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So It Goes
Feb 18, 2011

ColonelJohnMatrix posted:

This next season of Bonfireside Chat is going to be amazing. I've been playing Dark Souls 3 on Xbone all weekend (thanks to the Japan store trick) and here are some very vague, spoiler-free thoughts on it for those wondering but who are avoiding the main threads for fear of said spoilers.

While I haven't been able to play online (the US Servers are off thus far), the 12 hours I've played have been amazing. It feels like a true sequel to Demons / Dark Souls but with the best mechanics and bits from DS2/Bloodborne refined. It's so nice to have variety and a major sense of exploration back as I found Bloodborne's streamlined world/gameplay to not be as enjoyable. It's great playing with all sorts of characters and having the game feel vastly different depending on build/weapon choice.

The best thing I can say about it (and why it should make for a great Bonfireside Chat Season) is how fantastic and interesting the areas and their relationship to each other are. It feels like you are exploring a dangerous, hosed up, and yet beautiful world instead of just a series of levels. There are so many paths to explore and it's great getting lost and running into crazy poo poo. I've also really enjoyed the NPC story beats.

Assuming online play works great it will be my favorite game in the series outside of the original Dark Souls. Considering I'm really not that far in I'm probably going to just scale back on playing and hold off until the servers go live as I want to be involved in the madness of that.

You know how DLC is typically the best part of any Souls game? This whole game (12 hours in) feels like DLC content.

I've finished the game and, at its best, it's probably the best Soulsborne content I've played. I have plenty of problems with it though, which I won't get into in this thread for obvious reasons. I'll be curious to see it reception after the initial release and people have had time to fully digest its package beyond first impressions.

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Captain Invictus
Apr 5, 2005

Try reading some manga!


Clever Betty
Eh, the game has a lot in it, but there's a certain point where you realize just how small it is. Like I unlocked the bridge repair and bus repair, and the areas you get access to through them are a few screens in size total.

I expect the updates he's talked about will ad a ton more, but right now once you hit a certain threshold, usually around the end of year 2, the game very suddenly feels all too small.

That said, for 15 dollars it's an absolute bargain.

NmareBfly
Jul 16, 2004

I posted my food for USPOL Thanksgiving!


Captain Invictus posted:

Eh, the game has a lot in it, but there's a certain point where you realize just how small it is. Like I unlocked the bridge repair and bus repair, and the areas you get access to through them are a few screens in size total.

I read this, assumed you were talking about Dark Souls 3, and now I want to see a dilapidated bus station that portrays the deep sorrow of a magnificent transit system doomed to slow and possibly endless descent into ruin.

Ever Disappointing
May 4, 2004

Captain Invictus posted:

Eh, the game has a lot in it, but there's a certain point where you realize just how small it is. Like I unlocked the bridge repair and bus repair, and the areas you get access to through them are a few screens in size total.

I expect the updates he's talked about will ad a ton more, but right now once you hit a certain threshold, usually around the end of year 2, the game very suddenly feels all too small.

That said, for 15 dollars it's an absolute bargain.

I'm 25 hours in and have yet to finish Fall of the first year. So reading you complain about the game feeling too small after two years sounds crazy.

zapjackson
May 21, 2012

Man, Idle Thumbs has been so, so good lately. I keep having that thing happen where I get weird looks in public because of the big dopey grin on my face while I'm listening.

mango sentinel
Jan 5, 2001

by sebmojo

zapjackson posted:

Man, Idle Thumbs has been so, so good lately. I keep having that thing happen where I get weird looks in public because of the big dopey grin on my face while I'm listening.

Bee Camel

Captain Invictus
Apr 5, 2005

Try reading some manga!


Clever Betty
Makes me excited to catch up, I fell behind since the Bombcast, Best Friendcast, and Beastcast have been so lengthy as of late(one week the bombcast and SBFC totaled nearly 8 hours in length combined!) that I've not even had time to listen to Idle Thumbs since I only listen to podcasts during certain times at work, but I've been able to listen to a few episodes from near the end of last year and they've been pretty good when not talking about mobile games. Looking forward to the new year's stuff since I hear after Firewatch released they got way more relaxed.

