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Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


VivaNova posted:

This person is a terrible influence. Do bowmore or ecco's game so I can play one before I become busy again!

I followed Vivanova here and am signing up as a result! Also this game looks cool.

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Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Sorry I'm late all! Just wanted to confirm that I'm here. I've been tied up at work with a bad computer virus so it might be a few hours before I can catch up and play.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


I can't believe I'm using Mafia to de-stress after work.

GUISSEPPE PIZZAPIE posted:

I didn't get a PM yet you are confirming? ##vote Opop

Opopanax posted:

Yeah I guess he did town first ##vote diqnol

Opopanax posted:

Ok, if people are actually starting to take this seriously no I did not receive a PM, I just wanted to do a JFK voice and then have a jokey back and forth with Diqnol. I didn't think anyone actually believed I scum slipped but I guess I can see how you would.

##vote Opopanax - I'm trying to picture a scenario where someone not getting a role PM would use the phrase "he did town first" and coming up empty.

In other news:

Poison Mushroom posted:

##vote Poison Mushroom

Max posted:

Hello, everyone should be voting PM for claiming scum.

Max - any reads outside of PMush? I understand policy-voting people claiming scum, but feel like holding to that 100% (despite the fact that it was pretty obviously a joke) is lazy at best and scummy at worst.

TheRam posted:

~~~MAX CONFIRMED TOWN AND OPOP CONFIRMED SCUM DUE TO ISSUES IN THE BOWMORE DELIVERY SYSTEM~~~

I'm with you on Opop. Calling Max "confirmed town" because he said he didn't get a PM might be a little bit hasty.

GUISSEPPE PIZZAPIE posted:

MT are you Opop's best scum friend and do you want to kiss him on the mouth mwah mwah he tastes like musty cigarettes

I'm pretty sure Opop sticking his foot in his mouth covers up the musty cigarette smell.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Opopanax posted:

Do you guys really think I just blundered in here without reading a single thing the instant I got my PM?

fiery_valkyrie posted:

So are you saying you did get a PM?

I'm genuinely confused by the fact that people are talking about anything besides Opop at the moment.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


fiery_valkyrie posted:

Also, you think you've caught Opop on a scum slip. Isn't he too experienced to be that careless?

You're telling me with a straight face that you think that this

quote:

Opopanax posted:

I am er ah confahming

GUISSEPPE PIZZAPIE posted:

I didn't get a PM yet you are confirming? ##vote Opop

Opopanax posted:

Yeah I guess he did town first ##vote diqnol

and

quote:

Opopanax posted:

Do you guys really think I just blundered in here without reading a single thing the instant I got my PM?

fiery_valkyrie posted:

So are you saying you did get a PM?

Opopanax posted:

I'm actually going to be pretty MIA for the next two days so I will ##vote wall mon now just in case I miss deadline

were intentional pre-planned jokes and not scum slips / him running away?

Rarity posted:

diqnol, you're up mega late. Don't miss sleep for mafia :ohdear:

I pulled an all-nighter last night. Not on purpose, I just couldn't shut my brain off. :sigh:

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


wall monitor posted:

I still don't like firey valkyrie, my vote is standing for now

WM: Can you take me through what you were thinking when you posted this?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Max posted:

Why do people call it cuddle now?

It's a less-offensive alternative to "lynch". See also: "lunch" and "dunk".

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Rarity posted:

I think you'll find it's called plorp now :colbert:

e.g. We should all plorp wall monitor today

Rarity, what is your read on Opop? I hate speculative cases but in my head I'm already mentally casing you as his scumsis.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


GUISSEPPE PIZZAPIE posted:

I agree with MT about that, it was just A LITTLE PREMATURE to GET INTO THAT, murmur TWIN

I've found I enjoy Mafia most when I just say every single thing I'm thinking as I think it. :)

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


wall monitor posted:

I still don't like firey valkyrie, my vote is standing for now

Murmur Twin posted:

WM: Can you take me through what you were thinking when you posted this?

My read on WM is pretty much dependent on if they answer this post.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


wall monitor posted:

The original vote on Valkyrie was because his vote on me really seemed like he was reaching for a chance to drop suspicion on someone.

That post in particular... what was going through my head was that I needed to keep posting, was still kind of grasping for something to say, and thought, 'hey, should I recant my FV vote... nah. Okay, I'll post about that.' Perhaps not the best move given the reaction I got from it.

