Pillars of Eternity: pillars lasting more than four hours

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Pillars of Eternity: pillars lasting more than four hours

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

theDOWmustflow posted:

Chanters are cool but I feel like their spells take way too long to come online. Most of my fights are decided by the 4th stanza, which is around when Chanters are supposed to shine.

I got my chanter fella to chant about reloading faster and it's loving hilarious and more powerful than his skeletons or situational stun.

As for wizzards, I feel like people are just picking the wrong spells to use. It of course depends on enemies, But Aloth took out all the mobs in the drake lair with one level one spell. That's a bit better than having to spam abilities imo.

I also feel like Wizards could be fun solo because they have some ridiculous spells that will wipe your own party too.

# ¿ Mar 29, 2015 06:05

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# ¿ Apr 25, 2024 05:34

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

After starting a new character as a monk, I have to say, I feel like the martial classes feel very unexciting when you level up. Monk abilities require wounds you hope to not get, and barbarians get passives you don't notice in combat. Judging based on Eder, same for fighter (woop two knockdowns then sit there tanking)

Add in that ranged weapons feel more effective. Overall I'm really feeling the bad kind of D&D vibes. As in, casters are the only classes that let you be a death machine.

Any advice on more effective builds Stat and weapon wise for barb/monk?

# ¿ Mar 30, 2015 12:20

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

So after restarting a couple times after listening to grognards in this thread, I have come to the conclusion that I should focus on creating a living character because stats are very "Whose Line"

Death god monk here I come :black101:

# ¿ Mar 31, 2015 07:45

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Drifter posted:

A living character as opposed to...?

As in a literary sense. Like actually chose creation options based on who my character is, instead of a flat character with grognard stats.

# ¿ Mar 31, 2015 07:52

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Rookersh posted:

The difficulty feels uneven, and it's really bugging me.

I started on Normal, and while it started alright, by the time I hit the Temple of Eothas, I was just autoattacking my way through every fight it was so easy. It felt like an Easy mode.

So then I restarted on Hard, and that was good till about Raedrics Keep, where again, I could get away with basic buffs/auto attack for most fight, and I never felt in any sort of danger. It felt about what Normal would be in a game like this.

Then I started on PotD and got my poo poo kicked in because those loving ghosts can jump past the front line if they interrupt, and they spam that poo poo on Eder. And none of my CC ever touched enemies, because their defensive stats were so high I'd whiff 6 Knockdown's in a row, forcing me to blow my proverbial CC load on every battle in the hopes a single CC would hit so I could mitigate some damage. It's a challenge mode, which is fine, but I wasn't looking for one, I was looking for the games actual Hard mode.

It feels like there is a missing difficulty mode here somewhere between Hard and PotD where you have all the enemies of PotD/they have their higher damage, but they don't have defenses high enough to remove CC from the equation.

And christ, what is Easy like. Can you just solo the entire game without any problems?

I'm on level 10 of the paths on my easy mode save. I started the paths right after they opened and I only have 5 in my squad. Tanking as a barb.

The difference between easy and normal is huge btw. Between being able to solo the bear and wolf encounters have like 4 less wolves max.

That said, I feel like act 1 is not balanced around having a full party. I believe different classes and class combinations make the game way easier too. Even just switching the ranger dwarf with the chanter was a huge difference.

Also, why are people arguing about how a game makes numbers go up? You know they're going up regardless.

# ¿ Apr 5, 2015 00:44

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Wait, people are complaining that doing quests for the mafia means that the police and the vigilantes don't want to do business with you? Jesus christ. The game shouldn't have to tell you that, it's common sense.

# ¿ Apr 5, 2015 00:51

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

splifyphus posted:

I've started a second playthrough on PotD and I'm kind of wondering this too. You can go through the content with a lot of freedom and do many of the quests in any order you want, but sometimes the different outcomes are quite superficial and you get funneled down the same chute regardless.

I keep thinking of DA:O where in the last quarter of the game there was a huge parley with all the main characters and factions and it could play out in dozens of different ways on just one playthrough. I remember spending hours just reloading that part, trying different combinations and options. Compare that to the animancy hearings with the Duc at the end of Act II. No matter what faction you picked, no matter who your character is or how you play out the dialogue, Thaos marches in at the end and the city goes up in flames. Makes it feel like nothing you did in Act II mattered at all. The setting and writing in this game are leagues better than Dragon Age but overall the world does seem to lack some kind of vital interactivity that made DA:O very replayable for me.