101
Oct 15, 2012


Vault Dweller
Yeah, I fell behind on Idle Thumbs at around 200. Anyone suggest a good jumping back on point?

Osmosisch
Sep 9, 2007

I shall make everyone look like me! Then when they trick each other, they will say "oh that Coyote, he is the smartest one, he can even trick the great Coyote."



Grimey Drawer

zapjackson posted:

Man, Idle Thumbs has been so, so good lately. I keep having that thing happen where I get weird looks in public because of the big dopey grin on my face while I'm listening.

For what it's worth, this has been my response to VGHD lately.

Not sure how to put this in a way that isn't weird, but I found your apology in the latest episode about Threadsteading's name to be extremely touching. I remember the early days of VGHD when that never would have happened, and I probably wouldn't have expected or wanted it to happen. It's nice to have something like that make you realise things have changed for the better in some ways, both in oneself and in others.

Vastakaiun
Apr 16, 2008


Nothing like embarrasing yourself in your workplace by laughing at an internetman in your ear coming up with a racial slur for robots.

Stan Taylor
Oct 13, 2013

Touched Fuzzy, Got Dizzy

I was keeping it together until the whole sound of the neighborhood pizza truck (*BZZZZZZZ* ) bit.

Blowjob Overtime
Apr 6, 2008

Steeeeriiiiiiiiike twooooooo!


This post had me primed to hear this phrase, and I thought at first that it was going to be just a one-off thing that Nick said in passing. The discussion that they looped back to when Chris called him out was amazing.

ElMaligno
Dec 31, 2004

Be Gay!
Do Crime!

zapjackson posted:

Man, Idle Thumbs has been so, so good lately. I keep having that thing happen where I get weird looks in public because of the big dopey grin on my face while I'm listening.

Well yes, but i have something to complain about :
https://twitter.com/zapjackson/status/715192317934567424

How the gently caress do I live with myself after reading such a loving good joke??? Do you know how hard it was to be stoic and stand a good watch after reading such a good joke????? gently caress you zack.

ja2ke
Feb 19, 2004

ElMaligno posted:

Well yes, but i have something to complain about :
https://twitter.com/zapjackson/status/715192317934567424

How the gently caress do I live with myself after reading such a loving good joke??? Do you know how hard it was to be stoic and stand a good watch after reading such a good joke????? gently caress you zack.

What I have learned after working in an office with Zack for two years is that he just shits this stuff out, so maybe he just doesn't notice anymore.

NieR Occomata
Jan 18, 2009

Glory to Mankind.

ElMaligno posted:

Well yes, but i have something to complain about :
https://twitter.com/zapjackson/status/715192317934567424

How the gently caress do I live with myself after reading such a loving good joke??? Do you know how hard it was to be stoic and stand a good watch after reading such a good joke????? gently caress you zack.

Or he just watched a 5sf that's over three years old at this point???

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-3-CCmBI80

Helter Skelter
Feb 10, 2004

BEARD OF HAVOC

ja2ke posted:

What I have learned after working in an office with Zack for two years is that he just shits this stuff out, so maybe he just doesn't notice anymore.
Unrelated, but I checked out the first episode of the FOO Show tonight, and it was really neat hanging out in that watch tower with you guys goofing around.

al-azad
May 28, 2009



I got around to listening to Game Informer's The Inside Story Of Recording Metal Gear Solid and it's a great interview. Lots of stuff on the back story to the original and some strong feelings regarding MGS5 (including debunking the belief that Sutherland's lack of lines was because he was too expensive or unavailable).

I think the most interesting thing to me are the Guild rules regarding re-using voice work. It ended up being cheaper to re-record Twin Snakes than use the old recording.

Lone Goat
Apr 16, 2003

When life gives you lemons, suplex those lemons.