It sounds like WM felt the pressure to post but didn't see any good cases. That says "newbie" (no offense) more than necessarily "town" or "scum" to me.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


VivaNova posted:

You are arguing that Opop made a scum slip, then came back a day later and made the same exact scumslip! Which is gloriously ridiculous if true, but is it really likely?? I'm want it to be, but lean no.

Let's say it was a joke. What's your read on Opop?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Just noticed this on a reread. Max, regarding PMush:

Max posted:

Back in my day, you didn't get away with calling yourself scum, even in joke vote phase.

Max posted:

You don't understand. I'm used to always taking people out, even if it's a joke, when they say anything resembling "I am scum" which you did. You can say you're joking, but that's moot. The words were still said.

If you feel this way, why aren't you voting Opop? He either scumslipped or made a joke about being scum.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Max posted:

even if it's a joke, when they say anything resembling "I am scum"

For some reason my brain parsed those two things in reverse order. Fair enough.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Diqnol posted:

I like MT for town as of now as well. MT has been on the same page as me about a number of things.

:rip: I'll carry on your legacy as best I can!


Rarity posted:

I'm not sure cause I am massively hanging today and a still a bit high so I'm not really thinking straight right now.

Same here - I'm using Mafia as an excuse to not get out of bed :) I just finished a re-read, expect some try-hand cases within the next few hours.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


My point of game on the view so far centers on the Opop slip.

Opopanax posted:

(a) Yeah I guess he did town first ##vote diqnol

(b) I am a N0 tracker, and I tracked bowmore to you, so I know for a fact you got a PM. Why you lying, huh? What do you have to prove?

(c) Bowmore thinks I'm cool and the best so he gave me a special role that allowed me to track him, somehow only to you. You are the only person in the game who received a role PM.

I feel perfectly fine about how I caught you.

He was either lying or joking - the best way to assess it is to read his tone. His first four posts ran the gambit from (a) kind of deadpan to (b) defensive to (c) false-confident. If it was a joke, why wasn't there a punchline? Or at the very least an emoticon or something indicating humor? To me the tone solidly pointed to Opop covering up a lie.

Right now I have to look at the most suspicious people as the ones that were trying to move the vote off of him. So before I go into individual cases, here's a general question for Rarity, Max, and EXAKT (The first three people I'm going to case individually:



These posts were all within 6 hours of Diqnol casing Opop, and all of them basically ignored it to make weak pitches on other people. So to you three: When you guys made these cases, had you not read the Diq/Opop interaction yet or did you not think it was significant? And was there something specifically that made you think "joke" over "lie"?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Rarity posted:

Dude, it was months ago, I don't remember where in the thread it was. Essentially, at LYLO-1 MMM was onto all three of us hardcore but he wasn't getting enough support. That night, following your thinking we should have killed MMM. Instead we killed yuming, which convinced MMM he'd been wrong about us being scum and ended up with us getting a flawless victory. You want more details, go check yourself.

Bonus: you get to watch me as town be the only one in the game to believe MMM lying about a Survivor claim and drive myself slowly crazy.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


I'm going to combine multiple posts into single on-theme quotes for the sake of readability.

RARITY

Rarity posted:

Opop I will give you this one opportunity to REDEEM YOURSELF. Will you take it?

Not in the least. All you have to do is... vote wall monitor!

Haha. I'm glad you agree about WM though. Consider your redemption pending based on further commitment!

Obviously there was a level of joking around to this, but I think a town Rarity should have tried to get Opop to make a solid case. Instead she solicits a vote on WM, which he obliges her on before vanishing.

Rarity posted:

What? How? I'm gonna need you to explain that in more detail. The only thing you need to remember is that WM has never been scum before so he will be prone to newbie scum mistakes.

I'm having difficulty relating what you're describing with what WM posted. I wouldn't call what he was doing as putting himself out there, I'd say it's trying to sneak it through under the radar. To me his posts read a lot like someone trying to be careful.

I guess we just have a difference of opinion then cause I think it's exactly what a first time super nervous scum would do.

Rarity posted:

