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Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

ultimateforce posted:

My next car is going to be a 911.

+1. I don't know if it will be a 964 or a 991 or what, but yes.

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Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

655321 posted:





1985 930 Turbo Euro Spec with 36k miles. I've posted it before but, you know, Porsche thread.

Bravo, love it. Post more pics. :)

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

IOwnCalculus posted:

I'd love to own an air-cooled '78-'89 but with the way that market is going, that will probably be... never.

What's special about the 78-79s?

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

Pass. Getting in over your head on a car like that when you're making $25k annually is just asking for heartache and sorrow.

You sure he's getting a Mazda rx8 and not an Audi R8?

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

Yes, buy it.

On a different subject - I'm looking for turbo upgrades for the 2011+ 958 Cayenne Turbo and coming up short. Does anyone know which turbos are used on the 958, and any firms that are doing either turbine wheel upgrades or whole turbo replacements?

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

blk posted:

Dropping the GL?

Possibly. We took it to the track for the first time this week (first Club Clash - bracket racing - of the year) and it ran an underwhelming 16.3 @ 85, because Bandimere Speedway (5800ft and usually 7500-9000 DA) is on the moon. So now wife is itching to have her '06 Cayenne Turbo S back which at least ran 14.5 @ 97, and frankly if we're going to do this, I'd rather go big or go home. For most bracket racing 14.00+ is the 'Hot Rod' class where you're up against everything from PT Cruisers (19.2 at 68 baby) to stock Camaro SSs and last-gen Mustang GTs (14.5 at 95 or so). If you run 13.99 to 10.50, however, you're in with the big boys ('Top Street').

OK, so, most cars that run 12s at sea level will be in the 13s up here, that's good enough, right? Well, not really - being in the 13s is no man's land, especially high 13s as one day you might run a 13.8 and the next, if it's hotter or more humid, you might run a 14.0 - and get disqualified as Top Street cars MUST run at least 13.99. To make matters worse one of the fun events is called King Street where you have to run at least 12.75.

The current leading candidates would be the ML63 which has a plethora of tunes (Alpha's tune alone, no joke, takes that car to 700hp/830tq, which is insane) and then possibly a '11+ CT, but oddly I can't find much in the way of crazy tune results or turbo upgrades for it, which is puzzling. Surely there are other retards who want to go real loving fast in a 5200lb SUV? :confused:

Yes, I know, this is the dumbest of problems, but I love it.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

I almost bought another pcar but bought a BMW instead because it's faster. :( I'm a little sad about this.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

Jymmybob posted:

Not quite in line with the other cars in this thread but we just put our order in for a '16 Macan S for late September delivery. It can't come soon enough :ohdear:

Hark, a mythical "new Porsche buyer" spotting! Thank you for doing your part for the betterment of society and taking a depreciation hit for those of us that want one down the road. :)

Seriously though, congrats, that stands to be an awesome car. Very curious to hear your take on the performance of the TT V6.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

Am I totally off base in thinking 996TTs were $10k cheaper a year ago? Is anyone actually tracking this?

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

fknlo posted:

I honestly have no idea what kind of deal that might be. I've seen a lot of base 996's in the low to mid $20k range but have no real idea what pricing on them is. Doesn't seem like a horrible price though.

No one should pay more than $15k for a base 996 right now. If you do, you're both buying the least-desirable 911 on the planet, and a fool parting with his money.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

howling_mad posted:

Where are you finding these magical $15k 996s?

Just checking my local market, here and here? They're all over. A bunch at that pricepoint listed on cars.com too. Plus... Negotiation? This doesn't change the fact that it's still the least-awesome 911. At least get a 996t.

Tremek fucked around with this message at 06:59 on Nov 17, 2015

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

Encor3 posted:

That's actually a pretty good deal. The listing states Automatic but it's clearly a 6 speed manual from the pictures.
Lets not forget it's still a 911, let the haters hate.

"It's still a 911" doesn't hold up too well in the face of the past 10 years of amazing cars that hold a tremendous amount of bang for the buck. While I'd drive a 996 Turbo, the 996 Carrera is outclassed in just about every way by very pedestrian stuff at the same price point today.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

kimbo305 posted:

15k is still pretty cheap though. What's the competition -- slightly newer Boxster, S2000, fairly junky C5? Ignore the 4 seater part.

