans.



tanglewood1420 posted:

There's an American at our club who played baseball at a high level in college in the US and was even drafted by an MLB team, though in the 18th round or something. He decided not to pursue a career as minor leagues get paid sod all and the chance of making it to the big leagues is so slim.

Anyway, he's been playing cricket for three or four years now in Australia and he is a pretty good player in our 2s. His technique is horrible though, like 8 year old just learning cricket at school level terrible. He gets away with it purely because of his hand-eye skills and strength. At the start of every season one of the experienced guys at the club tries to take him aside and spend a couple of sessions working on the basics with him - getting your body in line, moving your foot to the pitch of the ball, keeping your elbow high etc. - and he always looks awful and eventually rejects it before going back to just standing a foot outside leg stump, trying to clout anything that is hitting the stumps and leave anything else.

Now obviously this guy is nowhere near the standard of Ichiro, or anyone who even made an MLB roster yet alone a future Baseball Hall of Famer, but I think it's far from a given that anyone who is elite at one sport would be a success in the other. You are fighting so much muscle memory and years and years of repetition to transfer your skills across. In some ways it may be even more difficult for professionals considering they will have even more 'programming' to overcome.

There was some American TV show comparing cricket to baseball but they made it unfair and had the baseball player significantly better than the cricketer.

But the baseball player essentially just planted his front foot and wacked the ball a mile outside his body. He would have had no control over his shot. I know people hate this tactic but the standard number 11 short/full tactic would work quite well on someone batting like that. Hit them a few times and pitch up. Hell even just try a good length ball and see if he just belts it to a fielder

The problem with baseballers crossing over to cricket is that they have brilliant eyes but in cricket (even t20) shot selection or even choosing not to play a shot matters a lot more than just being able to twat the thing

exmachina
Mar 12, 2006

Look Closer


I was specifically talking about Ichiro. Watch some videos guys, this guy was unbelievable. He batted in a very unconventional way, slipping between fielders in a very cricket-like way.

He was held in Japanese Leagues until 27 due to an agreement with MLB, and still achieved insane numbers of hits.

I feel like cricket in particular is very resistant to crossover as it values skills not valued by other, even similar sports, bit Ichiro would have done it.

Seams
Feb 3, 2005


The crisis in South African cricket is over, for now.

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/cricket-south-africa-csa-members-council-interim-board-reach-vital-agreement-1261091

As for baseballers making good cricketers, I'm sure some could, just like some AFL players have made the transition to NFL. Some cricketers would probably be good at baseball too, if they tried it out.

therattle
Jul 24, 2007

I'm a family man - I run a family business. This is my son and my partner, H.W.


Soiled Meat

Seams posted:

The crisis in South African cricket is over, for now.

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/cricket-south-africa-csa-members-council-interim-board-reach-vital-agreement-1261091

As for baseballers making good cricketers, I'm sure some could, just like some AFL players have made the transition to NFL. Some cricketers would probably be good at baseball too, if they tried it out.

It was inevitable that CSA would cave as the alternative was catastrophic but it's appalling that is had to come to that.

As far as cricket administration goes, have any of you watched The Death of a Gentleman? I know Sam, one of the director/producers of the film, and asked him recently if Giles Clark was really as odious as he comes across in the film. Apparently he's worse. There is even more damning footage that they weren't able to include.


I read a very interesting article recently about two types of athlete. There is the Tiger Woods, who focuses intently on one sport from an early age. What is actually more common among elite athletes is that they excel in a number of sports and only in late teens or so pick one in which to specialise. The diverse skills and strengths that they pick up in other sorts often end up helping the primary sport that they choose. There are a few examples of people who excelled in a number of sports at high level: I think Jeff Wilson played cricket and rugby for NZ; when I was growing up I remember someone named Gerbrand Grobler who played provincial cricket and rugby (and perhaps played at an international level - if he didn't he was almost good enough). There are some rumours about AB de Villiers's sporting prowess as a kid, most of which are untrue, but he was very good at tennis and had a one handicap aged 15.

Transferring into cricket would be very hard, I think, because as others have written there is a lot about shot selection and technique. There is so little time, especially when playing a fast bowler, that years of training and muscle memory come into play, which would be hard to learn quickly.

Flayer
Sep 13, 2003

Enjoyment and excitement



Buglord

Or the interesting case of Rory Delap, a football player who was good enough at Javelin at youth level to be considered Olympic material and went on to become the only specialist throw-in player in Premier League history.

therattle
Jul 24, 2007

I'm a family man - I run a family business. This is my son and my partner, H.W.


Soiled Meat

Flayer posted:

Or the interesting case of Rory Delap, a football player who was good enough at Javelin at youth level to be considered Olympic material and went on to become the only specialist throw-in player in Premier League history.

Ooo, thatís a great example.

Or the Jamaicans who turned their sprinting gifts into Olympic bobsledding glory!

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

A bracing glass of carrot juice!


Sprinter -> Bobsledder is a recognised career path

tarbrush
Feb 7, 2011

But Schefter said they Love Herbert?!


MrL_JaKiri posted:

Sprinter -> Bobsledder is a recognised career path

Greg Rutherford, the long jump gold medalist from 2012 is attempting to convert to bobsleigh at the moment.