Ok, I see your point. But I don't think that's the only way newbie scum would play and assuming scum only act one way is the kind of thinking that allows scum to win.

In the first block of quotes, Rarity implies that WM's game has the tendencies of how newbie scum plays. After Diqnol points out that newbie scum would have scumbuddies to rely on, Rarity changes her mind: Iin the second quote,. the bold part more or less contradicts the original point she was making on Wall Monitor, which implies to me that she never believed her case on WM in the first place.

Rarity posted:

I'm busy making my mixtape for Byers's game, my push on WM looks to have stalled so ##vote Opop, see ya tomorrow

This feels like scum covering up her tracks after a failed defense attempt. That said, I've been listening to Rarity's mixtape while I've been casing her and it's very good. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=playlist

TheRam posted:

I'm kind of intentionally ignoring this thread for a few more hours before I do a full read, but I really like your posting Murmur Twin.

Thanks :) I think this is our third game together and we've never really interacted yet, but I enjoy your posting and have a town read on you so far. Looking forward to your reads!

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


EXAKT Science posted:

Just feels like you have an agenda, friend :)

I think EXAKT is scum who is (a) throwing out questions to give the false impression of content (b) throwing out votes/reads willy-nilly to see what sticks.

I looked over his posts on Day 1 and found it really dificult to see a firm stance on anything (with the unfortunate exception of his defending Opop):

EXAKT Science posted:

Oh hey Hal! This post is scummy as well! Is there anyone you would vote?

Hey TheRam, who do you think is scum?

VivaNova, it's nice to meet you! I'm EXAKT and I'm new! I noticed that you don't want to vote either of the vote leaders yet. Do you have any scumreads yet?

This is funny because it means (Rarity) you're continuing your streak of never getting my alignment right. Maybe you're scum again!

I think it's really weird that WM hasn't voted for Opop. Why not? His votes on f_v are also terrible.

WM can you show, with quotes, why you're townreading DHD?

I look forward to when TheRam shows up and posts, because I have some weird ~vibes~ from him. His interactions with Opop in particular.

Opop are you going to scumhunt or just keep trying to extend jokephase?

Max you're being super silly. Also,

It's interesting that (Viva) you're jumping to defend him (Max).

Oh hey DHD! What do you think about Viva, WM, and Max, and do you think any of them could be scum with Opop?

Yes, I want to vote Opop. I'm waiting for TheRam as well and am going to be here until deadline.

DHD I think it's interesting that you're latching on to the weakest part of the case on Opop. Also you should case Hal.

Um no. I'm playing the game too. I was asking Max for some more elaboration on why he was agreeing with you, and I thought that your reaction to my asking that question was interesting. I want to hear it in Max's words is all.

The way TheRam was just completely absent doesn't sit right with me.

Also I want to look more closely at DHD and Viva.

Day 2 it continues:

EXAKT Science posted:

##vote Viva best vote for today.

Wait KB you seriously think that WM could be scum with Opop?

Hey TheRam I think what we have is just a clash of playstyles. I find your posting difficult to read, and it's really frustrating. which is the biggest reason I was suspicious of you.

Yeah okay, that's a decent case. Mostly it seems off to me that Viva was casting shade on both Opop and WM when she could have probably gotten away with just casing Opop.

I feel even better about f_v now, because that feels like a real case to me. It's incorrect, but who gives a poo poo?

If I were scum with Opop, who would be our other scumbuddy/scumbuddies and why?

I don't like this post because Rarity is talking about what she would do if she were scum

See this would honestly be enough to ping for me, honestly. You're scumhunting for yourself first, and that goal just so happens to align with the goal of the town.

Seriously, we should be voting Viva today.

Hmm, I had PMush as null when I did my reread last night, but I really don't like her last few posts.

Double agreed. I would be perfectly happy dunking either Rarity or Viva today.

Disclaimer: I know this case essentially amounts to me just reposting a lot of what EXAKT has said. My main point is that it feels more like he's trying to generate content than he is finding scum and casing them. I find Rarity scummier than EXAKT but am suspicious of him.

Heading out of the hosue for awhile but I'll be around tonight!

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


EXAKT Science posted:

Wait where do I defend Opop? :confused:

(Phone post)

Oops! My original case on you started with you casing Hal instead of Opop after Diqnol's case and that I felt you were redirecting attention for him. As I continued reading I was more pinged by your casing style than that vote (since you unvoted Hal) so I removed that part.