Not that you couldn't find any of this yourself, but if we start here:

1999 Carrera:
0–60 mph: 4.8 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 13.4 sec @ 105 mph
Curb weight: 3149 lb
Skidpad: .90g

Below are a few examples, but because I have other poo poo to do, feel free to expand the list? If they're on my local CL in this price range, then they're cheaper elsewhere in the country. Ask me how I know? I have flown for the last 6 cars I have bought, which includes a Cayenne Turbo, E55 AMG, Saab 9-7x Aero, Cadillac CTS-V wagon, BMW X5M, etc.

Just starting with power/performance as a basic metric to compare against the 996; some advantages include forced induction or are highly moddable or tuneable; note this includes pretty much anything from the past decade with an LS drivetrain:

2003-2006 Mercedes E55 AMG - 4.7s 0-60 & 12.6 @ 116
2003-2004 Mustang Cobra - 'Terminator' - 4.5s 0-60 & 12.9 @ 111
1997-2004 C5 Chevy Corvette - 4.8s 0-60 & 13.2 @ 110
2004-2007 1st gen Cadillac CTS-V - 4.8s 0-60 & 13.2 @ 109
2004-2006 Pontiac GTO - 4.8s 0-60 & 13.3 @ 107
2007-2011 BMW 335i E90/E92 - 4.8s 0-60 & 13.5 @ 106

You could split these into 'more reliable and ~15k', 'better driving dynamics and ~15k', etc. and some of these would be on multiple lists. You go up to $20k and the competition becomes far more fierce - late-model Camaro SS, Mustang GT, Evos, STIs, E63s, Audi S4s, E60 M5s, etc. Again, many cars in the same price range that are highly competitive in various ways, and most aren't an IMS bearing-style failure away from requiring a drivetrain repair that costs more than the purchase price.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

kimbo305 posted:

I dunno; of those cars, only the E92 and C5 fit the handling criteria that a 996 buyer might be looking for, and even then, it's not quite the same. They might be just as fast for fun driving, but I know I wouldn't cross shop a Terminator or GTO against a 996.

Can we agree that the main criteria for most folks will likely be a DD or 2nd car, with an occasional track day?

With that said, only brand snobbery is preventing you from cross-shopping. They're about as equally suited as an occasional track or lapping day car (with the exception of the C5, which is head & shoulders the best track car of the bunch), all will hustle nicely on a back road, and all are decent DDs - including the 996 I will add.

My point is it's not some magical unicorn of price to value, and will have easily the highest running/repair costs. Especially once you transcend the $20k mark, it looks less and less like a good value.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

Gorgar posted:

What's left on the list if you want mid or rear engine for the handling characteristics?

... is there actually a RR car, other than a late-model 911, with desirable handling characteristics? MR's another thing... Speaking of illogical purchases, I'd buy this imminent failure 100/100 times over a 996. Remember that I'm not a Porsche hater - I have lusted after a 911 forever - but the 996 ain't a great value.



Curse you, 80s-kid upbringing!

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

Falken posted:

Well, I think I'll be the first to show off my 944 here.

Is that a turbo? I really love the 944 lines still, and red is just great. I'm sad I never managed to get my act together and own one when I could have made it work. Also see: 928s.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

coolskillrex remix posted:

Curb weight: 2900 manual
HORSEPOWER296 @ 6800 rpm
TORQUE258 lb-ft @ 4600 rpm

Those are still really impressive numbers. Thats 100 lbs heavier than a BRZ but with far more power, and a new one of those still costs $25000 (i also hate that i run into a white BRZ every day without fail and i only have a 10 minute commute). If people looked at 0-60 then no one would ever buy an frs/brz (unless your city is all grid style stop light to stop light driving, then you can look solely at 0-60)

2900 lbs before options and gas. In reality they're all 3000-3100 lbs+ with options and a tank of gas.

If we're playing this game, I should have checked the national market - C6 Vettes are well under $20k now...

Curb weight: 3200 lbs
Horsepower: 400 @ 6000 rpm
Torque: 400 @ 4400 rpm

First year was 4.3 0-60, 12.8 @ 112, stock had .95g skidpad and gets almost 30mpg highway, and I'll let you guess which one has the best aftermarket on the planet for sports cars.

Edit: re: your stealth edit:

coolskillrex remix posted:

I feel like all of those cars are apples to oranges.

Your dollars are buying you apples with 4 wheels and an engine no matter what. Calling a Vette an 'orange' in this context is, as you say, absurd?

