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Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Costume looks wonky because it's CGI , but hopefully the horns are more pronounced.

Great I can wake up at 6am watch a episode then go to work and be annoyed I have to at work all day .

Hollismason fucked around with this message at Apr 9, 2015 around 22:48

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Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


mikeraskol posted:

I thought it was 12am PST, so 3am EST and 2am CST.

Or do I have my times off?

No you are correct I used google, it failed me.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Must do responsible thing and go to work. Ugh, glad to see it's getting praise here. Cannot wait to get home. Order a Pizza, and watch 2 to 3 episodes.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


I'm on episode 04 and i just kind of want to say this is loving amazing. I'm taking my time I'll finish it stoday but Imma take breaks between, this is just loving crazy good.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Ugh I am just on episode 1 x 05

This is loving great, I was uh.. not expecting Fisk to do that, holy poo poo balls Vincent is loving nailing it to the wall , wasn't expecting the romance either

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


I'm just starting 1:08 and uh Holy poo poo Holy poo poo that opening

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Oh my god it's 13 episodes, I thought it was 10 , I am just on Episode 9 now.

I am so happy.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


I'm on episode 11 right now Is that the Tinkerer? Isn't that his name? The guy who's making his suit? Also as it has been pointed out this is the origin of Daredevil and The Kingpin

Vincent D'Nofrio is loving awesome.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Wow , I was to sleepy to finish things last night, woke up and just finished it this morning. Probably the one of the best adaptation of a origin story every put on the screen, it had time to breathe, and let you really get involved with the characters.

E1 x13 The Fisk fight was appropriate it actually, I mean the fight choreography was top loving notch, and just man every thing from Fisk asking Vanessa to marry him onward was amazing. I know they said well "Fisk couldn't handle him in a fight" but I thought the end fight with him was appropo , two men who believe in the city fighting it out in a alley way. Also, Daredevil fought Fisk after he was out of the wreckage of the Police van and weakened. [/spoilered]

E1x 12 [spoiler] I cannot loving believe they killed Ben Urich, that was pretty shocking and honestly I felt it was a mistake


The fight scenes in this were loving amazing , and I like how "real" they made them feel.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Also, I don't think this is to spoilery its about a easter egg but can someone confirm that The Nelson and Murdock lawfirm, when they open the door the sign across the room for the other office says Atlas Corportation the one in the hallway.


Oh and also 1x13 That's Wilson Fisk through out the series, he only becomes the Kingpin at the very end, he sees how badly he hosed everything else up. He's even wearing his "costume" a white suit. That's what I think people aren't getting is that this isn't the Kingpin this is the RISE of the Kingpin.

Hollismason fucked around with this message at Apr 11, 2015 around 15:31

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


None of the Russians stuff was subtitled it seemed. I went back through scenes to see if my Subtitles were hosed up.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Gyges posted:

1X13
I wouldn't say it was the rise of the Kingpin, more his origin. Which is kind of funny because Daredevil was already daredeviling at the start of the series so the only hero origin we got was the completion of the Nelson and Murdock law firm.

1x13 Right it's the Origin of the Kingpin but he's not The Kingpin in the actual series he's Wilson Fisk , one of the things I liked was that everyone really was like " How the gently caress do we take down Wisk" and I thought they really brought this air of untouchability to his character. I like D' Ofirio ( I know I always spell his name wrong) potrayal of him , it's loving excellent and believable. Of course he's a loving lunatic with emotional problems and you can understand why

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Foggy is loving awesome. Like there's dynamite performances all around but he is perfect.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


I think a key issue surrounding this series that I thought was really interesting was the fact that Matt Murdock is a Catholic and Christian struggling with his faith.

General Spoilers for the whole series 1 -13



I find it interesting that although he has heightened senses, and heightened abilities. He doesn't kill people , meanwhile almost all the other Marvel Superheroes do. Captain America , Iron Man, etc.. do not have rules about not killing people. They don't go out of their way to murder people but Daredevil does go out of his way to NOT murder people.

The entire series resolves around Christian ideology regarding Good/Evil which I think is really interesting and brings a nuance to the character that's missing from other Super Hero films of the MCU.

He kills one person, through out the series and that's literally when he is going to be killed himself.

Meanwhile you've got Wilson Fisk talking about no god and being unable to pray.Kind of interesting dynamic there where the main villian is a atheist and the other is a Catholic.