Somebody posted something along the lines of 'you don't get your own personal story in this game, you play someone elses' and I think that's part of the problem. You being 'The Watcher' far outweighs any flavor you can give your character via the various race, culture and dialogue options and the Watcher's story is really just about closure for a nebulous 'someone' who's long dead. The character you create and play barely seems to exist in the game's world at all.

I wish this game had the 'origin' style start thing going that DA:O did, where the race, class, and culture you picked slotted you into one of 7 or so unique opening sequences that were each quite lengthy and involved. Really helped make it feel like your character belonged and had a personal connection to the world. Here you can customize the poo poo out of your Watcher on paper but no matter what you're a drifter with no past when you start and a drifter with no future with you finish.

Continuing with the writing chat. IMHO, this game really feels like playing a well thought out, pre-built campaign with a new DM. Lots of cool detail and lore there, but hilariously ridiculous railroading and it matters more that your party has the skill checks than actual character development. Even the multi-ending in quests remind me of a new DM i played with. He shoehorned in the written rewards and ending even though we just blew apart the encounter in the most unsuspected ways.

# ¿ Apr 5, 2015 06:42

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Rascyc posted:

I just can't imagine how they're going to do a use-based skill system that is fun for all crowds. I was pretty disinterested after reading that too.

[e] I guess it was kind of fun in Heroes Quest when I think about it longer. Hours of throwing daggers at the practice board behind town...

Idk how they're doing it, but I feel like a use based system has shortcomings in terms of fun early game. Imho I think a cool way to remedy that would be a light version of equipment based skills, kind of like GW2 weapons.

Also, in terms of PoE. How the gently caress do I make an effective chanter? Just made a new character and hired one, and also have an act 3 save with kana and they both feel useless.

# ¿ Mar 22, 2016 21:53

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Yeah, I think the main reason chanter feels so useless is that on lower difficulties battles don't last long enough to chant, and on higher difficulties, the player knows enough that battles still don't last long enough. Summoning a couple skeletons when the last enemy is at half health even in a big fight blows. Maybe I'll switch him out with a druid companion.

# ¿ Mar 23, 2016 01:35

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

I usually keep one or two of my back line as off tank to catch anyone that gets past the frontline. Paladins and druids are both especially good for this. But Rangers can do enough damage in melee that the enemy isn't a threat, and Mages have plenty of cone and touch spells.

It also sounds like maybe your front line is positioned too close to eachother, or you don't have a fighter or hold the line.

# ¿ Mar 23, 2016 23:22

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

2house2fly posted:

Heodan dying in the biawac and Calisca getting killed by the trapped floor ftw

I've never seen the latter, please explain. Also, you get plenty of free bows, equip them in weapon slot two and change right after everyone is dead while the game is making sure combat is over if you really want to save heodan.

Also speaking of backlines, gently caress spectres.

# ¿ Mar 24, 2016 00:22

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

kujeger posted:

if you choose to rest once you enter the ruins, she goes off by herself.

this is a bad decision for her.

That's awesome. But she's never run off when I've rested. Though I've always said, no we need to move on before camping.

# ¿ Mar 24, 2016 00:32

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Wizard Styles posted:

Yeah, I was just checking what happens when you don't qualify for anything/if there's a Monk-specific option.

Also, I'm kinda sad there's no Disappointer-specific outcome to the "fire at his attacker" option where the bullet misses, hits a rock and ricochets into Heodan's butt.

Finding the disapointer at level 15 of the paths made me laugh harder than most things in the game. I do wish it lived up to its name though

# ¿ Mar 24, 2016 00:45

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

I got that paladin perk and a hunting bow on my paladin so I can snipe any charmed ally asap.

# ¿ Mar 24, 2016 16:13

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

I was actually just wondering if people have been doing challenges a la FFV.

I feel like a 6 man fighter team would be bizarrely fun to play.

# ¿ Mar 24, 2016 16:27

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Mr. Neutron posted:

Can you elaborate? Perhaps I am missing something but fighters don´t seem to bring much to a party..

You could specialize one or two to be full tank, one or two for dps, one or two for ranged and pick a few to be lore masters for scrolls. Especially with the cross class stuff I feel like it might be more interesting than say six wizards/druids just making GBS threads out aoe.