Dead Goon
Dec 13, 2002


Next time a side fails to bowl the other out for a low score I am going to question why the batters didn't take more wickets, in much the same way bowlers seem to get blamed for a low total and "not hanging around".

gently caress the Batriachy.

therattle
Jul 24, 2007

I'm a family man - I run a family business. This is my son and my partner, H.W.


Soiled Meat

Dead Goon posted:

Next time a side fails to bowl the other out for a low score I am going to question why the batters didn't take more wickets, in much the same way bowlers seem to get blamed for a low total and "not hanging around".

gently caress the Batriachy.

Do they?

Dead Goon
Dec 13, 2002


Yes.

therattle
Jul 24, 2007

I'm a family man - I run a family business. This is my son and my partner, H.W.


Soiled Meat


I feel like one quite often reads/hears something like "the specialist batsmen didn't do their jobs and were rescued by the tail/left the tail with too much to do". I can't say I have focused on it too much though. The broader point that bowlers are expected to contribute something with the bat while batsmen don't have the same expectation when it comes to bowling is right though.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

A bracing glass of carrot juice!


All-rounders are generally very highly valued so it's not like "batsman who can bowl" aren't regarded as useful

Madkal
Feb 11, 2008

It was all going well, and then the parademons showed up


Fallen Rib

Now I wonder how Bo Jackson would have done at cricket. Probably would have owned the sport.

Also South African cricket his been in shambles for a long time now and it never stops hurting my soul.

Varkk
Apr 17, 2004




Often it will be one specialist batsman will still be there watching wickets fall at the other end. A lot of the commentary will be about them not supporting him properly.

exmachina
Mar 12, 2006

Look Closer


It is hard to justify playing absolute weasels like Chris Martin (and I say that with love, never forget the Phantom) at the highest level these days.

exmachina
Mar 12, 2006

Look Closer


Chris wouldn't make it into NZ's team today, we don't need a machine that could bowl both ends all day if you let him anymore, our team can actually take 20 wickets these days.

Anyway have a funny video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_NsFh-Z4aE

tanglewood1420
Oct 28, 2010

The importance of this mission cannot be overemphasized


RE: the Ichiro playing cricket question, my skepticism was based on the idea of a 28 year old peak Ichiro leaving baseball to play cricket with no prior experience and try and make it professionally. Not impossible, but certainly very difficult even for someone as grossly talented as him. That's a very different scenario from all the multi-sport athletes mentioned like Bo Jackson, Deion Sanders, Elyse Perry and so on who grew up playing both the sports they played professionally in.

Of course if you took 10 year old Ichiro and moved him to Melbourne or Bradford or Mumbai and he took up cricket then he very likely would have become an excellent cricketer. But I took that as a given.

I'm not the biggest combat sports guy, but I think an instructive comparison would be between Boxing and MMA. On the surface they are very similar sports - two strong and athletic people get in a ring and try to beat the poo poo out of the other - but at a technical level they are quite different, even if some of the skills are transferable. And (to my limited knowledge) it has been shown that elite boxers aren't great at MMA and elite MMA fighters are mediocre boxers.

tanglewood1420 fucked around with this message at 23:06 on Apr 26, 2021

V for Vegas
Aug 31, 2004

THUNDERDOME LOSER

Probably wouldn't take the second run on offer if Ichiro was at long off though.

Seams
Feb 3, 2005


https://twitter.com/cricketcomau/status/1386854686897049607

webmeister
Jan 31, 2007

The answer is, mate, because I want to do you slowly. There has to be a bit of sport in this for all of us. In the psychological battle stakes, we are stripped down and ready to go. I want to see those ashen-faced performances; I want more of them. I want to be encouraged. I want to see you squirm.

No gloves, lmao

exmachina
Mar 12, 2006

Look Closer


Is that Kane dicknosing the mask? C'mon dude

goatface
Dec 5, 2007

I had a video of that when I was about 6.

I remember it being shit.




Grimey Drawer

The no gloves and non-matching parts would ordinarily make me think they were taking the piss, but given the state India is in they might have just not had any and decided hand sanitiser is cheap and effective.

Ratios and Tendency
Apr 23, 2010

MURALI



Imagine having Kane Williamson in your team but giving the captaincy to Dave "Davey" Warner instead just lol

exmachina
Mar 12, 2006

Look Closer


Ratios and Tendency posted:

Imagine having Kane Williamson in your team but giving the captaincy to Dave "Davey" Warner instead just lol

I just can't stop intensely hating that guy, it's exhausting

Seams
Feb 3, 2005


If you hate Warner you should've watched the match last night. He couldn't pierce the field at all and every shot that did was cut off at the boundary. He was getting so visibly frustrated and kept yelling, punching his bat, etc.

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BrigadierSensible
Feb 16, 2012

I've got a pocket full of cheese, and a garden full of trees.

Re: David "davey" Warner

If you hate him now, imagine how much you are going to hate him in 5 or so years when he slithers his way into the commentary box.

Then imagine a Warner, Warne, Healy commentary team. Go on, I dare you.

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