I acknowledge that you were in favor of the Opop lynch, for what it's worth.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Hah, I wasn't trying to impress anyone with that image! When people ask me technical questions I've found that they usually respond better to screenshots with boxes/circles/arrows than they do to ordered lists. I just happened to see three different things on one page that felt shady so was taking a shortcut. :)

VIVANOVA

VivaNova, defending Opop posted:

You are arguing that Opop made a scum slip, then came back a day later and made the same exact scumslip! Which is gloriously ridiculous if true, but is it really likely?? I'm want it to be, but lean no.

1. Early ~scumslip~ : Dumb. Anyone voting Opop solely for this reason is likewise dumb. Thinking of MT, DHD and TheRam here since Hal and Diq at least backed their thoughts up. Maybe PM.

Oops!

Everything I've said earlier on the others applies here; I don't feel the need to repeat myself in-depth but assume I find anyone who thought Opop's slip was a joke to be suspicious.

VivaNova posted:

D1: Yes, I said Opop or WM in a post a few hours ago.

D2: Ok, everything else I have to say is about Exact Science- MT's case on him, his case on me, very probably my case on him. You will need to wait until tomorrow evening for serious casing/effort, but if you have specific questions I can try to answer before then.

What happened to your case on WM?

VivaNova posted:

I just noticed the deadline is Monday, not Tuesday as I had assumed. This is not ideal, but ##vote Exact.

Read his posts before the end of D1, he's trying to salvage the situation by setting up today's lynch.
Read FV's case on him.
Read his case on me on the last page. Everything he quotes has a perfectly logical non-scum response, but he's not interested in hearing my interpretation of events - he's tunnel visioned into interpreting everything I posted this game as a scumtell. Cause his decision is obviously made up and he's (over)manufacturing evidence. He's scum and he has obvious reasons to pick me to case, but there's no great evidence against me and he's scrambling to act like there is. I feel more strongly about this vote than almost any other one I can remember. Please reread him and consider this.

preview: drat, ram

This feels scummy to me. Viva is focusing on her conclusions rather than the process to get there.

I was going to case Max but I don't have him in the same tier as Rarity/Viva/EXAKT at the moment so I feel like it would make more sense to wait on it. Off the top of my head I lean ##vote Rarity (her vote on EXAKT and subsequent disappearance is scummy whereas EXAKT/Viva casing each other makes me think one is town) but I'll be around later tonight for more discussions.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


One other thing while it's on my mind - I've noticed that my main weakness as of late has been identifying and casing lurker scum. In an effort to not keep repeating the same mistakes:

Poison Mushroom posted:

I'm trying the opposite approach this time, flying rear end-first into whatever whims or feelings I've got and taking the game as seriously as a game should be taken. We'll see how it works!

CapitalistPig posted:

Sorry you rolled scum viva.

##vote viva

wall monitor posted:

Lemme try to put together something more substantial than gut.

PMush, CPig, WM - why do you think the people you think are scum are scum? What stands out the most right now to you?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


VivaNova posted:

All the votes on us are rude. Is it cause we're too pretty?

Pretty scummy! :boom:

(I'd like to put it out there that I like all of Rarity, EXAKT, and Vivanova as people and it's only a game and blah blah blah you guys know how I roll)

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


First off, hi Byers and PMach!

I was offline most of yesterday and am in the process of re-reading based on new information. After a super-skim:

Propaganda Machine posted:

murder to win, we have not had a proper slapfight yet

I'll make the next thing I say a terrible case that you can jump on :j::respek::j:

bowmore posted:

TheRam Unconfirmed Mason Lover Town-Aligned was murdered Night 2

King Burgundy Unconfirmed Mason Lover Town-Aligned died from sadness Night 2

Also!!

Propaganda Machine replaces Hal Incandenza

Byers2142 replaces Poison Mushroom

If Hal/PMush were the same alignment I feel like bowmore would have replaced PMush with PMach for the sake of simplicity. One of them is scum :tinfoil:

:rip: King B/TheRam - I got those things you sent me.

I plan to re-read everyone at some point during the game day - right now off the top of my head I think it's Viva and a lurker.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Max posted:

I don't want to quote a private message I got, but I received a message along with being told I'm a lover that clearly indicates that I'm meant to be killed, one way or another.

Hmm. Was the letter written by a dead player? Can you guess from the writing style who it might have been?