# ¿ Mar 24, 2016 17:56

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

The one where you just pull a scorpion and yank that lovely wizard into your loving embrace is one of my favourites.

Also for 6 fighters, imagine that rogue or shadows face when they teleport to the back lines and it's 3 more fighters :getin:

# ¿ Mar 24, 2016 18:04

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Captain Scandinaiva posted:

I wonder if it's viable to make a total glass cannon party? Like 5 rogues and a barb with dumped res and some kind of CC weapon who rely on murdering everything before they get looked at funny.

is there any strategy to buffs vs debuffs that lower accuracy/attack speed? I guess it's balanced somehow but it seems buffs are just better, since they always "hit".

Six rangers with 4 blunderbuss' each. With the animal pack flank murdering anything left.

# ¿ Mar 25, 2016 04:57

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Under the vegetable posted:

dragon age 2 is possibly the worst AAA game released in decades, on all levels.

Arkham Knight, whichever that hosed up rear end creed game was.

And at least DA 2 improved the visuals of combat to almost be satisfying (though it's just as terrible as origins elsewise). And the storytelling was actually an improvement over origins in that tension and the main plot moving actually existed(though it did lack responsitivity compared to its predecessor)

Really, DA2's biggest flaw is that it's a sequel. They improved the flaws, but didn't maintain or improve the good parts of origins. That and the obviously reused dungeons, even PSO did that better years previous.

# ¿ Mar 25, 2016 09:07

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

I've always preferred portraits like in dragon age where they just reuse the actual character model. Even if they look less cool.

I think a fun option would be more levels. Like obviously if you could be level 20, even the adra dragon would be a cump, but that is one of my favourite parts of tabletop, killing everything including gods. So it'd be cool if there was an option for that turned off boss and beating the game achievements but let you gain like 5 or even 10 extra levels.

Along the same vein, a feat every level option.

Idc where the main game is. But a living lands dlc.

# ¿ Mar 25, 2016 18:08

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

The battle of Yenwood was bizarre on my easy playthrough(i suck at DnD, so i figured id suck at this) because they hype up this big battle and needing soldiers, and then i mowed them all down almost single handedly(that ogre you can hire did kill like 6 dudes and the captain)

Re: cameos, have one companion quest to find out who their father is, only for all signs to lead to a certain fiery priest.

# ¿ Mar 26, 2016 08:29

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Isn't Morrowind an example of the "static level scaling" you refuted though? Like, instead of scaling to the player on the fly, they predict the level of a player either when they should get there, or when that loot is appropriate. I agree that's a more rewarding and interesting experience for the player though. Getting better or smarter yourself and getting that +2 Sword of Cool early is fun as hell.

I think the main problem with Beth games is that they double down on vertical advancement . In that you get better stats to hit harder, while at the same time get better swords to hit harder.

Imho, the problem with scaling in newer Bethesda games is less the enemy scaling( I like the direction they went with FO4) and more the loot scaling and a severe lack of static, unique items.

Witcher 3 did it well I think in that there was very few items to vertically advance outside of quests, which they specifically put suggested levels next to. So the game could be balanced around what level and items CDPR knew the character would be/have. Though level restricted equipment sucks. I would prefer another approach, but it's well executed.

I like also how pillars focuses a bit more on horizontal advancement via levels and vertical via equipment. Though this is also why classes that can focus on vertical can get stupid powerful (rogue, ranger)
In fact, Ranger feels the least fun to me because there's so much less horizontal advancement. Which is a real shame, I feel like animal choice should have given you more options like priest/paladin orders.

# ¿ Mar 26, 2016 21:54

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

In terms of progression I want it to be close to x=y if it were a graph.

# ¿ Mar 26, 2016 22:09

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

I agree though that I'm not a fan of Witcher 3s take. But I think it was well executed, which is as, of not more important than the base idea.

In regards to x=y i should probably clarify that personally I think y=1/4x would probably be the lower end of the fun spectrum and y=x on the upper end. And that I prefer the pillars approach where Y is items, X is levels and the abilities they add.

Or say dark souls, where there's a choke point on vertical progression based on player skill. Sure there are infinite souls to get, but the exponential cost for weapon and level upgrades means you need to get good enough to kill hard enemies to more efficiently get larger soul quantities. But if you're between average to good, you will adapt and learn the gameplay at a similar pace to acquiring levels and items.