Moreover I'll take a huge horsepower advantage in a 4-door behemoth any day over an anemic BRZ or pcar; at the Virginia City Hillclimb this year I ran a time of 3:51 in my 4400lb wagon whereas the guy in the BRZ turned in a 4:20. While I'm sure we were both having fun, I'm willing to bet I was having more fun!

Tremek fucked around with this message at 00:13 on Nov 18, 2015

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

coolskillrex remix posted:

The c6 is definitely the best bang for your buck by far. Also i wasnt saying the c5 was an orange, just that it was really the only apple in the group, but at the end of the day youre making significant trade offs with a c5. C6 fixes a lot of those.

You have the CTS-V wagon correct? So that 4400lb wagon cost north of $65,000, while his car cost $25,000. I can think of 20 other new cars i rather have for $65000 on a hill climb than a cts-v wagon (and i love the v wagon, its probably the most useful car with the best grunt/handling out there, i always rubber neck when i see one on the road since theyre so rare).

At the end of the day theres a lot of subjectivity that goes into cars. Lots of magazines prefer a 991 carrera to a 2015 c7 corvette, even though its black and white as to which one out performs the other AND which one is cheaper (so you would think it would lose out on both value and performance metrics).

I bought used, and you can buy '09+ sedans for well under $30k now, putting them in the same price range as a BRZ. No brake fade either with 14" Brembos btw, which incidentally are dirt cheap as performance stuff goes. F&R OEM pads from Amazon for $50, Prime delivered, front rotors are well under $100 each, etc. MPSS are going to be similarly expensive for anyone.

Agreed re: subjectivity - I'll be the first to tell you I want a 911 turbo of some variety someday, even if it's not by the number "the best" for X or Y.


Thanks!

Tremek fucked around with this message at 00:50 on Nov 18, 2015

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

Motronic posted:

Best case it's the coolant pipes under the intake and the turbo coolant tees. So about $600 worth of parts and a long day of labor for a home gamer who knows what they are doing.

I'm sure it's much worse than just that.

E: honestly if it were close to me I'd buy it for parts at $2500, maybe 2800 depending on how if it actually ran right cold.

It was $600 in parts when I did it in 2013 but it's more like $1k now as far as I can tell.

There's also $hundreds in tools you may well not have like reverse torx bits etc. and be sure to enjoy your permanent scars on the inside of your wrist from jamming your hand behind the driver's side block and the firewall to get at some of the pipes. Ask me how I know.



That car getting totaled 3 months later was the icing on the cake.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

Motronic posted:

poo poo no, not on BFG KO2s. There are more interesting ways to die.

I happened to ponder this quandary for a moment whereupon I realized I have done triple digits on KO2s in 3 separate vehicles, including one I currently own. You’ll be fine!

I’d be more concerned about driveshaft speeds in most KO2-equipped trucks at 120mph

Ahem. Carry on.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

slidebite posted:

Sales people of any stripe wearing $20K watches and fancy jewelry when trying to get my business turn me right off. I would literally ask for another rep.

I was selling a house and the real estate guy who was recommended dropped by in a god drat diablo and I immediately engaged with another realtor. When I used to deal with a financial advisor I had one that smoked like a steam engine, smelled like a human ashtray and wore a Rolex and made sure his cuffs were up high enough so you couldn't help but notice it.

Dude is literally why I got into teaching myself investment basics and do everything through a discount brokerage now. If they are that gawdy and have such incredibly poor judgement I do not want to give them a dime, let alone make thousands on a real estate or investment commissions.

A couple brief observations; while business-to-consumer sales people (realtors, luxury goods people, etc) are almost invariably obnoxious, hating on said sales guy for watches and cars is silly. Is it not better to judge them on their acumen that you're theoretically retaining them for? Isn't their ability to own a Diablo likely indicative of someone that can perform in their job, trust funds etc. aside?

Second, was your 'financial advisor' a fiduciary or not? If not, that's on you for doing any business with him. Non-fiduciary financial advisors are out for themselves and should be lumped into the same groups as people running MLMs, chiropractors, etc. They're neither obligated nor frequently interested in actually helping you.

Both in the US and Canada you can have 'financial advisors' running around who are in no way legally obligated to look out for your best interests. With all that said, if you're choosing money people based on their apparent success, lack thereof, or the ability to somehow be both successful but not display it, in my opinion you're chasing the wrong signals and probably getting weird outcomes.