Murmur Twin posted:

:rip: King B/TheRam - I got those things you sent me.

In retrospect, maybe my gifts were from Rarity/TheRam. I have two of them but would rather not go into specifics at this time.

King Burgundy posted:

BTW, I just want to put this out there, since it doesn't affect anything, and it might lend us some insights later.

I was given a gift from the departed.

I am now an unconfirmed mason with TheRam.

I was assuming this would have come from Diqnol on his death. But I can't be sure of that, and I don't know if Opop would have been able to do something similar.

This was where the first masonry came from. My guess is that when KB died he passed it on?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Byers2142 posted:

i just realized I misread the OP, wills are a min of 125 characters, not a max. I cut mine down three times to get under the wire!

I thought it was "125 words minimum" for night 1 and still overshot that by a ton :words:

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Max posted:

It literally just says Die.



That's just German for "The".

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Byers2142 posted:

What? Seriously, that's a legitimate point? I don't get it at all.

Murmur Twin posted:

I'll make the next thing I say a terrible case that you can jump on :j::respek::j:

It was a joke! The first (and only I think?) time I've Mafia'ed with PMach, I opened the game with a case where I said that "she usually capitalizes her posts but is typing in lowercase" and we proceeded to angrily case each other as town for the rest of the game.

We won though :slick:

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Hi guys! Expect cases to start trickling in from me tonight.

Max posted:

Viva Nova and I are now lovers, apparently. I guess they have that ability. :words:

fiery_valkyrie posted:

Really? You cant imagine a town player thinking you're making a stupid move by letting the scum know how to get a double kill again tonight? :words:

Max posted:

You realize the only people that could confer that power are scum, right?

I'm not sure that's necessarily true.

bowmore posted:

This game has No power roles. I repeat! It is an all vanilla game.

But there is an exception…

Every night every player will send me a PM with a “last will and testament”. A letter that will be read out after they have died. Every letter sent from the start of the game will be published in this way. Each letter will be the minimum length of a 125 characters (a maxed out tweet) with no maximum length.

Upon the death of a player they may send current living player or players gifts from the afterlife concluding their business in life.

TheRam posted:

SCUM PICKS (ordered most to least)
Rarity (not sure between rarity viva, but I think rarity pips it)
Viva
Max (very very awkward over all, shows intellect, has an pretty intellectual scum game imo)

Max posted:

It literally just says Die.

If I were to guess, I would say that TheRam thinks that Max/Viva are scum and was trying to give us a way to take them both out in one fell swoop.

The problem with that is looking over Max's reactions, they're either (a) written from a town POV or (b) a result of some of the best acting I've ever seen. It didn't seem to dawn on him that it might have been done as a town move against scum, which makes me feel like he's town. This is problematic because I don't feel the same way about Viva.

Vivanova posted:

(long post about FV)

Now then. I would like someone to tell me why Exakt shouldn't be killed today.

Also same question for Pig.

Why case FV and declare that you think she's scum and then push for two other people?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


CapitalistPig posted:

Well, to be fair Ive barely read anything.

Ill look back at exakt when I get a chance (probably after work because Im on my last break now)

do me do me!

lol you're a dumb

##vote byers

I forgot

##vote wall

To answer Viva's question, I'd be fine dunking Pig tonight. As usual, I have a complete null-read on him, so this is more based on the fact that either

(a) Pig is scum, or
(b) Pig is town who isn't reading the game, isn't trying to make cases, and voting at random

I just lost a game to CPig as scum because whenever I went to case him, there was nothing there, and so I spun my wheels trying to find scum elsewhere while he beat me by just shutting up. I don't want that to happen again. Yes, this apparently makes me dumb.

I have the same basic feeling about DHD (who hasn't posted at all this game day) and WM (who I need to go back and re-read).

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


VivaNova posted:

Ok, MT, this is odd.

Cause I actually think you're right- it makes perfect sense that it was Ram, it's more likely than the scum did it scenario I suggested to Max this morning,

and what byers suggested isn't possible.

I wrote this in response to byers when he was discussing it later:
"I came up with that scenario after considering max’s theory that scum did it. Initially I actually felt it was obviously rarity/kb/ram, and now I’m back to suspecting it was Ram."