I think the bonus of nearly even progression is that you can get fun and weird gimmicks. Providing that vertical progression is separated from horizontal, like items vs skill or items vs levels. Like getting the daedric crescent early, or the level one runs of dark souls.

If progression is mostly vertical or horizontal, that's boring as hell imho. Partly because not being able to one shot starting enemies feels like a lack of progression and just pressing A with bigger numbers means that there's no difference between the first and last hour of a game.

# ¿ Mar 26, 2016 22:54

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Octo1 posted:

For PoE2 I hope they do circular progression where your character starts at level 1, grows old as you play, dies, and then gets reincarnated as a level 1 character again.

This would be a rad way to do NG+ or a pretty cool twist in the middle of a plot. Especially if it's a prequel.

# ¿ Mar 26, 2016 23:29

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

I haven't beaten the game yet on either file. Are those monks really more bullshit than these stupid four armed xaurips that paralyze you in WM?
At least the cool pet is worth doing that a dozen times.

# ¿ Mar 27, 2016 01:31

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

CommissarMega posted:

Honestly, you don't really need to sneak and search, you never find anything really stupendous anyway, apart from the first area- and even then it's a rubbish pistol that's only worth selling for 150 cp.

On the first level of the paths there's a rapier that gives +1engaged enemy. At that character level it makes Eder stupid good because he can hold 4 enemies.

Also, is the Temple of eothas really that hard on hard and above? I had an easy time with a level 1 adventurer, eder and aloth level 2.

# ¿ Mar 27, 2016 20:22

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Haha, I hadn't heard of tidefall before. But I just got that sweet cursed estoc from WM

# ¿ Mar 27, 2016 22:31

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Watched the beginning of a barbarian solo tc and it was crazy how precise and fast they did the temple. Idk if I could do a solo tk because I love clearing everything out. Though I hear that might be possible with a paladin.

# ¿ Mar 27, 2016 23:40

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

The Little Kielbasa posted:

I desperately want to love this game, but the combat is just seems so unpleasant. I always thought the most annoying part of BG2 was the whole "casting the right spell-stripping spells in the correct order remove all the protections mages have" dance. And it's like the creators of PoE were like "that was awesome, let's make every encounter all about matching buffs and debuffs for various attributes depending on the attack type and monster!" Every time the combat music starts, I groan inwardly and start digging through my piles of unintuitively-named spells. It's such a slog, and 99% of the time you don't even get xp for it.

It's entirely possible that I just don't get it. Maybe I'm officially too old to learn new poo poo and should just switch to story mode.

I felt this way too a while ago. I did two things to fall in love. 1. Stopped playing it for like half a year and 2. When i came back i started on Easy, not because i thought i couldn't handle normal or even hard, but because i didn't want to handle that without more knowledge.

Basic Chunnel posted:

Mechanics would be more appealing to me if I thought traps were worth laying

The worst part is that the accuracy is based on the person who lays it's mechanics skill, and only one trap is allowed per party member. So that guy that's force to specialized to remove traps? he doesn't get to be the trap king either, because essentially one trap an encounter. Even though you can clearly lay six down at once.

# ¿ Mar 28, 2016 18:41

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Grieving Mother is like the only companion that's not a typical dnd character idea. Like they're all done well but she's so much more unique.
Edit: and due to rerolling idk why you think she's weak?

Another note, you'll be a third of the way done with the game by the time you get the monk, rogue, or barbarian character. The rogue is the latest companion you can get too.

Nasgate fucked around with this message at 09:06 on Mar 29, 2016

# ¿ Mar 29, 2016 09:03

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

There's a loading tool tip that says backer's are the gold named NPCs with their fanfiction.

So am I reading right in thinking that martial classes shouldn't bother too much with might? Really just druids and mages?

Also, what's the stat for saving that dude in WM? Wanna save them both next time.

# ¿ Mar 31, 2016 06:54

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Cool, thanks for the clarification.

Also, can vouch for might being able to replace the prybar. Though I habitually buy those kinds of items due to them being cheap and useful.

# ¿ Mar 31, 2016 08:11

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Samuel Clemens posted:

That seems to be a general issue with creature-specific accuracy bonuses and aoe attacks. It doesn't work on Sacred Immolation or the The Dragon Trashed either, for instance. My guess is that since those abilities don't target a specific creature, the game doesn't realise that it should apply the bonus.