PS, Realtors have a fiduciary obligation to their clients.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

All fair points, and caveat emptor in all things - the classic real estate scenario comes to mind where $20k means a lot more to the seller or buyer, but when +/- $20k means +/- $600 on each realtors’ commission, they’re going to care far less than the interested parties, and that’s frankly the duty of the customer to know.

@Motronic you’re mostly aware of some of the ridiculous real estate bullshit I have waded through (and continue to wade through) these recent years - you know I’m no fan of realtors.

There are tons of realtors that suck for varying reasons, but at least there’s accountability there legally where (for example) with non-fiduciary financial advisors there’s zero oversight and only baseline legal remedies available.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

The Prong Song posted:

It's just a car.

Yup. Obsessing over garaging a car is a lost cause. Enjoy it while you got it.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

gvibes posted:

Thinking of making a poor financial decision - how cheap do not-complete-basket-case 996 turbos (coupe/manual) get?

e: Guess I will see what a local/pretty clean one goes for at auction soon - https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2001-porsche-911-turbo-84/

e2: 3156 range 1 ignitions, 9 range 2 ignitions. lol. Barely driven.

Even a basket case 996 manual turbo coupe is $30k+ these days, they’re a lovely value. There’s one that had a bunch of undisclosed issues that was listed on BaT maybe last year or the end of 2018? It didn’t end up selling, you should be able to find it as one of the lower closed auctions on BaT’s history graph for 996 Turbos.

It’s been 5+ years since the 996 Turbo was a decent-to-good value. Now most are well north of $40k which can buy you a brand new sports car under warranty that will run rings around a 996 and connect to your phone and all that jazz.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

If I was going to spend $40k on a 911 today I’d be looking for a manual 964 coupe as there’s only so many of them and among other intrinsic things that come with an air cooled 911 like the classic gauges and styling, they’re what Singer starts their builds on, so there’s some intrinsic meta-value there too.

$.02

e: that’s the very bottom of their price range generally speaking and of course that will be a private seller, possibly even a basket case, but they’re out there if you’re patient. 964 cabs are way cheaper.

Tremek fucked around with this message at 23:23 on Feb 4, 2020

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

What you did 3 or 4 years ago sounds pretty rational, but the case for a 996 has gotten worse, not better, in the interim. “I must have a 911 Turbo for $45k or less” notwithstanding, cars available at the same price point have become even more aggressively good versus a nearly 20 year old 911 with arguably the least-great and dated interior in any water cooled 911 and maybe even versus air cooled interiors too.

The 996 is both significantly down on power as well as heavier than a 997 which will probably be ~$15k more. It’s the versus-other-cars part that’s the hardest bit to justify; those formerly $60k ZL1s and GT350s are now coincidentally ~$45k. As are C7 Z06s. Any of these cars absolutely murder a 996 in any competitive measurement even on modern tires.

Sure, they’re not Porsches, but they’re all great cars in their own right and any of them will be nicer to live with due to modern features and probably safer in a crash to boot.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

Motronic posted:

That's my real issue with it.

I'm dealing with a 955 interior in the Cayenne, which is basically the same thing. It's not BAD but it's not good. Under 50 degrees and I have leather squeaks in the dash, courtesy features are lacking in their function (things like seat memory and how it works), preference setting is buggy and randomly changes (I guarantee you that I did not change my door lock option to "only drivers door on single button press" but somehow that became a thing last week), MFD is kinda lame but workable (again with settings issues and lack of features/preferences that would have made a lot of sense for an extra couple weeks of software dev time), many button locations and function make no sense at all and are obvious afterthoughts (like how to adjust footwell lights).

Center stack is hot garbage. Climate controls make no sense. Why do I have a little cover over a panel with mostly non-fucntional buttons, and the functional ones are cryptic? At least the nav/radio is easy enough to change out.

Does your PiG have a second battery in the rear? All this sounds similar to low-battery induced issues... https://rennlist.com/forums/cayenne-955-957-2003-2010/970246-yes-virginia-there-is-a-second-battery.html

A bunch of stuff didn't work properly on my S65 when it got here and replacing the second battery made things right.

Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

For what it’s worth Motronic my fire investigators told me they find trickle chargers as a frequent cause of fires; might want to make sure it’s sitting/hanging in a steel bucket or something if possible while connected and of course obligatory smoke alarm recco for the barn etc

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Tremek
Jun 10, 2005

Fire don’t care about your credentials nor does it have the good manners to not roast your tractor while you’re on a plane PAL

Turned out the power strip that roasted my poo poo was UL rated and everything. Welp, as they say

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