If anything the entire point of the series seems to be saying " God is real and does exist"

Hollismason fucked around with this message at Apr 11, 2015 around 16:17

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Gyges posted:

1X13
I wouldn't say he goes that far out of his way not to kill people. He tried to keep Vladimir alive, but that was mostly because he needed information. He just watched the one detective inject his partner with poison, only stepping in aftewards to get info. Plus he's dropping guys off buildings and pounding the gently caress out of their heads. Hell, he kills Nobu but then no one other than Fisk and the bad guys ever mention it again.

Killing in Daredevil is about intent. Did you show up planning to kill the guy? That's murder and wrong. Did you kill the guy in self defense, inadvertently through a sever beating and gravity, or in a desperate fight to the death with a guy you didn't come to kill? Well, that's just how the cookie crumbles.

Setting a ninja on fire and throwing a Russian off a roof and into a coma are both just fine. Slashing at the Kingpin with a blade while he tries to beat the gently caress out of you? Whoah dude, that's a bit much. Thought you were supposed to be better than the people you fought.

Also apparently shooting the guy who drugged and kidnapped you, then threatened the lives of everyone you ever loved is morally pretty dark grey and could really go either way for Karen.

So I guess now that I think about it, the moral stance on killing is loving bonkers in this show and worse than using a stupid Batman rule of NEVER KILL!


The point is though that it's intent. It didn't give the impression to me at least that he was waiting for the detective to be injected to then interrogate him, when he arrives he just knows that's what has happened.The Fisk and the Nobu things were both him lashing out and trying to live though. Also he intentionally through him off the roof into the garbage bin.

It's the intent that matters, that was the whole point of Sticks training and methodology versus his unwillingness to become an assassin for Stick.

He actually debates on whether he should kill Wilson Fisk, and in fact goes there with the intent to kill Wilson Fisk and realizes he is wrong. Hence his with the law methods.

Captain America , Iron Man and others intentionally kill people. Iron Man straight up kills people and so does Captain America It's not that their bad people, Captain America is flat out a soldier. So is viewpoint is pretty much the same as STicks.

Matt at least struggles with it, he at least says " Why can't I kill this man, should I kill this man, is it RIGHT to kill this man". Matt also shows a level of knowledge and in depth skill into the human body through his senses that he knows and this is important how not to kill.

I mean his senses are super human, so he knows exactly how much he can hurt someone, which I think is pretty interesting.

He also feels guilty about what he's doing which is what I thought was really interesting.




Petr posted:

Leland Owlsey is, I think, the only one who exists in Marvel comics. He's really different, though. He looks like this: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...c/Owlmaleev.jpg


Actually 1x13 He's not the OWL, he specifically talks about his son, Lee which would be short for Leland, it'd also give nuance to the Owl and Kingpin hating each others loving guts so his son being the Owl and the reason him coming to New York over his father's death is more interesting

Hollismason fucked around with this message at Apr 11, 2015 around 17:08

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


I plan on rewatching it but another thing about the series that's really good is the some what realistic depiction of his injuries and how this affects the flow of the show Episodes 1-13 After getting his rear end kicked by Nobu I'm pretty sure it's weeks , not days that he's completely laid up after that fight. This also happens through out the series, it actually has a time frame for this happening. Like he legitimately just lays on a couch most of a episode.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


bobkatt013 posted:

Wait until you see the scene with him and his bat

Also the fucken Owl and Gladiator

Oh poo poo that is Herc in episode 8.

That is Gladiator , but that may not beThe Owl. Leland specifically mentions his son which he refers to as Lee.

Where did you see Herc?

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


XboxPants posted:

It is definitely Atlas Investments. Is that a reference to the Olympus group AKA Best Hero Ever Hercules?? Or just a boring Atlas Comics/Atlas Foundation?

I'm pretty sure it's a reference to the following:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agents_of_Atlas

Maybe?

BSam posted:

Ep8
Herc from the wire, Domenick Lombardozzi, plays Fisks dad.


Oh I thought you mean HERC as in Hercules

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Jose Oquendo posted:

So the Greek girl Foggy mentioned is Elektra?

There's no way that it is not.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


XboxPants posted:

I've yet to see an image but apparently 1x13 his stilts show up in Gladiator's shop.

Can we get a timestamp, at least?