But I didn't post it cause YOU said you received 2 gifts last night. That's a problem cause I got another 1 last night that wasn't the lover thing. Are you positive you got 2 different gifts last night, (bowmore's been sorta confusing with the PMs)?

Hmm! I am not sure - I jumped to the conclusion that there were two gifts because there are two abilities, but upon a reread it says "a gift from the departed".

EXAKT Science posted:

I'm not lovers with anyone and I probably shouldn't be anywhere near LYLO, so now's the best time to misdunk me if you're going to.

Who do you think is scum? You had a lot of theories early on in the game, how have they changed in light of Rarity / KB / TheRam all flipping town?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


VivaNova posted:

If I didn't make this clear, I got a gun last night. I assume from Rarity and I assume to blow ES's idiot head off with, but I'm open to suggestions and grovelling.

Really? If this is true I would prefer more discussion before any decisions are made.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


EXAKT Science posted:

Viva, Max, and WM are my top three scumreads at the moment.

EXAKT Science posted:

Like are you trying to bait me into getting defensive and panicking about potentially dying? That's not going to happen.

Do you have a case on WM?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Byers2142 posted:

But he's not voting at random?

"Seemingly at random" would have been a better choice of words there. Obviously my and CPig's play styles are completely different - I am inherently distrustful of people who vote without explanation why they're doing so.

In that vein:

wall monitor posted:

Yeah, how is that case coming?

DuckHuntDog posted:

That's a bit misleading considering the game hasn't been open for D3 that long and most of that was a workday.

Propaganda Machine posted:

murder to win, we have not had a proper slapfight yet

HAVE AT ME

There's a whole lot of people who I'm finding myself distrustful of at the moment. If it was truly down to WM vs. EXAKT I think WM is a better target - his response to be threatened with a vig was to sit back whereas I feel like town would have engaged - but I also feel like there are people that haven't weighed in yet who probably should.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Byers2142 posted:

I'd like to see the vig happen in the next 12 hours, so we have a full day to use that flip in our discussion before deadline.

When I say I "want people to weigh in first" I want to be clear - my goal is to encourage people to :justpost:, not to delay the vig.

Thinking about it more critically - EXAKT is probably the best vig target. I feel that a lot of my reads on this game would be strengthened or weakened by knowing his alignment, and I like that it would force certain people (CPig and WM off the top of my head) to produce new cases.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Byers2142 posted:

I'd be cool with it being used on people that aren't posting, actually. Shoot a lurker, win my heart.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Murmur Twin posted:

"Seemingly at random" would have been a better choice of words there. Obviously my and CPig's play styles are completely different - I am inherently distrustful of people who vote without explanation why they're doing so.

There's a whole lot of people who I'm finding myself distrustful of at the moment. If it was truly down to WM vs. EXAKT I think WM is a better target - his response to be threatened with a vig was to sit back whereas I feel like town would have engaged - but I also feel like there are people that haven't weighed in yet who probably should.

##vote wall monitor

(...now would be a really good time for WM to pop in with an amazing case or two.... :shh:)

Max posted:

My nose was a fountain of blood today. Let me re-read exact for a moment.

Jeez - feel better!

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


WALL MONITOR

Max posted:

B) I've never heard of a player procrastinating when they get a FOS on them, unless they are attempting to hide in the background and hope a more suspicious person comes forward, which is a scummy play more than it is a town play.

wall monitor posted:

That's my bad, I tend to procrastinate when people point FOS at me, since I get easily discouraged and such. It's a bad habit I probably should try to deal with.

Lemme see what I can do today. If I accomplish nothing else then at least you'll have my opinions available after you miscuddle me.

-

I know, I know, I'm trying to stop doing it. It doesn't help that the last couple of times it has worked for me, whereas staying engaged has lead to getting hammered.

Everything about WM reads to me as newbie scum in over his head. What's funny is that he starts the game telling us that his trick to staying alive is to hide when people put pressure on him, and then he does just that.

wall monitor posted:

Opop's slip-up seems really suspicious, but gut is telling me to hold off a little bit. I dunno.

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Is this a slip? I think it's pretty good evidence, but I wouldn't turbo Opop on this alone.

The read I get from this is someone who realized his scumbro slipped but isn't sure whether to bus him or defend him. He doesn't want to vote Opop but doesn't really provide us with a good reason as to why.

wall monitor posted:

I still don't like firey valkyrie, my vote is standing for now

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The original vote on Valkyrie was because his vote on me really seemed like he was reaching for a chance to drop suspicion on someone.

That post in particular... what was going through my head was that I needed to keep posting, was still kind of grasping for something to say, and thought, 'hey, should I recant my FV vote... nah. Okay, I'll post about that.' Perhaps not the best move given the reaction I got from it.

After he voted for FV on what seemed like a joke, I pressed WM on his thought process and he essentially said he had voted for no reason.

wall monitor posted:

Doing reads on three random posters...

Fiery I (still) think is scummy. Most of his D2 reads as lukewarm. I may be biased because of D1 though.

DHD I'm not sure about, maybe town? The posts he's made seem sincere to me at least.

KB is being pretty reasonable here, and I still don't quite get the logic that's suddenly put me from 'backup lynch choice' to 'all but confirmed town' overnight. I appreciate not being thought of as scum but at the same time I kind of wonder if people are abandoning ship on me because they know it'll blow up in their faces when I flip town.

(My point here being that I think KB is town)

This is the one that I find most suspicious. After I made a lurker call-out post, WM responds with reads. He (a) admits that he chose random people to case, which implies no opinion about who is scum; (b) gives three hedge-y reads - FV might be scum, DHD might be town, and KB is town because he agrees with WM, and (c) doesn't make a giant effort to convince anyone else what he believes.

wall monitor posted:

EXAKT is who I feel the most strongly about but doing more on him feels kinda :bandwagon: at this point.

The other bit I find odd so far is the vig target. People were discussing Exakt/WM, which despite being one of the targets I thought made sense, but then all of a sudden we decide to shoot Propaganda Machine instead?

If Exakt flips scum I would consider that pretty strong evidence against Byers here for about-facing on the vig target when a different oppotunity presented itself.

Actually, this is the post I find most suspicious. If EXAKT is the person he feels most strongly about, why not case him beyond "he seems desperate"? Why bring up the vig if you're not going to case Viva for how she used it?

fiery_valkyrie posted:

So MT (and anyone else) if we were in the position where there was another person with a vig, who do you think should be shot?

I don't think the opinions that WM are sharing with us are genuine. He only really seems to share information when prodded, and then never tries to back them up or convince us that he's right, which screams "trying to fake content" to me. Of the people remaining the game he's the person I most think is scum and would shoot if I had a vig.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


wall monitor posted:

Do I look like I'm concerned about my image?

wall monitor posted:

I have a hard time telling when jokephase ends and seriousphase begins I guess.

-

That's my bad, I tend to procrastinate when people point FOS at me, since I get easily discouraged and such. It's a bad habit I probably should try to deal with.

-

I know, I know, I'm trying to stop doing it. It doesn't help that the last couple of times it has worked for me, whereas staying engaged has lead to getting hammered.

-

That post in particular... what was going through my head was that I needed to keep posting, was still kind of grasping for something to say, and thought, 'hey, should I recant my FV vote... nah. Okay, I'll post about that.' Perhaps not the best move given the reaction I got from it.

-

Clearly I'm gonna have to put in more effort into my will next time I have a chance to submit.

-

Huh. Everyone thinks I'm town today.

-

I appreciate not being thought of as scum but at the same time I kind of wonder if people are abandoning ship on me because they know it'll blow up in their faces when I flip town

-

As a personal note I'm in the process of buying my first house. That doesn't excuse any lurkiness that's been going on but it's been taking up a big chunk of my headspace.

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Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


(On a non-game note - good luck with the house stuff! I've been in the position before - heck, I'm in it now - where I sign up for Mafia games and then real life comes in and makes it really hard to participate. All of my reads are strictly game-based :))

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