I forget what podcast talked about it (Thumbs? Weekend? Hot Dog? Crowbar???) but that Diablo post mortem from GDC is up now

claw game handjob
Mar 27, 2007

pinch pinch scrape pinch
ow ow fuck it's caught
i'm bleeding
JESUS TURN IT OFF
WHY ARE YOU STILL SMILING
It was Idle Thumbs last? week.

DLC Inc
Jun 1, 2011

when is WOFF revealing the brawler votes? I can only assume it was TMNT IV and Streets of Rage 2, though.

Song For The Deaf
Aug 10, 2006

I HAVE TO USE MY SOUND SWORD NOW.
We reveal it at the end of the Portal episode, which just came out today. Here's the entire upcoming slate:

* Warcraft III: Reign of Chaos
* Dungeons and Dragons: Shadow Over Mystara / Turtles in Time
* Oregon Trail / Typing of the Dead
* A full month of Fallout: New Vegas

Phone
Jul 30, 2005

親子丼をほしい。
Is it too late for WC3 responses? Would you guys be interested in hearing about some specific meta fuckery on the multiplayer side of things? I'll keep it as concise as possible since you guys are covering the single player campaign.

Song For The Deaf
Aug 10, 2006

I HAVE TO USE MY SOUND SWORD NOW.
It's not too late.

Pasco
Oct 2, 2010

Song For The Deaf posted:

We reveal it at the end of the Portal episode, which just came out today. Here's the entire upcoming slate:

* Warcraft III: Reign of Chaos
* Dungeons and Dragons: Shadow Over Mystara / Turtles in Time
* Oregon Trail / Typing of the Dead
* A full month of Fallout: New Vegas

Man. Warcraft 3.

Great game, but also the progenitor of World of Warcraft and DotA (among other things).

Easily one of the top 5 most important games of all time.

HMS Boromir
Jul 16, 2011

by Lowtax
I've been playing through the campaign again on Hard in preparation for the episode and it's weird where the difficulty spikes end up being. I've just started the night elf campaign and the human survival mission and the orc caravan escort mission have been the roughest points so far.

Bug Squash
Mar 18, 2009

Also the origin of the tower defence genre. Bizarrely influential for a game that's ok, but not amazing.

Srice
Sep 11, 2011

Bug Squash posted:

Also the origin of the tower defence genre. Bizarrely influential for a game that's ok, but not amazing.

Starcraft had custom maps like those, but WC3's map editor was just so much more robust that it allowed for more specialized towers.

C-Euro
Mar 20, 2010

:science:
Soiled Meat
I wasn't expecting to come out of that Portal episode wanting to replay Portal, but here I am with Portal re-installed. It's doing some weird thing where bars appear on the screen for a moment every time a portal spawns though, gonna need that to not happen.

Also 2007 is when I met my wife so I thought it was a good year :shobon:

Pasco posted:

Easily one of the top 5 most important games of all time.

I wonder what that list looks like. I think Game Informer did an article like that years ago but it was 1) 25 games, and 2) before a lot of modern gaming trends like MOBAs, post-WoW MMOs and even the annualized military shooter. WoW might have been on that list though.

dipple
Oct 22, 2008
I was sad no one remembered meatspin in the latest Jick Show.

Pasco
Oct 2, 2010

C-Euro posted:

I wonder what that list looks like. I think Game Informer did an article like that years ago but it was 1) 25 games, and 2) before a lot of modern gaming trends like MOBAs, post-WoW MMOs and even the annualized military shooter. WoW might have been on that list though.

My comment was a little hyperbolic, because it's sort of an impossible question. Everything stands on the shoulders of giants.

To stick with WarCraft 3: We don't get that without WarCraft 1 and 2 (obviously), we don't get those without Dune 2, and we don't get that without Herzog Zwei and Populus, the latter of which we don't get without Lander / Virus / Zarch (which is a loving awesome and largely forgotten game), etc.

So which of those is the most important? Which one really birthed the LoMa genre, tower defence and the biggest MMO of all time?

Beyond that, those genres are important to gaming right now, but a decade ago FPS was king and a decade from now it'll be something else.