Pretty sure Daredevils original colour of red and yellow are in his shop as well

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Jessica Jones is the series I'm looking forward to MORE than Daredevil, because she's a very interesting character.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Yeah The Punisher would be difficult to bring to screen because eventually the character is just a serial killer who targets criminals. He's basically Dexter, but with Guns. He's not super sympathetic and has no moral issues with just murdering people.

I mean maybe a Dexter style The Punisher mini series could work but I don't think it would.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


The Punisher would be interesting character to introduce in the series as a antagonist , he's a interesting character and initially is sympathetic.

It'd be interesting to have him in the show.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


One of the problems with the Punisher is he only really was interesting once Garth Ennis got a hold of him before that he was basically boring guy. Except for Punisher 2099 which is what most people don't know Marshall Law book that makes fun of the Punisher.

The problem though is Garth Ennis wrote him so well and brought so much to the character that's pretty much who the character is now.

He's basically depicted as a broken human being.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Yeah that's why people here have said it eventually just becomes the story of a serial killer who preys on criminals. The Punisher works as a fantastic antagonist to other characters , but as a protagonist beyond that first "I'm taking revenge" motive of his origin afterwards is just a serial killer story.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


There's actually really good legitimate motivations for the characters in the series that are very realistic Episode 1 -13 Ben Ulrichs arc was brutal but through out he maintained his integrity when they were like "Hey this is happening" he was like " yeah, I can't take the word of a masked vigilante" , in fact it's kind of interesting but Wilson Fisk is almost the embodiment of corruption. Everyone that was associated or deals with him becomes Corrupted in some way. Karen , Ben , Matt, Vanessa, all leading to their downfall. Only Matt recovers but Fisk still does corrupt him still reaches him by forcing him to kill Nobu. The only person that's not really corrupted by it is Foggy which is interesting because Foggy has doubts he wants the nice house the nice car, but the entire series Matt isn't Foggy's moral compass, he's his Devils Advocate, haha.

Like seriously, Matt plays devils advocate to Foggy the entire series. That's what's great. Foggy was already a amazing person he didn't need people to really tell him to do the right thing. He just needed any exscuse


The show's fairly nuanced with it's writing and I think that's what is so amazing.

Can't wait to go back and rewatch each episode.

But yeah it's got some killer stuff in it I still love that in every single conversation Ep 1 -13 With Karen, Foggy, Matt plays devils advocate.

Hollismason fucked around with this message at Apr 12, 2015 around 02:06

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


The only character that I felt was a bit two dimensional was Vanessa, like there just wasn't a lot of back story and we weren't shown that at all. I mean she knocked it out of the park in a nuanced performance, but still the romance between them felt .. contrived

Vincent D'onfrio's performance was excellent. I think just the nuanced parts of his behavior are just incredibly interesting potrayal. He's not like hand wringing evil. He's actually got legitimate reasons, he genuinely cares about people.

That's what I thought was interesting about the whole series was that it really in it's way at once made you terrified, but saddened and happy for his character. Like Episode 13 I legitimately was worried about Vanessa and whether she was going to die and you genuinely felt sorry for him . I mean I don't know how others felt but I wasn't rooting for Vanessa to die.

I thought it was a great take on the character and just a great potrayal.

And how loving amazing is Wesley E 1 x 11 I was genuinely upset he died but also genuinely scared for Karen, that's a really great scene, cause you wanna root for both and you can't win either way

Hollismason fucked around with this message at Apr 12, 2015 around 02:13

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Drifter posted:

He cares about 2 people.

I don't get where you're seeing that he's a good person aside from him telling you he's a good person.

I never said he was a good person, but that's the whole point. If he was just a murderous thug it'd be different. He cared for more than 2.

That's what I found interesting, was that really very few characters in the show were hand wringing evil. Here's a list and there is one that is just well evil.

Each of the Characters actually represent a Facet of Fisk, the people he deals with.
E 1x 1 -13 Not to spoilery


Each of the characters that make up Fisks "empire" represent
Leland = Is shown to be incredibly business like , not cruel or taking joy in violence. Yet he loves his son. : Proffesionalism
Guabo ? = Is shown to take no pleasure in what she does, she wants neither money , she wants purpose : Purpose but she's Evil.
Nobu = Is a honorable warrior, when he faces Matt he straight up says that he shows him respect : Respect
The Russians : Two Brothers who are evil but would do anything for each other : Family
Vanessa : This is pretty obvious : Love , but also specifically motherly love

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Well I mean I think that it's obvious in the potrayals that Matt and Fisk are both self delusional. That this is something that drives both of them.