Speaking of bugs, is it just me or does the Redeemer's Vessel-destroying property no longer work?

Did you have it before the update? I didn't start WM till afterwards and it's working for me. Nothing quite like causing full health dead dwarfs to explode.

Any suggested level for the wizard tower thing? Also any tips on the dragon in White March would be cool.

# ¿ Apr 2, 2016 20:48

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Zore posted:

I wish guns were good.

I've tried to make my gunRanger work but Powder Burn is hilariously bad compared to Twinned Arrows, Durgan Steel does fuckall for then, there isn't a soulbound gun or even an interesting unique one and 5 DR pierce falls off really goddamn hard when stuff has 20+ DR.

Even with Gunner/Swift Ila nocked her arrows/Swift Aim guns are just so loving slow and do less damage per hit than;

My pet
Druids in shapeshift
A rogue sneak attack

And attack more than twice as slowly. DPS is lol.

Plus Rangers have one of the best weapons in the game in Stormcaller which is just stupidly powerful.

I haven't fully upgraded it, but so far my ranger is doing less dps with storm caller than when I had her using a pistol. The bonus procs and spells make up for it though. It was a total cock tease in the dungeon with the Devil of Carroc because the notes in the lab say that one dudes pistol is bound to his soul, but it's just a unique.

# ¿ Apr 2, 2016 23:44

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Zore posted:

Yeah, Storm-caller doesn't do great per-shot but best of shock/Pierce and the Returning storm proc it gets as you bind it make it absolute murder.

The fact that's it's a dual damage ranged option also makes it way better. Especially since so few Non boss enemies have shock dr.

What's a good party comp for dragon fights? I know the Adra is easy to abuse chanter summons on. I haven't gotten to the sky dragon, but the white March one immediately breathed half our hp away and surrounded me with ice blights and spectres. I assume using Eder to initiate dialogue and hiravais/aloth hiding in the back to rain judgement down is a good strat? My PC is a tanky paladin.

# ¿ Apr 3, 2016 02:02

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

Thank you. I've been meaning to re-roll my pally anyway since he's not quite as good at killing things so I might make him tankier. Especially since his haunted estoc owns anyway just by hitting things.

I figured I'd hit level 15 before trying the 3. And changing my party up. I'm using Durance, a ranger and the 3 dlc companions, which is no good against a dragon.

# ¿ Apr 3, 2016 02:53

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

pentyne posted:

Tell me if I'm doing this right or I'm going to/have hit a wall

Eder as my main tank

Pallegina as the off tank/DPS

When playing content at the recommended level its been tough but manageable after 1-2 tries for major fights. I'm playing on Normal and since level 6 have been having an easy time. I'm level 10 going in to Elmswood and got the warning "you are over-leveled for this content" but when I tried to fight the ogres in the north I got wrecked 3x in a row. The rest of the party is Wizard PC, Aloth, Durance, and Kana.

It seems like having a high DR is useful for characters that don't already have really high defense. Eder's just been the "run up and engage while everyone else shoots guy" for my entire game and is always the last one to go down in a fight. Prior to trying to use Pallegina Grieving mother was the other member and still most fights were tough but fair.

How are you running Aloth and your PC? Aloth can kind of do whatever, but is a bit more suited to spamming spells in a large aoe, or long DoT. He has decent might and perception so he can go either way with nuke or debuff focus. If you're running both more middle ground you might not have enough dps, though Kana has access to dragon thrashed and ogre summons.

# ¿ Apr 7, 2016 12:03

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

GM rules because the soothing bell sound is miles ahead of hearing the voiced call outs.

# ¿ Apr 8, 2016 09:24

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# ¿ Apr 25, 2024 05:34

Nasgate: Jun 7, 2011

multijoe posted:

No offence to any extremely cool dudes who may be reading, but she was the most boring and underwritten character in the game who's not GM. Whilst I can see what Sawyer was going for with her, she just doesn't come together in any satisfying way and even discounting that section of RPG fandom who's hate her regardless for being black and female I can't really fault people for not really liking her.

It's funny you say this, because imho Palegina is the only companion with any character at all. The others are essentially tropes and one minded quests. Wheras Palegina has conflicting motivations like an actual person would. She's also a pretty boss offtank aura paladin too. In addition, in my experience she has a lot of interjections to flesh her out, much like Eder in act one and Hiravais in act 3.

# ¿ Apr 9, 2016 02:17

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