Funkmaster General
Sep 13, 2008

Hey, man, I distinctly remember this being an episode of Spongebob. :colbert:

Everyone always credits Warcraft 3 with having the original DOTA map, but I definitely remember seeing rooms titled "Defense of the ancients" in the Starcraft battle.net browser well before warcraft 3 released.

Stan Taylor
Oct 13, 2013

Touched Fuzzy, Got Dizzy
Warcraft 3 had the custom scene that directly led to the popularity of both tower defense and "moba" games. If you want to be obtuse and trace everything back to the first instance of a similar thing in games feel free. If you want to be a normal person, Warcraft 3 was huge.

Good slate of Woff episodes coming up. I'm ending up less enamored with New Vegas as time passes, but I'm still looking forward to that.

Funkmaster General
Sep 13, 2008

Hey, man, I distinctly remember this being an episode of Spongebob. :colbert:

I don't think it's being obtuse or looking for "similar things" to point out that there was literally a popular user-made gametype called "defense of the ancients" prior to what most people credit with being the birth of the thing called "defense of the ancients."

Scorchy
Jul 15, 2006

Smug Statement: Elementary, my dear meatbag.

Funkmaster General posted:

Everyone always credits Warcraft 3 with having the original DOTA map, but I definitely remember seeing rooms titled "Defense of the ancients" in the Starcraft battle.net browser well before warcraft 3 released.

"Aeon of Strife" was the precursor to the DotA map.

WrightOfWay
Jul 24, 2010


The Ancients refers to a structure from Warcraft 3, so unless it was a backport there couldn't have been a Starcraft map called Defense of the Ancients.

Stan Taylor
Oct 13, 2013

Touched Fuzzy, Got Dizzy

Funkmaster General posted:

I don't think it's being obtuse or looking for "similar things" to point out that there was literally a popular user-made gametype called "defense of the ancients" prior to what most people credit with being the birth of the thing called "defense of the ancients."

I was more referring to the dude talking about Dune and Warcraft 1. I know about Aeon of Strife. WC3 was all the right things at all the right time to really blow up in customs though.

Funkmaster General
Sep 13, 2008

Hey, man, I distinctly remember this being an episode of Spongebob. :colbert:

Yeah I talked to a buddy and I think the literal "defense of the ancients" games in StarCraft were after Warcraft 3 came out and were renames of the aeon map. Never played either, just remembered seeing DOTA games in StarCraft and always thought it was weird that Warcraft got the credit.

Phone
Jul 30, 2005

親子丼をほしい。
It's not surprising though because WC3 is hero unit focused. Yeah, there were special units in SC; however, the UI wasn't designed around them. Not to mention that WC3s narrow FOV is significantly less narrow than SC.

Blizzard doesn't innovate or create groundbreaking new ideas or genres, they refine and polish the hell out of existing ones. For example, WOW isn't the first MMO, but it was the first MMO that wasn't a dumpster on fire rolling down five flights of stairs. Warcraft wasn't the first fantasy based RTS, but it was definitely the most user friendly and narratively interesting one.

HMS Boromir
Jul 16, 2011

by Lowtax
I feel like a big part of what makes WC3's editor and custom maps attractive to me, much moreso than SC1 or SC2, is that the game itself is in a pretty generic fantasy setting and the "creep" mechanic gives you a lot of generic monsters you can adapt to your purposes. It's hard to make something in Starcraft that feels like it's something other than Starcraft.

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Stan Taylor
Oct 13, 2013

Touched Fuzzy, Got Dizzy

HMS Boromir posted:

I feel like a big part of what makes WC3's editor and custom maps attractive to me, much moreso than SC1 or SC2, is that the game itself is in a pretty generic fantasy setting and the "creep" mechanic gives you a lot of generic monsters you can adapt to your purposes. It's hard to make something in Starcraft that feels like it's something other than Starcraft.

Another thing that made customs so great were the huge amounts of bespoke models for different unit types and factions. Game was loving huge.

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