I mean Matt is man who is good who does evil and Fisk is a man who is evil but does good.

I kind of think that this is what tortures both of them.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


XboxPants posted:

1x13 I guess? General theme of the show stuff.

I think there's a very strong case to be made that Fisk was not, in fact, just evil all along. That, although he says that he was the thief all along and it seems like he's "accepting" this, that maybe there's something more subtle than that going on.

There's a theme all throughout the series of the struggle between Good and Evil in Matt. It's not just a story about how Matt has to accept that he was an inherently good person all along; he has to decide who he's going to be. He could have gone down a darker path, if he had chosen. The potential for evil was in him all along.

Perhaps the same could be said of Fisk. It seems like he's just accepting who he is, but maybe that's just bullshit that he's telling himself so he can feel good about who he is, just like everything else he says about himself. It makes more sense to me that he's not just accepting that he's evil; he's deciding that. He's making a conscious choice to discard any potential good that he may have in him, and to embrace the devil.

And that only works if there was good in him to begin with.


You said it way better than me , the entire series deals with this Catholic idea of Damnation. The way that Matt describes his world is his world is on fire, like he's literally living in hell

I'm not as well versed on Catholic dogma , but I'm pretty sure the series is full of it.

I think that's kind of what elevates the show though.

I mean it's the struggle of a Christian Warrior. He's on a Crusade.

Also and this is just a E 1 x 13 Matt has one kiss during the series, but he does not have sex. It's implied in the film that of course Matt is not a virgin but in the actual series the romantic sub plot is dealt with pretty quickly between him and Claire. Matt has a brief romance with Claire, but then the entire Romantic sub plot really is between Foggy and Karen , as well as Fisk and Vanessa. I kind of thought this was interesting. Like if they'd had a scene of Matt praying to god then that would have been a bit to on the head, but Fisk says he doesn't even know how to pray.

It's also interesting is that Matt decides to seek justice not because of pain inflicted on him. In fact it subverts the Batman idea completely. His father is gunned downed by Mobsters and he doesn't train to seek revenge. It's the suffering of others that drives him to be a hero.

Hollismason fucked around with this message at Apr 12, 2015 around 02:54

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


I don't think it was preachy because it actually gave you a sense immediately of where Matt was coming from. It's far easier to understand. It's also not super heavy handed. Matt doesn't fall down on his knees and start praying to god for salvation. Series : I mean the series has Fisk and Matt both come from traumatic upbringings Matt with his accident and death of his father. Fisk with the trauma that comes from his father, but also causing the death of his father. Matt believes he is responsible. Fisk knows he is responsible. So there is this specific iteration of intent. Intent is all through out the series, what you actually carry in your heart so to speak. I'm sure there's lots more there. THe fact that they both have this missing Mother figure in their lives. The show has obvious Christian Morals through out the film, self sacrifice, etc... Damnation and Salvation

Hollismason fucked around with this message at Apr 12, 2015 around 03:22

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


I'm kind of curious as to what the budget was for the series.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


That's pretty impressive. Although if the total of all 5 are 60 Episodes then that means 1 of the series isn't going to be 13 episodes.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


It's going to be brutal to wait 2 or more years to watch Daredevil Season 2, ugh.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Yeah it's just dawning on me that we won't see another Daredevil series ever possibly . Like this is it for the next 2 years.

Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuccck.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


I don't think they have the television rights to X-Men, I know that Fox sued Marvel over some television series. We'll never see a X-men / Avengers movie ever though. I don't think that FOX and Marvel have a great relationship at all.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


I'm pretty sure Agent's of Shield costs 3 to 5 million per episode as well. So saying budget is a issue is obviously not the case.

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Not a spoiler at all but a interview with Vincent D'Onofrio on playing Wilson Fisk.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUy8zfRUKNk

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


Joe Quasada get's a lot of poo poo, but he's the first artist to be named Editor in Chief, and is kind of responsible the for the Daredevil stories we have now. He's a terrible writer, but he's a great artists and he brought some amazing talent to Marvel Comics.

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Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007


1 x 11 I actually like Karen and Wesley so that stand off sucked , I don't get why people would not like Karen, I thought her character was good. Intelligent , etc..

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